Date   

Re: On the proliferation of groups

Maria Morrow <mariamorrowquilter@...>
 

Jim and Diane,

Most of my adult life has been volunteering.  You are right on all points. I hope this poem blesses and doesn’t offend anyone.  I learned it in a private school forty years ago. At that time the author was unknown... now someone has claimed ownership. But I think the author was someone from way long ago.   This poem, among many other great writings, gives me great hope when this world gets scary and when I think about Big Brother watching. 
 

Step By Step
Author unknown

He does not lead me year by year,
Nor even day by day.
But step by step my path unfolds.
Th Lord directs my way.

Tomorrow’s plans I do not know,
I only know this minute. 
But He will say, “This is the way,
By faith, now walk ye in it.”

And I am glad that it is so,
Today’s enough to bear. 
For when tomorrow comes,
His grace shall far exceed His care. 

So do not worry then or fret,
The  God who gave His Son.
Holds all my moments in His Hand
And gives them one by one.



Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 10, 2018, at 11:08 AM, onlinesewing@... wrote:

< Long Rant>
Many years ago, perhaps an eon in Internet time, I joined an email list run by a couple in Virginia. This was known as the "Wades' List", following the name of the couple. Through that list I met a number of friends, and even attended a "gathering" of members. Eventually the company that hosted that list was absorbed by Yahoo. After the introduction of the Memory Craft 12000 I created a new group for support, and extended it to eventually include all of the 9mm embroidery-capable models. Last year Verizon consumed Yahoo, as we move ever closer to one gigantic corporation that owns everything in the world. I blissfully ignored that, until my dear friend Maggie alerted me that Verizon has no intention of supporting Yahoo Groups. Using the tools provided, I migrated the group to Groups.io, which you are now in if you are reading this. This company still provides a free service, with some restrictions. As we move forward I will probably adopt one of their commercial plans just for the convenience of the additional features.

Meanwhile, down in the (Silicon) Valley another gigantic entity called Facebook also provides groups. These are not email-based, but rather feed into your Facebook daily feed. It's very close to real time, meaning that questions asked there are often answered within a few minutes - no need to wait for email, especially if you only get a daily digest of posts here. A group focused on the Janome 15000 was created, which I joined. I should point out that being the administrator of a group does require a time commitment, especially if it has a lot of members. I have one group that I administer, but it's small and devoted to one of our iPad apps. I don't post as often as I should, but that's mostly because I am over-committed in other areas. What I have noticed in very large Facebook groups is that there is a lot of impatience. When the same question is posted for the third or fourth time, snarky comments follow. This is partly because Facebook is like a stream. Things go floating by and they disappear. You can't search to see if a question has been asked before. Searching a mailing list is not particularly rewarding either, but there is some hope of finding what you want. Not so on Facebook - if you see it and you think you might want it later, you have to save it. I think this is why a lot of groups tend to get "mean" over time. This has happened to two groups I am in that are devoted to humor. New people don't know what's already been posted, so they post things they like, not knowing they've been seen by almost all the members multiple times. This leads to nasty comments and requests that the administrator change the rules regarding new posts. As members are chastised for innocent behavior, they leave and often form a new "nice" group. This process can repeat many times.

This is not quite the same behavior as what has happened in the "Janome Horizon MC 15000" group, but it's similar. Moderating a group means you may have a member who has little to no dealer support, and you get peppered with questions that have already been answered before. I learned early on that creating this group would mean I would be fulfilling the dealer's role of support without any compensation. It's worth it to me in order to keep in touch with you, as friends AND as customers. We do have an income stream from our apps, which is sufficient for us to avoid food stamps, but not enough for a weekend in Maui. You have been very loyal to us, and have recommended us to countless others, for which we are very grateful. That's why we're here.

All that having been said, we need to say something about Facebook. It's a completely free service, yet the founder is one of the richest men in the world. How is this possible? On the Internet, which you cannot see where the money comes from, it's YOU! Not only does Facebook relentlessly watch your every click so they can craft ads just for you, they also mine an enormous amount of data regarding your likes, dislikes, and general interests. This is shared (for money) with many other companies so they can market to you. That's the price of using this "free" service. With all the furor over the CIA and NSA capturing data on citizens, I would venture to say that Facebook already has far more information than the government has ever collected. And they are working non-stop on new methods to capture even more data. I'm not trying to prevent you from using Facebook. It's too late for that, we're all in now! I just wanted to offer a bit of perspective to increase understanding. The unintended consequence of the always-connected nature of the Internet tends to split people up into polarized camps. That's why I don't use Twitter - everything said leads to one group loving it and another hating it! I don't have a solution. I think it's inherent to the Internet itself. It's much easier to chew someone out through a keyboard, rather than face to face over the back fence.

