Date
1 - 20 of 29
If you were looking for a new outboard
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What would you buy brand wise.
For Scandal I would like to put a new outboard on. 4 stroke, 4-6hp. Lots of options out there and the pricing is reasonable for a new engine. Granted if a used on e in great shape popped up I’d go that route. The engine on Scandal is fine, but I’d like to have some bells and whistles, like reverse and neutral 🤣 Case -- Dirt |
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Edward Epifani
Honda if you can bear the price but Yamaha beats all for durability. IMHO never Mercury.
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Where I lived in Baja, Yamaha was prevalent. The Pangeros used them very very hard. And we fished with them in offshore winds with total reliability.Hondas there were a bit delicate. Only non ethanol in a Honda, even here, IMHO. Ed On May 1, 2022, at 2:13 PM, Case Turner <casesturner@...> wrote: |
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David Graybeal
Dirt - I can certainly sympathize with the desire for a neutral, and a reverse, But, iirc, the features you're after don't start until 4hp, and that's on a (heavier) 4-stroke modern outboard. Might have to rig and even longer tiller extension than Pat had, and sit on the firward thwart to steer ?? <G>
If you do decide to swap it out, I might be interested in the existing one. |
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Case Turner <dirtsailor2003@...>
Well David I was thinking if I put you up in the front it would, balance things out 🤣
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I was looking at the weight of the newer 4hp engines and the my are right there with the Evinrude on there. Even some of the 6hp are pretty close. I will take all of that into consideration Yep coots up front snuggling maybe I could put a 8hp. On ther 🤣 Case Sent from not here On May 1, 2022, at 3:17 PM, David Graybeal via groups.io <harbordavid@...> wrote:
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I'll bet that 4-hp. Johnnyrude 2-stroke only weighs 30-35 pounds (I've got one too). A 4-stroke 4-6 weighs around 55. A lot heavier, proportionally, but an extra 20 pounds on Scandal's transom probably won't kill her performance. Moving the gas tank forward might be all that's necessary to get good trim. In between the two is the Tohatsu/Nissan/Mercury 3.5 hp. 4-stroke. Lighter than the 4-6, neutral but no reverse.
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David does make good ballast, in any case: https://flic.kr/p/7nK4DY Pat steered from the center thwart when boating solo, using a rope running all around under the sheer. The tiller-looking thingy is to control the lever throttle on the Johnnyrude. Scandal trimmed just about perfect with that setup: https://flic.kr/p/orBaC I hope we get to see her in the water again soon. :o) On 5/1/2022 5:34 PM, Dirt wrote:
Well David I was thinking if I put you up in the front it would, balance things out 🤣-- John <jkohnen@...> The ideals which have lighted my way, and time after time have given me new courage to face life cheerfully, have been Kindness, Beauty, and Truth. (Albert Einstein) |
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Case Turner <dirtsailor2003@...>
John,
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Yes all of that is pertinent. I plan on having the fuel tank all the way forward ( the Graybeal ballast factor has been proven to not be a reliable standard). I did look at the weight differences between the 2 and 4 strokes and I agree that I don’t think it will kill the performance much. All of the rope steering system is there as well as the throttle control. I Agree that placing the fuel tank forward would help initially. But as it empties you lose that benefit. I’ll be playing with things and we’ll see where we end up. Scandal will be seen in the water again! Dirt On May 1, 2022, at 6:12 PM, John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote: |
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David Graybeal
Good ballast? He makes GREAT ballast!!!
Of course, I can't claim to be unique in that regard <G> |
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Dan Pence
Let’s not skip over the gas vs. electric thing. You can get 4-6 hp in electric. My old Torqeedo 1003 can almost do what a 4 hp can, has reverse, light when broken down, requires no maintenance, no winterization, last years old fuel left in the tank, etc.
yes, you will probably spend about $1,000 more new, but over the life of an outboard that covers just two visits to the mechanics shop. Which you will avoid. I wrestled with about a dozen gas outboards and as a landscaper we used a bunch of small engines. Electric power is so much better. Plus, you guys ever hear of climate change? It’s kind of a thing. in a few years you will be towing Scandal behind a Ford Lightning pickup, right? Don’t you want the boat to also be electric? |
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The Suzuki 3 to 6 hp works well, when I do my part, and the power head is easier to mount than the two stroker, it's more rounded and needs a smaller powerhead opening than a 2 stroke by a bit. The 4 hp can be upgraded to 6 hp anytime, just a carb. change. My 4 became a 6 real easy, I have both built in and exterior fuel hoses, but the built in lasts quite a while, so one quart well sealed metal bottles, are probably easier to deal with for storage.
Later, Cal |
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Electric would be great, but not in my budget right now. The 3hp Torqeedo is currently $4,298, the 3hp is $2,948. Then I’d need to add several hundred or more for batteries. Which I’d need to figure out how to charge off grid so all told I’d be well into the $6,000 dolly range. In comparison a 6hp four stroke is $1,400-1,600.
