Impulse Driver


bailey.services@...
 

Is an impulse driver something to buy or something to make? For someone with no skill in electronics buy would seem sensible but what would be appropriate to go with a Synchronome distribution board? And easily obtained in the U.K.

Not sure if an Aduino is something that would do the job and how easy it would be to program.

Thoughts welcome
Howard


Darren Conway
 

Hi

Fortunately I have knowledge of electronics so that has steered me towards a Arduino based solution.  The availability of super cheap modules from China is also an influence.  I used to make my own PCBs and circuits, but these days it is cheaper/faster/better to buy something ready made.

There is absolutely no danger of finding a Synchrome distribution board in New Zealand.  Making an equivalent version would be more expensive than an Arduino version.  I would still have the problem of driving the Udine flip clock. 

The Udine clock requires a 48V pulse that reverses polarity.   Each pulse drives a motor to turn 1/2 revolution only.  You can see an explanation of how it works at this Youtube Link. 
The easiest way to drive the clock motor is with a cheap Chinese motor drive module that plugs straight into a Arduino Uno board. 



Regards

Darren Conway

New Zealand


On 19.03.21 9:15 am, bailey.services via groups.io wrote:
Is an impulse driver something to buy or something to make? For someone with no skill in electronics buy would seem sensible but what would be appropriate to go with a Synchronome distribution board? And easily obtained in the U.K.

Not sure if an Aduino is something that would do the job and how easy it would be to program.

Thoughts welcome
Howard

Virus-free. www.avast.com


John Haine
 

I think basically the Udine clock (from the photo that someone posted here recently) uses a Lavet stepper motor as used in quartz clocks but bigger and operating on a higher voltage.  The latter are trivial to drive from an Arduino, as you say you just need a bridge driver that can run on 48 V and few lines of Arduino code - mind you if it's getting pulses from a 'Nome initially they might need some debouncing first.


bailey.services@...
 

Thanks, i wanted to bench test the distribution board away from the master clock. So was looking for easy way to generate a signal. The Arduino sounds like it needs other bits with it and some knowledge of computing and electronics to make it work, in which case I need to buy something ready made. Any recommendations?
Howard


Ian Richardson
 

Call me stupid if you like, but if all you want to do is to test the distribution board, couldn't you just apply an appropriate supply and switch it on and off?  A 12vdc or similar supply and a suitable resistor to limit the current to 330mA would do the trick.

Ian R



-----Original Message-----
From: bailey.services via groups.io <bailey.services@...>
To: synchronome1@groups.io
Sent: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 20:00
Subject: Re: [synchronomeelectricclock] Impulse Driver

Thanks, i wanted to bench test the distribution board away from the master clock. So was looking for easy way to generate a signal. The Arduino sounds like it needs other bits with it and some knowledge of computing and electronics to make it work, in which case I need to buy something ready made. Any recommendations?
Howard


bailey.services@...
 

Yes that would work but I thought the piece of kit would be useful and fun to have. Regards Howard


Darren Conway
 

Hi

Yes the Nome input will require debouncing and yes this will take more than a few lines of code.  Especially since I will be adding features to advance/retard the clocks by a minute or an hour (day light saving).


Regards

Darren Conway
36 Orr Crescent
Lower Hutt
New Zealand
ph +64  (0)4 569 1963

On 20.03.21 2:17 am, John Haine wrote:
I think basically the Udine clock (from the photo that someone posted here recently) uses a Lavet stepper motor as used in quartz clocks but bigger and operating on a higher voltage.  The latter are trivial to drive from an Arduino, as you say you just need a bridge driver that can run on 48 V and few lines of Arduino code - mind you if it's getting pulses from a 'Nome initially they might need some debouncing first.

Virus-free. www.avast.com


John Haine
 

There is an Arduino library called EasyButton which I have used for debouncing a clock contact, seems to work fine.

https://www.arduino.cc/reference/en/libraries/easybutton/

I've got a couple of clocks with Arduinos for control, one of which is Nome derived.  Both regulate the clocks in the code by omitting one dial pulse every N (set N to match the rate).  In one it's slightly different, it omits one every N except every M x N which gives another fine adjustment.  You have to set the pendulum slightly fast.  Displayed time is accurate to +/- 0.5s when the right values set.


