Date   
Re: WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

Puckdropper
 

We'll try to help.  Could you turn your caps lock off first?

Please answer these questions:
1. Do you have a track plan?
1a. Does your track loop back on itself?  IOW, will a train be able to go on the same track it was on previously without changing direction?
2. How many operators?
3. How many locomotives in use at one time?
4. Do you plan on any sort of signaling, even crossing signals?

Puckdropper

---In wiringfordcc@..., <b55go@...> wrote :

I AM NEW TO DCC, I WANT TO BUILD A DCC ON30 LAYOUT, NEED SOMEONE TO PROVIDE TRACK WIRING DIAGRAM USING NCE EQUIPMENT AND LIST OF NCE EQUIPMENT NEEDED.
THANKS
BERNARD

Re: WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

Alan Cushing
 

Well, details - how big a layout or more important, how many trains, oops, how many engines do you expect to run at a  time?  Maybe a beginner system ($160?) could handle up to 5 engines, a basic system ($450-500) perhaps 5-10 locos or many double or triple-headed trains then a system with multiple boosters and breaker panels.   NCE is a good system; throttles offer lots of info on their displays.  My club uses it and we run maybe 20+ engines at a time with many boosters with  breaker panels on each.

   AC

dcc track plan wiring diagram services?

b55go@...
 

i am planning to build an on30 layout using peco code 100 track and switches, iam looking for someone to provide DCC layout wiring diagram,  

and list of NCE equipment neededi 

thanks so much for any help

Re: WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

Alan Cushing
 

Well, details - how big a layout or more important, how many trains, oops, how many engines do you expect to run at a  time?  Maybe a beginner system ($160?) could handle up to 5 engines, a basic system ($450-500) perhaps 5-10 locos or many double or triple-headed trains then a system with multiple boosters and breaker panels.   NCE is a good system; throttles offer lots of info on their displays.  My club uses it and we run maybe 20+ engines at a time with many boosters with  breaker panels on each.

   AC



On Friday, February 9, 2018, 2:42:14 PM EST, bernard steinbacher b55go@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:


 

I AM NEW TO DCC, I WANT TO BUILD A DCC ON30 LAYOUT, NEED SOMEONE TO PROVIDE TRACK WIRING DIAGRAM USING NCE EQUIPMENT AND LIST OF NCE EQUIPMENT NEEDED.
THANKS
BERNARD

Re: WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

bernard steinbacher <b55go@...>
 

Thank you for your reply :one operator two locomotives at one timeno signals,eliminate wharf areapeco code 100 track and peco switches ( not sure what kind of peco switch)??would like to use nce system18 feet long, not 28 as shownthanks bernard

On Friday, February 9, 2018, 9:30:50 PM EST, @Puckdropper [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 
We'll try to help.  Could you turn your caps lock off first?

Please answer these questions:
1. Do you have a track plan?
1a. Does your track loop back on itself?  IOW, will a train be able to go on the same track it was on previously without changing direction?
2. How many operators?
3. How many locomotives in use at one time?
4. Do you plan on any sort of signaling, even crossing signals?


Puckdropper

---In wiringfordcc@..., <b55go@...> wrote :

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Re: WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

dvollrath@...
 

Bernard,

Get an NCE PowerCab system. Easiest to use. Ideal for a one operator limited sized layout. You can cope with programming of several locos by fiddling with CV settings 'manually' with the PowerCab. No other frills are needed unless you have an reversing track section needing a PSX-AR auto-reverser.


DonV



---In WiringForDCC@..., <b55go@...> wrote :

Thank you for your reply :one operator two locomotives at one timeno signals,eliminate wharf areapeco code 100 track and peco switches ( not sure what kind of peco switch)??would like to use nce system18 feet long, not 28 as shownthanks bernard


On Friday, February 9, 2018, 9:30:50 PM EST, puckdropper@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 
We'll try to help.  Could you turn your caps lock off first?

Please answer these questions:
1. Do you have a track plan?
1a. Does your track loop back on itself?  IOW, will a train be able to go on the same track it was on previously without changing direction?
2. How many operators?
3. How many locomotives in use at one time?
4. Do you plan on any sort of signaling, even crossing signals?


