Date   

Re: Difficult decision

John Weiss
 

FWIW, way back in the 60s, a group of Snipe racing sailors in upstate NY did a bit of a non-scientific experiment to see if waxing the hulls of their newfangled fiberglass boats would make them go even faster. General consensus was that waxing did NOT help, and may have even hurt a bit. Theory was that the "beading" of the water on the surface still occurred to some extent underwater, causing more drag. Instead they decided on a waxless polish and/or wet-sanding with 600 grit.

On 05/20/20 14:55, John Kohnen wrote:
I'm pretty sure we've talked about those water-repellent coatings before. I believe the consensus opinion was that if you coat the entire surface of the hull below the waterline with the stuff, the boat will "repel" itself up out of the water and float on a film of air above the surface. Planing at rest, so to speak...
;o)
On 5/20/2020 9:20 AM, Electri-Cal wrote:
...
Whoops !!  Almost forgot --  I'm just looking at a new product, another one EH!!     I'm ordering it in for testing today.  It  stops water adhesion to whatever it is applied to, by a lot !!  First  trial will be my great sweeps, one at a time to check it out..  If that works maybe on the boat bottom to reduce friction.  After testing, maybe that could add boat speed without any penalty.  No, I will do an article on this yet !!    If, and When, it Works!!    With the boat on a trailer it may take some doing, lifting and blocking to get clear --
so the oar testing comes first..  If I row in a circle, or with extra drag on one side when trading oars, THEN i'm good to share this out..
...


More NW Boating Events Bite the Dust

 

More boating events have been cancelled due to the dread Virus, including the Cathlamet Boat Show. The Solstice Messabout at Cathlamet may once again be an Autumnal Equinox Messabout this year...

http://www.coots.org/mb/

Even if an event isn't crossed out in the Coots' Schedule, check with the event organizers before planning to attend.

Eat lots of chocolate and wash your hands.

--
John <@Jkohnen>
The fact is that the average man's love of liberty is nine-tenths imaginary, exactly like his love of sense, justice and truth. (H. L. Mencken)


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Re: Difficult decision

cherrill boissonou
 

A truly water repellant coating would prevent a boat from going anywhere near water!
Earl B.

On May 20, 2020, at 2:55 PM, John Kohnen <@Jkohnen> wrote:

I'm pretty sure we've talked about those water-repellent coatings before. I believe the consensus opinion was that if you coat the entire surface of the hull below the waterline with the stuff, the boat will "repel" itself up out of the water and float on a film of air above the surface. Planing at rest, so to speak...

;o)

On 5/20/2020 9:20 AM, Electri-Cal wrote:
...
Whoops !! Almost forgot -- I'm just looking at a new product, another one EH!! I'm ordering it in for testing today. It stops water adhesion to whatever it is applied to, by a lot !! First trial will be my great sweeps, one at a time to check it out.. If that works maybe on the boat bottom to reduce friction. After testing, maybe that could add boat speed without any penalty. No, I will do an article on this yet !! If, and When, it Works!! With the boat on a trailer it may take some doing, lifting and blocking to get clear -- so the oar testing comes first.. If I row in a circle, or with extra drag on one side when trading oars, THEN i'm good to share this out..
...
--
John <@Jkohnen>
Creationists make it sound as though a "theory" is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. (Isaac Asimov)


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Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

 

Here's Myles's first prop guard, and you can see his jackleg skeg extension if you look close:

https://flic.kr/p/pwsyc9

Didn't you say that you notices an improvement in performance after you put the prop-guard on, Myles?

On 5/20/2020 1:43 PM, Myles T wrote:
Maybe it’s time for a prop guard…?
In 23+ years now with the Reach Of Tide, I’ve not damaged a prop even once after installing a prop guard---first one installed about 16 years ago.
...
When I installed my first 14” prop guard, I needed to extend the outboard skeg.  Being cheap, I made an extension out of aluminum and JB Welded it to the bottom of the outboard.  It held thru a lot of log- and bottom-interference for maybe 14 years before finally letting go at the bottom of Cat’pillar island in December as I dragged the bottom.  It was a nice loud dramatic event until everything got quiet! J
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Re: Difficult decision

 

I'm pretty sure we've talked about those water-repellent coatings before. I believe the consensus opinion was that if you coat the entire surface of the hull below the waterline with the stuff, the boat will "repel" itself up out of the water and float on a film of air above the surface. Planing at rest, so to speak...

