Date   
Re: How to find the booster common?

ed wilson
 

if it s an NCE booster like the SB5 / DB5 with the plastic case, you can use a screw on the metal back plate

On Mon, Nov 14, 2016 at 9:53 AM, 'Vollrath, Don' don.vollrath@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

Please tell us what brand and model of booster you are using.

Is it being fed from AC (transformer) or a DC power supply?

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 1:33 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Re: How to find the booster common?

 




Alas the case is all plastic...

Op 13 november 2016 7:14:47 p.m. schreef "Kurt kurt.konrath@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...>:

 

A very few of the early booster setups didn't have a ground connection on the main power plug.  So you had to do a case tap. But I can't remember what model booster that was. 

 

Kurt


On Nov 13, 2016, at 9:57 AM, asychis@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

OK, sorry if I supplied the wrong information.  I was always of the opinion you needed to connect a ground to the case.  I can make my installation much cleaner if I can remove the ground wire connected to a screw on the case and use this input.

 

Jerry Michels.







--
Ed Wilson   ewilson248@...

Re: How to find the booster common?

Jan Boen
 

Hi Don, all,

Tams B-3 and powered by normal AC transformer.
For sure I can open the box and start looking for the internal common of the H-bridge that is likely to be there but that is an intrusive way of working and you have to reverse engineer or have the schema's of each and every booster that will come to the event.
So not a solution that can be easily used.
So from what I gather there is no such thing as a common way to implement a booster common if your booster doesn't have this connection.
So instead of implementing this booster common it might be more universal, alas also more expensive, to implement a kind of reversing loop set-up that switches as needed while avoiding "short circuits" between 2 domains.

Any other suggestions are more than welcome :-)


Thanks,


Jan

On 14/11/2016 15:53, 'Vollrath, Don' don.vollrath@... [WiringForDCC] wrote:
 

Please tell us what brand and model of booster you are using.

Is it being fed from AC (transformer) or a DC power supply?

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 1:33 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Re: How to find the booster common?

 




Alas the case is all plastic...

Op 13 november 2016 7:14:47 p.m. schreef "Kurt kurt.konrath@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...>:

 

A very few of the early booster setups didn't have a ground connection on the main power plug.  So you had to do a case tap. But I can't remember what model booster that was. 

 

Kurt


On Nov 13, 2016, at 9:57 AM, asychis@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

OK, sorry if I supplied the wrong information.  I was always of the opinion you needed to connect a ground to the case.  I can make my installation much cleaner if I can remove the ground wire connected to a screw on the case and use this input.

 

Jerry Michels.






Virusvrij. www.avast.com

Re: So many feeders for sectional track??

Puckdropper
 

Run a sub bus from the BDL168 and drop feeders from each rail.  Rail joiners will fail, and they don't always fail by going open circuit.  Sometimes they fail by going high resistance which can play havoc with block detection.

lPuckdropper


---In wiringfordcc@..., <bklyns_baseball_club@...> wrote :

I assume if you are wiring for dcc using a bdl168 that running two wires to each block which are a train length long and attaching to just one point is what's done or does that pair of wires have to be attached to multiple points

Tony


On Nov 12, 2016, at 6:12 AM, puckdropper@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

You can follow a "one feeder every X feet" rule if these conditions apply:
1. The track will not be painted.
2. The track will not be ballasted.
3. You do not plan on keeping the track in place for more than a couple years.
4. The layout is small, for the sake of discussion a layout with a capacity of 1-2 simultaneous operating trains is small.

This will reduce the number of feeders you have to run and attach to the bus, as well as make it easier to remove the track for rearranging later.  When a problem with a rail joiner does occur, you can solder it or jumper around it.  Problems like that are infrequent enough that on a small layout it's much easier to fix each problem as it arise than it is to prevent the problem from occurring in the first place.

When any of the conditions above becomes true, you'll need to follow the "one feeder per rail" rule.  I've seen painted track suddenly quit working, it's just because the paint got into the parts that were making contact and now they aren't.

Puckdropper




---In wiringfordcc@..., <ryenpreston@...> wrote :

I have a small 4 x 6 layout that uses Atlas 83 sectional track. I want to solder a feeder to every piece of track so I don't have to worry about the joiners failing. How much soldering of track joiner joints can I get away with so I don't have to run so many feeders. I have a number of short pieces (3-4 inches and the longer at 9 inches).


Re: So many feeders for sectional track??

Glenn
 

Skip soldering the joiners and adding drops.

