Topics

20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits

Bent Andersen
 

Hell all... 


I am just starting to do my first PCB on my cnc and I have buy some 20° 0.1mm bits to do the job.....but I am not happy whit the job, the tracks is not cut nice... on the pcb there is IC in the TSSOP-16 package.


I am trying at 10000rpm and the bit is going 0.15mm down in the pcb


running Eagel 6.5 and PCB-Gcode (last ver) and win7-64


any help ????



Bent

Wilfred <wswinkels1@...>
 

First of all buy 0,1mm 60 deg bits they dont break as fast as the 20 deg. ( more flesh in a 60 deg angle) and you loose next to nothing of your trace.
Second more rpm. I use 20k rpm and making nice straight lines. 
Third
Go for NO runout on your spindle ( imagine that the bit is not cutting when it is at max amplitude of runout. And max amplitude runout is  not in the direction in wich you are cutting.
Then you are pushing copper in stead of cutting which makes for a ugly burr)
Lastly use scotchbright to clean up all the burrs, look at your work and smile. Because it looks much better :-)

Wilfred

Send from the Millenium Falcon





Op 9 dec. 2015 om 06:52 heeft eskolin@... [pcb-gcode] <pcb-gcode@...> het volgende geschreven:

 

Hell all... 


I am just starting to do my first PCB on my cnc and I have buy some 20° 0.1mm bits to do the job.....but I am not happy whit the job, the tracks is not cut nice... on the pcb there is IC in the TSSOP-16 package.


I am trying at 10000rpm and the bit is going 0.15mm down in the pcb


running Eagel 6.5 and PCB-Gcode (last ver) and win7-64


any help ????



Bent

Lebelin <nlebelin@...>
 

Must say that 0.15mm down is like to plow a field particularly for TSSOP. Try 0.05mm it is sufficient for copper and give good aspect. Don’t forget that bits are generally 0.127 mm and it is important in using PCB Gcode

 

Bernard

 

De : pcb-gcode@... [mailto:pcb-gcode@...]
Envoyé : mercredi 9 décembre 2015 17:59
À : pcb-gcode@...
Objet : Re: [pcb-gcode] 20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits

 

 

First of all buy 0,1mm 60 deg bits they dont break as fast as the 20 deg. ( more flesh in a 60 deg angle) and you loose next to nothing of your trace.

Second more rpm. I use 20k rpm and making nice straight lines. 

Third

Go for NO runout on your spindle ( imagine that the bit is not cutting when it is at max amplitude of runout. And max amplitude runout is  not in the direction in wich you are cutting.

Then you are pushing copper in stead of cutting which makes for a ugly burr)

Lastly use scotchbright to clean up all the burrs, look at your work and smile. Because it looks much better :-)

 

Wilfred

Send from the Millenium Falcon

 

 

 

 


Op 9 dec. 2015 om 06:52 heeft eskolin@... [pcb-gcode] <pcb-gcode@...> het volgende geschreven:

 

Hell all... 

 

I am just starting to do my first PCB on my cnc and I have buy some 20° 0.1mm bits to do the job.....but I am not happy whit the job, the tracks is not cut nice... on the pcb there is IC in the TSSOP-16 package.

 

I am trying at 10000rpm and the bit is going 0.15mm down in the pcb

 

running Eagel 6.5 and PCB-Gcode (last ver) and win7-64

 

any help ????

 

 

Bent

Bent Andersen
 

Hi Willfred 

I have order and waiting on some 60° 0.1mm bits I found on Ebay

10Pcs 60 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits CNC Router Tool for PCB board

and I use this Kress FME-1050 and will try to turn it up to 25000 Rpm


and look how it will look. wil start whit my 20° 0.1mm bits


and as Bernard write I wil only go 0.05 mm down in the pcb.... 


I will be back whit result :-)


Bent




Paul Kiedrowski
 

Bent,
Cutting depth is fine, on a 62mil thick board you can cut to 8 or 10 mils no problem and it may help you if your board is not perfectly flat.
You also don't need to set your RPM higher if you feel the spindle runs smoother at 10k RPM, instead just set your feed rate slower.
After all, why rush the milling when it may take 30 minutes after you just spent days days designing the board.

