Date   
Re: yard wiring questions

Carl
 

Hello Jerry:

May I suggest double gaps in all routes between the Main and the Yard.
Easier trouble shooting, etc.

Then my I suggest gaps just past the power routed ( Hex Juicer ) frogs.
This way if one locomotive is working the yard while another is moving
in or out things won't short out or stop the switcher. We have this
problem in one of our towns where you can use both the road engine and
the town switcher at the same time. You throw a turnout and then the
town is shorted, and you don't know why.

It doesn't look like you have any reversing loops in your yard, use one
reverser for the turntable?

Good luck, Carl.

yard wiring questions

jerry <gii@...>
 

1. I want the Main Line running through the yard on a separate power district, what do I need to do that? I do have three auto reversing boards from my first layout. My concern is turnouts 2,4 and 6 which connect it to the yard tracks
2. Should all the yard tracks be powered all the time or only when routed?
3. Anything I should be concerned about or do differently - so far no track is down, just being prepped.
I'm still pretty new at this, my second attempt at a layout.

Thanks for your help
Jerry

_______________________________
____/1_____________________________3&#92;_____ Main line
&#92; 2 &#92;4 6/
&#92;_________5&#92;__________/7_______________
&#92; 8 9 / 10/
&#92;_______________12/ /11__________
/ / Caboose
____________________13 / /_____
/ /MOW
______________________14/ / __
_____________________15/_________17_____________ &#92;__18___turntable_
Layout under Digitrax Zephyr
Track Atlas code 55
All turnouts Peco electrofrog
Turnouts 1 and 3 will be controlled by Tortises
Turnouts 2,4,5,6 and 7 to be controlled by Peco motors with
Hex frog juicer for the frog power switching
All other turnouts controlled manually
Yard is on a lift out section 96"x16"

Re: Moderator: Yahoo Contact List Virus/Bot?

sundogusa
 

I was not the one requesting the circuit, but I would be interested in it.

Shea.tim99@...

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On
Behalf Of Greg Harter
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 12:24 PM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: Re: [WiringForDCC] Moderator: Yahoo Contact List Virus/Bot?

I can't remember who asked for the delay circuit for starting up a DCC
system without the sound locomotives preventing it. The electrical guru (I
am a lowly sub-guru) in our club has designed, built, and successfully
tested such a circuit and would be happy to send you the circuit diagram if
you let me know the (email) address of that person.

Thanks.

Greg Harter


On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 5:47 PM, Mark Gurries <gurriesm@...> wrote:

**


FYI

This is information only. I do NOT want a discussion on the
list. If you think you have more FACTUAL and BRIEF information
as to a solution, contact me off-list.

Problem: If you use Yahoo web mail for processing your email
on-line and you use the yahoo contact list for sending emails,
your potentially at risk.

Solution: It is not clear to so far how to address this problem
as a user. However if one changes their Yahoo password, that
might help especially if your email address has been used in spamming.

Background:

In talking to my friend and co-moderator Mark Schutzer over
lunch today, he related to me how his Yahoo email addresses was
just recently being used for spamming both individuals and Yahoo
groups. Apparently the problem is some kind of "bot" is getting
into HIS Yahoo webmail address book and using that to spam
everyone. This was discovered by who got the spamming emails.
The spammed list uniquely matched his Yahoo address book. This
was verified when he looked as his Yahoo "out-box" where he saw
all the spamming emails listed. So the BOT seems to working
from WITHIN the Yahoo email system. To be clear, his spam list
did not match the email address books at any of his work or home
computers which were all re-checked for Viruses....none found.

I personally have recently seen a large rash of such spamming on
the Yahoo list and off-list. Typically the signature of each
"spam email" is that it is being sent to a small group of
contacts of about 8 or so at a time. But multiple emails are
being sent in sequence as it goes through/down the addresses book.

I suspect this intentionally limited email addressing is being
used to get around Yahoo spam detection. The detection system
maybe looking for one or just a few emails with a very large set
of contact addresses associated with them. Who knows but they
got out none the less.

All Mark S. has done/could do is changed his Yahoo password. So
far so good.

Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com







------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo! Groups Links

Re: Moderator: Yahoo Contact List Virus/Bot?

