Date   
Re: tortoise switch machines vs peco point motors

Thomas
 

The Tortoise can be controlled with a SPDT toggle switch.
The Tortoise instructions show how to do it using an AC supply, two diodes and a SPDT toggle switch.
The following web page shows several ways to control a Tortoise with a SPDT toggle switch.
Tom

Tortoise SPDT

Thomas
 

I have tried to respond to the messages about Tortoise switch machines.

They do not show2 up. I will try a new message.


 
The Tortoise can be controlled with a SPDT toggle switch.
The Tortoise instructions show how to do it using an AC supply, two diodes and a SPDT toggle switch.
The following web page shows several ways to control a Tortoise with a SPDT toggle switch.
Tom

HO Double X-Overs

George Galyon
 

Our club has two older Shinohara C100  #6 double crossovers with the metal throw bar and metal pivot ba plus insulfrogs.  We have some newer Shinohara C100 #6 double x-overs with the single metal throw bar and insulfrogs and we have a Walthers C83#6  DCC friendly double x-over with electrofrogs on the 4 turnouts and insulfrogs on the diamonds. 

The C100s look like the point-stock rail gaps might still be a problem with wheels shorting and the C83 looks like it might not short out but older engines may "bottom out" due to larger flanges.  Any experience with these x-overs?   Walthers says there are no plans for either Shinohara or Walthers to make truly DCC friendly code 100 double x-overs.  And we don't want to buy all the Fast Track equipment necessary to custom build DCC friendly C100 #6 (or #8) x-overs. 

Thanks for any advice. 
George T. Galyon
Olde Newburgh Model RR Club
Walden, New York

Re: tortoise switch machines vs peco point motors

Bernie Halloran
 

Gents,
I should be made clear that installing Peco switch motors calls for a very large hole, a rectangular one at that, under the track, whereas a Tortoise only needs an easy-to-drill ~.5” hole. 
 
Tortoise motors can power Peco switches without removing the spring in them.  I love Pecos, wish they were price competitive, but they aren’t. 
 
I have discovered the sanest installation is the finger flicking Micro Engineering switch. Fallback position is the Atlas Superswitch, throw in a Caboose switch stand and the finger-flicker costs the same as the Atlas + Caboose thingie.
 
However, when it comes to hidden yards, slyly transitioning from Code 83 to Atlas flex and less expensive Peco code 100 switches makes perfect sense.  Why are Peco code 100 switches so much less expensive than their code 83?
 
Bernie Halloran
NYK&W 

Re: tortoise switch machines vs peco point motors

Jim
 

Hi Bernie

 

I should be made clear that installing Peco switch motors calls for a very large hole, a rectangular one at that, under the track, whereas a Tortoise only needs an easy-to-drill ~.5” hole. 

 

Have you thought of using the adaptor base – you can use a ~0.375” hole.  This is what I use.

Re: HO Double X-Overs

Bill Wilken
 

I attempted to install two different Shinohara double crossovers, but abandoned them after encountering two problems.  First, my long wheelbase 4-8-4 locomotives didn't like the tight #6 configuration:  too much non-prototypical "jitterbugging" when crossing over.   Second, I learned the hard way that they must be installed perfectly level in all planes to avoid embarrassing power interruptions, especially to steam locomotives.

On 01/09/2014 04:55 PM, Redvdub1@... wrote:
 

Our club has two older Shinohara C100  #6 double crossovers with the metal throw bar and metal pivot ba plus insulfrogs.  We have some newer Shinohara C100 #6 double x-overs with the single metal throw bar and insulfrogs and we have a Walthers C83#6  DCC friendly double x-over with electrofrogs on the 4 turnouts and insulfrogs on the diamonds. 

The C100s look like the point-stock rail gaps might still be a problem with wheels shorting and the C83 looks like it might not short out but older engines may "bottom out" due to larger flanges.  Any experience with these x-overs?   Walthers says there are no plans for either Shinohara or Walthers to make truly DCC friendly code 100 double x-overs.  And we don't want to buy all the Fast Track equipment necessary to custom build DCC friendly C100 #6 (or #8) x-overs. 

Thanks for any advice. 
George T. Galyon
Olde Newburgh Model RR Club
Walden, New York


Re: tortoise switch machines vs peco point motors

Carl
 

If you use a torque wire you only need a 0.050" hole. And if you miss you can try again and don't have a 0.375" hole to fill in.

On 1/9/2014 7:07 PM, Jim Gifford wrote:
 

Hi Bernie

 

I should be made clear that installing Peco switch motors calls for a very large hole, a rectangular one at that, under the track, whereas a Tortoise only needs an easy-to-drill ~.5” hole. 

 

Have you thought of using the adaptor base – you can use a ~0.375” hole.  This is what I use.


