50MHz Beacon Multiplex Sequencing (or not) #beacons


Peter Taylor
 

GB3MCB 50MHz:

It's all gone very quiet on this subject - we run the risk of sleepwalking into this as we did with the previous 50MHz band plan changes putting R1 out of step with the rest of the world Again.

As I think many know, personally I feel that, to be useful a VHF beacon should be active 60min/hr 24/7. That is not what has been decided by IARU / RSGB and I don't want to get involved in the politics of this.

However, the thought of having GB3MCB (by far the UKs premier and most reported/useful 50MHz DX beacon) on air for only 1min in every 5 (20% duty cycle) just seems wrong when we have a whole bunch of available frequencies and not many (real) beacons.

MY VOTE IS THEREFORE FOR GB3MCB TO HAVE EXCLUSIVE 24/7 USE OF THE 50.005 MULTIPLEX UNTIL SUCH TIME AS IT IS NECESSARY TO REDUCE THIS (i.e. multiplexing is REQUIRED due to number of beacons)

Of course at the end of the day, it's up to the beacon keepers/sponsoring groups and the RSGB, not me, and I will continue to support the GB3MCB beacon(s) whatever happens.

 73,

Peter G8BCG IO70RK


Kerry G8VR
 

Agree strongly

73's

G8VR

On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 at 18:33, Peter Taylor <peter@...> wrote:

GB3MCB 50MHz:

It's all gone very quiet on this subject - we run the risk of sleepwalking into this as we did with the previous 50MHz band plan changes putting R1 out of step with the rest of the world Again.

As I think many know, personally I feel that, to be useful a VHF beacon should be active 60min/hr 24/7. That is not what has been decided by IARU / RSGB and I don't want to get involved in the politics of this.

However, the thought of having GB3MCB (by far the UKs premier and most reported/useful 50MHz DX beacon) on air for only 1min in every 5 (20% duty cycle) just seems wrong when we have a whole bunch of available frequencies and not many (real) beacons.

MY VOTE IS THEREFORE FOR GB3MCB TO HAVE EXCLUSIVE 24/7 USE OF THE 50.005 MULTIPLEX UNTIL SUCH TIME AS IT IS NECESSARY TO REDUCE THIS (i.e. multiplexing is REQUIRED due to number of beacons)

Of course at the end of the day, it's up to the beacon keepers/sponsoring groups and the RSGB, not me, and I will continue to support the GB3MCB beacon(s) whatever happens.

 73,

Peter G8BCG IO70RK


Alan Williams
 

I agree as well.

 

Alan GM3MHD/VK7AM

 

From: uksmg@groups.io [mailto:uksmg@groups.io] On Behalf Of Peter Taylor
Sent: Wednesday, 12 April 2017 3:34 AM
To: uksmg@groups.io
Subject: Re: [uksmg] 50MHz Beacon Multiplex Sequencing (or not)

 

GB3MCB 50MHz:

It's all gone very quiet on this subject - we run the risk of sleepwalking into this as we did with the previous 50MHz band plan changes putting R1 out of step with the rest of the world Again.

As I think many know, personally I feel that, to be useful a VHF beacon should be active 60min/hr 24/7. That is not what has been decided by IARU / RSGB and I don't want to get involved in the politics of this.

However, the thought of having GB3MCB (by far the UKs premier and most reported/useful 50MHz DX beacon) on air for only 1min in every 5 (20% duty cycle) just seems wrong when we have a whole bunch of available frequencies and not many (real) beacons.

MY VOTE IS THEREFORE FOR GB3MCB TO HAVE EXCLUSIVE 24/7 USE OF THE 50.005 MULTIPLEX UNTIL SUCH TIME AS IT IS NECESSARY TO REDUCE THIS (i.e. multiplexing is REQUIRED due to number of beacons)

Of course at the end of the day, it's up to the beacon keepers/sponsoring groups and the RSGB, not me, and I will continue to support the GB3MCB beacon(s) whatever happens.

 73,

Peter G8BCG IO70RK


Murray Niman
 

On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 10:33 am, Peter Taylor wrote:

>It's all gone very quiet on this subject 

>a VHF beacon should be active 60min/hr 24/7. That is not what has been decided by IARU / RSGB

>on air for only 1min in every 5 (20% duty cycle) 


Dear all on this reflector - perhaps a fuller update may be helpful.... 