Greg Harter
 

I can't remember who asked for the delay circuit for starting up a DCC
system without the sound locomotives preventing it. The electrical guru (I
am a lowly sub-guru) in our club has designed, built, and successfully
tested such a circuit and would be happy to send you the circuit diagram if
you let me know the (email) address of that person.

Thanks.

Greg Harter


On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 5:47 PM, Mark Gurries <gurriesm@...> wrote:

**


FYI

This is information only. I do NOT want a discussion on the
list. If you think you have more FACTUAL and BRIEF information
as to a solution, contact me off-list.

Problem: If you use Yahoo web mail for processing your email
on-line and you use the yahoo contact list for sending emails,
your potentially at risk.

Solution: It is not clear to so far how to address this problem
as a user. However if one changes their Yahoo password, that
might help especially if your email address has been used in spamming.

Background:

In talking to my friend and co-moderator Mark Schutzer over
lunch today, he related to me how his Yahoo email addresses was
just recently being used for spamming both individuals and Yahoo
groups. Apparently the problem is some kind of "bot" is getting
into HIS Yahoo webmail address book and using that to spam
everyone. This was discovered by who got the spamming emails.
The spammed list uniquely matched his Yahoo address book. This
was verified when he looked as his Yahoo "out-box" where he saw
all the spamming emails listed. So the BOT seems to working
from WITHIN the Yahoo email system. To be clear, his spam list
did not match the email address books at any of his work or home
computers which were all re-checked for Viruses....none found.

I personally have recently seen a large rash of such spamming on
the Yahoo list and off-list. Typically the signature of each
"spam email" is that it is being sent to a small group of
contacts of about 8 or so at a time. But multiple emails are
being sent in sequence as it goes through/down the addresses book.

I suspect this intentionally limited email addressing is being
used to get around Yahoo spam detection. The detection system
maybe looking for one or just a few emails with a very large set
of contact addresses associated with them. Who knows but they
got out none the less.

All Mark S. has done/could do is changed his Yahoo password. So
far so good.

Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Moderator: Yahoo Contact List Virus/Bot?

Mark Gurries
 

FYI

This is information only. I do NOT want a discussion on the
list. If you think you have more FACTUAL and BRIEF information
as to a solution, contact me off-list.

Problem: If you use Yahoo web mail for processing your email
on-line and you use the yahoo contact list for sending emails,
your potentially at risk.

Solution: It is not clear to so far how to address this problem
as a user. However if one changes their Yahoo password, that
might help especially if your email address has been used in spamming.


Background:

In talking to my friend and co-moderator Mark Schutzer over lunch today, he related to me how his Yahoo email addresses was
just recently being used for spamming both individuals and Yahoo
groups. Apparently the problem is some kind of "bot" is getting
into HIS Yahoo webmail address book and using that to spam
everyone. This was discovered by who got the spamming emails.
The spammed list uniquely matched his Yahoo address book. This
was verified when he looked as his Yahoo "out-box" where he saw
all the spamming emails listed. So the BOT seems to working
from WITHIN the Yahoo email system. To be clear, his spam list
did not match the email address books at any of his work or home
computers which were all re-checked for Viruses....none found.

I personally have recently seen a large rash of such spamming on
the Yahoo list and off-list. Typically the signature of each
"spam email" is that it is being sent to a small group of
contacts of about 8 or so at a time. But multiple emails are
being sent in sequence as it goes through/down the addresses book.

I suspect this intentionally limited email addressing is being
used to get around Yahoo spam detection. The detection system
maybe looking for one or just a few emails with a very large set
of contact addresses associated with them. Who knows but they
got out none the less.

All Mark S. has done/could do is changed his Yahoo password. So
far so good.







Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com

Re: Momentary False Detection using BDL 168

Mark Gurries
 

There are two sources of false occupancies for the BDL168.

1) Noise on the BDL168 common rail: This noise is indicated
when the 5th LED in the center of the LED board flashes randomly
as opposed to one of the 4 individual block occupancy LEDs. It
happens when the BDL168's common rail wire is incorrectly
extended on to other BDL168s boards and creates a ground loop
between BDL168's.