Puckdropper

---In wiringfordcc@..., <b55go@...> wrote :

I AM NEW TO DCC, I WANT TO BUILD A DCC ON30 LAYOUT, NEED SOMEONE TO PROVIDE TRACK WIRING DIAGRAM USING NCE EQUIPMENT AND LIST OF NCE EQUIPMENT NEEDED.THANKSBERNARD

Re: Power Cab was WIRING DIAGRAM FOR ON30 LAYOUT ??

Richard Gagnon
 

I have been using the NCE Power Cab for some years. Very easy to use. I might run two locos at one time.

Rich


On Tuesday, February 13, 2018, 9:47:48 AM EST, dvollrath@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:




Bernard,

Get an NCE PowerCab system. Easiest to use. Ideal for a one operator limited sized layout. You can cope with programming of several locos by fiddling with CV settings 'manually' with the PowerCab. No other frills are needed unless you have an reversing track section needing a PSX-AR auto-reverser.


DonV_,___

Re: dcc track plan wiring diagram services?

John Cahill
 

I'd suggest you download AnyRail (you can select your track supplier in a menu), enter your baseboard size and play with it to see what fits, what you like and only the talk about equipment.
Regards,
John

On Fri, Feb 9, 2018 at 8:15 PM, b55go@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

i am planning to build an on30 layout using peco code 100 track and switches, iam looking for someone to provide DCC layout wiring diagram,  

and list of NCE equipment neededi 

thanks so much for any help


Re: Large Gauge Ground Wire in Parallel with Loconet Gound Wires == Groundloop?

Mark Gurries
 

Chris,

I have one more question. Did you order the “opto" version of the DB210.  Opto and optical isolated version of the DB210?


On Feb 2, 2018, at 10:04 AM, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



Well that explains why the booster ground wire does not work.

With these new products, what I do not know is if this is a manufacturing defect, an intentional design change by Digitrax or a accidental design omission.

One would need to examine more of these new unit to eliminate the manufacturing defect variable.

I would contact Digitrax and ask them about this.




On Jan 31, 2018, at 7:42 AM, Chris Elliott cpelliott100@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



Hi Mark, sorry for the slow response.

So as requested I've taken a few measurements and I'm a little surprised by the results, but it certainly explains a few things. My results are in the redish colour.

You asked
If you have an ohm better, check if there is continuity between the ground terminal and the metal case.
My result, I removed a case screw and stuck the probe into the thread due to all the metal having a black "coating". The measured resistance between the thread and the ground pin on the front connector was 6.8 ohms.

The next step is to measure electrical continuity between the ground terminal and the loconet ground pins 3 and 4. 
My result, to my surprise 74Kohms. Yes 74,000 ohms! This was measured between the ground pin on the front connector and the middle conductors of a dummy loconet cable.

Measurements were taken with a Fluke 1587 and the booster was totally disconnected from the layout and power supply.

Regards
Chris Elliott





On Monday, 8 January 2018, 10:46, "Mark Gurries gurriesm@comcast..net [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:




Ok,

I have no first hand experience with the new systems.  I am not sure what has changed with the new systems.   The documentation of the new system promotes the ground wire as a AC Earth ground connection which makes no sense since it assumes that they have a safety liability situation which they do not.  They are not making the AC power supply which does have a liability situation and cannot be legally be sold unless it addresses that safety issue per UL, ETL or equivalent safety agency requirement.

Anyway, if it is intended as a Earth Ground connection, then it must be connected to the metal chassis.

If you have an ohm better, check if there is continuity between the ground terminal and the metal case.  There should be if supposed to fulfill its safety requirement.

The next step is to measure electrical continuity between the ground terminal and the loconet ground pins 3 and 4.   I know there is on the older Digitrax systems.  I measured it and you know it works because your suing the large ground wire with the older systems..   If the new system BREAKS that continuity, that would explain why the large ground wire does not work and you must relay on the Digitrax Loconet ground for the booster common function.






On Dec 30, 2017, at 3:01 AM, Chris Elliott cpelliott100@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I have a DCS100 as the command station. In loconet port A I have a UR92 connected and that’s it. In loconet port B I have the loconet cable that runs to the other boosters. There are no other loconet devices connected anywhere. On the DCS100 the “home ground” is connected to the little digitrax installed pigtail. This pigtail is connected to a lug which is held against the rear heat sink.. 

