Date   
Re: Website Down - Wiring For DCC

wirefordcc
 

All,

 

GoDaddy has my website back up!

 

Allan Gartner

Wiring For DCC

 

From: w4dccqa@groups.io <w4dccqa@groups.io> On Behalf Of wirefordcc
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2020 11:32 AM
To: w4dccqa@groups.io
Subject: [w4dccqa] Website Down - Wiring For DCC

 

All,

I discovered that my website is down.  I've contacted GoDaddy.  They are having problems.  It is supposed to be back up today.  

I'll keep checking for it and will announce here when I see that it is back up.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: turnout machines

mgj21932
 

Ted Tyson,

Tam Valley (tamvalleydepots.com) also has a line of switch machines, servos, controllers, etc. you might consider.  What I find particularly attractive are (1) they have a fully compatible set of wires that facilitate connecting all the elements together; and (2) they have fascia buttons pre-wired with colored LEDs to indicate switch direction.  Easily mounted on a schematic of you layout.

Duncan McRee can be very helpful.  dmcree@...

Just another option.

Bill D

On Friday, March 27, 2020, 07:23:00 PM EDT, ted tyson <ttyson55@...> wrote:


can you tell me who makes (or where i can get) those machines...and thank you!
Ted

On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 11:34 AM wirefordcc <bigboy@...> wrote:
Hi Ted,

Yes, you can still use your Atlas snap switch machines.  Normally, these were powered off the Accessory output of a power pack which was AC.

If you wanted to, there are some DCC turnout controllers that can drive Atlas snap switch machines.  These provide a pulse.  If you want to do this, make sure you pick one that is designed for twin-coil switch machines like the Atlas snap switch machines.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: wiring

wirefordcc
 

Hi Ted,

NCE is probably recommending it for less than 5 amp systems due to the size of the supplied feeders.

If you are using your MRC system with electronic circuit breakers, which would lower the available current before tripping, to less than 5 amps.  Doing something like this has always been my recommendation.  Eight amps is a lot for a short in an HO system, so electronic circuit breakers are advisable.  Or set your MRC to output no more than 5 amps.

Even then, it is a good idea to use electronic circuit breakers with trip points set to say 2.5 - 3 amps for HO.  You are trying to run trains, not weld!

However you get below 5 amp max to your track, the NCE product should serve you well.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: turnout machines

wirefordcc
 

Hi Ted,

You asked about the machines, but I assume you have switch machines already.  Do you mean to be asking about the devices that can control snap action switch machines?  Check with the manufacturer of your DCC system.  Look for "accessory decoders" or "stationary decoders".  NCE makes units for their system.  It is called the Qsnap-Mk2.  Digitrax calls their product the DS52.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Website Down - Wiring For DCC

wirefordcc
 

All,

I discovered that my website is down.  I've contacted GoDaddy.  They are having problems.  It is supposed to be back up today.  

I'll keep checking for it and will announce here when I see that it is back up.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: turnout machines

ted tyson
 

can you tell me who makes (or where i can get) those machines...and thank you!
Ted

On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 11:34 AM wirefordcc <bigboy@...> wrote:
Hi Ted,

Yes, you can still use your Atlas snap switch machines.  Normally, these were powered off the Accessory output of a power pack which was AC.

If you wanted to, there are some DCC turnout controllers that can drive Atlas snap switch machines.  These provide a pulse.  If you want to do this, make sure you pick one that is designed for twin-coil switch machines like the Atlas snap switch machines.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

wiring

ted tyson
 

i was looking at a nce wiring kit...but at the bottom of the description it says for 5 amp or lower systems...my MRC claims to be 8 amps  (adjustabe)...?...so is the nce kit ok to use???...im guessing no   thx

Re: turnout machines

wirefordcc
 

Hi Ted,

Yes, you can still use your Atlas snap switch machines.  Normally, these were powered off the Accessory output of a power pack which was AC.

If you wanted to, there are some DCC turnout controllers that can drive Atlas snap switch machines.  These provide a pulse.  If you want to do this, make sure you pick one that is designed for twin-coil switch machines like the Atlas snap switch machines.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

turnout machines

ted tyson
 

since the dcc power doesnt contact my atlas coil "snap "remote machines, can i still use these safely?   with dc power of course?

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

Michael Maioriello
 

What gauge are you using, also what system do you use. I uses Lenz system 3.6 and must use circuit breakers. The science behind this is that LENZ Invented that’s out there and smart people ran with free technology. I am not up-to date on the newer systems to pick from. Good Luck!

On Sat, Mar 21, 2020 at 10:18 PM Michael Boyle <boyle10017@...> wrote:
Greetings,
I've read, and been told, to offset the rail gaps between power districts. What is the science behind this and do we do that everywhere (for example in a reversing loop)?
Thanks,
Michael

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

wirefordcc
 

In this case, short means, makes a connection.  If the polarity of the two sections are the same, no shutdown of a booster or electronic circuit breaker should occur.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

john
 


Gentlemen,

The only place a short should occur is at a reverse loop or at a "Y. It doesn't matter if the polarities are reversed or not because your reverser, your PM42, or separate booster will make them the same almost instantly when they sense a short. It doesn't matter if the gaps are directly across from each other because when the wheels touch either rail with the reverse polarity, you reversers will correct both rails.