Runout is a concern mainly if the runout is a significant percentage of the isolation you are trying to get.
So if you need a 10 mil cut and 2 mil runout, then you need to use an 8 mil cutter.

Runout must be added to any vibration or non-rigidity in the system that can add to cut width. Runout can be difficult to measure since a rotating spindle may have other factors too (bearing looseness, shaft flexing, etc) so the best thing is to just do a cut and see how much larger the cut is than the cutter. Another thing I do is to spray WD-40 on the board while milling to flush chips and lubricate the cutting tip. May not be necessary but probably will extend the cutting edge life.

Finally, I like to cut initial boards with a cheap tapered spade bits, then if the design is perfected, use a nice (10 mil) square end mill for a final board with nicer trace edges. Don't worry about a jagged cut edge either, it comes off nicely with a little fine-grit sandpaper.
I have an example picture of that at pcbgcode.com.

Just my opinion. Good luck!
-Paul

--------------------------------------------

On Tue, 12/8/15, @OZ1CT [pcb-gcode] <pcb-gcode@...> wrote:

Subject: [pcb-gcode] 20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits
To: pcb-gcode@...
Date: Tuesday, December 8, 2015, 11:52 PM


 









Hell all... 
I am just starting to do my
first PCB on my cnc and I have buy some 20° 0.1mm bits to
do the job.....but I am not happy whit the job, the tracks
is not cut nice... on the pcb there is IC in
the TSSOP-16
package.
I am trying at 10000rpm and
the bit is going 0.15mm down in the
pcb
running Eagel 6.5 and
PCB-Gcode (last ver) and win7-64
any help
????

Bent









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Bent Andersen
 

Hi Paul

I try to upload some photo in my album "Eskolin" but whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down in the pcb at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is ok...but I wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.

now I only have to figur it out how to save my settings in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but every time I start it up.... I have to change inch to mm ???

Bent 

casy_ch@tbwil.ch
 

Hi Bent

I wonder what you expect from WD40? That's a moisture preventive product!

Here I mill the pcb with 5-6000 RPM and 400mm/min.

I love metric! I do not know pcbgcode but surely you can set metric as a definition in the input file.

Jean-Claude


Am 10.12.2015 um 09:41 schrieb eskolin@... [pcb-gcode]:

 

Hi Paul


I try to upload some photo in my album "Eskolin" but whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down in the pcb at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is ok...but I wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.

now I only have to figur it out how to save my settings in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but every time I start it up.... I have to change inch to mm ???

Bent 

Bent Andersen
 

HI Jean-Claude

The WD40 was a idea from Paul.... jut try it out !!!

5-6000rpm and 400mm....this is another setting I can try to get a good result!

Bent

Wilfred <wswinkels1@...>
 

Hi Bent, 
That are the exact same mills I ordered
I dont know if you broke those 20 deg ones allready
I bought the 60 deg ones because the 20 deg kept breaking
I didnt have succes with WD40 or with official cutting fluid
I ( lots of I's :-) ) work at a swarf making plant in the netherlands
So i can get every cutting fluid i need to experiment 😃😃

Wilfred


Send from the Millenium Falcon





Op 9 dec. 2015 om 19:25 heeft eskolin@... [pcb-gcode] <pcb-gcode@...> het volgende geschreven:

 

Hi Willfred 


I have order and waiting on some 60° 0.1mm bits I found on Ebay

10Pcs 60 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits CNC Router Tool for PCB board

and I use this Kress FME-1050 and will try to turn it up to 25000 Rpm


and look how it will look. wil start whit my 20° 0.1mm bits


and as Bernard write I wil only go 0.05 mm down in the pcb.... 


I will be back whit result :-)


Bent




Bent Andersen
 

Hi Wilfred

no I have all mine...no one is broken.... but som weeks ago I order the 45↑ and 60° so I looking in 
the mail box these days...

you can look in my photo-album (Eskolin) and see my result....