The “home ground” wire runs for approx 14 metres before reaching the first and second boosters, it is a 2.5 millimetre cable (approx awg 13) It does not connect to anything else.
The “home ground” wire connects to the ground terminal on the front of a DB210 and then daisy chains off to the second DB210 and connects the same way.

I had previously wired a friends layout which has a DCS100 and six DB150’s configured as boosters. I had cut the loconet cables as described in Alan Gartners “booster wiring” and it works without issue.

So when I installed the booster loconet cable on my layout, I cut the wires as described on Alan’s website and as I’d done previously. But the DB210’s would not wake up. The LEDs on the front on the DB210 were not correct and trains would not run on the DB210s power districts. The both rails at boundary between power districts are gaped and insulated. Reterminating the booster loconet cable so that all 6 wires are connected corrected the issue.


Sent from planet earth

On 30 Dec 2017, at 11:53, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:


How did you make the ground connection?  Details please.

On Dec 26, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Chris Elliott cpelliott100@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



Yes, I had installed a heavy gauge “home ground” between the boosters and command station. 

Sent from planet earth

On 27 Dec 2017, at 11:15, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:


Did you have the ground wire installed?


On Dec 24, 2017, at 8:28 PM, Chris Elliott cpelliott100@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I’ve found that the new digitrax boosters won’t come on line if the ground wires in the loconet cables are cut.
Chris Elliott

Sent from planet earth

On 25 Dec 2017, at 04:50, nwsteamer modelrr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

Mark,

The way I read this statement the large gauge wire in parallel to the 
Loconet 'ground'  wires does constitute a 'loop' and could cause a 
reliability problem..

Thus, the recommendation in Allan Gartner's website to cut the Loconet 
'grounds' at the boosters is valid.  Do you agree?

On 12/24/2017 05:03 AM, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] 
wrote:
> Adding the large gauge parallel ground wire permitting a ground loop 
> to be establish is the LESSER of the two evils. 




Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com







Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www..markgurries.com







Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com








Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com






Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com



Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Nick Ostrosky
 

I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!

Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Mark Gurries
 

This is where purchasing a Keep Alive with the decoder comes in handy.  It will make up for the consequences of not having all wheel pickup.  The only think you must remember is let the keep alive charge up for a minute of so before you run the locomotive.


On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:04 AM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!




Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com



Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Alan Cushing
 

Well, by converting to DCC, you have the chance to put a Keep Alive circuit in there so the loco will be capable of coasting a distance when hitting a dead spot.  

   ASC

Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

whmvd
 

Trying to think through what would happen if such a skewed pick-up engine crosses from one power district into another, or into an auto-reverser. It's giving me brain freeze. Any special considerations there?

Wouter

On 21 February 2018 at 10:54, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

This is where purchasing a Keep Alive with the decoder comes in handy.  It will make up for the consequences of not having all wheel pickup.  The only think you must remember is let the keep alive charge up for a minute of so before you run the locomotive.



On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:04 AM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!




Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com




Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Charles Brumbelow
 

Is the existing motor suitable for DCC or will you need to remotor? Is there or will there be room for a flywheel? Charles




On Monday, February 19, 2018, 1:04 PM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!



Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Mark Gurries
 

As a general rule it is best to re-motor.  Many brass engines had very low efficiency motors that draw much higher currents than modern motor do.  Often they will require a 2amp decoder to work properly.

You will get smoother performance and less current draw and the Keep Alive will work a lot better.

The need for a flywheel goes away if you have a keep alive.   That said having one will make early movement of the engine better until the keep alive charges up.  Personally I always have one anyway.

On Feb 20, 2018, at 7:01 PM, Charles Brumbelow mrb37211@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



Is the existing motor suitable for DCC or will you need to remotor? Is there or will there be room for a flywheel? Charles




On Monday, February 19, 2018, 1:04 PM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!






Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com



FYI -- Keep Alive

Glenn
 

The TCS KA-series of "Keep-Alive" devices is intended to be used with TCS decoders. Publicity info infers they can be used with any decoder. They must be wired internally to the decoder, not to the external wires.