2) Capacitance + Noise on the track. This is track block
specific and usually a problem with the longest blocks be it
track and/or wiring to the track. The solution is to reduce the
sensitivity even more.

I suspect #2 is your problem. On occupancy blocks with this
problem, the solution is to place a 1K (or less) resistor in
parallel with the detection diode. Figure 7 titled "LED DISPLAY
WIRING" is located page 19 (2004 manual) shows 2 such resistors
installed on two example troublesome DS's (Detection Section).
There is a comment below figure stating that it reduces
sensitivity. As a general rule, the resistor when installed
goes between the zone common (A, B C or D) and any DS section
belonging to that zone that has a problem.

Section 13.6. (Page 22 of the 2004 manual) title in the BDL168
manual suggest the resistor is a solution only for Outdoor railroad applications. That may be the most common application
but the solution itself has NO technical reason that limits its
use to outdoor. I found this solution worked very well on a
very LARGE Digitrax layout I worked on.

Give it a try.



On 1/27/12 at 2:53 PM, claysmith44@... (Clay) wrote:
Group,
Every since I've been using BDL 168's for my detection I get a
momentary false occupied block on my dispatchers panel.
Sometimes only one or two blocks will light up as occupied and
other times it will start out in one block and run down the
line several blocks. It never lasts longer than a couple of
seconds and there doesn't appear to be any rhyme or reason to
when it happens. In my last session Wednesday night it happened
early in the session and then quit, didn't happen in the last
90 minutes of the session. I do not have the high sensitivity
setting checked on any of the 4 boards I use. My layout is of
the shelf type, doubled decked, and I use CF's to light the
lower deck. In some areas the layout is not very deep and the
detection wiring comes pretty close to the CF's. Could there be
some kind of interference from the CF's causing this? I've also
bundled some of the detection wiring with electrical tape, is
this a bad thing? I would appreciate any feedback if anyone has
any ideas on this.
Thank you.
Clay Smith
Hopkinsville KY



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo! Groups Links


Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com

LS150 and Roco uncouplers

scaletone <scaletone@...>
 

Hello

I have just wired up two Roco underboard uncouplers as per the Lenz manual address 60 and 61 on input 6 of my LS150, the second one does not work, how do I get this to work and what milliseconds should I use for the pulse duration, the first one seems to stay on to long, I have the black wires from both in the centre and a green wire from each on each side, i am using the Roco multinouse to switch them

Regards

Anthony

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Max Maginness
 

I have done this with a pair of DB 150's by using a ordinary 12 volt
(coil) relay driven by the rectified DCC output of the command station with
the relay contact switching the power to the booster. Relay uses 60mA or so
of DCC command station output but this is negligible for an 8 amp capacity.
This arrangement needs no special timing, when the command station is fully
"up" it activates the booster.



Need more details?



Max



From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On
Behalf Of dale_gloer
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2012 7:29 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Re: Turn ON delay relay





Max,

I need to delay the turn on of power to a Digitrax booster until the the
Loconet signal is "GOOD". My command station, DCS200, and booster, DCS200
set to booster mode, are both fed from the same power source. I want to
delay the power to the booster for a few seconds while the command station
starts up. The switching device needs to handle 18 VAC at up to 8 amps.

Dale Gleor

--- In WiringForDCC@... <mailto:WiringForDCC%40yahoogroups.com>
, " Max Maginness" <m.maginness@...> wrote:

Perhaps you can state the reason you want to delay one supply, and what
are
the related and connected components. That might make a method more
apparent.



Max



From: WiringForDCC@... <mailto:WiringForDCC%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:WiringForDCC@... <mailto:WiringForDCC%40yahoogroups.com>
] On
Behalf Of dale_gloer
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 7:29 AM
To: WiringForDCC@... <mailto:WiringForDCC%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Turn ON delay relay





I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply for a second
or
so after power is applied to other related and connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have not found
anything suitable, either not the correct function or the cost is
prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but other
common
voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



_____

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4766 - Release Date: 01/25/12






_____

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4768 - Release Date: 01/26/12