Bent


 
 

Art Eckstein
 

Brent,
Just to let you know, when the group was setup by JJ, he has it configured such that all photos have to be "approved" by a moderator. Therefore, please be patient with us as we (moderators) are few in number and are located in the Eastern time zone of the US!  I usually get started checking things about 8am and then off and on during the day.



To set PCB-Gcode  to metric, in the pcb-gcode-setup.ulp, go to the Machine tab and click on the appropriate bullet that you want:


Art
Country bubba

Moderator




At 03:41 AM 12/10/2015, you wrote:


Hi Paul

I try to upload some photo in my album "Eskolin" but whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down in the pcb at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is ok...but I wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.

now I only have to figur it out how to save my settings in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but every time I start it up.... I have to change inch to mm ???

Bent


Bent Andersen
 

HI Art Eckstein

ok...now I get it.... I upload and just waite...no problem...

and thanks for hint about to get PcbGcode to change to mm....but it only work for 
me when you are in the setup...if you change the settings as you wanted and let 
the program make the code...and start up agn the pcbgcode then you have to 
change the settings :-( it would be nice if it can rember the settings from tome to time !!!

using Pcbgcode 3.6.2.4 and Eagel 6.5.0
Bent 

Art Eckstein
 

Brent,
It saves the setting for me.  One possible problem may be where you have the ulp on your hard drive. If your running a later version of windows and have put the ulp in the program files directory, that is a forbidden location for normal writing.

Put the pcb-gcode files in a seperate directory such as in your "user" area or even a seperate one on the C drive if that is all you have (mine is on an external drive) and then in the Eagle control panel, under the Options  Directories tab, set the location as needed.  Here is the way mine is set:

I:\eagle\pcb-gcode\pcb-gcode-3.6.2.4-art;$EAGLEDIR\ulp  


Note there is a ; after the path to my directory and before the default location.  If I remember correctory in the instruction pdf, this directory has to be the first one in the chain.  You can have as many as needed as long as they are ; delimited.

when I dowloaded and unzipped the whole system, I simply used the path structure as noted above and the "pcb-gcode" directory contains and the necessary pcb-gcode files and subdirectories.

Hope this helps,

Art
Country Bubba



At 10:20 AM 12/10/2015, you wrote:


HI Art Eckstein

ok...now I get it.... I upload and just waite...no problem...

and thanks for hint about to get PcbGcode to change to mm....but it only work for
me when you are in the setup...if you change the settings as you wanted and let
the program make the code...and start up agn the pcbgcode then you have to
change the settings it would be nice if it can rember the settings from tome to time !!!

using Pcbgcode 3.6.2.4 and Eagel 6.5.0
Bent


Bent Andersen
 

HI Art

it work's 

I change as you write the settings where to find the file

d:\EAGLE-6.5.0\ulp\gcode;$EAGLEDIR\ulp



Bent



Art Eckstein
 

Glad I could help.

Art
Country Bubba


At 11:49 AM 12/10/2015, you wrote:


HI Art

it work's []

I change as you write the settings where to find the file

d:\EAGLE-6.5.0\ulp\gcode;$EAGLEDIR\ulp



Bent





Paul Kiedrowski
 

WD40 is about 25% mineral oil...oil is a lubricant...therefore WD40 is a lubricant :-)
If you don't believe that try screwing steel screws in an aluminum chassis and see how much galling you get with and without it.
Just something that is relatively cheap and easily available compared to custom cutting agents.
Someday I'll run a long cutting test to see how much it effects the tool edge and post the results.
-Paul

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 12/10/15, Casy_ch casy_ch@... [pcb-gcode] <pcb-gcode@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [pcb-gcode] 20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits
To: pcb-gcode@...
Date: Thursday, December 10, 2015, 2:59 AM


 












Hi Bent



I wonder what you expect from WD40? That's a
moisture preventive
product!



Here I mill the pcb with 5-6000 RPM and 400mm/min.



I love metric! I do not know pcbgcode but surely you can
set metric
as a definition in the input file.