The KA's have a blue wire and a black/white stripe. I purchased a KA-2. I had to email TCS, they responded with instructions on where to solder these wires inside a decoder.

The -C designation defines Keep-Alives ready to be plugged into KA ready decoders.

Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: "Alan Cushing ascushing@... [WiringForDCC]"
Sent: Feb 20, 2018 10:11 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC



Well, by converting to DCC, you have the chance to put a Keep Alive circuit in there so the loco will be capable of coasting a distance when hitting a dead spot.  

   ASC


Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

dvollrath@...
 

No special considerations required. If you have only one booster there is no issue as there will always be a path for current to flow from rail A of one power district through the decoder and back to rail B on a different power district, unless a protective breaker has tripped. Ditto for crossing A-R boundaries as a short circuit will be created by the first trucks to combine opposite rail polarities together, causing the A-R unit to flip and correct the problem. If you have correctly installed the power common wire between multiple boosters there will still be a path to power the loco when drawing power from rail A of booster 1 and rail B of booster 2 when a loco crosses those boundaries. This is one of the several reasons to provide that common bonding wire.

DonV

---In WiringForDCC@..., <vandoornw@...> wrote :

Trying to think through what would happen if such a skewed pick-up engine crosses from one power district into another, or into an auto-reverser. It's giving me brain freeze. Any special considerations there?

Wouter

On 21 February 2018 at 10:54, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

This is where purchasing a Keep Alive with the decoder comes in handy.  It will make up for the consequences of not having all wheel pickup.  The only think you must remember is let the keep alive charge up for a minute of so before you run the locomotive.



On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:04 AM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!




Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com




Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Nick Ostrosky
 

Thank you for all the responses. I did stumble across this link which appears to be identical to mine.

https://brasstrains.com/Classic/Product/Detail/082378/HO-Brass-Model-Sun-Dancer-B-O-Baltimore-Ohio-2-8-0-E-60-Unpainted

The motor does appear to be a DC "can" type, but whether that is suitable for DCC, especially with a loco dating to 1987, has me wondering.

The rail picks split between loco and tender also had me asking the same question about crossing a block, especially my two reversing sections.

Any guidance on how to overcome that, if it is a concern, would be appreciated.

Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

Nick Ostrosky
 

Thank you for all the responses, I obviously have more research to do.  Very helpful!

Re: Converting a brass E-60 2-8-0 to DCC

whmvd
 

Thanks, Don. So I worry too much, but at least it keeps me careful! :-)

Wouter

On 21 February 2018 at 17:00, dvollrath@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

No special considerations required. If you have only one booster there is no issue as there will always be a path for current to flow from rail A of one power district through the decoder and back to rail B on a different power district, unless a protective breaker has tripped. Ditto for crossing A-R boundaries as a short circuit will be created by the first trucks to combine opposite rail polarities together, causing the A-R unit to flip and correct the problem. If you have correctly installed the power common wire between multiple boosters there will still be a path to power the loco when drawing power from rail A of booster 1 and rail B of booster 2 when a loco crosses those boundaries. This is one of the several reasons to provide that common bonding wire.


DonV

---In WiringForDCC@..., <vandoornw@...> wrote :

Trying to think through what would happen if such a skewed pick-up engine crosses from one power district into another, or into an auto-reverser. It's giving me brain freeze. Any special considerations there?

Wouter

On 21 February 2018 at 10:54, Mark Gurries gurriesm@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

This is where purchasing a Keep Alive with the decoder comes in handy.  It will make up for the consequences of not having all wheel pickup.  The only think you must remember is let the keep alive charge up for a minute of so before you run the locomotive.



On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:04 AM, nick79ostr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:



I have a brass Consolidation I'd love to convert for operation on my DCC layout.  It appears the loco picks up right rail from the drivers and left rail from the tender.  I know I'll have to isolate the motor from the frame, but my concern is that the gap between the last driver and first tender wheel pickups may be large enough that if I do have a dead spot somewhere (e.g., in an already-installed turnout that works fine with my F7s) the loco will stall.  Does anyone have experience in this area, and am I being overly cautious/concerned?  Thanks!




Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com