Date   
copyright issues

nr_groups <efmiwg7@...>
 

I think that we have explored this issue exhaustively, and maybe we
need to call it to a close.

Nichola Robinson
Moderator

Online Dealer for Single Current Issues...

lru29
 

Here is the website of a dealer that specializes in selling Single
Current Issues of Magazines, not backissues. This can be
helpful if you need to get your hands on a real current issue,
don't subscribe, no one in town carries it and its too new to be a
backissue yet.

http://www.magsnmore.com/

I notice that they do handle MILITARY MODELING, among
others...

Lee

ebay items oct 21

daniel jackson <djaxon@...>
 

Here are some more Ebay items.
Dan


Was this a railgun? French 24 cm gun. ( oct 23)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2277619051&indexURL=0&photoDisplayType=2#ebayphotohosting<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2277619051&indexURL=0&photoDisplayType=2#ebayphotohosting>

Was this a railgun? 1924 Empire Exhibition Gunn (oct 21)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=918&item=2277183816&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=918&item=2277183816&rd=1>

HO Lima railguj for sale in UK (oct 21)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=69804&item=5927413474&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=69804&item=5927413474&rd=1>


ww1 French railgun camo (oct 23)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=13973&item=2277628202&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=13973&item=2277628202&rd=1>

ww1 Krupp railgun close up views ( oct22)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6124248916&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6124248916&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1>


usa army train engine GP-7 #1835 color slide (oct 22)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=130&item=2277475797&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=130&item=2277475797&rd=1>

usa army train engine GE 80Ton color slide (oct 22)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=130&item=2277475971&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=130&item=2277475971&rd=1>

usa army train engine H-12-44 (oct23)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=71011&item=2277737666&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=71011&item=2277737666&rd=1>



ww2 V-1 crashlanded--details for a museum flatcar diarama
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=921&item=2275879192&rd=1<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=921&item=2275879192&rd=1>

ww1 German A7A big tank on flatcar as trophy
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2274370169<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2274370169>

ww1 French tanks, and well I see all kinds of railroad track but where are the flatcars??...
http://imagehost.vendio.com/bin/viewimage.x/00000000/aapaperc/350a.jpg?pt=bidpay&sp=1<http://imagehost.vendio.com/bin/viewimage.x/00000000/aapaperc/350a.jpg?pt=bidpay&sp=1>

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copy...

EntrepreneurOH@...
 

Marcel and Peter,

I agree with both your points: Marcel's about not ripping off the copyright
owner and Peter's about keeping access to information widely available. I also
agree with Peter about the responsibility of collectors to insure that, upon
the demise of a collector, that the decedent's family, heirs, or executor
don't inadvertently destroy the collection because they don't understand its value
or significance. At a relatively young age of 39, I myself have amassed a
large collection of materials on a number of subject matter. Being single with
no children at this point; I have made the effort to let several of my most
trusted friends and family know specifically what to do with my collections if I
should pass on before they could be transferred. I have also documented
these materials on CD rom with pictures of the items, approximate values, and most
importantly, contacts to groups and collectors who would want the stuff. I
think the biggest problem facing those that have to decide what to do with a
collection once the collector is gone is finding the venue to transfer ownership
of the collection to, and also how to get paid for it if it is to be sold. I
have found that Museums tend to be some of the worst places to donate or sell
certain material to because museums often dont have the money to pay for it
and if the curator or directors of the museum receive it as a gift and they
have no interest in the collection, then it often sits in a warehouse or is sold
after an appropriate time or is lost. I have found quite a few artifacts
right in museum archives and warehouses that the museum was all too willing to
sell because they wanted money to use for some other purpose.

I do have to disagree on the part about publishing the content of a picture,
document, etc. causing the original artifact to lose value. This is not
necessarily the case. For example, The US Declaration of Independence has been
printed off as it was originally penned many hundreds of millions of times, yet
the original is still priceless. Several years ago, a person purchased a
picture frame at a flea market for a few dollars. Upon taking the frame apart to
clean it, a folded paper fell out from inside the backing. The purchaser
unfolded the paper to find a copy of the Declaration of Independence. This paper
was later found to be an actual copy from the first printing of it which was
printed in Philadelphia for distribution amongst the colonies. If memory
serves, there are fewer than 6 of these in existence. The document was sold at
auction for over $1,000,000.00. The fact that lithos and reproductions exist in
abundance of the Mona Lisa does not diminish the value of the original work.
There will always be collectors, museums, governments willing to pay the
premium to own the original. I was watching a program on the History Channel just
last week talking about Abraham Lincoln. Evidently Lincoln penned several
copies of the original Gettysburg Address in his own hand upon the request of
close friends. One is on display at Gettysburg National Memorial, another
believed to be the actual copy that Lincoln read from at the battlefield is in
private hands. Both would command many hundreds of thousands of dollars at auction
despite the fact that every history book read by US school children probably
has a copy in the book.