Over the past few months a number of things have been underway in the background in liaison with UKSMG (inc Peter), Ofcom, OZ2M, 6m keepers and others

a) Ongoing renewals of all UK Beacon NoVs - and in the case of 6m ones, frequency changes/SBP as part of that (where we have viable sites)

b) Coordination of a fully populated SBP test multiplex on 50.005 and early consideration for some others

c) A new ability to run dual-frequency mode, so SBP systems may run 50.4xx as well on 'free/unused' minutes- which is now supported by latest hardware/software  -to make fullest use of  a beacon,  if the keeper wishes  ie 100% (in either 20+80 or 40+60) 

d) Early provision for PI4 decoders and Beaconspot  to accommodate dual mode/SBP reporting 

GB3MCB has just been re-licensed for such dual-freq ops as its NoV has unrestricted full time operation on its new main 50.443 freq, with the additional key provision... 

'Use of 50.005 MHz is authorised for shared frequency use, which should be coordinated as appropriate.'

(ie exclusive 005 use is not permitted)

For info the 50.005 pilot multiplex is currently coordinated as:    

    • EI0SIX   (due on test shortly, prior to its switch to the lead 005 slot)
    • IW9GDC/B
    • PI7SIX
    • GB3MCB
    • OZ4BHM

    Am sure we will learn/tweak  a few things from this pilot but we have to start somewhere. It will take time for other beacons/multiplexes though a few more are lined up, so the option to run up other multiplex freqs at say twice per cycle as an interim measure was part of the original planning (though it might have to reshuffle later on as it grows)

    So whilst I can understand some of the concerns, things are all intended to be positive developments (as are other proposals associated  with the 6m band  wrt the IARU-R1 Conference and WRC19 processes underway where we are very busy right now) . The std and Sync Beacons are due to feature as one of the element in that WRC prep too.

    Finally - of course am grateful for the MCB upgrade work so far and offer of continued support 

    best regards

     Murray G6JYB, RSGB


     PS we havent exactly rushed this. Looking back its roots are back in May-2010, Six News 103


    Murray Niman
     


    repost just in case

    Dear all on this reflector - perhaps a fuller update may be helpful.... 

    Over the past few months a number of things have been underway in the background in liaison with UKSMG (inc Peter), Ofcom, OZ2M, 6m keepers and others

    a) Ongoing renewals of all UK Beacon NoVs - and in the case of 6m ones, frequency changes/SBP as part of that (where we have viable sites)

    b) Coordination of a fully populated SBP test multiplex on 50.005 and early consideration for some others

    c) A new ability to run dual-frequency mode, so SBP systems may run 50.4xx as well on 'free/unused' minutes- which is now supported by latest hardware/software  -to make fullest use of  a beacon,  if the keeper wishes  ie 100% (in either 20+80 or 40+60) 

    d) Early provision for PI4 decoders and Beaconspot  to accommodate dual mode/SBP reporting 

    GB3MCB has just been re-licensed for such dual-freq ops as its NoV has unrestricted full time operation on its new main 50.443 freq, with the additional key provision... 

    'Use of 50.005 MHz is authorised for shared frequency use, which should be coordinated as appropriate.'
    (ie exclusive 005 use is not permitted)

    For info the 50.005 pilot multiplex is currently coordinated as:    

    EI0SIX   (due on test shortly, prior to its switch to the lead 005 slot)
    IW9GDC/B
    PI7SIX
    GB3MCB
    OZ4BHM
    Am sure we will learn/tweak  a few things from this pilot but we have to start somewhere. It will take time for other beacons/multiplexes though a few more are lined up, so the option to run up other multiplex freqs at say twice per cycle as an interim measure was part of the original planning (though it might have to reshuffle later on as it grows)

    So whilst I can understand some of the concerns, things are all intended to be positive developments (as are other proposals associated  with the 6m band  wrt the IARU-R1 Conference and WRC19 processes underway where we are very busy right now) . The std and Sync Beacons are due to feature as one of the element in that WRC prep too.

    Finally - of course am grateful for the MCB upgrade work so far and offer of continued support 

    best regards

     Murray G6JYB, RSGB



     PS we havent exactly rushed this. Looking back its roots are back in May-2010, Six News 103


    Peter G3ZSS
     

    Thank you Murray.  I am all for a shared multiplex on 50.005 MHz where I can use a PI4 decoder to determine the best direction for propagation.  Now all we need are some synchronised beacons outside Western Europe!  It is also a good idea that these beacons can use a frequency above 50.400 when not in a synchronised mode.