;o)

On 5/20/2020 9:20 AM, Electri-Cal wrote:
...
Whoops !!  Almost forgot --  I'm just looking at a new product, another one EH!!     I'm ordering it in for testing today.  It  stops water adhesion to whatever it is applied to, by a lot !!  First  trial will be my great sweeps, one at a time to check it out..  If that works maybe on the boat bottom to reduce friction.  After testing, maybe that could add boat speed without any penalty.  No, I will do an article on this yet !!    If, and When, it Works!!    With the boat on a trailer it may take some doing, lifting and blocking to get clear -- so the oar testing comes first..  If I row in a circle, or with extra drag on one side when trading oars, THEN i'm good to share this out..
...
--
John <@Jkohnen>
Creationists make it sound as though a "theory" is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. (Isaac Asimov)
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Re: Oar Creep?

 

If you care about such things, you could modify your oars' square looms to a D shape and releather them to regain feathering. Toledo Joe loves to make oars. He could knock out a set of oars with D shaped looms in no time. ;o)

On 5/20/2020 8:53 AM, Thorne wrote:
I've been using the Douglas locks with my 8.5' spoons and like them, but of course you can't feather oars or row in the purist's style.  ;-)
Not liking the plastic sleeves / leathers (both noisy and ugly) I built up  my own with layers of leather and PL Premium which work well.  And you can remove the oars from the Douglas locks by running the oar inboard until the thin part where loom meets blade.
That said, if having the locks attached to the oars is OK for your style of boating, the Gaco locks are probably a better choice.
--
John <@Jkohnen>
In this world of sin and sorrow there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican. (H. L. Mencken)
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Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

Myles Twete
 

Maybe it’s time for a prop guard…?

In 23+ years now with the Reach Of Tide, I’ve not damaged a prop even once after installing a prop guard---first one installed about 16 years ago.  I did finally destroy the prop guard itself dragging on the bottom this past December and had to replace it.  The new red 14” Prop Guard looks great with a new jet black paint job on the outboard.

 

Oh, don’t forget to unlock the lower unit so if you do hit something, it can ride over the object.

 

When I installed my first 14” prop guard, I needed to extend the outboard skeg.  Being cheap, I made an extension out of aluminum and JB Welded it to the bottom of the outboard.  It held thru a lot of log- and bottom-interference for maybe 14 years before finally letting go at the bottom of Cat’pillar island in December as I dragged the bottom.  It was a nice loud dramatic event until everything got quiet!  J

 

-MylesT

From: oregoncoots@groups.io [mailto:oregoncoots@groups.io] On Behalf Of Electri-Cal
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 1:30 PM
To: oregoncoots@groups.io
Subject: Re: [oregoncoots] Flailing for a shallow alarm system

 

Yep, Rich!!  Being the guy who has ruined several props, torn off a lower unit, hung on logs at Toledo, I just gotta know whats DOWN there.  Stumps, logs, and rock piles where the big ones lurk all seem to gang up on me.  With the low water we now live with, I have seen the stumps in many lakes..  I see the bent props in every lakeside resort, and with two electric pods hanging down there, I'm not taking chances.   This from the guy who got a centerboard hung in logs at sundown at Lemolo lake.  If not for a good boat hook and luck, i'd be there yet.  Boy bscouts motto is the guide on any water, so I will have two units to save the day.

See you later, and thanks for the note,  --- cal


Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

Electri-Cal
 

Yep, Rich!!  Being the guy who has ruined several props, torn off a lower unit, hung on logs at Toledo, I just gotta know whats DOWN there.  Stumps, logs, and rock piles where the big ones lurk all seem to gang up on me.  With the low water we now live with, I have seen the stumps in many lakes..  I see the bent props in every lakeside resort, and with two electric pods hanging down there, I'm not taking chances.   This from the guy who got a centerboard hung in logs at sundown at Lemolo lake.  If not for a good boat hook and luck, i'd be there yet.  Boy bscouts motto is the guide on any water, so I will have two units to save the day.

See you later, and thanks for the note,  --- cal


Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

Richard Green
 

Of course, you might ask yourself is close or guesstimate is good enough.  If it is, maybe you didn't need a sounder at all.  Just me, but I want it to be accurate and thorough as can be.