US copyright law allows the heirs of the writer a 50 year copyright on the
original work after the death of the author and then the intellectual property
passes into "public domain" I feel that the legitimate owner of intellectual
property has the right to control and/or profit from his work. Collectors of
original works in certain cases should have the right to charge people for
access to thier property so long as thier fees don't usurp the copyright of the
work's creator; however, free access, or access with certain conditions, is
usually best for the sake of allowing all to benefit from said intellectual
property.

Christian Weiss

problem

joeri <joeri.michiels@...>
 

First I want to thank Peter for telling the group there was an article in MM and second he bought me the last MM in the store and send it to me, other wise I would never know th ere was the article .As good friend of him I can tell you, there was no bad intention just the will to help other members.


Than my problem, i'm building the ironside K5E with turntable. During my several visits on the batterie Todt k5e
I notice there is a double track on the generator. But non of my archive pictures shows it in WW2 pictures. Was it a test
or just to spend the time for the soldiers when the where waiting? I need the info bacause i will build my model that way.

modeling greetings, Joeri

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copyrights

marcel
 

Hi Peter,

you have a really good point there.
It is one of my main worries.
I would be very interested to hear what kind of arrangements fellow
collectors have made
to protect there collections for the future.
And how they share their material.

On one hand, I can agree with the opinion that original material with
historical value
should in fact be shared to anybody who is interested.
This is what we expect from a museum our governmental archive.
On the other hand, there are some barriers to do the same thing with a
private collection.
Without bringing back the whole discussion we just had, there is a risk
that the material which is
shared with the community will be used in many ways. Good ones and bad ones.
Another thing is the value of the material.
As we all can see on Ebay, unpublished material is much more expensive
than press photo's and
published material. Many private collectors spend about their whole
income to their hobby.
Once published, their investments will lose a lot of their value.
And the material is less interesting for trading too.

In the area of art, the main museums are quite serious in protecting
pieces of historical value.
And sharing them with the community.
In the field of military history it is not always done that serious.
Some years ago, one of the main collections of original Krupp and
Rheinmetall artillery
and railgun drawings was offered by it's owner to the big military
museums and archives.
They had a limited interest, but no money.
But even if they would have had the money, I am not sure if we were
better off.
It took me a lot of effort to get any information from those archives.
In one case, photo's, drawings and other data of the V2 launcher train
seemed to be deliberately
hidden... By coincidence I got access.
In favour of the archives I must admit they always have a lack of personnel.

Maybe it is about time to find a way to publish scans of valueable
material in private collections
in a way that protects the copyrights of the owners and maybe
compensates for the loss of value.
I hope the lists members will have some good idea's...
If we can work something out, It is worth this discussion in the list I
think.

take care,

Marcel



Peter Ellis wrote:

The message <cl5sop+4tlb@...>
from "Lee" <lunterborn@...> contains these words:



The real threat to the list is a lack of total commitment by members
to the free exchange of ideas/information.
And I say that as someone who has had work that I have written
ripped off by others in past years without credit or
acknowledgement.
That experience still hasn't dampened my feeling that freely
exchanging information is still the best approach that benefits
everyone in the end, and that those who have such information have a
responsibility to make it available to the many with as few
restrictions as is possible.
If your main concern is solely to jealousy guard your unpublished
material, then belonging to a list that exists for the free exchange
of information is probably not really the place to be, unless your
intent is only to take, and not freely give.


Interesting comment. I realise we are in danger of moving off the
original point about copyright of a recent magazine but I agree on
sharing info otherwise. I'm very interested in seeing the widest
possible distribution of any information. There was a lot of paperwork
around in 1945 that has long since gone, as nobody valued it. Any stuff
in private collections is in danger of going the same way. If you go
under a bus, what arrangements have you made to ensure that your
relatives don't just junk a valuable collection that they neither
understand or know what to do with? Keeping the originals can be an
aspect of collecting, but sharing the contents ensures that the
knowledge remains available through the widest possible distribution.
A particularly good example is Thomas Nosske's EpII German railways
site, in which whilst collecting old documents, he also posts them on
his site, enabling scrutiny of original source material.