Jean-Claude





Am
10.12.2015 um 09:41 schrieb
@OZ1CT
[pcb-gcode]:




 



Hi Paul



I try to upload some photo in my album
"Eskolin" but
whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down
in the pcb
at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is
ok...but I
wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.



now I only have to figur it out how to save
my settings
in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but
every time I
start it up.... I have to change inch to mm
???



Bent 

















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casy_ch@tbwil.ch
 

Paul

After a year if not shorter unscrew your screws and look what is left in the tap. You can also spray it on a table and have a look after a certain time what is left over. I am compassionate with people who believe the marvellous marketing guys at WD and "oil" their spindle with it.

Jean-Claude


Am 10.12.2015 um 18:42 schrieb Paul Kiedrowski paul_kiedrowski@... [pcb-gcode]:

 

WD40 is about 25% mineral oil...oil is a lubricant...therefore WD40 is a lubricant :-)
If you don't believe that try screwing steel screws in an aluminum chassis and see how much galling you get with and without it.
Just something that is relatively cheap and easily available compared to custom cutting agents.
Someday I'll run a long cutting test to see how much it effects the tool edge and post the results.
-Paul

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 12/10/15, Casy_ch casy_ch@... [pcb-gcode] wrote:

Subject: Re: [pcb-gcode] 20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits
To: pcb-gcode@...
Date: Thursday, December 10, 2015, 2:59 AM


 












Hi Bent



I wonder what you expect from WD40? That's a
moisture preventive
product!



Here I mill the pcb with 5-6000 RPM and 400mm/min.



I love metric! I do not know pcbgcode but surely you can
set metric
as a definition in the input file.



Jean-Claude





Am
10.12.2015 um 09:41 schrieb
eskolin@...
[pcb-gcode]:




 



Hi Paul



I try to upload some photo in my album
"Eskolin" but
whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down
in the pcb
at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is
ok...but I
wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.



now I only have to figur it out how to save
my settings
in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but
every time I
start it up.... I have to change inch to mm
???



Bent 

















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Danny Miller <dannym@...>
 

WD40 is indeed a lubricant.  It is a light machine oil- similar to "3-in-1 oil" and a volatile solvent to temporarily thin it out, and a propellant.  Once the solvent's gone, it's just oil.

It is only good for things where you don't need a heavy oil or grease and you don't need a lot in one place (like you wouldn't try to pack an oiled bearing even if you need light machine oil, you'd just drip liquid oil into it).

Danny

On 12/10/2015 11:42 AM, Paul Kiedrowski paul_kiedrowski@... [pcb-gcode] wrote:
 

WD40 is about 25% mineral oil...oil is a lubricant...therefore WD40 is a lubricant :-)
If you don't believe that try screwing steel screws in an aluminum chassis and see how much galling you get with and without it.
Just something that is relatively cheap and easily available compared to custom cutting agents.
Someday I'll run a long cutting test to see how much it effects the tool edge and post the results.
-Paul

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 12/10/15, Casy_ch casy_ch@... [pcb-gcode] wrote:

Subject: Re: [pcb-gcode] 20 Degree 0.1mm Carbide Engraving Bits
To: pcb-gcode@...
Date: Thursday, December 10, 2015, 2:59 AM


 












Hi Bent



I wonder what you expect from WD40? That's a
moisture preventive
product!



Here I mill the pcb with 5-6000 RPM and 400mm/min.



I love metric! I do not know pcbgcode but surely you can
set metric
as a definition in the input file.



Jean-Claude





Am
10.12.2015 um 09:41 schrieb
eskolin@...
[pcb-gcode]:




 



Hi Paul



I try to upload some photo in my album
"Eskolin" but
whit no luck ?? but I try yesterday
to mill my pcb whit 25000 rpm and cut down
in the pcb
at 0.025mm doing 250mm/min and the result is
ok...but I
wil try it whit WD40 and se the result.



now I only have to figur it out how to save
my settings
in pcbgcode.... I use mm and not Inch, but
every time I
start it up.... I have to change inch to mm
???



Bent 

















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