Re: tortoise switch machines vs peco point motors

wirefordcc
 

Various methods of controlling a Tortoise, including using a SPDT switch is at:



http://www.wiringfordcc.com/sw_ctl.htm#a15



Allan

Wiring For DCC

Re: DCS System ?

wirefordcc
 

It doesn't appear that anyone here is using the MTH DCS system


 I do use the MTH locomotives with DCC and they work fine.


I don't recommend mixing DCS and DCC on the same layout like we also don't recommend mixing DCC and DC on the same layout. It is doable.  But I suspect you could smoke something if a loco bridges the two systems if in use at the same time.


Allan

Wiring For DCC

Re: DCS System ?

Paul <summermanva@...>
 

I think that it is generally a bad idea to use a proprietary system. I would stick to systems that adhere to the DCC standards. MTH locomotives have gotten better about working with DCC and they are great machines. I love mine, but I only use it with DCC.
 
Paul
 
Live Simply, Laugh Often


On Saturday, January 11, 2014 11:16 AM, "bigboy@..." <bigboy@...> wrote:


It doesn't appear that anyone here is using the MTH DCS system

 I do use the MTH locomotives with DCC and they work fine.

I don't recommend mixing DCS and DCC on the same layout like we also don't recommend mixing DCC and DC on the same layout. It is doable.  But I suspect you could smoke something if a loco bridges the two systems if in use at the same time.

Allan
Wiring For DCC




Re: HO Double X-Overs

George Galyon
 

Thanks Bill for that advice.  Our club Shinohara double x-overs work fairly well but do have stop and go problems with some locos and they are not technically DCC friendly.  I am going to follow up on your comment about "leveling" and check our doubles tomorrow for planarity. 

Re: HO Double X-Overs

Bill Wilken
 

What's really "fun" is installing four Tortoise switch machines underneath one of these beasts.  I finally resorted to bunches of #10 turnouts to achieve the same effect functionally.


On 01/12/2014 02:46 PM, Redvdub1@... wrote:
 

Thanks Bill for that advice.  Our club Shinohara double x-overs work fairly well but do have stop and go problems with some locos and they are not technically DCC friendly.  I am going to follow up on your comment about "leveling" and check our doubles tomorrow for planarity. 


Soundtraxx LC series again

asychis@...
 

Well I have solved my lighting issues, and have everything working the way it needs to on two LifeLike PAs.  One remaining problem.  The sound does not work on one locomotive.  The wiring, capacitor and speaker are  identical to the first locomotive.  Is there a way to test the green/brown leads to test to tell if there is a signal going tot he speaker when the sound, such as the bell is turned on? 
 
 I am guessing that the audio portion of the decoder is blown, but would like to confirm that.  I have changed out the speaker with the same result. Will you damage the decoder or speaker by leaving the capacitor out?  I have not done this, but perhaps the cap is bad?
 
Thanks,
 
Jerry Michels

Re: HO Double X-Overs

Gregory Latiak
 

If using the Tortoise remote operator it is possible to use two motors to operate the complete double crossover. Each remote has two flexible connectors -- the tricky part is setting them up so the throwbars move in opposite directions. And acceptance that the cross-over really has two states -- straight thru and crossed, so for all intents it is really just a very messy simple turnout. So both motors are driven from the same DS64 port.

Greg Latiak

Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

Paul O
 

Jerry, that is a ‘bipolar’ electrolytic capacitor; meaning it has no specific + or – lead.

If you want to use a replacement to test the original, get two electrolytics of twice the capacitance of the original and wire them in series, that is, + to +, or, - to -.

Voltage rating of the new caps can be the same or higher.

 

Paul O

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of asychis@...
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2014 8:52 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Soundtraxx LC series again

 

 

Well I have solved my lighting issues, and have everything working the way it needs to on two LifeLike PAs.  One remaining problem.  The sound does not work on one locomotive.  The wiring, capacitor and speaker are  identical to the first locomotive.  Is there a way to test the green/brown leads to test to tell if there is a signal going tot he speaker when the sound, such as the bell is turned on? 

 

 I am guessing that the audio portion of the decoder is blown, but would like to confirm that.  I have changed out the speaker with the same result. Will you damage the decoder or speaker by leaving the capacitor out?  I have not done this, but perhaps the cap is bad?

 

Thanks,

 

Jerry Michels

Custom length RJ cables ++

Glenn
 

I previously made the assumption the reference to RJ cables mean network patch cables. AKA RJ45. I am unfamiliar with the NCE wired setup.

 

The RJ12 – 6P6C system is used in telephone networking known commonly as the Key System. This may help in locating suitable cables.

 

On a slightly different thought, assuming you are doing a custom installation, you might be able to skip the plug portion of the cable and go with a Keystone Jack.

http://www.cablestogo.com/product/03800

It requires stabbing the wire into a vise like jaw, preferably with a specialized tool, but I have successfully used a 1/8” flat screw driver.