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As for a tow vehicle my 21 Tacoma is going to be doing the work for many years to come. Case On May 2, 2022, at 7:07 AM, Dan Pence <pence@...> wrote:
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Dirt |
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I’ve been looking at the Suzuki as an option. It’s on lower end of the price range. Right around $1,400. The Tohatsu is also another contender.
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Case On May 2, 2022, at 7:23 AM, Electri-Cal <calboats@...> wrote:
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David Graybeal
Good points.
It's always nice you have the youngsters among us remind us of the new realities!!! <G> |
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Richard Green
My two bits worth is I have had very good luck/success with Tohatsu and Honda. I have a 3.5 hp with neutral/forward to power my 13’ Livingston….someday when all the medical crap is a done deal. Soon…..
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Rich
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Case Turner <dirtsailor2003@...>
Tohatsu is made by Honda and rebranded as Tohatsu. So it is a real contender. Not to mention the 6 has Forward neutral and reverse. You can also attach an external tank. Which for scandal would be ideal so it could be located near the bow.
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Case Sent from not here On May 2, 2022, at 9:04 AM, Richard Green <chaos5@...> wrote:
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It would have been a seismic shift felt 'round the World if Tohatsu stopped making outboards! <g> They did make a deal to sell _large_ outboards made by Honda with Tohatsu decals on them, giving their dealers something to sell in the high-power range that Tohatsu never built motors for. Tohatsus under 60 hp. are still made by Tohatsu, and they also make the small Mercuries, and used to make Nissans. Tohatsus have the cheapest decals, Nissans had slightly more expensive decals, and the Mercs sport the most expensive decals, but have a larger dealer network (and better parts service -- Tohatsu shops often order parts through Mercury).
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On 5/2/2022 9:08 AM, Case wrote:
Tohatsu is made by Honda and rebranded as Tohatsu. So it is a real contender. Not to mention the 6 has Forward neutral and reverse. You can also attach an external tank. Which for scandal would be ideal so it could be located near the bow.-- John <jkohnen@...> All violence, all that is dreary and repels, is not power, but the absence of power. (Ralph Waldo Emerson) |
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Scandal is intended to be a light, fast with low power, outboard utility boat. While I love electric power, I don't think Scandal is a good candidate for it, unless one is willing to pungle up the cash for a bunch of lightweight lithium batteries. Maybe someday an electric Scandal will make sense...
http://www.atkinboatplans.com/Oar/Scandal.html BTW, the Elto Rudder Twin shown in the illustrations above was light for its time, it was quite a bit heavier than the 3-4 hp. outboards of the postwar era. On 5/2/2022 8:00 AM, Case wrote: Electric would be great, but not in my budget right now. The 3hp Torqeedo is currently $4,298, the 3hp is $2,948. Then I’d need to add several hundred or more for batteries. Which I’d need to figure out how to charge off grid so all told I’d be well into the $6,000 dolly range. In comparison a 6hp four stroke is $1,400-1,600.John <jkohnen@...> Any boy who does not read and enjoy Slocum's "Sailing Alone" should be drowned immediately. (Arthur Ransome) -- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com |
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Edward Epifani
Edifying. Thank you. 6hp is a lot of power. I used a Honda LS on my MacGregor. Heavy. Great motor. Can I get Mercedes’ decals for my Honda minivan?
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On May 2, 2022, at 12:28 PM, John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote: |
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Earl Boissonou
When I built Dr. Petra electric wasn’t the option chosen.....were I building her today electric would take priority. Yes, the initial cost is high, but the environmentally moral choice calls for it. Besides: gasoline, oil, maintenance, wear, repairs and mechanical failures add up overtime. Electric is nearly maintenance free......and how much will a used gas outboard fetch in a few years? It’s time to face our climate nemesis by making the best choices for our and our children’s future. Enough said🌝.
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Earl🧙♂️🌝⚓️🐷 On May 2, 2022, at 12:27 PM, John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote: |
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elaineginader
Yay Earl. On Mon, May 2, 2022, 12:54 PM Earl Boissonou <cboissonou@...> wrote: When I built Dr. Petra electric wasn’t the option chosen.....were I building her today electric would take priority. Yes, the initial cost is high, but the environmentally moral choice calls for it. Besides: gasoline, oil, maintenance, wear, repairs and mechanical failures add up overtime. Electric is nearly maintenance free......and how much will a used gas outboard fetch in a few years? It’s time to face our climate nemesis by making the best choices for our and our children’s future. Enough said🌝. |
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Dan Pence
As to the expense of batteries; my Torqeedo Travel 1003 has a built-in battery. No added expense unless you want the larger capacity version.
Thanks John for posting the Atkin drawing for scandal, cool design! The guy who sold me my Torqeedo used it on a 22’ fiberglass sailboat of about 1600 lbs. but he just needed it to get out into the lake. I imagine it would push Scandal at about 4-5 knots. |
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