Rich

On May 20, 2020, at 6:02 AM, Electri-Cal <calboats@...> wrote:

I contacted the Hawkeye folks for info on the inside hull mounting.  Yes, it works, but reduces the depth to some degree and you have to figure it out yourself.  The bottom is less defined, Muddy bottoms might drop out, sometimes obstructions do not show up as clearly as needed before contact, fish are more problematical, etc.  Depends on the type of unit, epoxy type and thickness, and the transducer shape, -- puck, or skimmer types.   Bottom line on inside install -- is how much reduction in performance can you deal with??  I'm not fond of glassed over holes either, ones the size of a pickup ( say 3 inches outside tube ) are not my idea of great. 

 I chatted with a few folks on this, and what I am doing is in  "maybe, just try it first !!"  mode.  So, wait till I get done with the project for the moment, do some water testing and hopefully a good installation for real, and then I will have some demo stuff for intended use.  I have been known to roar off in pursuit of something that had side effects that killed the project, I THINK I can solve my dilemma , no guarantees for now.

Just thinking, maybe too mych !!  ----  Porky Pig       Thea,thea,thea, that's all folks !!            ( Still not admitting this !!  )  


Difficult decision

Electri-Cal
 

Finally got more barn wood gone, saved enough for small projects I might have, but hard to do.  Just made a small bracket from some, nice old growth, I can't even count the growth rings over 100 to the inch, unbelievable perfect grain 12 foot long and straight under the rough black outer coating.  I was surprised that  it cut like butter, dried for 50 years estimated total, always stored high and dry in my barn.  The hard part was knowing it will be used for garden borders in a guys backyard tomato bed.  Strange stuff, i've never seen that fine a grain in so light a wood, maybe like antique cedar, yellow OG hemlock, but not sure.  I might bring a sample sometime, peeled down for show and figure out what it was..

I sure tried to get coots to take it, but the black rough sawn outer coating turned lookers off, me too -- until I cut into a random couple pieces yesterday, that I held on to for a mast or other project.  Some of the heavier species might have been fabulous timbers, probably wouldn't bend well though.  Now to get rid of a couple 8 by 12 pieces of painted straight grain from an old church beam or two.  Probably cut those into firewood, or make them into new steps to replace some steps that finally rotted out at some point, and save me some bucks.

Whoops !!  Almost forgot --  I'm just looking at a new product, another one EH!!     I'm ordering it in for testing today.  It  stops water adhesion to whatever it is applied to, by a lot !!  First  trial will be my great sweeps, one at a time to check it out..  If that works maybe on the boat bottom to reduce friction.  After testing, maybe that could add boat speed without any penalty.  No, I will do an article on this yet !!    If, and When, it Works!!    With the boat on a trailer it may take some doing, lifting and blocking to get clear -- so the oar testing comes first..  If I row in a circle, or with extra drag on one side when trading oars, THEN i'm good to share this out..  

Just stuff, making goPro camera mounts, sound system install, wiring lights into Surprise,  more li'l stuff for the summer,  ----  later,   Cal 




Re: Oar Creep?

David Luckhardt
 

I've been using the Douglas locks with my 8.5' spoons and like them, but of course you can't feather oars or row in the purist's style.  ;-)

Not liking the plastic sleeves / leathers (both noisy and ugly) I built up  my own with layers of leather and PL Premium which work well.  And you can remove the oars from the Douglas locks by running the oar inboard until the thin part where loom meets blade.

That said, if having the locks attached to the oars is OK for your style of boating, the Gaco locks are probably a better choice.

P2012203.JPG

--

David "Thorne" Luckhardt

cell 510.604.8203


Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

Electri-Cal
 

I contacted the Hawkeye folks for info on the inside hull mounting.  Yes, it works, but reduces the depth to some degree and you have to figure it out yourself.  The bottom is less defined, Muddy bottoms might drop out, sometimes obstructions do not show up as clearly as needed before contact, fish are more problematical, etc.  Depends on the type of unit, epoxy type and thickness, and the transducer shape, -- puck, or skimmer types.   Bottom line on inside install -- is how much reduction in performance can you deal with??  I'm not fond of glassed over holes either, ones the size of a pickup ( say 3 inches outside tube ) are not my idea of great. 