 

Instead solder a short jumper across the rail joint. Use stranded wire, 22ga should be OK for your layout. Put a small bow in the jumper to allow for expansion and contraction. And if you are really good at soldering, put the jumper on the side of the rail away from the viewer's eye. This means on the inside of the rail.

 

BTW: this is prototypical

 

Glenn

 

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2016 10:49
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] So many feeders for sectional track??

 

I have a small 4 x 6 layout that uses Atlas 83 sectional track. I want to solder a feeder to every piece of track so I don't have to worry about the joiners failing. How much soldering of track joiner joints can I get away with so I don't have to run so many feeders. I have a number of short pieces (3-4 inches and the longer at 9 inches).

 

 

 

Re: So many feeders for sectional track??

Steve Haas
 



<<Skip soldering the joiners and adding drops.>>

 

<<Instead solder a short jumper across the rail joint. Use stranded wire, 22ga should be OK for your layout. Put a small bow in the jumper to allow for expansion and contraction. And if you are really good at soldering, put the jumper on the side of the rail away from the viewer's eye. This means on the inside of the rail.>>

 

For the short sections of track, soldering a jumper across a gap as Glenn has suggested can work, and is preferable in the long run to soldering the rail joiners themselves.

 

Unless you have an environmentally stable layout room, and/or use only benchwork and roadbed materials not impacted by temperature and/or humidity, rail joiners will fail sooner or later (soldered or otherwise).  

 

<<BTW: this is prototypical>>

 

Yes, but usually far out of proportion in relation to the size of the track.  Far better to drill a hole through the roadbed on either side of the gap, drop a feeder down through one hold and up in the other, soldering both wires to their respective sections of track.

 

Best practice is to always run feeders direct to each section of rail; this is the most reliable, fool proof method of ensuring both voltage and DCC signal always make it to the engine you are operating. The odds of a wire to rail solder connection failing, while not zero, is much lower than the failure rate of rail joiners, soldered or otherwise.

 

The folks who provide input and support on the various DCC lists advocate the use of “best practices” for a reason; each layout and its wiring is unique and from a distance we can’t tell if a layout can get away with less than those “best practices”.  

 

There is a lot of anecdotal evidence that many a layout has performed well with wiring that doesn’t rise to these best practices.  While the experiences of those layout owners are real, the reality is that experience can change at any time as the passage of time corrodes the connections they are depending on.

 

Back in the early years, as early adapters converted to DCC, the question was often asked; “Do I need to rewire my layout before implementing DCC?”  The response at the time was “plug it in and give it a try, see what happens, then make updates to the wiring as needed”.  Depending on the specifics of the layout, the changes ranged from no changes needed, to a complete rewiring.

 

If one is going to skip on wiring/standards/quality, do it in areas where it will be easily accessible to come back and do it right later.  Keep in mind that “later” means sometime down the road when you and your layout helpers find it exponentially more difficult to crawl under a layout than it is today.  If you must take short cuts, take them in places that are easily reached for correction some time down the road.

 

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

 

Steve Haas

Snoqualmie, WA

Re: So many feeders for sectional track??

Mark Cartwright
 

Verryl,
Thank you for your post....I had not considered using a Jewelry Tig Welder until you mentioned it.
Jewelry Welder from TheRingLord.com

 

I am strongly considering all that was said here.
:)) Mark

Best wire strippers?

Ryan Hulsey <ryenpreston@...>
 

What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.

Re: So many feeders for sectional track??

Glenn
 

While the jumper is below the roadbed, solder a feeder wire to it. Then you can skip every other rail joint.

 

Way back when I was just a young one I did track planning with sectional track. When I arrived at the desired route I pulled the track leaving the switches, then replaced the track with flex track.

 

I only had a little more than a large oval of sectional track to work with so the layout developed over a period of time.

 

Glenn

 

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2016 16:00
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: RE: [WiringForDCC] So many feeders for sectional track??

 

 

Far better to drill a hole through the roadbed on either side of the gap, drop a feeder down through one hold and up in the other, soldering both wires to their respective sections of track.

 

Re: Best wire strippers?

RONALD ST.LAURENT
 

Ryan,

Here's a link to the type of wire stripper you want. Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper There are many manufacturers for this type of stripper.  What it does is move the insulation to expose bare wire in the middle of your run or anyplace else along the wire including the end.  In other words it does not remove the insulation per se but actually cuts the insulation and "compresses" it on each side exposing wire for you to make your connections.