Geoff
 

What is a "Synchronome Distribution Board"?  I have had master clocks for years and you just need power to them, why would you want a distribution board?  Geoff Mawdlsey

On Friday, 19 March 2021, 02:15:39 GMT+6, bailey.services via groups.io <bailey.services@...> wrote:


Is an impulse driver something to buy or something to make? For someone with no skill in electronics buy would seem sensible but what would be appropriate to go with a Synchronome distribution board? And easily obtained in the U.K.

Not sure if an Aduino is something that would do the job and how easy it would be to program.

Thoughts welcome
Howard


Simon Taylor
 

With GPO clocks, you have a GMT relay set so that you can power several clock circuits in large buildings.

With Synchronome, you have a distribution board, which does the same thing. It just allows expansion so that a really huge enterprise can run hundreds of clocks. From memory, County Hall in London was fitted out by Gillet & Johnston and had 1200 clocks running in it.

I would have loved to see the distribution system used there!


--
Simon GPO Clocks

http://www.lightstraw.uk/gpo/clocksystems/index.html


John Hubert
 

The Synchronome Distribution Board is a system to allow clock circuits to be operated in parallel from one master clock.

A series clock circuit (such as the typical Synchronome, Gents etc) has the dials in connected in series - and needs a 330 mA (Synchronome) pulse.  To supply this current, as more dials are added, move supply voltage is needed (about 1.5 Volts per dial).  This puts a practical limit on the number in a circuit.

Therefore, for larger systems, a distribution board allowed several (the boards were built from two up to many circuits) circuits to be operated in parallel.  It also allowed for individual circuit current adjustment, advancing and pausing.  In the Synchronome versions, the master movement (i.e. pendulum assembly) could be kept running whilst all dials (including the master pilot dial) were paused such as setting the clocks back after summer time.

The operation of the Synchronome board is covered in Bob Miles book.  One notable peculiarity of the system used by Synchronome is that the master clock contact carry the current of all circuits in parallel - so a six channel set up will switch approximately 2 Amps.

Gents also made distribution boards - but used a different system where each circuit wad ‘added’ via a relay, the real coils being driven in a single series circuit by the master - thus not increasing the current switched directly by the master contacts.

On 21 Mar 2021, at 21:52, Geoff via groups.io <urjoking_uk@...> wrote:

What is a "Synchronome Distribution Board"?  I have had master clocks for years and you just need power to them, why would you want a distribution board?  Geoff Mawdlsey

On Friday, 19 March 2021, 02:15:39 GMT+6, bailey.services via groups.io <bailey.services@...> wrote:


Is an impulse driver something to buy or something to make? For someone with no skill in electronics buy would seem sensible but what would be appropriate to go with a Synchronome distribution board? And easily obtained in the U.K.

Not sure if an Aduino is something that would do the job and how easy it would be to program.

Thoughts welcome
Howard


Peter Torry
 

Good morning all,

Following your request I attach an image of a six circuit Gillet and Johnston distribution system for your information.  The jack plug stored at the top of the unit can be removed and inserted in any of the other circuits to display that circuit current on the meter and the rheost adjusted to give the required current in that circuit.  To advance a particular circuit the toggle switch is moved from normal to advance and the push button next to the meter depressed as required to bring the circuit to time.

Kind regards

Peter  UK


On 22/03/2021 06:52, Simon Taylor wrote:

With GPO clocks, you have a GMT relay set so that you can power several clock circuits in large buildings.

With Synchronome, you have a distribution board, which does the same thing. It just allows expansion so that a really huge enterprise can run hundreds of clocks. From memory, County Hall in London was fitted out by Gillet & Johnston and had 1200 clocks running in it.

I would have loved to see the distribution system used there!


--
Simon GPO Clocks

http://www.lightstraw.uk/gpo/clocksystems/index.html


John Hubert
 

Hi Peter,

That looks very similar to the Synchronome type.