</ Long Rant>


[No Subject]

DIANNE COOPER
 


register me please    ditiques
@comcast.net


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Patricia Ward
 

Kaye, no that was not me....  maybe another Pat?    I met Diane, Jim, and Stan Woodward at the Wades Gathering in Virginia.  That Stan was quite a character...  put him with Jim and you were sure to have laughs and entertainment from the two.  😊

Pat 

On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 2:57 AM, Kaye Lessard <ekay50@...> wrote:
Pat are you also the lady who went to jims mc university classes in Denton Tx way when???
i remember meeting you at that class!!!
kaye in la (lessard)



Re: whose turn to make the coffee

B Diane Landon <publicaddress@...>
 

Please where is the group to learn to digitize? I want to join.
B Diane Landon 6600 and S9

Sent from my iPad


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Kaye Lessard
 

Pat are you also the lady who went to jims mc university classes in Denton Tx way when???
i remember meeting you at that class!!!
kaye in la (lessard)


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Ann Jones
 

Lovely rant Maggie. I so supported your first email re the temerity of the writer re the FB group. I always look forward to my emails that this group sends in and have found Jim and Dianne’s information valuable
I do not have the 15000 but both the 9400 and 500e The information is generic to a sewer who can multitask.
Btw I am in Adelaide au which has little to do with this discussion other than to say our shop options are few hence the internet invaluable especially this group.handi quilter went to FB from a yahoo group and has been the poorer for it. Google are good at targeting ads directed at the user, Hmmm as Maggie said just a huge data collection.
May the group continue to thrive and blossom as is very much needed. And may the odd user read the information re email etiquette. My two cents worth.
Ann


Sent from Yahoo7 Mail. Get the app

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 11/1/18, maggie cooper via Groups.Io <maggiecoops=yahoo.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

Subject: Re: [onlinesewing-janome] On the proliferation of groups
To: onlinesewing-janome@groups.io
Received: Thursday, 11 January, 2018, 9:31 AM

that's not a rant
Jim, just someone explaining things nicely. I have been
accused of being a technophobe because I refuse to own an
iPad or iPhone, or one of the many android versions that
exist. How can you possibly manage without a smart phone is
a question I'm frequently asked. I know I shouldn't
but I invariably answer with 'send smoke
signals'that usually is met with 'so your scared of
technology, I shrug and ignore it. I love all the massive
technological leaps that have happened over the past 100
years, I embrace the advances made in fields as diverse as
weather forecasting, (still can't compete with Freds
aching knees) to space exploration, I love using technology
as a tool. What I don't like is how it is used by
commerce to shape peoples choices, the callous way companies
like Google, Facebook, Instagram, Watts-app. MicroSoft and
Apple simply ignore end users  privacy settings, they are
treated as nothing more than data collection points to
generate huge profits. If you own a smart phone, you are
effectively wearing a barcode, it can track your every move,
send details back to an enormous data cruncher, who needs
big brother, its here and its called iPhone, iPad or
Android. Clicks on a like symbol, that betrays your likes
and dislikes, browse the Internet and every site you visit,
every article you read, even sites well brought up folks
shouldn't visit, are recorded. Governments would love
unfettered access to all the data we unwitting mortals
gladly provide every day, that is the side of technology I
dislike. 
I did very much against my better
judgement, join FB to support both a good friend and
Wilcom's Hatch FB group Hatchlings. I sent one post to
my friends group, and answered 2 hatch questions, FB decided
my activity was suspicious and because I didn't own a
smart phone to verify my identity, decided to bar me.
Believe me that was wonderful, I don't do Twitter,
Instagram, LinkedIn, WhatsAp, (owned by FB) I do use Skype
to natter to my family in Oz, Indonesia, old friends in the
USA and Europe, but even that is getting annoyingly
pervasive. So I'm thinking of going back to a Voip
softphone, something I used for a long time.  So no
technology doesn't worry me, its the way the big boys
use it to control, manipulate, shape the lives of their end
users.
Now that is a rant!


