Date   

Re: short reversing section

Richard Sutcliffe
 

Shorten the trains??

On Jul 26, 2015, at 7:45 AM, Kenneth Burr kennburr@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

I know my reversing sections should be longer than my longest train, but what are my best options when it isn't?
Ken Burr



Re: Advice on Team Digital Setup

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Output drivers on the BlocD8 are open collectors. By leaving pin 6 unconnected on the BlocD8 the user is free to operate the outputs at a different voltage, provided the user somehow connects it up. The how to do it info is missing from the T-D manual. I traced out the connections on the PCB. The rectified track voltage is available at yet another solder pick-off point. The individual outputs can alternately be controlled by CV programming to respond to commands over the serial link. Notice the relay example in the manual. In my case I powered pin 6 from rectified track volts and added a few external parts to operate a lone remote Tortoise motor. That has nothing to do with occupancy. I don’t use the other output channels, just serial link occupancy info.

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 7:23 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: Advice on Team Digital Setup

 




Thanks Don,  this is very helpful.  That tip on soldering a wire across those solder pads to get +5V on pin 6 is excellent!  That saves a lot of wiring back to the power source. Wonder why Team Digital didn't think of that since the pads are already there? Jerry





Re: short reversing section

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

The risk of a too short reversing section is that sooner or later you will end up with steel wheels and/or electrically connected axles bridging the gaps at both ends of the A-R section at the same time, causing a short circuit.

Options:

1.      Make the reversing section longer than your longest consist and have no following cars or locos that also have power pick-up connections between axles. (like passenger cars)

2.      Use isolating gaps in the rails that are filled with plastic so that there is no chance of a steel wheel on a following car falling into the gap and touching both sides of the gap.

3.      There are several relay controlled schemes for Short Track Reverser controls. Look in the files section of this forum. They all have their own rules and potential drawbacks. My analysis of the Loy’s Toy’s unit (no longer available, but can be hand duplicated) is that it does work when wired up and used correctly.

4.      Re-examine the layout to see if the A-R section can be moved to a different track section or extended, perhaps including a turnout with the turnout position also controlling a relay that swaps track connections from mainline to A-R to effectively make the A-R section longer over the selected path.

If you can post or send me a sketch of the layout by e-mail I might be able to make suggestions.

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 9:46 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] short reversing section

 




I know my reversing sections should be longer than my longest train, but what are my best options when it isn't?

Ken Burr





short reversing section

Kenneth Burr
 

I know my reversing sections should be longer than my longest train, but what are my best options when it isn't?
Ken Burr


Re: Advice on Team Digital Setup

Federico Carminati
 

Touché ….

Federico Carminati
Diplomate à Genève
29 av Ste Cécile
1217 Meyrin
Switzerland/Suisse
Tel: +41797732246
Fax: +41227668505

On 26 Jul 2015, at 14:22, asychis@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

 

Thanks Don,  this is very helpful.  That tip on soldering a wire across those solder pads to get +5V on pin 6 is excellent!  That saves a lot of wiring back to the power source. Wonder why Team Digital didn't think of that since the pads are already there? Jerry



Re: ANOTHER AUTO REVERSE LOOP QUESTION

pbeinert@...
 

Ed,   
    Diagrams make it some much easier for me :).
I agree with DonV as long as trains aren't crossing more than 1 set of gaps at a time, you should have no issues.

Paul


Re: Advice on Team Digital Setup

asychis@...
 

Thanks Don,  this is very helpful.  That tip on soldering a wire across those solder pads to get +5V on pin 6 is excellent!  That saves a lot of wiring back to the power source. Wonder why Team Digital didn't think of that since the pads are already there? Jerry


Re: ANOTHER AUTO REVERSE LOOP QUESTION

Ed
 

Got it.  Thanks Don.

Ed Robinson


Re: ANOTHER AUTO REVERSE LOOP QUESTION

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

As long as there is only one train crossing the A-R isolating gaps at a time, there should be no issues.

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 11:47 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] ANOTHER AUTO REVERSE LOOP QUESTION

 



My reverse loop has a second entry point back to the main on one side of the loop only (see diagram in reverse loop file folder under "ESR reverse loop").  This looks like it should perform OK.  Does anyone see issues with this setup?

Ed Robinson

 





ANOTHER AUTO REVERSE LOOP QUESTION

Ed
 

My reverse loop has a second entry point back to the main on one side of the loop only (see diagram in reverse loop file folder under "ESR reverse loop").  This looks like it should perform OK.  Does anyone see issues with this setup?

Ed Robinson



New file uploaded to WiringForDCC

WiringForDCC@...
 

Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the WiringForDCC
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File : /ReverseLoops/ESR Reverse Loop.jpg
Uploaded by : esmileyrob <lehighman@gmail.com>
Description : Reverse loop with double entry on one side


You can access this file at the URL:
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Regards,


esmileyrob <lehighman@gmail.com>


Re: Advice on Team Digital Setup

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Jerry,

 

The TD BlocD8 header pin-out is shown on p 8-9 of their tech manual. Their TSA adapter board plugs right on to the 10 pin output header connector and has a 470 ohm resistor between each output pin/channel and the screw terminals. Terminals 1-4 and 7-10 are the individual output channels that essentially pull their respective output line to gnd/common at pin 5 on the PCB (through the 470 ohm resistor) when that channel senses current in the CT. However, as furnished there is no +V power source on pin 6 of the BlocD8. You need to add a wire to connect the two solder pads marked with a + sign to get +5V on pin/terminal 6. [One near the standing up capacitors and the other near the PCB edge opposite end of the power terminals.] Verify that there is +5V on pin 6 relative to pin 5. Then if you simply connect the anode of an LED to TSA terminal 6 and the cathode to any other terminal it should light up when that channel senses current.  If you plug on the TSA in the opposite direction, the +5V supply and gnd/common terminals, as well as the other numbered output channel terminals swap places. The output driver is an open collector type  ULN2803.