Cheers


[railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copy...

lru29
 

If anyone wants to contact Military Modelling about obtaining the
issue in question, their e-mail address for backissues is:

Modelshop and back issue enquiries
customer.services@...

unfortunately they do not seem to offer an article reprint service
of any type so that you could order just the single article, rather
than the whole issue.

--- In railwaygun@..., "Peter Crispyn" <toytoy@f...>
wrote:

Hi,

To all the members who are asking for a personal mail with the
article, I have to say sorry, I can't send it. The article caused
such a storm (or rather a hurricane!) that I can't reply and send
the scans. I've learned my lesson!
I'm glad that I deleted the files, I apologized myself for not
knowing and I hope we can now close this discution.

Peter Crispyn, Belgium

--- In railwaygun@..., JPrigent@a... wrote:
Peter

I agree with you completely, the sharing of information is
important to
prevent its loss. My concern is that the information shared
should be the property
of the poster, not direct copies of someone else's intellectual
property. I
won't dignify M. Rathe with a response since he obviously does
not
agree that
an author's work is the author's property. We shall just have
to
agree to
differ over that, and perhaps note that copyright law allows the
copying of
material for private study but not for passing on to others â€"
even to a restricted
group like this one.

On the point of subscriptions versus casual purchase, it's
through
casual
purchase that people decide to take out subscriptions. Military
Modelling is not
a magazine that many railgun enthusiasts would think to pick up
without the
gun on its cover as in this case, so the other posters were
quite
correct to
direct attention to it. I won't comment on how difficult it
might
be to get
back issue without knowing the edfitor simply because the
editor's
email address
is, in this case, published in the magazine so he can be easily
contacted to
sort out problems in the very unlikely event that the back
issues
department
does not respond. And as I said, if anyone wants the issue in
question I'm sure
there are several of us who would help.

And finally, many thanks to the first Peter for deleting the
pages
so
quickly!

John


[railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copy...

Peter Crispyn <toytoy@...>
 

Hi,

To all the members who are asking for a personal mail with the
article, I have to say sorry, I can't send it. The article caused
such a storm (or rather a hurricane!) that I can't reply and send
the scans. I've learned my lesson!
I'm glad that I deleted the files, I apologized myself for not
knowing and I hope we can now close this discution.

Peter Crispyn, Belgium

--- In railwaygun@..., JPrigent@a... wrote:
Peter

I agree with you completely, the sharing of information is
important to
prevent its loss. My concern is that the information shared
should be the property
of the poster, not direct copies of someone else's intellectual
property. I
won't dignify M. Rathe with a response since he obviously does not
agree that
an author's work is the author's property. We shall just have to
agree to
differ over that, and perhaps note that copyright law allows the
copying of
material for private study but not for passing on to others â€"
even to a restricted
group like this one.

On the point of subscriptions versus casual purchase, it's through
casual
purchase that people decide to take out subscriptions. Military
Modelling is not
a magazine that many railgun enthusiasts would think to pick up
without the
gun on its cover as in this case, so the other posters were quite
correct to
direct attention to it. I won't comment on how difficult it might
be to get
back issue without knowing the edfitor simply because the editor's
email address
is, in this case, published in the magazine so he can be easily
contacted to
sort out problems in the very unlikely event that the back issues
department
does not respond. And as I said, if anyone wants the issue in
question I'm sure
there are several of us who would help.

And finally, many thanks to the first Peter for deleting the pages
so
quickly!

John


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Leopold and copyrights

Stephen Auslender <auslend@...>
 

Look everybody,
The problem of copyrights vs the internet is a problem that has been and is being fought by scores of lawyers in many countries. The problem has not yet been resolved by any of them.
Personally, I'm not going to worry about it. Let them argue it out. If I see something I want to show the other guys on a closed forum, like this one, I will show it. Period.
It the owner of the material hollers at me I'll deal with it then.
Until then this whole discussion is, to me, a "tempest in a teapot". No one is making any money out of this copying and publishing on the internet in a closed forum and I simply refuse to worry about it.
If you guys want to discuss it, go right ahead. Have fun.
To me the whole issue is a waste of time.
Stephen Auslender

----- Original Message -----
From: Marcel Verhaaf
To: railwaygun@...
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 10:03 AM
Subject: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Leopold and copyrights


Dear listers,

Buying a magazine doesn't mean you own the copyrights of the contents.
Trading scans doesn't mean you can publish them.
Copyrights remain with the owner.
This is just european law.