Re: A new Facebook group...

Jeannie Smith
 

I wish to say A Big thank you to you for this you are so very RIGHT . THANK YOU.



From: Laura Velez via Groups.Io <lgvelez@...>
To: onlinesewing-janome@groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 9:40 AM
Subject: Re: [onlinesewing-janome] A new Facebook group...

Amen. I agree. I do not have a 15000, but have an S7. I have learned more from this group than any other Janome group. 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

On Wednesday, January 10, 2018, 8:13 AM, maggie cooper via Groups.Io <maggiecoops@...> wrote:

I read this mail in total disbelief, it implies a friction existed, something I never experienced in the old group, it is also totally inappropriate to advertise another group on a successfully running platform that fulfils the needs of its membership and owner.  Quite frankly I'm appalled by your  mail, it shows a lack of group etiquette on your part, and implies this groups owner lacks the expertise and skill set to run a group. 2 attributes Jim and Diane have continuously shown they both have in abundance. 

Jim quite sensibly portaged the old group to this platform after discovering Yahoo had removed support for Yahoo groups back in 2014, something they never advised group owners about. One thing beyond his control was members whose mails were bouncing, Groups.io. do not transfer members who are bouncing mails back to senders, they class them as removed. Had the group remained with Yahoo/Verizon/Oath it would have been left to decay to the point of destruction, a point many Yahoo groups have found themselves in. 

This group has two very important assets, three if I include Jim's lovely sense of humour, those assets are Jim and Diane Stutsman, it would be a very foolish move to leave the known tried and tested knowledge of the owners of this group to follow an untried, untested group that appears by the first mail in this thread, to be a group of disaffected, dare I say drama queens, perhaps not, but certainly people who are maybe disappointed that Jim and Diane chose not to use perhaps the worse group provider on the web, FaceBook. 




Re: Yahoo Mail Question

J Fraker
 

I've been having an awful time with yahoo mail.  It's been sluggish, shuts down for no reason.  I too have had it for many years.  In fact, it's the only email address I've ever had.  I just switched to gmail.  So far, I'm very happy with it.  It's kind of a pain to notify everyone, change it various website, etc., but I'm still checking the Yahoo mail and will continue to for awhile until I get everything switched over.

On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 6:08 PM, Jim Stutsman <jim.stutsman@...> wrote:
The consensus among the experts seems to be that Yahoo Mail will remain as it is, although one would hope that they would improve security and overall operation. See this:

Personally I use iCloud mail, which is available free to anyone with an Apple product (iPhone, iPad, Mac). All of my other email addresses forward to that account. iCloud mail does not do advertising. There have been hacks of individual accounts, using social media to get the answers to the “Lost password” security settings. Apple has since added two-step authentication, which plugs that hole.



Re: A new Facebook group...

Kaye Lessard
 

Hi Maggie
I have to agree on Jim & Diane!!!!without Jim I would have never learned to digitize to begin with!!! I have taken classes with Diane also and she is great!!!! Love them both and very very grateful for them!!!!
Kaye in la

Sent from my iPhone


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Patricia Ward
 

Back to the days of the 9000... remember Jim's Lettering program and the program for the no 5 hoop so we could get more designs into it?   

Yep, way back when.....and we sure have come a LONG way...   vbg 

Pat

On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 6:46 PM, suerevere@... <srevere@...> wrote:
As one of the “Wade’s Group” members eons ago, I thank you for the education and the trip down memory lane. I remember when you started the group and how much help you gave to us all. Remember the program you wrote to use as a work-around until Janome came up with a fix for … ( I don’t remember what it did or why we needed it, but I used it — it had a frog for it’s icon). You always had a workaround for us for problems, and this is going back to when many of us were using coffee filters for stabilizers. WOW has technology and access to everything come a long way quickly. My first access to online was using Prodigy thru Compuserve and aol at a baud rate of 1200 — (shoot me!). I loved out of the country for several years and your group’s assistance was invaluable. Thanks to all the help you and the group provided, I was able to stick to it and enjoy it tremendously. Thanks to you and Diane!






