Date   
Re: Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Interesting how the discussion in a forum sways back and forth.
What Ed seemed to want was a mushroom head e-stop button to disconnect all power to the layout, maybe one with multiple stations. Not sure why he wanted it but it is his RR. Seemed to already have found one on e-bay.
From there it diverged into using D-I-Y relays (some at 120V no less) or the commercially available X-10 controls or even the 'clapper'.
Then a note or two about killing only the DCC track power.
Then several methods of built-in e-stop features of various brand 'throttles' to stop a locomotive and/or possibly all DCC track voltage.
Then to using a single switch to control not only the layout, but also room lighting.
Soon we will be discussing using cannibalized IR motion detectors from an outdoor light fixture to automatically kill whole room power when leaving for grandma's house. (Or was that on a different forum?)
Someone opens the door and the ideas just pour in! Enjoy.

Please don't fiddle with 120Vac power wiring (220V for you guys down under) unless you really know what you are doing, and your local inspector and insurance company agrees.

DonV

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of David Heine
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2014 10:39 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: RE: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant

My basement layout is powered off on one 20A circuit that is used for layout power only, and I have a one 20A rated switch that turns off all the layout power. I have receptacles around the layout off that switched circuit, but most of the layout is powered off one central area. If I wanted multiple locations to kill the total layout power, I would use switches to operate a relay with a low voltage coil to shut off the power to that circuit.

I have more than one layout lighting circuit, but I installed a contactor and it is wired so that one switch turns off all the lights for the layout and my workshop area. I have other switches installed so that if don't need to have all the layout lights on if I am only working in one area of the layout.

Dave Heine
Easton, PA

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of Ed S
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2014 9:47 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: RE: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant


The thinking has narrowed down to turning off the DCC portion of a layout. I started this thread thinking of a catastrophic failure somewhere on the layout. Lots of accessories are powered and a lot of lighting...... large transformers to boosters, etc.

When I smell smoke I don't want to spend time looking for where. I just want all the electricity OFF.

I will have one 120v feed to the layout, I want to chop it off at the source then do the trouble shooting later.

Ed S





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http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo Groups Links







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Re: Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant

David Heine <davesn3@...>
 

My basement layout is powered off on one 20A circuit that is used for layout
power only, and I have a one 20A rated switch that turns off all the layout
power. I have receptacles around the layout off that switched circuit, but
most of the layout is powered off one central area. If I wanted multiple
locations to kill the total layout power, I would use switches to operate a
relay with a low voltage coil to shut off the power to that circuit.

I have more than one layout lighting circuit, but I installed a contactor
and it is wired so that one switch turns off all the lights for the layout
and my workshop area. I have other switches installed so that if don't need
to have all the layout lights on if I am only working in one area of the
layout.

Dave Heine
Easton, PA

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On
Behalf Of Ed S
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2014 9:47 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: RE: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant


The thinking has narrowed down to turning off the DCC portion of a layout. I
started this thread thinking of a catastrophic failure somewhere on the
layout. Lots of accessories are powered and a lot of lighting...... large
transformers to boosters, etc.

When I smell smoke I don't want to spend time looking for where. I just
want all the electricity OFF.

I will have one 120v feed to the layout, I want to chop it off at the source
then do the trouble shooting later.

Ed S





------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo Groups Links

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Flash Gordon
 

Glenn,

You  are correct, it took a month to get my  ESB but when you are retired you tend to plan ahead, and you really don't even know what day of the week it is. But it arrived all ready to go, no assembly or painting required.

If you remember the Ren an Stimpy show, this is my "end of the world button" and it will be mounted on the main control board.

Ed S


At 10:03 AM 2/13/2014, you wrote:
 

Not to nit-pick but: Switch .75, box, .39, cover .25

 

I was not concerned about cost as much as availability. These items can be found at any home center or hardware store.

 

The �Real� thing is hard to find locally.

 

I did look at the eBay vendor cited other items and found this 5-pack

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111146956435?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

 

If I bought today I wouldn�t receive them until between March 4th and 20th.

 

Glenn

 

Just Out of Curiosity

Glenn
 

Have you ever wondered how much time you spend on running trains?

While searching through the item of the seller of Ed's switch I found this
item.

