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DCC-Friendly Walthers/Shinohara Turnouts

Alan Cushing
 

Hi,
   Too cheap.  $32 for something that a couple of toggle switches would do offends me.  This is supposed to be just a simple end of track group of sidings.  Also my scheme would still work for DC though my number of DC engines is dwindling.  Can't remember the last time I bought one.

   AC

On Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:51:47 PM EST, Annette and Dante Fuligni dfuligni2144@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:


 

Why not use Frog Juicers as I did and suggested? Then you don’t have to fiddle with toggles and you can still use basic Caboose throws.

Dante

Annette and Dante Fuligni
 

Why not use Frog Juicers as I did and suggested? Then you don’t have to fiddle with toggles and you can still use basic Caboose throws.

Dante

Alan Cushing
 

  Finally, have the 3-way switch spiked down.

  Along the way, I did find an older non-DCC compatible switch on ebay so I bought it.  Found out it was worse.  Where the new DCC-compatible one causes a short along 1/2 inch of independent rail (wired underneath to the right-hand rail) between the smaller left-side frogs, the older one has a short on the same spot but the problem rail is much longer, ,part of one of the frogs.  The problem/confusion is when using the left hand route, the frog polarity there is controlled by the position of the other throwbar.  Does not sound logical but it is true.

   So I spiked down the new DCC-compatible after first accessing the wire that ties that 1/2 inch of annoying rail to one of the main rails.  I cut the far end of the welded strap thinking to drop it down a hole so I could possibly control it later but once moved the strap broke loose from the underside of that rail.  With that short rail now isolated, I tested the switch with my heisler.  No shorts now but it did find the dead frogs.  I also tested the switch with an 0-8-0 which ran through it just fine.  So no surprise that the frogs must be powered.

   I thought about using electrical Caboose throws but as listed in paragraph one, it would be confusing.  When switching the first throwbar to the left, the 2nd throwbar must be in the proper position otherwise one of the left-hand frogs will short.  I went to a logic chart listing the required polarity of the frogs in the 3 routes.  I have decided to make a little switch panel with two toggles  (2 frogs are always the same polarity) and a chart listing their positions for each of the 3 directions.  Now I can use simple caboose throws to control the rails.

   Good Luck,
   
   AC

vincent marino
 

Dante I haven't gotten to the frogs yet. I'm still wiring the layout. See
the enclosed schematic and correct any problems you see.

Sincerely,
Vincent Marino
Vincent Marino
Affordable Roofing Contractors
Project Manager
904-260-7663 office
904-683-2914 fax
904-449-6339 mobile
www.bestaffordablecontractors.com

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On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 11:32 AM, Annette and Dante Fuligni
dfuligni2144@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...>
wrote:



Relax! I have a Walthers/Shinohara 3-way on my layout controlled by basic,
non-powered Caboose controls. All frogs are, of course, isolated. It has
bottom-of-rail connections between powered rails and the unpowered rails
branching off the frogs (true of all DCC-friendly W/S turnouts). Therefore,
power-routing is not an issue.

That being said, there are a couple of possible problems that depend on
your motive power:

• First, there is a small section of rail between the 2 smallest frogs.
Some motive power might short on this piece of rail. The typical solution,
I believe, is to coat this short section with nail polish or equal.

• Second, again depending on your motive power, some equipment might lose
power over the isolated frogs. This can be resolved in the usual ways:
keep-alive decoders in the motive power or frog-powering controls or
Frog-Juicers. I added Frog-Juicers: one to power the largest frog and one
to power the 2 smallest frogs (one juicer can serve 2 frogs in this case
because there will never be 2 different pieces of motive power traversing
those 2 frogs the same time).

Remember, your particular motive power might not trigger either of the
above issues.

Dante F



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Alan Cushing
 

Hi,
   Progressing with my 3-way Walthers switch installation.  Preliminary tests show that an RS3 diesel operates through it, with dead frogs, just fine.  However my Rivarossi Heisler does find the dead frogs and even shorts out at one spot.  Powering the frogs is obvious but shorts?  I thought this whole redesign for DCC was supposed to eliminate shorts of this kind.

   I have put together one electric ground throw that I had on hand to control the right hand switch and frog.  It has built in contacts that can switch the frog power.   Still have to buy a 2nd to operate the other part of the switch.   If people feel that Caboose throws are too clunky, then the electric one is worse as it is a lot bigger.  My club, North Shore Model Railroad Club, has hundreds of switch machines, most of which control the associated frogs.

   Also this scheme would allow me to run on DC if I want to.  Yeah, yeah, once you run on DCC sound you never want to go back.  But they still sell DC locos which I still have.  Can't remember when I last bought one though.

  Still I am an operating guy.  These sidings are end of the line for logging; an empty train can come up from town, drop the empties, use the escape track to uncouple the loco and get out, and then pick up loads to go back to the sawmill.

   The last electric throw I used never failed me for 20 years.  If looks were a problem, then putting in a switch machine like a Tortoise, or Cobalt, would solve all of this but would require some panel for the control switch or control it through DCC.

  Moving on,

   Alan

Annette and Dante Fuligni
 

Relax! I have a Walthers/Shinohara 3-way on my layout controlled by basic, non-powered Caboose controls. All frogs are, of course, isolated. It has bottom-of-rail connections between powered rails and the unpowered rails branching off the frogs (true of all DCC-friendly W/S turnouts). Therefore, power-routing is not an issue.

That being said, there are a couple of possible problems that depend on your motive power:

• First, there is a small section of rail between the 2 smallest frogs. Some motive power might short on this piece of rail. The typical solution, I believe, is to coat this short section with nail polish or equal.

• Second, again depending on your motive power, some equipment might lose power over the isolated frogs. This can be resolved in the usual ways: keep-alive decoders in the motive power or frog-powering controls or Frog-Juicers. I added Frog-Juicers: one to power the largest frog and one to power the 2 smallest frogs (one juicer can serve 2 frogs in this case because there will never be 2 different pieces of motive power traversing those 2 frogs the same time).

Remember, your particular motive power might not trigger either of the above issues.

Dante F