Date   
Re: bacmann ez track and dcc

Richard Gagnon
 

Yes it is. Some in the Bachman forums do.

Rich




On Wednesday, April 3, 2019, 7:02 AM, staceyatvt@... wrote:

i was wondering is it possable to run dcc on my ez track (silver/nickle) and what i need to buy 

Re: bacmann ez track and dcc

Scott Nelson
 

Yes, DCC works on the same tracks that DC (or AC for that matter) does.

What you'll need is:
  • A command station
  • A throttle
  • A booster
but many manufacturers combine those into one device for beginners, for example the Digitrax Zephyr Express or the NCE PowerCab. I thought Bachmann did also but I couldn't find it on their site.
If you have a local club that uses DCC, you might want to follow their direction and get the same brand hardware so that you have some friends locally that can help. 

Power/wiring

WILLIAM RAILEY
 

I just finished a new layout and am a novice at best.  I have had trouble with shorts but thought I had it finished when the command light went on.  However, I cannot get either of my engines to run or get work.  I have power two the tracks.  

When I run through the setup, it says it cannot read the CV.  I as struggling needless to say.

Re: Power/wiring

wirefordcc
 

If you are on the mainline, DCC systems cannot read CVs.

 

What system do you have?  Digitrax for example, has a track power on standby mode.  You will have power on the track, but nothing will go anywhere.  This has befuddled more than one novice Digitrax user.  See your throttle manual.

 

Allan Gartner  WiringForDCC.com 

        

 

Re: Power/wiring

WILLIAM RAILEY
 

I have Nce and cannot get either engine to run. I even isolated a section


On Apr 4, 2019, at 11:55 AM, wirefordcc <bigboy@...> wrote:

If you are on the mainline, DCC systems cannot read CVs.

 

What system do you have?  Digitrax for example, has a track power on standby mode.  You will have power on the track, but nothing will go anywhere.  This has befuddled more than one novice Digitrax user.  See your throttle manual.

 

Allan Gartner  WiringForDCC.com 

        

 

K.I.S.S.

PennsyNut
 

This may be the dumbest question I've ever had.
The PECO Insulfrog. I have them not wired, not in any way. They are connected to flex track only by joiners. (I may solder them in the future, but for now, they are removable.) All flex track adjoining them is caulked down nice. All joiners conduct electricity. Now: When one throws the turnout, the points conduct the electricity. Right? The two tracks off the frog end. One is dead when the other is live. Or vice versa. Is there a simple way to make them both live? Jumpers from ? to ?
Morgan Bilbo, new to DCC

Re: K.I.S.S.

wirefordcc
 

Morgan,

For how to wire a Peco Insulfrog, go to my website at:

http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_peco.htm#a1

Both frog rails are always hot as shown in the diagram.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: Power/wiring

whmvd
 

Hi rrailey,

If you really have power to the tracks (how do you know?), you are probably asking the wrong group at the moment. Depending on your hardware, you might be better off looking at specific groups that exist for the support of your brand.

I could start guessing (best guess now: you cannot read CVs because you are using not your command station in programming track mode). But guessing isn't going to get this resolved, probably.

Wouter


On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 at 17:54, <rrailey1@...> wrote:
I just finished a new layout and am a novice at best.  I have had trouble with shorts but thought I had it finished when the command light went on.  However, I cannot get either of my engines to run or get work.  I have power two the tracks.  

When I run through the setup, it says it cannot read the CV.  I as struggling needless to say.

Re: bacmann ez track and dcc

staceyatvt@...
 

yes theres also MRC what one u think is best i see theres also many types of NCE MRC & DZE Meaning models  :)

Re: bacmann ez track and dcc

staceyatvt@...
 

yes i do want to run the switches on the controler i have it be much easyer  for me 

Re: bacmann ez track and dcc

vincent marino
 

I have NCE and put 2.5 amps on each power district (6). Love the system. Might be a little over powered but that's better than under powered. 

Once you have your system running the way you want  and you want to take your operation  to another level. Look into running JMRI on your layout. Specifically the consists and turnouts run unbelievably smooth. 

Tip: before  going to JMRI know your electrical system and controller inside and out. 


On Thu, Apr 4, 2019, 7:05 PM <staceyatvt@...> wrote:
yes i do want to run the switches on the controler i have it be much easyer  for me 

Re: Power/wiring

Richard Gagnon
 

I have the NCE Power Cab and have programmed different decoders.
Is the display on? I think it must be. The red LED also.
You said you are getting shorts so the display must go out and the cab resets and the display comes back on.
I normally use the program track option for programing.
I have done Digitrax, LokSound, SoundTraxx and QSI decoders. No problem.
Probably not important but I measure 13.6 vac across the rails on by Power Cab with my meter. Not all meters will show the same as it is RMS AC. Not pure sine wave. I have looked at it with a Scope.