Ron




On Tuesday, November 22, 2016 9:40 AM, "Ryan Hulsey ryenpreston@... [WiringForDCC]" wrote:


 
What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.




Re: Best wire strippers?

Mark Stamm
 

I have a pair from Southwire that I picked up at Lowes. They worked well for me on 14 gauge stranded wire. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Southwire-Wire-Strippers/50081506

That said I decided I liked suitcase connectors better and have been using them instead. The December MR has good article and you can find them on eBay for good prices. I mainly use the 3M 905 type. 

Mark P Stamm
Mark at Euphoriatt dot Com

Sent from my mobile device

Re: Best wire strippers?

Kevin Reeve
 

I used one just like this that Ron suggests to do my feeders on my 12 guage bus wire.  It works well.

Mine came from Radio Shack many years ago, however I see Lowes has them as well as many places online.

 

Kevin

 

 

From: <WiringForDCC@...> on behalf of "'Ron St.Laurent' r.stlaurent@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...>
Reply-To: "WiringForDCC@..." <WiringForDCC@...>
Date: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 at 9:21 AM
To: "WiringForDCC@..." <WiringForDCC@...>
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?

 

 

Ryan,

 

Here's a link to the type of wire stripper you want. Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper There are many manufacturers for this type of stripper.  What it does is move the insulation to expose bare wire in the middle of your run or anyplace else along the wire including the end.  In other words it does not remove the insulation per se but actually cuts the insulation and "compresses" it on each side exposing wire for you to make your connections.

 

Ron

 

Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper

Use this wire stripper to strip 12-26 gauge wire

 

 

On Tuesday, November 22, 2016 9:40 AM, "Ryan Hulsey ryenpreston@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

 

What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.

 

Re: Best wire strippers?

Cheryl Gale-Multz
 

I bought this one (actually two of them for $25) at the National Train show this past summer.. Works great! It strips 12-30 ga and the smaller unit that came with it does smaller wires..








On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 9:56 AM, "Kevin Reeve kevin.reeve@... [WiringForDCC]" wrote:


 
I used one just like this that Ron suggests to do my feeders on my 12 guage bus wire.  It works well.
Mine came from Radio Shack many years ago, however I see Lowes has them as well as many places online.
 
Kevin
 
 
From: on behalf of "'Ron St.Laurent' r.stlaurent@... [WiringForDCC]"
Reply-To: "WiringForDCC@..."
Date: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 at 9:21 AM
To: "WiringForDCC@..."
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?
 
 
Ryan,
 
Here's a link to the type of wire stripper you want. Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper There are many manufacturers for this type of stripper.  What it does is move the insulation to expose bare wire in the middle of your run or anyplace else along the wire including the end.  In other words it does not remove the insulation per se but actually cuts the insulation and "compresses" it on each side exposing wire for you to make your connections.
 
Ron
 

Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper

Use this wire stripper to strip 12-26 gauge wire
 
 
On Tuesday, November 22, 2016 9:40 AM, "Ryan Hulsey ryenpreston@... [WiringForDCC]" wrote:
 
 
What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.

 


Re: Best wire strippers?

Jim Sturcbecher
 

Hi,

 

If you are looking for a tool that can strip wire in the middle of a run,

then look at the following:

 

jokari dbp 1907711

 

It is not easy to find one of these but they are well worth it when you do.

These strippers will allow you to cut the insulation in the middle of the run

and carefully expose the wire underneath. The amount of wire that can

be exposed is limited by the elasticity of the insulation. However, it is

normally possible to expose enough to be able to solder another wire to

the exposed wire.

 

Jim S.

Re: Best wire strippers?

Glenn
 

I would be careful with the T-Rex from Amazon. I have two look a likes and they do a great job until you release your grip. I would not say they all would, but mine did not release the wire before returning to normal and smashed stranded with into a tree armature or make a hook in solid wire.

 

The Southwire one was in the techie’s tool box at work. I never used it, but had to order a replacement after it went gone astray. I never heard any complaints.

 

Glenn

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2016 10:21
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?

 




I bought this one (actually two of them for $25) at the National Train show this past summer.. Works great! It strips 12-30 ga and the smaller unit that came with it does smaller wires..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 9:56 AM, "Kevin Reeve kevin.reeve@... [WiringForDCC]" wrote:

 

 

I used one just like this that Ron suggests to do my feeders on my 12 guage bus wire.  It works well.

Mine came from Radio Shack many years ago, however I see Lowes has them as well as many places online.