Hour Meter
http://www.ebay.com/itm/111146953956?var=410204514930&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:
IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

eBay item number: 111146953956

I previously installed one on my tractor so I would know when an oil change
was due. It cost me $40 plus $11 for the adaptive wiring harness.

This one can connect to the track leads or via a wall-wart to a power strip.

Glenn

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Glenn
 

Not to nit-pick but: Switch .75, box, .39, cover .25

 

I was not concerned about cost as much as availability. These items can be found at any home center or hardware store.

 

The “Real” thing is hard to find locally.

 

I did look at the eBay vendor cited other items and found this 5-pack

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111146956435?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

 

If I bought today I wouldn’t receive them until between March 4th and 20th.

 

Glenn

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of Ed S
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2014 09:41
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- IMHO

 




Glen,

The Emergency stop switch I bought is probably about as expensive as the parts you need.

It is already assembled, painted and labeled. It is obvious to what it is. Ready for surface mount ( there are punch-outs in the bottom) and it looks very professional. All I have to do is stick a wire in it.

You could use several in series.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130970913952?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

Ed S



 

At 05:48 AM 2/12/2014, you wrote:

 

 

Materials:

            Economy light switches. Look for them in bulk boxes at the home centers. They are about a third the cost of the boxed variety.

            Junction boxes. I typically use the blue plastic 1x2.5x3.5 box. I drill two small holes about 3/8 in from the front and mount them with drywall screws. The will take the standard switch or outlet.

            Cover plate. Get the typical face plate, rough sand it, definitely prime with a solvent based prime, and paint it what ever color you desire.

            Wire. Two-wire household wire is fine since it is a closed loop.

 

Glenn


Re: Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant

Flash Gordon
 

The thinking has narrowed down to turning off the
DCC portion of a layout. I started this thread
thinking of a catastrophic failure somewhere on
the layout. Lots of accessories are powered and a
lot of lighting...... large transformers to boosters, etc.

When I smell smoke I don’t want to spend time
looking for where… I just want all the electricity OFF.

I will have one 120v feed to the layout, I want
to chop it off at the source then do the trouble shooting later.

Ed S

Re: Emergency stop button -- Annuder Variant

Glenn
 

On a different take get an Atlas Snap relay (#200) and put it between the system and the track. Place push buttons in appropriate places around the layout.

 

Wire the control so when the emergency button is pressed it will interrupt power to the track. Put a reset push button someplace so you can reconnect power when the problem is cleared. It is not a true relay as it does not automatically return to it original position.

 

Since the Snap Relay is a DPDT switch when the power is interrupted from the track, the DCC power could be diverted to a set of flashing lights to indicate the emergency stop had been activate.

 

This set up eliminates fussing with the 120V power.

 

The relay is #200 in the Atlas line. A new one will cost $12, but I have seen them on eBay for $1.

 

Glenn

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Glenn
 

Carl is right. I didn’t have my coffee yet J

 

Glenn

 

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of Carl
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2014 10:37
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- IMHO

 



Hello Glenn:

If you are in the United States, the switches should always be in the Black Wire. The White Wire is neutral and at the breaker panel is connected to earth ground. You want to stop the voltage in the Black Wire so after the switch there is no risk of shock to ground.

Guards over the toggles would be nice, or recess them.

The nice thing about the industrial Emergency Stop Buttons is it only take a push to trigger them. But to reset them you must twist and pull the knob out, so it takes a special effort to restore power.

Carl.

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

wirefordcc
 

If you have a Digitrax system, the DT402 throttles have an e-stop on them.


Allan


Re: BDL168 & Peco & Power routing

hotrains@...
 

Thanks for clarifying the terms Don.


Jim McMahon

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

On a smaller one booster layout, You can also wire the e-stop button chain to interrupts only DCC power to the rails and not fiddle with primary 120Vac wiring.

DonV

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of Carl
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2014 9:37 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Emergency stop button -- IMHO

 



Hello Glenn:

If you are in the United States, the switches should always be in the Black Wire. The White Wire is neutral and at the breaker panel is connected to earth ground. You want to stop the voltage in the Black Wire so after the switch there is no risk of shock to ground.

Guards over the toggles would be nice, or recess them.

The nice thing about the industrial Emergency Stop Buttons is it only take a push to trigger them. But to reset them you must twist and pull the knob out, so it takes a special effort to restore power.