The opinion mr. Rathe just wrote down is a real threat to our list.
I have a huge amount of original and rare material on german, british
and french railguns
and various military railway subjects.
In the past I have been naive several times and shared unpublished
material with others.
Several times I was ripped off by people that appearently more or less
have the same opinion
as mr. Rathe.

Since quite some time I decided to share the material only with members
that I can trust.
And not with any others.
I think it is a real shame I cannot provide you all with interesting
material, which I would prefer to do.
But the message of Mr.Rathe once again proves, I better be carefull.

That is why this way of thinking is a threat to the list.
I think the discussion about this matter is very important for the list.
Therefor, I would like to suggest Mr.Rathe to unsubscribe if he is not
willing
to 'read on this list disparaging opinions....', as he stated.
Especially if he offences honourable authors like Mr. Prigent

And thanks Peter for immediately taking action!

kind regards,

Marcel





Jean-Guy Rathé wrote:

>I'm not a modellist, do not personally know any of the protagonists, nor am
>I directly interested by the highlighted articles.
>But I would really appreciate not having to read on this list disparaging
>opinions based on "articles of faith" or on trendy but unfounded reasons.
>And if this was ever posted with pseudo-commercial motivations, it is even
>less acceptable.
>
>There's no good reason why Peter should be ashamed. He did not "rip off",
>steal, publish, sell, or pirate anything, unless one insists in distorting
>the true meaning of words. Claims of consequential damage remain virtual
>only and cannot be demonstrated.
>And it might be sad to say (at worst), but what the article's author
>feelings are is immaterial to Peter's actions.
>
>Everybody has the right to give or share for free what he owns. It is the
>undue taking of a benefit for such action that makes it reproachable,
>possibly illegal.
>
>Please, Mr Prigent, you need to think more about taking this kind of public
>stand in the future.
>
>Regards,
> Jean-Guy Rathé
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>The Railwaygun, Armoured train and Military railway museum
>www.railwaygun.co.uk
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



The Railwaygun, Armoured train and Military railway museum
www.railwaygun.co.uk


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ADVERTISEMENT





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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copyrights

Peter Ellis <peter.ellis@...>
 

The message <cl5sop+4tlb@...>
from "Lee" <lunterborn@...> contains these words:

The real threat to the list is a lack of total commitment by members
to the free exchange of ideas/information.
And I say that as someone who has had work that I have written
ripped off by others in past years without credit or
acknowledgement.
That experience still hasn't dampened my feeling that freely
exchanging information is still the best approach that benefits
everyone in the end, and that those who have such information have a
responsibility to make it available to the many with as few
restrictions as is possible.
If your main concern is solely to jealousy guard your unpublished
material, then belonging to a list that exists for the free exchange
of information is probably not really the place to be, unless your
intent is only to take, and not freely give.

Interesting comment. I realise we are in danger of moving off the
original point about copyright of a recent magazine but I agree on
sharing info otherwise. I'm very interested in seeing the widest
possible distribution of any information. There was a lot of paperwork
around in 1945 that has long since gone, as nobody valued it. Any stuff
in private collections is in danger of going the same way. If you go
under a bus, what arrangements have you made to ensure that your
relatives don't just junk a valuable collection that they neither
understand or know what to do with? Keeping the originals can be an
aspect of collecting, but sharing the contents ensures that the
knowledge remains available through the widest possible distribution.
A particularly good example is Thomas Nosske's EpII German railways
site, in which whilst collecting old documents, he also posts them on
his site, enabling scrutiny of original source material.

Cheers

--
Peter Ellis

Croatia Property Services
Selling in the new Tuscany!

Mobile +385 (0) 981 82 62 40
http://www.croatiapropertyservices.com
http://croatiaproperty.proboards16.com

Re: Leopold and copyrights

lru29
 

The real threat to the list is a lack of total commitment by members
to the free exchange of ideas/information.
And I say that as someone who has had work that I have written
ripped off by others in past years without credit or
acknowledgement.
That experience still hasn't dampened my feeling that freely
exchanging information is still the best approach that benefits
everyone in the end, and that those who have such information have a
responsibility to make it available to the many with as few
restrictions as is possible.
If your main concern is solely to jealousy guard your unpublished
material, then belonging to a list that exists for the free exchange
of information is probably not really the place to be, unless your
intent is only to take, and not freely give.