I have noticed that when engines cross a gap between power blocks, especially reverse loops there is sometimes and miniscule spark. No, I am not crazy but it has to be Black Out Dark to see it. 

I have see a decrease in jerks and starts over gaps when I fill in the gap with plastic. It also allows the gaps to be much smaller and keeps the rails from creeping and shorting together. Our layout is in a basement but rails still expand and contract down there. 

Keep you wires in a twist and your fun in a bunch.
jd
 

On Thursday, March 26, 2020, 10:48:34 AM EDT, Tim <tarumph@...> wrote:


I wonder about this fascination with gap locations. If you're using an autoreverser it will detect the short when when a wheel hits the first gap, flip the polarity, and everything will be fine. As far as wheels connecting power districts (or track circuit blocks) that will happen as long as the wheelbase of the loco straddles the gap (assuming all wheel pick-up). The gap locations don't make any difference (within reason). Steam locos with pick-up on one side of the loco and the opposite side of the tender will pick up from both sides of the gaps. This is why boosters are bonded. Trying to space the gap so that the lead wheel on the loco hits one gap at the same time as the lead wheel on the tender hits the opposite gap can only work for one type of loco moving in one direction.

Having the gap distance longer than the locomotive should probably be avoided, but shouldn't really cause any problem. See steam loco example above. :)

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

Tim
 

I wonder about this fascination with gap locations. If you're using an autoreverser it will detect the short when when a wheel hits the first gap, flip the polarity, and everything will be fine. As far as wheels connecting power districts (or track circuit blocks) that will happen as long as the wheelbase of the loco straddles the gap (assuming all wheel pick-up). The gap locations don't make any difference (within reason). Steam locos with pick-up on one side of the loco and the opposite side of the tender will pick up from both sides of the gaps. This is why boosters are bonded. Trying to space the gap so that the lead wheel on the loco hits one gap at the same time as the lead wheel on the tender hits the opposite gap can only work for one type of loco moving in one direction.

Having the gap distance longer than the locomotive should probably be avoided, but shouldn't really cause any problem. See steam loco example above. :)

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

Jerry Michels
 

There is momentary shorts between blocks as metal wheels (Or Locos) cross the gaps.  

Is this true?  If the polarity and phase is the same for two blocks there should not be any shorts in my opinion.  If this was so, a train with all metal wheels would cause a large number of shorts to occur, and if a train stopped with a set of metal wheels bridging two blocks, the short would be constant.  I have not seen this.

Jerry Michels

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

John Melvin
 

Nothing wrong with this technique. It does what you state about stabilizing the track on curves. My railroad teachers from 70 years ago to present have taught me the same but also taught me that rail gaps should always be parallel at any change in electrical status, ie., ladder tracks in yards, engine storage tracks, mainline blocks, signal detection blocks, and moving from one booster region to another booster region, etc.

John
El Paso

In a message dated 3/25/2020 11:21:32 Mountain Standard Time, jjc3382@... writes:

I was taught to slide one rail on flex track halfway onto the next piece on a curve to maintain the curve without parallel cuts to avoid kinks. I solder my joints and never gap on a curved section. Is this wrong? It seems like the new thinking is to join the two pieces with joints across from each other but soldering the joints while they are straight and then bending them to the radius you want. Doesn’t my way stabilize the radius and prevent kinks better?

joint gaps

Michael Shockley
 

I found two pictures of rails that have a joiner on only one rail.  Both of these are straight tracks.  I'm not sure what prototype curves require.

Mike Shockley

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

John
 

I was taught to slide one rail on flex track halfway onto the next piece on a curve to maintain the curve without parallel cuts to avoid kinks. I solder my joints and never gap on a curved section. Is this wrong? It seems like the new thinking is to join the two pieces with joints across from each other but soldering the joints while they are straight and then bending them to the radius you want. Doesn’t my way stabilize the radius and prevent kinks better?

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

thomasmclae
 

the reason for gaping both rails is to prevent current/power/signals from one block to another.
There is momentary shorts between blocks as metal wheels (Or Locos) cross the gaps.
These are usually handled fine, but offset gaps extend the short times for Locos and lit coaches/cabooses.
The only reason to stagger gaps is mechanical, and if you need to do this, your technique needs to be revised.
Thomas
DeSoto, TX

Import Conversation

 

Hello Allan,
I posted the topic "Offset Rail Gapping" both here and at the NCE-DCC@groups.io site. On that site Bruce Petrarca generalized the discussion to "Rail Gaps" and the discussion really took off with many very interesting inputs by some of the most knowledgeable people, on the topic, that I know. Is it possible to import the conversation to this site so that members of this site could benefit?
As always,
Michael Boyle

Re: Offset Rail Gapping

prandn
 

RealWorldApplication ... joints in rails are ALWAYS* parallel to each other, a practice also required in model railroading.... 🙃

Now the staggering of joints is a completely different subject......

* Exception: when a “ sun-kink “ or derailment or some other phenomenon has caused the rails to become unparallel.....

loren martell
Aloha, OR 97007