Carl.

On 2/12/2014 5:48 AM, Glenn wrote:

 

Cut the switches into the white wire, and wire the black wires together in each box. At the last switch in the string connect white wire to the switch and the black wire to the switch to the other side. Power will run through the switches and return to the source via the black wire.

 

At the source (hear I am assuming you use a power strip) connect the white (switched) wire to the white side of the power cord on the plug side. Connect the black side to the white wire going to the power strip outlets or what ever you use to plug your “Track” power into.

 





Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Carl
 

Hello Glenn:

If you are in the United States, the switches should always be in the Black Wire. The White Wire is neutral and at the breaker panel is connected to earth ground. You want to stop the voltage in the Black Wire so after the switch there is no risk of shock to ground.

Guards over the toggles would be nice, or recess them.

The nice thing about the industrial Emergency Stop Buttons is it only take a push to trigger them. But to reset them you must twist and pull the knob out, so it takes a special effort to restore power.

Carl.

On 2/12/2014 5:48 AM, Glenn wrote:
 

Cut the switches into the white wire, and wire the black wires together in each box. At the last switch in the string connect white wire to the switch and the black wire to the switch to the other side. Power will run through the switches and return to the source via the black wire.

 

At the source (hear I am assuming you use a power strip) connect the white (switched) wire to the white side of the power cord on the plug side. Connect the black side to the white wire going to the power strip outlets or what ever you use to plug your “Track” power into.

 


Re: BDL168 & Peco & Power routing

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Jim,
Take a look at http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches.htm#a4 and http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches_peco.htm. The power supply for the frog rails (diverging/exit rails) on an isolated switch as shown in the drawing comes from the points at the throwbar touching the stock rail. When the switch is thrown for straight through path there is no power on the inside diverging rail. So Yes... in that sense power to the frog rails and any stub extension tracks attached to it is power routed through the points. In order to avoid that, simply supply track power to both rails extending from the switch. And since the track rails inside the turnout are always at the same polarity there is no need for insulated gaps or joiners.

The other use of the term 'power routing' with electro-frog turnouts refers to also selecting the frog polarity and connected frog rails by the position of the throwbar. With this type of turnout, you must electrically isolate the frog rails when creating a passing siding or there is a possibility of creating a track short by having the switches at opposite path selections at opposite ends of a passing siding. This type of turnout is not DCC friendly.

DonV

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of James McMahon
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2014 5:27 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: BDL168 & Peco & Power routing

Thanks for the reply donV.
I set up a test passing siding track with Peco code 83 insulfrog turnouts & wonder why it is said these turnouts are not power routing?With the tracks lined up for the main line the siding is dead.If I turn 1 or the other turnout for the siding it has power.
Is this not power routing.
No insulated joints used only nickel silver.

Jim McMahon

--- In WiringForDCC@..., "Vollrath, Don" <dvollrath@...> wrote:

Jim,

As long as you know the drill about when to isolate the frog rails on turnouts that power route and are sure that the Peco turnout you are adding does not power route, there is no need to supply any gaps or insulated joiners to extend power from Track #1 to the other stub sidings. Simply wire the new turnout and siding tracks from the track power wires of #1, and they simply become an extension of track #1.

DonV

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of James McMahon
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 2:26 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] BDL168 & Peco

I have an 11 track staging track working with detection & using Walthers Shinohara code 83 turnouts & all detection sections double gaped with insulated joiners working no problems.
I now have a Peco code 83 insulfrog turnout with the detection track #1 leading into the turnout coming straight out of the turnout the track is a dead end I would like to have it as a continuation of detection track #1.
The other track is also a dead end no detection.
Do I have to have 4 gaps or just use NS joiners in this instance?
I have other Peco code 83 insulfrog turnouts with detection & all 4 tracks gaped with insulated joiners.
All help appreciated.

Jim McMahon



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo Groups Links



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo Groups Links

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Flash Gordon
 


Glen,

The Emergency stop switch I bought is probably about as expensive as the parts you need.

It is already assembled, painted and labeled. It is obvious to what it is. Ready for surface mount ( there are punch-outs in the bottom) and it looks very professional. All I have to do is stick a wire in it.