    Peter G3ZSS


    Lawrence GJ3RAX
     

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Peter, G3ZSS

    Thank you Murray. I am all for a shared multiplex on 50.005 MHz where I can use a PI4 decoder to determine the best direction for propagation. > Now all we need are some synchronised beacons outside Western Europe! It is also a good idea that these beacons can use a frequency above 50.400 when not in a synchronised mode.
    The idea of beacons sharing a single frequency and switching time slots works well on HF. On 6 m many of us use more directional antennas so that is likely to be less useful. The other problem would be for those checking for meteor pings who would need a continuous signal from the beacon being monitored.

    73, Lawrence GJ3RAX


    Murray Niman
     


    Hi Lawrence

    On HF you only have relatively few  beacons in the IBP  - spread across several bands (and quite old tech in many of them)

    At 6m - this new multiplex scheme is focused on one band has a probable capacity of 150-200 beacons per Region if pushed to the limit. (ie everyone wanted to be in it rather than being at 50.4xx)   - 10 freqs/region, 5 times slots, plus some geographic reuse if its gets popular (esp if Africa and Middle East add new allcoations)

    Meteorscatter has been a separate consideration and is also less sensitive to MUF. An ongoing upgrade at GB3NGI (using OZ2M NGN hardware to which I thik both UKSMG and UKuG are contributing)) is likely to have MGM optimised for MS and is planned for 24/7 on 50.462 rather than being multiplexed (though its new NoV also has a 50.006 sharing option for experiments). That site might have full remote programming of the MGM mode to adapt to conditions or meteor showers. 

    73

     Murray G6JYB


    PS If you think that is fancy - we are also after a volunteer to fly 50 MHz moniotring-SDRs on a cubesats for 3D propagation profiling using precise SBP or similar sources








    Peter Taylor
     

    As I've repeatedly said, I am only the "technician" who got involved in GB3MCB/50MHz to construct the PI-4 beacon which replaced the old one on 50.043MHz.

    I strongly opposed the RSGB / IARU plan to move all beacons up to 50.4xx some years ago (as it reduced their value for DX).

    As 10 "multiplex" frequencies were allocated for DX beacons at the bottom of the band (each suggested for up to 5 beacons) I had assumed that it would be many years before multiplexing would become necessary and that multiplexing would then be planned with some geographical logic. It would seem that this could not have been further to the truth!

    These are simply my own views based on 39 years of working 50Mhz from 5 Continents - but I suspect they would be shared by the majority of DXers in EU and worldwide - if only anyone asked!

    The focus seems to have been on the technical aspects of developing a multiplex rather than on the use / benefits of the existing beacons (vs any replacement scheme) to those who actually use them as propagation indicators on 50MHz.

    Having let my views be known early on (to Murray and others) I have been trying to keep out of the politics and specifically absented myself from the RSGB / UKSMG discussions suggesting that they (both) should speak to the beacon sponsors / keepers for their views. It would seem that this has not happened - at least with GB3MCB.

    But most importantly it is the USERS of the beacons who should be CONSULTED and LISTENED TO.

    I guess this will not be high on the agenda for the RSGB but it should be TOP of the agenda for UKSMG!

    73, Peter G8BCG

    PS: Murray Niman has stated:

    So whilst I can understand some of the concerns, things are all intended to be positive developments (as are other proposals associated  with the 6m band  wrt the IARU-R1 Conference and WRC19 processes underway where we are very busy right now) . The std and Sync Beacons are due to feature as one of the element in that WRC prep too.

    HOW DO THE DXERS ON 50MHZ FEEL ABOUT THIS?



    jaliya lokeshwara
     

    I really like to run a sdr from sri lanka.

    On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 at 8:44 pm, Murray Niman
    <g6jyb@...> wrote:


    Hi Lawrence

    On HF you only have relatively few  beacons in the IBP  - spread across several bands (and quite old tech in many of them)

    At 6m - this new multiplex scheme is focused on one band has a probable capacity of 150-200 beacons per Region if pushed to the limit. (ie everyone wanted to be in it rather than being at 50.4xx)   - 10 freqs/region, 5 times slots, plus some geographic reuse if its gets popular (esp if Africa and Middle East add new allcoations)

    Meteorscatter has been a separate consideration and is also less sensitive to MUF. An ongoing upgrade at GB3NGI (using OZ2M NGN hardware to which I thik both UKSMG and UKuG are contributing)) is likely to have MGM optimised for MS and is planned for 24/7 on 50.462 rather than being multiplexed (though its new NoV also has a 50.006 sharing option for experiments). That site might have full remote programming of the MGM mode to adapt to conditions or meteor showers. 

    73

     Murray G6JYB


    PS If you think that is fancy - we are also after a volunteer to fly 50 MHz moniotring-SDRs on a cubesats for 3D propagation profiling using precise SBP or similar sources