--- In railwaygun@..., Marcel Verhaaf <marcel@h...>
wrote:
Dear listers,

Buying a magazine doesn't mean you own the copyrights of the
contents.
Trading scans doesn't mean you can publish them.
Copyrights remain with the owner.
This is just european law.

The opinion mr. Rathe just wrote down is a real threat to our list.
I have a huge amount of original and rare material on german,
british
and french railguns
and various military railway subjects.
In the past I have been naive several times and shared unpublished
material with others.
Several times I was ripped off by people that appearently more or
less
have the same opinion
as mr. Rathe.

Since quite some time I decided to share the material only with
members
that I can trust.
And not with any others.
I think it is a real shame I cannot provide you all with
interesting
material, which I would prefer to do.
But the message of Mr.Rathe once again proves, I better be
carefull.

That is why this way of thinking is a threat to the list.
I think the discussion about this matter is very important for the
list.
Therefor, I would like to suggest Mr.Rathe to unsubscribe if he is
not
willing
to 'read on this list disparaging opinions....', as he stated.
Especially if he offences honourable authors like Mr. Prigent

And thanks Peter for immediately taking action!

kind regards,

Marcel





Jean-Guy Rathé wrote:

I'm not a modellist, do not personally know any of the
protagonists, nor am
I directly interested by the highlighted articles.
But I would really appreciate not having to read on this list
disparaging
opinions based on "articles of faith" or on trendy but unfounded
reasons.
And if this was ever posted with pseudo-commercial motivations,
it is even
less acceptable.

There's no good reason why Peter should be ashamed. He did
not "rip off",
steal, publish, sell, or pirate anything, unless one insists in
distorting
the true meaning of words. Claims of consequential damage remain
virtual
only and cannot be demonstrated.
And it might be sad to say (at worst), but what the article's
author
feelings are is immaterial to Peter's actions.

Everybody has the right to give or share for free what he owns.
It is the
undue taking of a benefit for such action that makes it
reproachable,
possibly illegal.

Please, Mr Prigent, you need to think more about taking this
kind of public
stand in the future.

Regards,
Jean-Guy Rathé








The Railwaygun, Armoured train and Military railway museum
www.railwaygun.co.uk
Yahoo! Groups Links









Leopold and copyrights

marcel
 

Dear listers,

Buying a magazine doesn't mean you own the copyrights of the contents.
Trading scans doesn't mean you can publish them.
Copyrights remain with the owner.
This is just european law.

The opinion mr. Rathe just wrote down is a real threat to our list.
I have a huge amount of original and rare material on german, british and french railguns
and various military railway subjects.
In the past I have been naive several times and shared unpublished material with others.
Several times I was ripped off by people that appearently more or less have the same opinion
as mr. Rathe.

Since quite some time I decided to share the material only with members that I can trust.
And not with any others.
I think it is a real shame I cannot provide you all with interesting material, which I would prefer to do.
But the message of Mr.Rathe once again proves, I better be carefull.

That is why this way of thinking is a threat to the list.
I think the discussion about this matter is very important for the list.
Therefor, I would like to suggest Mr.Rathe to unsubscribe if he is not willing
to 'read on this list disparaging opinions....', as he stated.
Especially if he offences honourable authors like Mr. Prigent

And thanks Peter for immediately taking action!

kind regards,

Marcel





Jean-Guy Rath� wrote:

I'm not a modellist, do not personally know any of the protagonists, nor am
I directly interested by the highlighted articles.
But I would really appreciate not having to read on this list disparaging
opinions based on "articles of faith" or on trendy but unfounded reasons.
And if this was ever posted with pseudo-commercial motivations, it is even
less acceptable.

There's no good reason why Peter should be ashamed. He did not "rip off",
steal, publish, sell, or pirate anything, unless one insists in distorting
the true meaning of words. Claims of consequential damage remain virtual
only and cannot be demonstrated.
And it might be sad to say (at worst), but what the article's author
feelings are is immaterial to Peter's actions.

Everybody has the right to give or share for free what he owns. It is the
undue taking of a benefit for such action that makes it reproachable,
possibly illegal.

Please, Mr Prigent, you need to think more about taking this kind of public
stand in the future.