Rich


Re: Peco SL-E391F turnout

Michael Snyder
 

Thank you John!  This is all very helpful.  I wish Peco had a standard with which to connect their turn-outs.  Their website is also basically worthless in accessing information.

Michael

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 5:31 PM John Johnston <towboatjohnston@...> wrote:

Michael,

 

I found an SL-E391F still in the package and have uploaded a photo of the back to the group web site.  I also uploaded photos of an older-model Insulfrog turnout with exposed wires that are easy to see for comparison.  The Album name is Code 55 Electrofrog.  It is fair game for anyone who wants to use/add/annotate etc.  And just to add to the confusion, I threw in photos of a double-slip and some top views of scissors crossovers connected to either toe and frog ends of SL-E391F and SL-E392F turnouts.  In the process, I noticed that Alan Gartner is the moderator of this group.  He knows WAY more about this stuff than any of us, and can correct my mistakes if he has time.  My photos are better than his, though.

 

Anyway – to your questions:

 

  1. The jumper on the SL-E391F (and it’s small radius left counterpart) is the exposed Square-C shaped wire that bridges between inside two rails of the frog and the two closure rails.  You will see that the each end of the C connects across both rails, meaning that all parts of the frog are connected electrically.  They are also connected electrically through the hinges to the point rails, so that whichever point rail touches one of the stock rails, will deliver the power from that stock rail to the entire frog.  It is tricky to cut the very short legs connecting adjacent rails at each end of the C, and VERY hard to re-solder individual wires without melting the plastic ties.  I failed.  (See Frog Juicers).
  2. The jumpers on the medium radius turnouts (SL-E395F and 396F) are different.  Two separate wires run longitudinally to connect the each closure rail to its corresponding frog rail.  Mine are all glued down, but there is a picture of one on Alan’s web site.  It is easy to snip them in the middle, and end up with four nice leads already soldered to the appropriate rails.
  3. I included a photo of on older model Insulfrog with crossing longitudinal wires, and showing how the point rails connect to the closure rails through a joiner.  Now they use a wiper hinge, which is better but still not reliable enough.  (Also a little dirt or oxidation will prevent the point rail from making good electrical contact with the stock rail.) 
  4. MUST USE insulated joiners on the two inside rails at the frog end.  Otherwise whichever way the switch is set, the polarity will always be wrong for one of the two tracks.

 

I have 80 small radius turnouts, and cataracts.  Rather than melting ties, I have opted for “half-friendly.”  I power-route the frogs with Frog Juicers or Blue Points.  Results to date have been excellent.  I don’t seem to have many out-of-gauge problems.  Derailments still cause shorts, but I prefer that to collisions.  Electrofrog double-slips and crossovers are getting friendlier (cuts and leads already).  I haven’t tried any Unifrogs yet.

 

To use a Frog Juicer with the SL-E391F, I lift a corner of the jumper directly under the rail with an Exacto knife about 1/8th inch.  I pull a single wire from my big roll of Cat 5 and tin 1/4th inch, then bend a very small hook around the exposed jumper with the wire pointing straight down.  If I keep the solder blob small, it will go back into the groove in the plastic, or disappear into hole drilled into the roadbed directly under the rail. Connect that wire into one of the six holes in a Hex Juicer, and you are done.  Frog Juicers are expensive, but easy to use, and they work beautifully.  I use Hex Juicers because I need to juice a lot of frogs.  Haven’t tried singles or duplex.  Plenty of power for anything in N-scale.  No problems so far with some leads going to frogs on a reversing section or sharing two leads from one juicer across two adjacent frogs.  I not tried powering two frogs from the same lead, but it should work if the frogs never need different polarity at the same time.

 

Blue points are cheaper, but I don’t have enough in service yet to deliver a verdict.  Should also be easy and effective. Tortoises have built-in power routing switches, but I don’t know beans about them.  Micro switches are an option I haven’t explored.  They don’t seem to offer much benefit for the small difference in cost.  If I were doing sophisticated signaling, I might think differently.

 

Critical spots first (hidden, hard to reach, switching intensive).  Some routes have been so trouble free that I’m just letting them run as-is until they cause problems.  Eventually they will.  Oxidation happens.  Good cleaning may postpone the day.