John

On 22 Mar 2021, at 09:27, Peter Torry via groups.io <peter.torry@...> wrote:

Good morning all,

Following your request I attach an image of a six circuit Gillet and Johnston distribution system for your information.  The jack plug stored at the top of the unit can be removed and inserted in any of the other circuits to display that circuit current on the meter and the rheost adjusted to give the required current in that circuit.  To advance a particular circuit the toggle switch is moved from normal to advance and the push button next to the meter depressed as required to bring the circuit to time.

Kind regards

Peter  UK


On 22/03/2021 06:52, Simon Taylor wrote:

With GPO clocks, you have a GMT relay set so that you can power several clock circuits in large buildings.

With Synchronome, you have a distribution board, which does the same thing. It just allows expansion so that a really huge enterprise can run hundreds of clocks. From memory, County Hall in London was fitted out by Gillet & Johnston and had 1200 clocks running in it.

I would have loved to see the distribution system used there!


--
Simon GPO Clocks

http://www.lightstraw.uk/gpo/clocksystems/index.html

<G&J001.jpg>


Peter Torry
 

Hi John,

Yes, I think that they are all much of a muchness and differ only in the circuitry employed.  This example has a medium size relay as the interface between master and distribution outputs plus some spark suppression components.

Peter


On 22/03/2021 09:34, John Hubert wrote:
Hi Peter,

That looks very similar to the Synchronome type.

John

On 22 Mar 2021, at 09:27, Peter Torry via groups.io <peter.torry@...> wrote:

Good morning all,

Following your request I attach an image of a six circuit Gillet and Johnston distribution system for your information.  The jack plug stored at the top of the unit can be removed and inserted in any of the other circuits to display that circuit current on the meter and the rheost adjusted to give the required current in that circuit.  To advance a particular circuit the toggle switch is moved from normal to advance and the push button next to the meter depressed as required to bring the circuit to time.

Kind regards

Peter  UK


On 22/03/2021 06:52, Simon Taylor wrote:

With GPO clocks, you have a GMT relay set so that you can power several clock circuits in large buildings.

With Synchronome, you have a distribution board, which does the same thing. It just allows expansion so that a really huge enterprise can run hundreds of clocks. From memory, County Hall in London was fitted out by Gillet & Johnston and had 1200 clocks running in it.

I would have loved to see the distribution system used there!


--
Simon GPO Clocks

http://www.lightstraw.uk/gpo/clocksystems/index.html

<G&J001.jpg>


John Hubert
 

OK, thanks.

The standard Synchronome type (as Bob Miles book) doesn’t have a relay ‘between' the master and the board.  I use an emitter follower (removable without trace) to limit the master contact current to the usual 300-350 mA with my 6 channel Synchronome board.

Gents boards I have seen work in a ‘conventional’ really form with the relay coils (one for each circuit) in series driven by the master, and each relay contact set acting as the ’switch’ in independent circuits.

John

On 22 Mar 2021, at 10:27, Peter Torry via groups.io <peter.torry@...> wrote:

Hi John,

Yes, I think that they are all much of a muchness and differ only in the circuitry employed.  This example has a medium size relay as the interface between master and distribution outputs plus some spark suppression components.

Peter


On 22/03/2021 09:34, John Hubert wrote:
Hi Peter,

That looks very similar to the Synchronome type.

John

On 22 Mar 2021, at 09:27, Peter Torry via groups.io <peter.torry@...> wrote:

Good morning all,

Following your request I attach an image of a six circuit Gillet and Johnston distribution system for your information.  The jack plug stored at the top of the unit can be removed and inserted in any of the other circuits to display that circuit current on the meter and the rheost adjusted to give the required current in that circuit.  To advance a particular circuit the toggle switch is moved from normal to advance and the push button next to the meter depressed as required to bring the circuit to time.

Kind regards

Peter  UK


On 22/03/2021 06:52, Simon Taylor wrote:

With GPO clocks, you have a GMT relay set so that you can power several clock circuits in large buildings.

With Synchronome, you have a distribution board, which does the same thing. It just allows expansion so that a really huge enterprise can run hundreds of clocks. From memory, County Hall in London was fitted out by Gillet & Johnston and had 1200 clocks running in it.

I would have loved to see the distribution system used there!


--
Simon GPO Clocks

http://www.lightstraw.uk/gpo/clocksystems/index.html

<G&J001.jpg>