Regards,
Jean-Guy Rath�








The Railwaygun, Armoured train and Military railway museum
www.railwaygun.co.uk Yahoo! Groups Links







[railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

Peter Crispyn <toytoy@...>
 

Jean-Guy,

Thank you!
And to John: the article was deleted first thing this morning!
There was no way that any search engine could ever find the jpg's;
there was no index-page, not even a HTM-page on the site (search
engines need index- or HTM-pages to read the content of the site!)
and the jpg's had no significant name (K5_1.jpg,...).
I didn't think that far that I would harm somebody; it was never my
intention! I only wanted to help other K5 modellers!

Peter Crispyn, Belgium

--- In railwaygun@..., "Jean-Guy Rathé" <cpilon@a...>
wrote:

I'm not a modellist, do not personally know any of the
protagonists, nor am
I directly interested by the highlighted articles.
But I would really appreciate not having to read on this list
disparaging
opinions based on "articles of faith" or on trendy but unfounded
reasons.
And if this was ever posted with pseudo-commercial motivations, it
is even
less acceptable.

There's no good reason why Peter should be ashamed. He did
not "rip off",
steal, publish, sell, or pirate anything, unless one insists in
distorting
the true meaning of words. Claims of consequential damage remain
virtual
only and cannot be demonstrated.
And it might be sad to say (at worst), but what the article's
author
feelings are is immaterial to Peter's actions.

Everybody has the right to give or share for free what he owns.
It is the
undue taking of a benefit for such action that makes it
reproachable,
possibly illegal.

Please, Mr Prigent, you need to think more about taking this kind
of public
stand in the future.

Regards,
Jean-Guy Rathé

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

Peter Ellis <peter.ellis@...>
 

The message <6d.35fc6643.2ea7b29e@...>
from JPrigent@... contains these words:

Not meant to harm? You have posted a complete article, so there's no need
for anyone to buy the magazine. How does this not harm its sales? And
therefore its ability to pay contributors!
I wasn't the poster of the article. Most of its sales will be to
subscribers rather than to casual buyers. My recollections of
Argus/Nexus etc were that unless you knew the editor of a magazine, back
issue service was not all that good. In any case, we don't have the WHS
reading room here where you can look at a magazine before deciding
whether or not to buy it!

Cheers

--
Peter Ellis

Croatia Property Services
Selling in the new Tuscany!

Mobile +385 (0) 981 82 62 40
http://www.croatiapropertyservices.com
http://croatiaproperty.proboards16.com

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

"Jean-Guy Rathé <cpilon@...>
 

I'm not a modellist, do not personally know any of the protagonists, nor am
I directly interested by the highlighted articles.
But I would really appreciate not having to read on this list disparaging
opinions based on "articles of faith" or on trendy but unfounded reasons.
And if this was ever posted with pseudo-commercial motivations, it is even
less acceptable.

There's no good reason why Peter should be ashamed. He did not "rip off",
steal, publish, sell, or pirate anything, unless one insists in distorting
the true meaning of words. Claims of consequential damage remain virtual
only and cannot be demonstrated.
And it might be sad to say (at worst), but what the article's author
feelings are is immaterial to Peter's actions.

Everybody has the right to give or share for free what he owns. It is the
undue taking of a benefit for such action that makes it reproachable,
possibly illegal.

Please, Mr Prigent, you need to think more about taking this kind of public
stand in the future.

Regards,
Jean-Guy Rath�

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Leopold and copy...

JPrigent@...
 

Peter

I agree with you completely, the sharing of information is important to
prevent its loss. My concern is that the information shared should be the property
of the poster, not direct copies of someone else's intellectual property. I
won't dignify M. Rathe with a response since he obviously does not agree that
an author's work is the author's property. We shall just have to agree to
differ over that, and perhaps note that copyright law allows the copying of
material for private study but not for passing on to others — even to a restricted
group like this one.

On the point of subscriptions versus casual purchase, it's through casual
purchase that people decide to take out subscriptions. Military Modelling is not
a magazine that many railgun enthusiasts would think to pick up without the
gun on its cover as in this case, so the other posters were quite correct to
direct attention to it. I won't comment on how difficult it might be to get
back issue without knowing the edfitor simply because the editor's email address
is, in this case, published in the magazine so he can be easily contacted to
sort out problems in the very unlikely event that the back issues department
does not respond. And as I said, if anyone wants the issue in question I'm sure
there are several of us who would help.