You could use several in series.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130970913952?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

Ed S

 


At 05:48 AM 2/12/2014, you wrote:
 

 

Materials:

            Economy light switches. Look for them in bulk boxes at the home centers. They are about a third the cost of the boxed variety.

            Junction boxes. I typically use the blue plastic 1x2.5x3.5� box. I drill two small holes about 3/8� in from the front and mount them with drywall screws. The will take the standard switch or outlet.

            Cover plate. Get the typical face plate, rough sand it, definitely prime with a solvent based prime, and paint it what ever color you desire.

            Wire. Two-wire household wire is fine since it is a closed loop.

 

Glenn

Re: Wiring Setup

John
 

I put it under files and created a new subject calling it "Wiring Setup" just like my topic. Then I put the file under there.

Re: Wiring Setup

John
 

Thanks Paul for modifing the layout so all can see. The detector I was referring to is a circuit breaker. I was in the NEC group and they mentioned it there so I was trying to figure out what they ment. So I don't think I have anymore questions about how it works. I am the lone operator for now but I may buy another cab in the future. As far as power district I don't know. It seems that if it was broken up it would it would be easier to track down shorts since that seems to be the main issue but I don't know. What is best? Is the command station the same as what I am calling the cab? The main controlling unit that runs the locamotives. If so, that is going to be on the bottom (the side where the yards are located).

Re: Emergency stop button -- IMHO

terryintexas7@...
 

Most power strips have an off on switch
It's what i use for my 12x12 layout
Terry
 

In a message dated 2/12/2014 4:48:16 A.M. Central Standard Time, ghazel@... writes:
 

Do you really need a specialized emergency shut off?

I have a friend who has a 12x12 On30 G shaped layout. He has two emergency off switches in the fascia. They are simply household light switches wired in series with a power strip. The power strip is wired to the last one. The first switch is wired via a power cord plugged into a wall socket. Turning off either one turns off the track power.

My thought is this, wire a number (1-6) standard household light switches in series. Each located at vital spots around the layout. You can use standard two wire household wire. Cut the switches into the white wire, and wire the black wires together in each box. At the last switch in the string connect white wire to the switch and the black wire to the switch to the other side. Power will run through the switches and return to the source via the black wire.

At the source (hear I am assuming you use a power strip) connect the white (switched) wire to the white side of the power cord on the plug side. Connect the black side to the white wire going to the power strip outlets or what ever you use to plug your “Track” power into.

An alternate is to do like my friend did. Cut the plug off the power strip and wire that to the last switch. On the front end wire a power cord to the first switch and plug it in. The switches are wired in series on the white side.

One fallacy of my friend’s system was mounting the switches in the fascia. During a recent open house, two too many visitors in the inside aisle accidently shut power off a few times. I would mount the switches below the layout but accessible and marked on the fascia. Operators should know where they are. He is currently figuring out how to recess his.

Materials:

            Economy light switches. Look for them in bulk boxes at the home centers. They are about a third the cost of the boxed variety.

            Junction boxes. I typically use the blue plastic 1x2.5x3.5” box. I drill two small holes about 3/8” in from the front and mount them with drywall screws. The will take the standard switch or outlet.

            Cover plate. Get the typical face plate, rough sand it, definitely prime with a solvent based prime, and paint it what ever color you desire.

            Wire. Two-wire household wire is fine since it is a closed loop.

My set-up is a Rube Goldberg affair. My current layout is on two doors occasionally set up on the dining room table. My emergency shut of is a string wrapped around the wall wart that plugs into the wall. The string is attached to the layout at the farthest point from the outlet. I operate from one side only sitting in an office chair; the string lies in my lap. All I need to do is pull the string. And yes, I have used it on many occasions.

My modus operendi is to set a passenger train or manifest freight in motion on the continuous run and operate a way-freight around that trying to avoid stopping that train.

Glenn

Emergency stop button -- IMHO

Glenn
 

Do you really need a specialized emergency shut off?

 

I have a friend who has a 12x12 On30 G shaped layout. He has two emergency off switches in the fascia. They are simply household light switches wired in series with a power strip. The power strip is wired to the last one. The first switch is wired via a power cord plugged into a wall socket. Turning off either one turns off the track power.