 I chatted with a few folks on this, and what I am doing is in  "maybe, just try it first !!"  mode.  So, wait till I get done with the project for the moment, do some water testing and hopefully a good installation for real, and then I will have some demo stuff for intended use.  I have been known to roar off in pursuit of something that had side effects that killed the project, I THINK I can solve my dilemma , no guarantees for now.

Just thinking, maybe too mych !!  ----  Porky Pig       Thea,thea,thea, that's all folks !!            ( Still not admitting this !!  )  


Re: Oar Creep?

 

Not terribly expensive -- and be sure to watch the video of the scientific comparison test. ;o)

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/gaco-b.htm

On 5/18/2020 8:39 PM, Bob Miller wrote:
Duckworks sells Gaco.
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Re: Oar Creep?

Bob Miller
 

Duckworks sells Gaco.

Bob

On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote:
I found the Bolger el cheapo oarlocks in the file section of the group
web page. Put there by Pat Patteson years ago. I sure miss him. <sigh> I
enlarged the drawing. See attachment.

With a little simple lathe work a sleeve bearing could be fitted on the
horn that'd probably completely eliminate oar walking and make rowing
even easier. See Gaco oarlocks:

http://gacooarlocks.com/

--
John <jkohnen@...>
The means of defence against foreign danger have been always the
instruments of tyranny at home. (James Madison)



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Re: Oar Creep?

 

I found the Bolger el cheapo oarlocks in the file section of the group web page. Put there by Pat Patteson years ago. I sure miss him. <sigh> I enlarged the drawing. See attachment.

With a little simple lathe work a sleeve bearing could be fitted on the horn that'd probably completely eliminate oar walking and make rowing even easier. See Gaco oarlocks:

http://gacooarlocks.com/

--
John <@Jkohnen>
The means of defence against foreign danger have been always the instruments of tyranny at home. (James Madison)



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Re: Oar Creep?

Joe Novello
 

Thanks Cal. So many things to consider....I’m working on several different ideas.  I’m going to try crossing my legs - that sounds interesting. I’ll also be trying several other things as well. So much fun!

Joe



On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 5:38 PM Electri-Cal <calboats@...> wrote:
I like my oars to overlap by 6 in., especially in narrow boats.  But then I do row nor'east coast style.  Try crossing your legs opposite the oar arms crossing way, that evens the power level, then a foot board at full leg length.  On each stroke my butt raises off the seat by 3 in., then settles at strokes end.  If i don't get that lift, the blades are too small, or the length too short.  When correct, I could maintain a comfy gps 3 -4 mph in my earlier 16 ft lapstrake across Fern ridge, on a great sunny morning, about like a 3 hp outboard.  

Row like a dory fisherman 5 miles off Dover, with a catch to deliver, you'll love it.  You'll have to try the latest oars, soon as I can let go the electric fun stuff, bigger boat with locks further aft, no idea on that setup yet.

Best wishes,  Cal



On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 2:15 PM John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote:
Making your own "Bolger" oarlocks in the Boathouse foundry sounds like a
fun project! :o)

Duckworks sells bronze oarlocks with the forward horn and pin in line.
They're designed to use D-shaped collars for "automatic" feathering and
preset pitch. Not cheap:

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/rs-do.htm

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/dur-martinoli-parent.htm

A review:

https://preview.tinyurl.com/ybxtwexa

or

https://s3.amazonaws.com/duckbbs/hardware/oarlocks/douglas/Ash+Breeze+Article+11-05.pdf


On 5/17/2020 5:04 PM, Toledo Joe wrote:
> ...
> My sockets are slightly out of perpendicular, maybe 12 degrees.  I like
> the idea of the pin in line with the forward horn.  I now have food for
> thought and more directions to play.  Maybe we can forge some of our own
> oarlocks with the design described by Bolger with our new foundry.

--
John <jkohnen@...>
Skepticism, like chastity, should not be relinquished too readily.
(George Santayana)


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--
Thanks, I will reply to all mail as possible ---  Cal

--
Joe Novello


Re: Oar Creep?

Electri-Cal
 

I like my oars to overlap by 6 in., especially in narrow boats.  But then I do row nor'east coast style.  Try crossing your legs opposite the oar arms crossing way, that evens the power level, then a foot board at full leg length.  On each stroke my butt raises off the seat by 3 in., then settles at strokes end.  If i don't get that lift, the blades are too small, or the length too short.  When correct, I could maintain a comfy gps 3 -4 mph in my earlier 16 ft lapstrake across Fern ridge, on a great sunny morning, about like a 3 hp outboard.  