 

Like any good railroad nut, I could babble on until your eyes glaze over.  Will stop for now and wait for the next round…

John

 

From: w4dccqa@groups.io <w4dccqa@groups.io> On Behalf Of John Johnston via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, March 29, 2019 12:25 PM
To: w4dccqa@groups.io
Subject: Re: [w4dccqa] Peco SL-E391F turnout

 

Michael,

 

I am sorry not to have responded sooner.  Had some allergy problems that made me too sick to function, but am coming back to life now.  I use Peco Code 55 too.  The jumpers are different from HO, different (I think) from Code 80, and different between small (SL-E391F)  and medium radius turnouts.  They may also have changed over time. It is disconcerting, but they are worth the trouble.  Well manufactured and smooth running.

 

If you want truly understand, I recommend Alan Gartner’s web site.  The pictures don’t match the Code 55 electrofrogs on my layout, but the background was helpful within the rather tight limits of my mental capacity.  When my brain filled up, I resorted to my usual strategy of stomping into the minefield and waiting for something to blow up.  I haven’t tried everything yet, but I’m happy to report on what has and has not worked for me.  I use solenoids and Blue Points, so I don’t have any Tortoise experience, but there are plenty of smart people out there who can help you on those.

 

Must put some fires out on my day job first.  Then I will try to take a few pictures of things that are not glued down and send some comments, and we can go from there.

 

Cheers,

John Johnston

 

From: w4dccqa@groups.io <w4dccqa@groups.io> On Behalf Of Michael Snyder
Sent: Friday, March 29, 2019 10:22 AM
To: w4dccqa@groups.io
Subject: Re: [w4dccqa] Peco SL-E391F turnout

 

I put out these questions on Wed and haven't received any response.  I'm not sure what to expect, but I thought I would have heard something by now.  Does anybody know how to help please?

 

Michael

 

On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 8:46 AM Michael Snyder via Groups.Io <comichael57=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

I am new to your group and to model railroading.  I am currently laying track, N scale, and need help with the multitude of Peco turnouts.  

 As typed int he subject, I am using all Peco N Scale Code 55 electrofrog turnouts.  My first set of questions is for the SL-E391F:

 

1. What are jumpers as manufactured by Peco?  Where are they located?  It states that they are to be removed.  How does one go about removing them without destroying the turn out?

 

2. In the photograph, where the frog wires are cut and soldered together on the back side of the turnout, I get this.  What I can not see is, the wires that are joined and soldered together, are they both then connected to the main bus or to the Tortise Switch?  Then comes the question of where does the Frog Juicer fit into all of this?

 

Thats's about it on this switch.  Thanks to anyone who can help.

 

Michael

 

 

Re: Peco SL-E391F turnout

Michael Snyder
 

Thanks Allan.  Pass along anymore that comes your way.

M

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 9:14 AM wirefordcc <bigboy@...> wrote:
Michael,

Hopefully we'll hear from N-scalers who use the Peco electrofrog.  One of my website readers sent me a N-scale Peco turnout several years ago. It is documented on my website at: http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_peco.htm  I don't have it now.  So what I know is what is contained in my website. 

The diagram for the Peco electrofrogs indicates where the jumpers are located that you need to cut.  They are on the bottom of the turnout.  The rail is already gapped.  Just snip the jumpers and push apart the ends so they don't touch.

You will need to add jumpers on the bottom of the turnout as shown in the diagram in my website.  You will also need to add the feeders from the stock rails to your bus.

Don't forget the insulated joiners that I show in my diagram.

I hope this helps.  Otherwise, we'll have to rely on any Peco N-scale electrofrog users.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: K.I.S.S.

PennsyNut
 

What am I saying that is not clear. My turnouts are NOT wired. The turnout itself does not need wiring. I have reviewed a lot of drawings and diagrams - all about wiring a turnout. I choose not to wire the turnout. So is there a way to power the flex track at the frog end? Point feed works for me. Just that when the turnout is thrown one way that the other leg of track after the frog is powered. Or does it even have to be powered? As in sidings. You throw the turnout for the main and the siding is dead. Is this what it's supposed to be? And if the siding is to be powered, is there a short section of jumper wire connecting that rail to somewhere else so the power is there? Is this clear? NO WIRES ON TURNOUT. The turnout works fine as it is. There is continuity and no loss of voltage or amperage through the turnout.
From what I see on the bottom of an Insulfrog, there are jumpers from the point rail past the frog to the subsequent rail beyond the turnout.
I sure wish there was a way to do a diagram of what I mean. I can't seem to get jpg, pdf, odf, etc. I was able to draw a track plan on AnyRail6. But how do I get it to where I can add lines, arrows, using color, etc. I converted .any to jpg and jpg to pdf, but they lose part of the drawing.
Morgan Bilbo, new to DCC

Re: Power/wiring

Michael Snyder
 

Hi Richard,
Perhaps you can assist me.  I also have an NCE Power Cab.  I just purchased a new DCC Bachmann locomotive and of course...can not get it to run.  I have 13.77vac at track.  A call to Bachmann yielded that they feel the decoder is not recognized by NCE, but the CV is 8.  I went through the rack programming and entered this #8 under CV with no luck.  Any suggestions?