 

My thought is this, wire a number (1-6) standard household light switches in series. Each located at vital spots around the layout. You can use standard two wire household wire. Cut the switches into the white wire, and wire the black wires together in each box. At the last switch in the string connect white wire to the switch and the black wire to the switch to the other side. Power will run through the switches and return to the source via the black wire.

 

At the source (hear I am assuming you use a power strip) connect the white (switched) wire to the white side of the power cord on the plug side. Connect the black side to the white wire going to the power strip outlets or what ever you use to plug your “Track” power into.

 

An alternate is to do like my friend did. Cut the plug off the power strip and wire that to the last switch. On the front end wire a power cord to the first switch and plug it in. The switches are wired in series on the white side.

 

One fallacy of my friend’s system was mounting the switches in the fascia. During a recent open house, two too many visitors in the inside aisle accidently shut power off a few times. I would mount the switches below the layout but accessible and marked on the fascia. Operators should know where they are. He is currently figuring out how to recess his.

 

Materials:

            Economy light switches. Look for them in bulk boxes at the home centers. They are about a third the cost of the boxed variety.

            Junction boxes. I typically use the blue plastic 1x2.5x3.5” box. I drill two small holes about 3/8” in from the front and mount them with drywall screws. The will take the standard switch or outlet.

            Cover plate. Get the typical face plate, rough sand it, definitely prime with a solvent based prime, and paint it what ever color you desire.

            Wire. Two-wire household wire is fine since it is a closed loop.

 

My set-up is a Rube Goldberg affair. My current layout is on two doors occasionally set up on the dining room table. My emergency shut of is a string wrapped around the wall wart that plugs into the wall. The string is attached to the layout at the farthest point from the outlet. I operate from one side only sitting in an office chair; the string lies in my lap. All I need to do is pull the string. And yes, I have used it on many occasions.

 

My modus operendi is to set a passenger train or manifest freight in motion on the continuous run and operate a way-freight around that trying to avoid stopping that train.

 

Glenn

 

Re: BDL168 & Peco & Power routing

Carl
 

Hello Bill:

Pecos are great. For slow motion just take out the toggle spring. Then they look great with slow motion machines. The three ways are nice too, but about a #6.

Carl.

On 2/11/2014 10:36 PM, Bill Wiken wrote:
 

 I suspect, however, that some may not like them owing to the fact that they do not lend themselves to highly realistic slow motion throws.

Re: BDL168 & Peco & Power routing

Bill Wilken
 

I have only one Peco turnout on my layout, basically because I originally was discouraged by their comparatively high cost.  I must say, however, that Peco makes a very high quality product that completely avoids the hassles of wiring frogs associated with other products.  I suspect, however, that some may not like them owing to the fact that they do not lend themselves to highly realistic slow motion throws.


On 02/11/2014 06:27 PM, James McMahon wrote:
 

Thanks for the reply donV.
I set up a test passing siding track with Peco code 83 insulfrog turnouts & wonder why it is said these turnouts are not power routing?With the tracks lined up for the main line the siding is dead.If I turn 1 or the other turnout for the siding it has power.
Is this not power routing.
No insulated joints used only nickel silver.

Jim McMahon

--- In WiringForDCC@..., "Vollrath, Don" wrote:
>
> Jim,
>
> As long as you know the drill about when to isolate the frog rails on turnouts that power route and are sure that the Peco turnout you are adding does not power route, there is no need to supply any gaps or insulated joiners to extend power from Track #1 to the other stub sidings. Simply wire the new turnout and siding tracks from the track power wires of #1, and they simply become an extension of track #1.
>
> DonV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of James McMahon
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 2:26 PM
> To: WiringForDCC@...
> Subject: [WiringForDCC] BDL168 & Peco
>
> I have an 11 track staging track working with detection & using Walthers Shinohara code 83 turnouts & all detection sections double gaped with insulated joiners working no problems.
> I now have a Peco code 83 insulfrog turnout with the detection track #1 leading into the turnout coming straight out of the turnout the track is a dead end I would like to have it as a continuation of detection track #1.
> The other track is also a dead end no detection.
> Do I have to have 4 gaps or just use NS joiners in this instance?
> I have other Peco code 83 insulfrog turnouts with detection & all 4 tracks gaped with insulated joiners.
> All help appreciated.
>
> Jim McMahon
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo Groups Links
>