 

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 9:05 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Advice on Team Digital Setup

 




Hi Folks,  I am using Team Digital BlocD8 detectors and would like to use their Terminal Strip Adapters (TSA) to connect LEDs to the output.  I am having a problem understanding just how to do this.  Would anyone have a diagram or a description of how they have done this? I don't know how to start the conversation, the diagrams in the BlocD8 and TSA manuals seem to odds to me.

 

Thanks.

 

Jerry Michels





Advice on Team Digital Setup

asychis@...
 

Hi Folks,  I am using Team Digital BlocD8 detectors and would like to use their Terminal Strip Adapters (TSA) to connect LEDs to the output.  I am having a problem understanding just how to do this.  Would anyone have a diagram or a description of how they have done this? I don't know how to start the conversation, the diagrams in the BlocD8 and TSA manuals seem to odds to me.
 
Thanks.
 
Jerry Michels


Re: AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

pbeinert@...
 

Ed,
   Are you looking at adding:
A: a wye ( a switch ) to lead into a stub or
B: a wye ( a triangular reversing module with 3 switches ) and one side of the wye (two of the switches) on the current reversing loop
C: some other configuration

Situation A should be a non-issues and could be feed with the power from the existing PSX-AR.
In situation B, I would have the switches coming off of the existing reversing loop be part of the current reversing loop, then the other two sides of the wye would be connected to one of my PSX's and the third wye (switch and and track attached to it) connected a new PSX-AR.

Paul


Re: AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

The simplest method as Mark suggested, pending no multiple train/operator interference, is to isolate and wire up the wye turnout and stub track to be fixed polarity. Source that power directly from an existing mainline DCC circuit. Even then you might have to fiddle with the PSX-AR adjustments to ensure that it flips the AR track polarity to suit before any other circuit breakers trip. But the PSX-AR should be doing that now.

 

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 12:37 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

 



Thanks Mark and Don.  I suspected there may be some interaction that was not desired.  I will look more closely at your suggestions before I move on with my project.

Ed Robinson



Re: AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

Ed
 

Thanks Mark and Don.  I suspected there may be some interaction that was not desired.  I will look more closely at your suggestions before I move on with my project.

Ed Robinson


Re: AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

Mark Gurries
 

Although it is possible with the PSX-AR to work together with another PSX-AR and get it working…I would only do that as a last resort.


I would go with the throw bar method of determining polarity as Don indicated first.  If you use a tortoise to set the polarity, do so with the tortoise controlling a DPDT relay.  The Tortoise is, by design slow, and during the action of throwing the track polarity using it contact, you will temporally lose power on the stub track as it throws.  If you have a sound decoder, it might effect the sound.  The relay also solves the low contact current rating issue of running high DCC current through the contact.

Another thought which is the cheapest solution BUT would depend on how you operate you layout is to NOT put the stub and why do any autoreversing and let the existing PSX-AR deal with the problem.  Power the why and stub track with a regular DCC power form another DCC circuit breaker.  The only catch is you cannot have more than one train enter or leave the PSX-AR loop at the same time which will now include the train on the stub.  If you a one man train operator, this solution will work well.


On Jul 22, 2015, at 4:17 AM, lehighman@... [WiringForDCC] <WiringForDCC@...> wrote:

I have a long reverse loop on my layout that is managed by a PSX-AR.  I would like to add a wye module at the far end to service a quarry.  Can I just hookup another PSX-AR for that section or will a PSX-AR operating within another's district cause issues?

Ed Robinson



Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com




Re: AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Ed, If you use another PSX-AR you should be able to adjust the sensitivity/timing to ensure that the one feeding the wye stub & turnout flips first. Another option would be to forgo the PSX-AR for the wye stub and simply use the throwbar position of the turnout feeding the stub to determine the polarity via DPDT contacts of a Tortoise or a separate relay… or even a manual toggle switch… fed from the original reversing track power.

 

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 6:18 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

 



I have a long reverse loop on my layout that is managed by a PSX-AR.  I would like to add a wye module at the far end to service a quarry.  Can I just hookup another PSX-AR for that section or will a PSX-AR operating within another's district cause issues?

Ed Robinson

 





AUTO REVERSER CIRCUITS

Ed
 

I have a long reverse loop on my layout that is managed by a PSX-AR.  I would like to add a wye module at the far end to service a quarry.  Can I just hookup another PSX-AR for that section or will a PSX-AR operating within another's district cause issues?

Ed Robinson



Re: Reverse Polarity at Edge of Power District

pbeinert@...
 

Mark,
   The lack of a good diagram for RicZ's wiring issue makes it difficult as I cannot make sense of the ###---/// symbology.

I knew I should have checked on the terminology (Power vs Booster) before I posted but it was easy enough to see that both examples have  5 power districts with example 1 being single Booster District and example 2 being 2 Booster Districts.

I believe that by definition, all reversing loops are power districts and thus go right up to the edge of the district.  What I did not read was that it was two reversing loops edge to edge and so did not see why you said that he would have difficulties.

Paul

P.S. Your site is great, I studied the dickens out of it before I put together my wiring plan.

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