Michael

On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 7:09 PM Richard Gagnon via Groups.Io <richg_1998=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I have the NCE Power Cab and have programmed different decoders.
Is the display on? I think it must be. The red LED also.
You said you are getting shorts so the display must go out and the cab resets and the display comes back on.
I normally use the program track option for programing.
I have done Digitrax, LokSound, SoundTraxx and QSI decoders. No problem.
Probably not important but I measure 13.6 vac across the rails on by Power Cab with my meter. Not all meters will show the same as it is RMS AC. Not pure sine wave. I have looked at it with a Scope.

Rich


Re: K.I.S.S.

Mike Hoggard
 

The simplest way is to buy a packet of tiny sprung connections that fit between the track . Hornby sell them for a small amount of money and they work fine. Have a look at a hornby catalogue and all will be explained Mike
--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 4/4/19, PennsyNut <pennsynut@...> wrote:

Subject: [w4dccqa] K.I.S.S.
To: w4dccqa@groups.io
Date: Thursday, 4 April, 2019, 22:06

This may be the dumbest question
I've ever had.
The PECO Insulfrog. I have them not wired, not in any way.
They are connected to flex track only by joiners. (I may
solder them in the future, but for now, they are removable.)
All flex track adjoining them is caulked down nice. All
joiners conduct electricity. Now: When one throws the
turnout, the points conduct the electricity. Right? The two
tracks off the frog end. One is dead when the other is live.
Or vice versa. Is there a simple way to make them both live?
Jumpers from ? to ?
Morgan Bilbo, new to DCC

Re: Power/wiring

Richard Gagnon
 

After Cv8 I cycle track power off then on. Lights flash sixteen times and loco then runs on address 3 if reset took.
But always use program track option.

Rich




On Friday, April 5, 2019, 2:54 PM, Michael Snyder <comichael57@...> wrote:

Hi Richard,
Perhaps you can assist me.  I also have an NCE Power Cab.  I just purchased a new DCC Bachmann locomotive and of course...can not get it to run.  I have 13.77vac at track.  A call to Bachmann yielded that they feel the decoder is not recognized by NCE, but the CV is 8.  I went through the rack programming and entered this #8 under CV with no luck.  Any suggestions?

Michael

On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 7:09 PM Richard Gagnon via Groups.Io <richg_1998=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I have the NCE Power Cab and have programmed different decoders.
Is the display on? I think it must be. The red LED also.
You said you are getting shorts so the display must go out and the cab resets and the display comes back on.
I normally use the program track option for programing.
I have done Digitrax, LokSound, SoundTraxx and QSI decoders. No problem.
Probably not important but I measure 13.6 vac across the rails on by Power Cab with my meter. Not all meters will show the same as it is RMS AC. Not pure sine wave. I have looked at it with a Scope.

Rich


Re: K.I.S.S.

Dennis Cherry
 

Did you sign up on the AnyRail Forum. They are great about helping you understand AnyRail.

 

I use it.

 

www.anyrail.com and click on “Forum”

 

Dennis

 

 

 

Re: K.I.S.S.

Don Vollrath
 

Morgan,

The turnout as provided by PECO looks great and will not cause any shorts by itself. There is no instant need to butcher it up or provide additional electrical connections. However there ARE issues to take care of if you want rails beyond the turnout to always be correctly powered with DCC.

To do only that... The KISS principal says that you will need to 1) Isolate both of the frog exit rails beyond the turnout by providing insulated rail joiners at the frog end of the turnout, and 2) Provide electrical connections of your choice to power the connecting mainline and spur tracks beyond the turnout. Power to the turnout itself will come from your mainline connections at the point end of the turnout. If you do 1) and 2) power to internal PECO turnout rails and frog will take care of themselves with positioning of the throwbar. Power beyond the turnout will always be provided by your connections to those tracks. Will it work? ... Yes.

BUT... you will eventually learn that the selective electrical polarity connections to the turnout frog and frog rails via the movable points may become intermittent over time due to dirt and other contamination. Hence all the chit-chat on how to reconnect the turnout rails to prevent that. This is in part what making the turnout more "DCC Friendly" is all about. 

DonV