 

Depending on cost you may want to look into using another component of the Keystone system, the coupler.

http://www.cablestogo.com/product/03673

 

Either of the two fit into the Keystone wall plates which have up to six ports.

http://www.cablestogo.com/product/03410

These are available most anywhere.

 

The total Keystone system is represented at:

http://search.cablestogo.com/?vno=50&p=e&N=0&Ntt=keystone

 

I the references are from a previous vendor/manufacturer that I worked with for 12 years. Use the information as a reference. I have seen their products in many stores including the home centers.

 

It is possible to purchase just the mounting plate and attach it to the fascia board. You can also purchase a surface mount box which is similar to the retro fit modular telephone connections.

 

Glenn

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of george hohon3
Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2014 13:26
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Custom length RJ cables

 




Does anyone know of a supplier that makes custom length RJ cables for connecting UTP panels on a NCE system?  Thanks.

George


Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

asychis@...
 

Jerry, that is a 'bipolar&#39; electrolytic capacitor; meaning it has no
specific + or - lead.

If you want to use a replacement to test the original, get two electrolytics
of twice the capacitance of the original and wire them in series, that is, +
to +, or, - to -.

Voltage rating of the new caps can be the same or higher.

Paul O
Thanks Paul.  I will give that a try, but isn't + to + and - to - parallel wiring? I thought series wiring would be + to - to + to -
 
Jerry Michels

Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

Paul O
 

Jerry, NO, I said plus to plus OR minus to minus.

You want both eletorlytics in SERIES with OPPOSITE POLARITY.

Ex:  DECODER -à+CAP-à-CAP+àSPKRàDECODER

Paul O

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of asychis@...
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2014 12:31 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

 

 

Jerry, that is a 'bipolar&#39; electrolytic capacitor; meaning it has no
specific + or - lead.

If you want to use a replacement to test the original, get two electrolytics
of twice the capacitance of the original and wire them in series, that is, +
to +, or, - to -.

Voltage rating of the new caps can be the same or higher.

Paul O

Thanks Paul.  I will give that a try, but isn't + to + and - to - parallel wiring? I thought series wiring would be + to - to + to -

 

Jerry Michels

Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Jerry,

It’s NOT + to + AND – to – (which would be connected in parallel). It is + to +  OR – to - then connect each of the other ends as if it is a single capacitor component into the circuit. Note that no matter which way the current flows one of the polarized capacitors will see the correct voltage polarity. Hence the term… non-polarized capacitor. When AC voltage and current is applied eventually each capacitor will end up charging and holding some DC voltage and acting as two capacitors in series. This why each capacitor needs 2X the capacitance to yield the desired value. 1/Ctotal = 1/C1 + 1/C2

DonV  

 

From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of asychis@...
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2014 11:31 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: Soundtraxx LC series again

 




Jerry, that is a 'bipolar&#39; electrolytic capacitor; meaning it has no
specific + or - lead.

If you want to use a replacement to test the original, get two electrolytics
of twice the capacitance of the original and wire them in series, that is, +
to +, or, - to -.

Voltage rating of the new caps can be the same or higher.

Paul O

Thanks Paul.  I will give that a try, but isn't + to + and - to - parallel wiring? I thought series wiring would be + to - to + to -

 

Jerry Michels




Sub Bus "beyond" Main Bus

Chris Richter
 

I have a 3 tiered layout that is nearing the build phase after 2 years planning! I have approx. 700" of track to lay down and after reading through Wiring for DCC's web site I have designed my layout to use the Bus/Sub-Bus wiring scheme. The layout room measures approx. 16' x 21' and I am hoping to go with 2 Boosters for the layout. At least that is my current thinking as I will be running short trains - trams, subways and suburban trains with 2, maybe 3 passenger trains (7-9 cars w/ 1 Lok). All in all I plan no more than 6-8 in operation at one time.

I have drawn up my wiring diagram and limited my Main Buses to 30' max from Booster output to the end. What I am interested in knowing is: Can the last Sub Bus off a Main Bus run "beyond" the Main Bus (for instance if it is a 12 foot Sub Bus can it run out 11+ foot (allowing for some overlap with the Main Bus to allow connection to it) beyond that 30" Main length?

I ask as I'm not an electrician and electrically it strikes me as I'm possibly pushing the envelope of the 30' max. of a Main Bus by doing this (my Mains will have RC Filters installed at their ends). However when I look at Mark Gurries "Dedicated Main Bus" drawing under "Block Wiring for Large Layouts" it appears that a Sub Bus does run past the end of the Main Bus (far left of this drawing).

Thanks for all the help WiringforDCC has already provided me and future guidance to come.  Chris