Row like a dory fisherman 5 miles off Dover, with a catch to deliver, you'll love it.  You'll have to try the latest oars, soon as I can let go the electric fun stuff, bigger boat with locks further aft, no idea on that setup yet.

Best wishes,  Cal



On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 2:15 PM John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote:
Making your own "Bolger" oarlocks in the Boathouse foundry sounds like a
fun project! :o)

Duckworks sells bronze oarlocks with the forward horn and pin in line.
They're designed to use D-shaped collars for "automatic" feathering and
preset pitch. Not cheap:

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/rs-do.htm

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/dur-martinoli-parent.htm

A review:

https://preview.tinyurl.com/ybxtwexa

or

https://s3.amazonaws.com/duckbbs/hardware/oarlocks/douglas/Ash+Breeze+Article+11-05.pdf


On 5/17/2020 5:04 PM, Toledo Joe wrote:
> ...
> My sockets are slightly out of perpendicular, maybe 12 degrees.  I like
> the idea of the pin in line with the forward horn.  I now have food for
> thought and more directions to play.  Maybe we can forge some of our own
> oarlocks with the design described by Bolger with our new foundry.

--
John <jkohnen@...>
Skepticism, like chastity, should not be relinquished too readily.
(George Santayana)


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Thanks, I will reply to all mail as possible ---  Cal


Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

Electri-Cal
 

that will be a (wait for it ) Surprise, until I see that it works.  Don't want to give out bad info. on untested stuff.  I am hoping my idea will work, and I could produce a finished product asap.  Thanks for asking, when ready will show and tell.
Yea, Coots ---  Porky Pig


On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 4:33 PM John Kohnen <jkohnen@...> wrote:
What depthsounder did you order, Cal? Link?

A through-hull transducer would have been easy enough to replace, if you
bedded it in something less permanent than 5200... When mounting the
transom mount transducer inside the boat, remove _all_ the wood below it
and fill the hole with epoxy. Be careful to avoid bubbles in the goo. I
think I'd just stick the transducer to the top of the epoxy filler with
a glob of thickened epoxy. No messing with liquid filled tubes and such...

On 5/18/2020 11:05 AM, Electri-Cal wrote:
> Mumm, I just now ordered what I HOPE will be the answer to hanging the
> boat up on stuff.  I did order one at $56.00 - so half the price of the
> Norcross unit.
 > ...

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There are two theories to arguing with a woman. Neither works. (Will Rogers)


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Thanks, I will reply to all mail as possible ---  Cal


Re: Flailing for a shallow alarm system

 

What depthsounder did you order, Cal? Link?

A through-hull transducer would have been easy enough to replace, if you bedded it in something less permanent than 5200... When mounting the transom mount transducer inside the boat, remove _all_ the wood below it and fill the hole with epoxy. Be careful to avoid bubbles in the goo. I think I'd just stick the transducer to the top of the epoxy filler with a glob of thickened epoxy. No messing with liquid filled tubes and such...

On 5/18/2020 11:05 AM, Electri-Cal wrote:
Mumm, I just now ordered what I HOPE will be the answer to hanging the boat up on stuff.  I did order one at $56.00 - so half the price of the Norcross unit.
...
--
John <@Jkohnen>
There are two theories to arguing with a woman. Neither works. (Will Rogers)
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Re: Oar Creep?

 

Making your own "Bolger" oarlocks in the Boathouse foundry sounds like a fun project! :o)

Duckworks sells bronze oarlocks with the forward horn and pin in line. They're designed to use D-shaped collars for "automatic" feathering and preset pitch. Not cheap:

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/rs-do.htm

https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/dur-martinoli-parent.htm

A review:

https://preview.tinyurl.com/ybxtwexa

or

https://s3.amazonaws.com/duckbbs/hardware/oarlocks/douglas/Ash+Breeze+Article+11-05.pdf

On 5/17/2020 5:04 PM, Toledo Joe wrote:
...
My sockets are slightly out of perpendicular, maybe 12 degrees.  I like the idea of the pin in line with the forward horn.  I now have food for thought and more directions to play.  Maybe we can forge some of our own oarlocks with the design described by Bolger with our new foundry.
--
John <@Jkohnen>
Skepticism, like chastity, should not be relinquished too readily. (George Santayana)
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