 

Kevin

 

 

From: on behalf of "'Ron St.Laurent' r.stlaurent@... [WiringForDCC]"
Reply-To: "WiringForDCC@..."
Date: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 at 9:21 AM
To: "WiringForDCC@..."
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?

 

 

Ryan,

 

Here's a link to the type of wire stripper you want. Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper There are many manufacturers for this type of stripper.  What it does is move the insulation to expose bare wire in the middle of your run or anyplace else along the wire including the end.  In other words it does not remove the insulation per se but actually cuts the insulation and "compresses" it on each side exposing wire for you to make your connections.

 

Ron

 

 

 

 

Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper

Use this wire stripper to strip 12-26 gauge wire

 

 

 

On Tuesday, November 22, 2016 9:40 AM, "Ryan Hulsey ryenpreston@... [WiringForDCC]" wrote:

 

 

What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.

 

 


Re: Best wire strippers?

Chris Killgore
 

I used Klein when I worked, and still do.  Still work great for this.

Chris


On Nov 23, 2016 2:39 PM, "'Glenn' ghazel@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:
 

I would be careful with the T-Rex from Amazon. I have two look a likes and they do a great job until you release your grip. I would not say they all would, but mine did not release the wire before returning to normal and smashed stranded with into a tree armature or make a hook in solid wire.

 

The Southwire one was in the techie’s tool box at work. I never used it, but had to order a replacement after it went gone astray. I never heard any complaints.

 

Glenn

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2016 10:21
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?

 




I bought this one (actually two of them for $25) at the National Train show this past summer.. Works great! It strips 12-30 ga and the smaller unit that came with it does smaller wires..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 9:56 AM, "Kevin Reeve kevin.reeve@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

 

I used one just like this that Ron suggests to do my feeders on my 12 guage bus wire.  It works well.

Mine came from Radio Shack many years ago, however I see Lowes has them as well as many places online.

 

Kevin

 

 

From: <WiringForDCC@...> on behalf of "'Ron St.Laurent' r.stlaurent@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...>
Reply-To: "WiringForDCC@..." <WiringForDCC@...>
Date: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 at 9:21 AM
To: "WiringForDCC@..." <WiringForDCC@...>
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Best wire strippers?

 

 

Ryan,

 

Here's a link to the type of wire stripper you want. Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper There are many manufacturers for this type of stripper.  What it does is move the insulation to expose bare wire in the middle of your run or anyplace else along the wire including the end.  In other words it does not remove the insulation per se but actually cuts the insulation and "compresses" it on each side exposing wire for you to make your connections.

 

Ron

 

 

 

 

Heavy Duty Self-Adjusting Wire Stripper

Use this wire stripper to strip 12-26 gauge wire

 

 

 

On Tuesday, November 22, 2016 9:40 AM, "Ryan Hulsey ryenpreston@... [WiringForDCC]" <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

 

What is the best way to remove sections of insulation in the middle of the buss wire so I can connect and solder my feeders to it? I have heard of wire strippers that are able to remove sections of insulation in the middle of wire.

 

 


Optimized Digitrax Loconet

asychis@...
 

Optimizing Loconet at the Amarillo Railroad Museum is a very high priority.  We have a large Digitrax-equipped layout that will eventually use a command station and six boosters, around 20 PM42s, numerous UP5s, detectors, etc.  Reading the great information on the internet and this site, we are trying to make sure we have our Loconet up to the highest standards possible.  However, there are still a few nagging questions.

We took to heart Allan Gartner’s Wiring for DCC site, and have ensured that all of components are grounded together.  We prefer to use a heavy ground wire, so we use case attachments on the command station and boosters since this is easier and more secure than using the tiny Digitrax connectors. I will call this the system ground for clarity.

We have also separated the throttles and all other components into a Loconet throttle network and a Loconet booster network, respectively.

Reading Gartner’s site, he suggests strongly that if you use the system ground, you need to cut wires 2 and 5 in the Loconet booster network cable to prevent ground loops.  We have not done this yet, which leads to the current concern.

On another site, rr-cirkits.com, a suggestion is made to cut wires 3 and 4, the Loconet wires on the throttle network, and separating the power supply on the throttle network from the command station, cutting wires 1 and 6 on the throttle network and adding a separate 12-volt power supply connected to the throttle network and the wire 5 ground.  This circuit diagram shows the booster network ground in place. I take it this site either does not recommend or is unfamiliar with Gartner’s separate system ground procedure.  The rr-cirkit.com site also shows a connection between wires 3 and 4 on the throttle network, which I do not understand.