Momentary False Detection using BDL 168

Clay <claysmith44@...>
 

Group,
Every since I've been using BDL 168's for my detection I get a momentary false occupied block on my dispatchers panel. Sometimes only one or two blocks will light up as occupied and other times it will start out in one block and run down the line several blocks. It never lasts longer than a couple of seconds and there doesn't appear to be any rhyme or reason to when it happens. In my last session Wednesday night it happened early in the session and then quit, didn't happen in the last 90 minutes of the session. I do not have the high sensitivity setting checked on any of the 4 boards I use.
My layout is of the shelf type, doubled decked, and I use CF's to light the lower deck. In some areas the layout is not very deep and the detection wiring comes pretty close to the CF's. Could there be some kind of interference from the CF's causing this? I've also bundled some of the detection wiring with electrical tape, is this a bad thing? I would appreciate any feedback if anyone has any ideas on this.
Thank you.
Clay Smith
Hopkinsville KY

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Vollrath, Don <dvollrath@...>
 

Dale, If you are contemplating switching 18Vac to a booster it doesn't need to meet all the UL/NEC agency requirements so you should be able to d-i-y. Find a suitable 10-20amp rated relay with a 12Vdc coil. (think automotive) Add a 1A, 100-200V bridge rectifier to the incoming 18Vac to power the coil. Determine relay coil resistance ohms. Calculate a series resistor value that will end up with ~12Vdc across the relay coil when starting from ~15Vdc. Then add a big value 25V rated electrolytic cap directly across the relay coil as a simple RC time delay to pick up the relay. Use the relay contacts to route delayed power to your time delayed apparatus. There are many more sophisticated ways to do it, but all require more design value considerations and parts. Purchasing anything UL rated for 115Vac operation means mucho $$.
DonV

-----Original Message-----
From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On Behalf Of dale_gloer
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 9:29 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Turn ON delay relay

I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply for a second or so after power is applied to other related and connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have not found anything suitable, either not the correct function or the cost is prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but other common voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo! Groups Links

Re: Turn ON delay relay

richg_1998 <richg_1998@...>
 

--- In WiringForDCC@..., Carl <carl.blum@...> wrote:

Hi Dale:

Fix up a small cabinet. Opening the door closes switch #1 so it powers
up the main transformer before you can reach switch #2 for the second
DCS 200. If you need more delay put a beer in front of switch #2.

Also if switch #1 were two pole, the second pole could feed switch #2 so
if switch #2 were thrown first nothing would happen.

PS: I have used relay timers on 2 converter for 1 phase to 3 phase. The
timer blocks the 3 phase output until the rotary inverter is up to
speed. They worked fine, well until the first burned up in the Woodland
Scenics fire.

Good luck, Carl.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Kind of LOL.

Rich

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Carl
 

Hi Dale:

Fix up a small cabinet. Opening the door closes switch #1 so it powers
up the main transformer before you can reach switch #2 for the second
DCS 200. If you need more delay put a beer in front of switch #2.

Also if switch #1 were two pole, the second pole could feed switch #2 so
if switch #2 were thrown first nothing would happen.

PS: I have used relay timers on 2 converter for 1 phase to 3 phase. The
timer blocks the 3 phase output until the rotary inverter is up to
speed. They worked fine, well until the first burned up in the Woodland
Scenics fire.

Good luck, Carl.

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Dale Gloer
 

I guess I didn't make myself clear. Both DCS200s are fed by splits from a single transformer!

Also this is a large club layout so two switches, even if that was a solution, is less than ideal.

Dale Gloer

--- In WiringForDCC@..., JB <rideyam2@...> wrote:

Two switches labeled 1 and 2.
JB

-- Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together.
-- Red Green

Re: Turn ON delay relay

JB
 

Two switches labeled 1 and 2.
JB

-- Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together.
-- Red Green

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Dale Gloer
 

Max,

I need to delay the turn on of power to a Digitrax booster until the the Loconet signal is "GOOD". My command station, DCS200, and booster, DCS200 set to booster mode, are both fed from the same power source. I want to delay the power to the booster for a few seconds while the command station starts up. The switching device needs to handle 18 VAC at up to 8 amps.

Dale Gleor

--- In WiringForDCC@..., " Max Maginness" <m.maginness@...> wrote:

Perhaps you can state the reason you want to delay one supply, and what are
the related and connected components. That might make a method more
apparent.



