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Re: Help with wiring a reverse loop

wirefordcc
 

Hi Nick,

I recognized your layout when I pulled up your photos.  Where exactly is PM-42 being used?  Given the complexity of your layout, maybe you could upload a drawing with the track controlled by the PM-42 highlighted.

Have you seen my webpage on Kato turnouts?  IT is located at:  http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_kato.htm

I'm not promising I'll have a solution for you, but I'll try.  I will at least make sure you have nothing obviously wrong with your implementation.

I had a problem with a PM-42 that as I recall, sounds similar to what is happening to you.  It was probably 10 or so years ago, so my memory is foggy.  Digitrax wasn't able to help at the time.

Allan
Wiring for DCC

Re: Help with wiring a reverse loop

Nick Nelson
 

Allen,
I uploaded the layout back in April, i have two pics of it, one with my initial layout and a second with the plan i went with.    I am using powered Kato turnouts.
https://groups.io/g/w4dccqa/album?id=245012

Re: Help with wiring a reverse loop

wirefordcc
 

Hi Nick,

You mention a reversing loop, but you also talk about three turnouts.  Are you using a wye?  It may be helpful if you post a diagram of your layout or at least the portion with the reversing problem.

It has been a while since I used a PM42, but I do recall having a problem similar to what you describe.  I couldn't get it to stop, so I started using a different auto reverser and the problem went away.

Are you using powered or dead frogs on your turnouts?  Whose turnouts are you using?

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: Help with wiring a reverse loop

Nick Nelson
 

I have the layout fully wired finally, and it seems like it is working for the most part but want to make sure what i am hearing and seeing is normal.  I am running a Digitrax Chief, with an old Zephry booster and using a PM42 as my auto reverser.  For 90% of the layout things are running find it seems, but in the auto reversing section, i seem to be shorting out at 2 of the three turnouts.  The shorts seem to be quick and self correcting, so i assume that is what the auto reverser is suppose to do.  I hear a quick beep, from my control system and then the train restarts.  i have not placed a large train on the layout yet, mostly just the engine and 2-3 cars.  This happens with both just the engine as well as when the cars are on.  I do have one more thing going on somewhere else but have not pinpointed it yet, as it has only happened once or twice on a double crossover.  Thanks for the help so far.  If someone needs to see my layout again, these two shorts occur at the top and bottom turnout in the oval that is broken off at the wye.  If what i am experiencing is correct, cool, i just wanted to make sure, as i am a wiring novice at best still.
Nick

Re: Connector/cabling ideas?

Carl
 

Hi Gang:

I like plug connections so it is quick to change turnout motors. Put the sockets close to the motors.

Carl.

On 5/22/2020 10:17 AM, wirefordcc wrote:
Hi Dave,

Sounds like you found the same stuff I bought.

I'd prefer to screw things down as well, but not all DCC products come with a way to screw them down.  

Do note that when you screw something down with multiple screws, don't snug it down tight.  You might warp the board and it could develop a hairline crack.  I leave a small amount of wiggle.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Virus-free. www.avast.com

Re: Connector/cabling ideas?

wirefordcc
 

Hi Dave,

Sounds like you found the same stuff I bought.

I'd prefer to screw things down as well, but not all DCC products come with a way to screw them down.  

Do note that when you screw something down with multiple screws, don't snug it down tight.  You might warp the board and it could develop a hairline crack.  I leave a small amount of wiggle.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC

Re: Connector/cabling ideas?

Dave Emery
 

I looked on Amazon and found some heavy-duty outdoor black double-sided sticky foam tape. It arrived yesterday. Its only has been in place one day, but we are off to a good start. The old stuff I had wouldn't last more than a few minutes. Heck, the heavy-duty stuff stuck so good, I had to scrape it off my finger tips! I think it was $6.95 for roll.
That’s the stuff I’m using (red backer film that you peel off, right?) I’ve found I really have to sand and clean the surface to get anything like a good grab. Still, I’d rather have something with a physical connection (i.e. a screw) to hold the connector into place.

After talking to a couple of friends, I’m going to use 3 conductor Servo cables for the power runs, and just ignore the middle wire :-) They’re cheap and widely available.

dave

Re: Connector/cabling ideas?