And finally, many thanks to the first Peter for deleting the pages so
quickly!

John

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

JPrigent@...
 

Peter

Not meant to harm? You have posted a complete article, so there's no need
for anyone to buy the magazine. How does this not harm its sales? And
therefore its ability to pay contributors! The undisputed fact that this is a
restricted membership group does not prevent anyone with a good search engine from
finding your pirated copies on the internet. Please, please delete them
immediately for all our sakes — if this became a common practice we would kill sales
of the magazines we want to read and end by driving them out of publication.

And it is _not_ difficult to buy single copies of Military Modelling, they
have a very good back issue service. Anyone with internet access (which we all
have to be members here) can email them for a complete issue, just give a
credit card number and the details of what's wanted. A simple request on this
board would, I'm sure, produce some UK-based volunteers to obtain and forward the
magazine for anyone without a credit card — a swap deal is easy to work out.

John

Re: [railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: Ebay items Oct16

daniel jackson <djaxon@...>
 

Hello,
Thanks,,,I see it now.
Dan

----- Original Message -----
From: mnrdunck<mailto:mnrdunck@...>
To: railwaygun@...<mailto:railwaygun@...>
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 10:01 AM
Subject: [ Re: Ebay items Oct16 item=6121500282



Dan,

That is a Picture of PanzerZüge No.4 (late 1930's early 1940) The
tube actually connects the two turrets of this railcar. The boxlike
shape with the Death's Head houses a 7.5cm le.IG 18
(infantriegeschütz), while the other end (not shown in that
picture)
houses a 3.7cm PaK 35/36. More info can be found in "Die
Panzerzüge
des Deutschen Reiches 1904-1945" (Sawodny).

Mark

[railwayguns, armoured trains and Military Railways] Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

Peter Crispyn <toytoy@...>
 

John,

It wasn't ment to harm the publisher, I only put the pages on a
temporary site (a few days) to give access to the article to those
who haven't access to the magazine. Even in Belgium you have to
search to find the magazine. It isn't the latest issue; it's the
September issue and already hard to find!
This is a closed user group and you have to be member to view the
messages.
I will remove the article as soon as possible!
Sorry.

Peter Crispyn



--- In railwaygun@..., JPrigent@a... wrote:
Peter Cripsyn

You should be ashamed to rip off a copyright article in the very
latest issue
of a widely available magazine. I have forwarded your post to the
editor of
Military Modelling. If I had the author's email to hand I would
send it to
him as well. He is a friend of mine and you have no right to
place his work on
the internet for everyone to copy. How would you like to have
your own work
ripped off by everyone on the internet!

This kind of behaviour is not acceptable.

John


Re: 1/35 scale Leopo...

marcel
 

Hi all,

I agree with John,

It does make a difference to the autor of an article.
I did only a few publishing projects.
In most cases publishers will only pay a very small amount to the
writers of articles.
Sometimes they don't pay at all.

Once an article is put on internet, the author cannot write a similar
article for another
magazine, since it is available for free. And the author will not be
able to earn a little more.
That is one of the reasons why publishing an article without having the
permisson of the
autor is called theft.

Another thing is that the author remains the creative owner of the
content, also after publishing.
He is the one who decides in which magazine, newsgroup, book etc. he
wants his work beiing used.
There are many sites on the web, one would never like his articles
beiing published, regarding
their political behaviour...

Marcel


Peter Ellis wrote:

The message <1d7.2d7b9cc7.2ea6d804@...>
from JPrigent@... contains these words:



You should be ashamed to rip off a copyright article in the very
latest issue
of a widely available magazine. I have forwarded your post to the
editor of
Military Modelling. If I had the author's email to hand I would send it to
him as well. He is a friend of mine and you have no right to place
his work on
the internet for everyone to copy. How would you like to have your
own work
ripped off by everyone on the internet!



This kind of behaviour is not acceptable.

John

I take your point re copyright. However, this is a closed user group and
the magazine is not widely available to many if not most of the
membership. Few of us are in the UK, and obtaining a single copy of the
magazine is neither easy or practical. I have a UK email address but
have not lived in the UK for well over a year. MM is certainly not
readily available in Croatia. Looking at the author's article will not
make any financial difference to the author, whose work will be
appreciated by a wider audience and who has hopefully already been paid
by the publisher. There is no financial gain for anyone.

Regards

Peter



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