Max



From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On
Behalf Of dale_gloer
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 7:29 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Turn ON delay relay





I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply for a second or
so after power is applied to other related and connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have not found
anything suitable, either not the correct function or the cost is
prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but other common
voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



_____

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4766 - Release Date: 01/25/12




Re: Turn ON delay relay

aaronmorley@y7mail.com
 

--- In WiringForDCC@..., Mark Gurries <gurriesm@...> wrote:

I found this on line using google on the key words "AC delay Timer"

http://www.omega.com/pptst/TD-69.html

The TD69 is what you want. However its minimum time is 6 seconds.

The power supply must not draw more than 100Watts from the AC
line which is fine for most power supplies used with layouts.

On 1/26/12 at 7:29 AM, dale.gloer@... (dale_gloer) wrote:
I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply
for a second or so after power is applied to other related and
connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have
not found anything suitable, either not the correct function or
the cost is prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but
other common voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo! Groups Links


Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com

Use a transistor as the switch, bridge rectify the AC and pick an appropriate RC network to delay transistor turn on as required.

Re: Turn ON delay relay

Max Maginness
 

Perhaps you can state the reason you want to delay one supply, and what are
the related and connected components. That might make a method more
apparent.



Max



From: WiringForDCC@... [mailto:WiringForDCC@...] On
Behalf Of dale_gloer
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 7:29 AM
To: WiringForDCC@...
Subject: [WiringForDCC] Turn ON delay relay





I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply for a second or
so after power is applied to other related and connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have not found
anything suitable, either not the correct function or the cost is
prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but other common
voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



_____

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4766 - Release Date: 01/25/12

Re: Shinohara Turnout

Alan
 

Check this video out this may help you Alan C.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZHL25RgH4E&feature=related

--- In WiringForDCC@..., Denny Anspach <danspach@...> wrote:

On Jan 9, 2012, at 5:05 AM, WiringForDCC@... wrote:

Question to see how others fixed an issue. I have some Shinohara turnouts that are installed that have lost power to some of the point rails through the joiner. These did not have the modification that is shown on the website. These are ballasted turnouts so removing them is not an option.

My initial reaction is to solder the rail joiner to both sides. I realize this reduces flexibility but given the joiner is only a quarter inch long, I can't imagine that this would impact rail gauge etc. These are number 8 and 10's so the point rail is very long.
Not a good idea...at all. This will give you all sorts of problems, not the least of which is placing stress on the point assembly.

Although I routinely jumper these rails on the bench from the underside of the turnout- with #29 tinned uninsulated wire- providing wide-enough "loops" in the jumpers so that point rail movement is not impeded, this can also still be done with the turnout in place, but this time with the jumper on top of the ties, disguised with ballast, etc.

My other thought was to drill 2 holes through the table and add one side of a feeder wire to the pivot rail and the other end to the fixed rail.
This kind of fix is my "last resort" . It works well, is fast, and can be a very effective expedient.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento






Re: Turn ON delay relay

Mark Gurries
 

I found this on line using google on the key words "AC delay Timer"

http://www.omega.com/pptst/TD-69.html

The TD69 is what you want. However its minimum time is 6 seconds.

The power supply must not draw more than 100Watts from the AC
line which is fine for most power supplies used with layouts.

On 1/26/12 at 7:29 AM, @selkirk5934 (dale_gloer) wrote:
I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply
for a second or so after power is applied to other related and
connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have
not found anything suitable, either not the correct function or
the cost is prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but
other common voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer



------------------------------------

http://www.WiringForDCC.comYahoo! Groups Links


Best Regards,

Mark Gurries
Electrical Engineer
DCC Website & NMRA DCC Clinics: www.markgurries.com

Turn ON delay relay

Dale Gloer
 

I need a device that can delay the Turn On of a power supply for a second or so after power is applied to other related and connected components.

I have searched for a relay that would accomplish this but have not found anything suitable, either not the correct function or the cost is prohibitive.

Ideally the input to the device would be about 18 volts AC but other common voltages, like 12vdc or 120 vac, would be acceptable.

Does anyone have a recommendation?

Dale Gloer