Chaz Dawkins
 

In the UK Number plate tape from Halfords will stick like the proverbial. From tiles I had to use a paint scraper to remove it

 

From: w4dccqa@groups.io [mailto:w4dccqa@groups.io] On Behalf Of wirefordcc
Sent: 21 May 2020 18:47
To: w4dccqa@groups.io
Subject: Re: [w4dccqa] Connector/cabling ideas?

 

Dave,

I'll think about your problem, but if you like the Wago connectors, you may want to try different double-sided sticky foam tape.

I had some tape I had bought at Radio Shack years ago.  It wouldn't hold down my Frog Juicers and block detectors.

I looked on Amazon and found some heavy-duty outdoor black double-sided sticky foam tape.  It arrived yesterday.  Its only has been in place one day, but we are off to a good start.  The old stuff I had wouldn't last more than a few minutes.  Heck, the heavy-duty stuff stuck so good, I had to scrape it off my finger tips!  I think it was $6.95 for roll.

Other connectors you might try are stereo plugs and jacks.  They are 3 conductor and can be mounted in a panel.  They come 1/8" inch and 1/4" inch.  Also, there are DIN connectors.  These were popular during the CB craze in the '80's.  They also can mount in a panel.  If you want something square that can mount in a panel or glue to your benchwork, there are Cinch-Jones connectors and Molex connectors.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC 

Re: Connector/cabling ideas?

wirefordcc
 

Dave,

I'll think about your problem, but if you like the Wago connectors, you may want to try different double-sided sticky foam tape.

I had some tape I had bought at Radio Shack years ago.  It wouldn't hold down my Frog Juicers and block detectors.

I looked on Amazon and found some heavy-duty outdoor black double-sided sticky foam tape.  It arrived yesterday.  Its only has been in place one day, but we are off to a good start.  The old stuff I had wouldn't last more than a few minutes.  Heck, the heavy-duty stuff stuck so good, I had to scrape it off my finger tips!  I think it was $6.95 for roll.

Other connectors you might try are stereo plugs and jacks.  They are 3 conductor and can be mounted in a panel.  They come 1/8" inch and 1/4" inch.  Also, there are DIN connectors.  These were popular during the CB craze in the '80's.  They also can mount in a panel.  If you want something square that can mount in a panel or glue to your benchwork, there are Cinch-Jones connectors and Molex connectors.

Allan Gartner
Wiring For DCC 

Connector/cabling ideas?

Dave Emery
 

(Not directly DCC, but a related wiring question.)

My switch machines (Tam Valley SwitchWrights) have screw-down connectors for power. What I’d like to do is screw wires into those that have some other kind of connector on the other end, so that I can (a) easily hook up wires for testing and then (b) cable those switch machines into a (5v) power distribution board. The product I’m using for 5v will accept 2 conductor Dupont cables, and I got a kit to make those. But I’d like some sort of connector, either a plug-and-socket connector (like those 3-wire connectors you can get for extending servo cables) or a sonnector that would be easy to screw into the benchwork (so the switch machine and the power supply wires would ‘meet’ at that connector.) I’ve been using Wago connectors for track wiring, the connectors are nice but I have not found a good way to mount those to the benchwork. (double-stick tape doesn’t have enough ‘hold-em’ to where I can easily work the Wago levers.)

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

dave

Re: Layout de Tony

Tom O'Hara
 

I think that you will find later that you will have too much track and not enough room for buildings and scenery. Most of us have made that mistake. Ask your self where you are going to put buildings.

... Tom

On May 20, 2020, at 6:10 PM, Daniel via groups.io <danielnapoli@...> wrote:

Thank Paul for your advice. I am sure that reading the Allan articles about REVERSE it will be not difficult to insert a DCC Reverser.

So, I will go ahead with that layout. I hope it be not a very small layout, or very short of tracks. The baseboard 2,40 x 1,00 metres.

Thank you again

Re: Layout de Tony

Daniel
 

Thank Paul for your advice. I am sure that reading the Allan articles about REVERSE it will be not difficult to insert a DCC Reverser.

So, I will go ahead with that layout. I hope it be not a very small layout, or very short of tracks. The baseboard 2,40 x 1,00 metres.