OK, so with all that in mind, is one of these systems better than the other, or can the two be combined, that is, using Gartner’s system ground, removing the booster network ground and adding the separate 12-volt supply to the throttle network? If you can combine the two systems, then the booster network would only have the two Railsync wires; 1 and 6

We are assuming, regardless of the procedure used, that only throttles and respective UP5s be connected to the throttle network and the command station, boosters, PM42s, detection boards (in our case Team Digital Bloc8s), and other devices be connected to the booster network, correct?

Jerry Michels

Re: Optimized Digitrax Loconet

Kurt Konrath
 

Jerry. Your basis assumptions are correct about common ground, but some units like PM42's I believe should also be connected into the common wire. 

I and most all the people I run with use full six wire Loconet cables.  Never had ground loop problems unless you make full complete circle in the Loconet cables.   Always leave last unit plugged in to one end of the line to deadens the circuit.  If you had a full circle layout or square just don't connect ends together where the come to meet. 

Per standards I have learned from great Digitrax people at two National Train shows, you are correct in having a separate booster and power control Loconet "backbone" to controls all power related items. 

Also having a separate network for throttles is important. 

Have you thought of installing Loconet Repeaters (LNRP's) with each booster?

With our modular setups we have one LNRP with each booster. The power backbone connects all of them and the connect to boosters. 

Also each power district has a matched Throttle district connected to the unprotected side of the LNRP.  

This keeps problems isolated to specific districts as a bad throttle plug on one side won't short the whole layout. 

Make stable system and trouble shooting easier

Kurt Konrath
OK Free-mo



On Nov 23, 2016, at 11:40 PM, asychis@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

Optimizing Loconet at the Amarillo Railroad Museum is a very high priority.  We have a large Digitrax-equipped layout that will eventually use a command station and six boosters, around 20 PM42s, numerous UP5s, detectors, etc.  Reading the great information on the internet and this site, we are trying to make sure we have our Loconet up to the highest standards possible.  However, there are still a few nagging questions.

We took to heart Allan Gartner’s Wiring for DCC site, and have ensured that all of components are grounded together.  We prefer to use a heavy ground wire, so we use case attachments on the command station and boosters since this is easier and more secure than using the tiny Digitrax connectors. I will call this the system ground for clarity.

We have also separated the throttles and all other components into a Loconet throttle network and a Loconet booster network, respectively.

Reading Gartner’s site, he suggests strongly that if you use the system ground, you need to cut wires 2 and 5 in the Loconet booster network cable to prevent ground loops.  We have not done this yet, which leads to the current concern.

On another site, rr-cirkits.com, a suggestion is made to cut wires 3 and 4, the Loconet wires on the throttle network, and separating the power supply on the throttle network from the command station, cutting wires 1 and 6 on the throttle network and adding a separate 12-volt power supply connected to the throttle network and the wire 5 ground.  This circuit diagram shows the booster network ground in place. I take it this site either does not recommend or is unfamiliar with Gartner’s separate system ground procedure.  The rr-cirkit.com site also shows a connection between wires 3 and 4 on the throttle network, which I do not understand.

OK, so with all that in mind, is one of these systems better than the other, or can the two be combined, that is, using Gartner’s system ground, removing the booster network ground and adding the separate 12-volt supply to the throttle network? If you can combine the two systems, then the booster network would only have the two Railsync wires; 1 and 6

We are assuming, regardless of the procedure used, that only throttles and respective UP5s be connected to the throttle network and the command station, boosters, PM42s, detection boards (in our case Team Digital Bloc8s), and other devices be connected to the booster network, correct?

Jerry Michels

Re: Optimized Digitrax Loconet

asychis@...
 

Thanks Kurt,  This is good information.  I am pretty busy getting ready for 20 or so Thanksgiving guests.  I will reply in detail later on.  Thanks again, and Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours.
 
Are you in Oklahoma?
 
Jerry Michels

TRAINS

aztecmfg@...
 

 


Happy Thanksgiving

       John Claudino

      aztectrains .com


Re: Optimized Digitrax Loconet

Kurt Konrath
 

That I am.  In Oklahoma City as a fact

Kurt


On Nov 24, 2016, at 7:37 AM, asychis@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

Thanks Kurt,  This is good information.  I am pretty busy getting ready for 20 or so Thanksgiving guests.  I will reply in detail later on.  Thanks again, and Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours.
 
Are you in Oklahoma?
 
Jerry Michels