Thank you again

Battery Saver

Wil Davis
 

I hope this is not too far off topic. I recently received a gift of a bunch of HO Trains. One item puzzled me. It is by Loy’s Toys Caleb a battery saver.  I can’t find out how to upload a picture so will try to create a Battery Saver album. It is a small box which has two unmarked terminals on one end which I presume are to attach a power supply. There are 4 RJ12 type plugs on top and 4 LEDs. Three red and 1 green. I presume one would connect power to the end and plug in throttle cables to charge the batteries. I am convinced it is for Digitrax as I know they consume batteries like a hungry dog!  I tried googling it, but all I found were some listing for other Loy’s Toys products for sale. I know he closed the business years ago. Can someone tell me if my assumption is correct. I have a friend who uses Digitrax and he has trouble maintaining power in his cabs. I would like to be able to tell him what it does without guessing😊.  I have no use for it as I use NCE and get reasonable battery life  p

Wil

Re: Layout de Tony

Paul O
 

Daniel, the only place I see a problem is on the inner yellow track that connects to the red left hand turn out.
It presents a reverse loop. It needs to have insulated rail joiners and needs a DCC reverser.

Paul O

Layout de Tony

Daniel
 

Hello dear people, this is my new layout. I suppose that with the help of Allan´s articles about DCC I´ll be able to wire it with a mínimum of problem. But I would like if someone may help me with some critical or advice about my layout in order I may work out some design fairlure.
I posted two photos with the subject "Layout de Tony". 
Thank you very much

Daniel

(Excuse me, I don´t speak in english)

Re: Wiring at top of helix

Ken Bates
 

Thanks to everyone for the advice, I believe I know what has to be done now.

just need to finish the rest of the helix, didn’t want to finish it and find I couldn’t do what I wanted to.

Ken

Re: Wiring at top of helix

mgj21932
 

Ken the opposite phasing of DCC (while not as serious as the opposing polarity of DC) remains a problem, but is readily solved by wiring your feeders to the helix through an AutoReverse (AR) switch — a bit of magical circuitry that senses the short circuit created as the metal wheels of your loco cross the gap you will have at either end of the reversing segment and automatically switches the DCC phasing to eliminate the short before your in-line circuit breaker trips.  Very neat!  Be sure the length of the AR switched (or protected) track segment is as long as the longest train you plan to run (assuming metal wheels on your cars) and do not wire two AR segments adjacent to one another or they will with themselves until they melt down (at least figuratively). 
Bill Demarest
Mgj21932@...


On May 10, 2020, at 5:29 PM, wirefordcc <bigboy@...> wrote:

Hi Ken,

I didn't see the polarity reversal.  If you have one in your helix than you will likely need an auto reversing section, which could be in your helix, and an auto reversing unit.  

Allan Gartner

Re: Wiring at top of helix

wirefordcc
 

Hi Ken,

I didn't see the polarity reversal.  If you have one in your helix than you will likely need an auto reversing section, which could be in your helix, and an auto reversing unit.  

Allan Gartner

Re: Wiring at top of helix

Ken Bates
 

Is there any route to run trains back on the same track?  No

Where I was worried, is at the top of the helix if a train is then going to run anti-clockwise once it passes the point on level 6 , the outside rail and inside rail are then opposite polarity to what they were on the helix, if this not a problem I shall stop worrying.... 

Same scenario for a train entering the helix from a clockwise direction, what was the outside rail on the running lines is now the inside rail on the helix.

Ken

Re: Wiring at top of helix

Carl
 

Hello Ken:

I looked at your plans. It all looks like strictly one way traffic. Is there any route to run trains back on the same track?

Carl.


On 5/10/2020 8:42 AM, Ken Bates via groups.io wrote:
Hi, I have added 4 photos of drawings into the album Kens Helix. Not sure if they are good enough for the purpose though.

It is a 2 track helix.

At the bottom, the down track just runs to the far end of the fiddle yard and the enters a fan of turnouts.

At the top of the helix on level 6 trains running anti-clockwise will take the turnout to do so, trains running clockwise will continue to level 7 to do so.
In both cases it is about 6 feet from there to the running lines. 

Trains joining the helix to go to the fiddle yard will arrive at level 7 from both anti-clockwise and clockwise directions. Again about 6 feet of track from the running lines.

Not sure if this makes it clearer.

Ken