Re: On the proliferation of groups

suerevere@ymail.com <srevere@...>
 

As one of the “Wade’s Group” members eons ago, I thank you for the education and the trip down memory lane. I remember when you started the group and how much help you gave to us all. Remember the program you wrote to use as a work-around until Janome came up with a fix for … ( I don’t remember what it did or why we needed it, but I used it — it had a frog for it’s icon). You always had a workaround for us for problems, and this is going back to when many of us were using coffee filters for stabilizers. WOW has technology and access to everything come a long way quickly. My first access to online was using Prodigy thru Compuserve and aol at a baud rate of 1200 — (shoot me!). I loved out of the country for several years and your group’s assistance was invaluable. Thanks to all the help you and the group provided, I was able to stick to it and enjoy it tremendously. Thanks to you and Diane!


Re: A new Facebook group...

Pru Joy
 

It took a couple of reads but I knew what you were talking about Ceil & was grateful for the heads up although I left FaceBook about 6 months ago - it is such a time drain!  Time I could better invest in actual hands on sewing, lol!


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Charlene Kay Bergren
 

Just wanted to say a great big “thank you” Jim, for all your valuable information you provide to all of us.   I read it all every day – keep some for reference now and later – and gain lots of knowledge from someone who has “been there and done it” – you Jim.  Hope in 2018, I’ll see my way clear to get a 15000 – but time will tell.  Thanks again to you and Diane for all your great advice!

 

Kay Bergren

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Jim Stutsman
 

Well said!


Re: Yahoo Mail Question

Jim Stutsman
 

The consensus among the experts seems to be that Yahoo Mail will remain as it is, although one would hope that they would improve security and overall operation. See this:

Personally I use iCloud mail, which is available free to anyone with an Apple product (iPhone, iPad, Mac). All of my other email addresses forward to that account. iCloud mail does not do advertising. There have been hacks of individual accounts, using social media to get the answers to the “Lost password” security settings. Apple has since added two-step authentication, which plugs that hole.


Re: On the proliferation of groups

maggie cooper
 

that's not a rant Jim, just someone explaining things nicely. I have been accused of being a technophobe because I refuse to own an iPad or iPhone, or one of the many android versions that exist. How can you possibly manage without a smart phone is a question I'm frequently asked. I know I shouldn't but I invariably answer with 'send smoke signals'that usually is met with 'so your scared of technology, I shrug and ignore it. I love all the massive technological leaps that have happened over the past 100 years, I embrace the advances made in fields as diverse as weather forecasting, (still can't compete with Freds aching knees) to space exploration, I love using technology as a tool. What I don't like is how it is used by commerce to shape peoples choices, the callous way companies like Google, Facebook, Instagram, Watts-app. MicroSoft and Apple simply ignore end users  privacy settings, they are treated as nothing more than data collection points to generate huge profits. If you own a smart phone, you are effectively wearing a barcode, it can track your every move, send details back to an enormous data cruncher, who needs big brother, its here and its called iPhone, iPad or Android. Clicks on a like symbol, that betrays your likes and dislikes, browse the Internet and every site you visit, every article you read, even sites well brought up folks shouldn't visit, are recorded. Governments would love unfettered access to all the data we unwitting mortals gladly provide every day, that is the side of technology I dislike. 
I did very much against my better judgement, join FB to support both a good friend and Wilcom's Hatch FB group Hatchlings. I sent one post to my friends group, and answered 2 hatch questions, FB decided my activity was suspicious and because I didn't own a smart phone to verify my identity, decided to bar me. Believe me that was wonderful, I don't do Twitter, Instagram, LinkedIn, WhatsAp, (owned by FB) I do use Skype to natter to my family in Oz, Indonesia, old friends in the USA and Europe, but even that is getting annoyingly pervasive. So I'm thinking of going back to a Voip softphone, something I used for a long time.  So no technology doesn't worry me, its the way the big boys use it to control, manipulate, shape the lives of their end users.
Now that is a rant!
 


Yahoo Mail Question

Carole Hollmann
 

Advice, please. 

This is a bit off track...but since the Yahoo Groups isn't being supported any more, what about the free version of Yahoo Mail?  Does anyone know?  I've been using it for 14 years now, but have had a few problems getting the mail to update on my iPhone lately (not to mention the security hacks).  As bad as it would be to change e-mails at this point, I'm thinking it might be a good time to go to a different e-mail.

Does anyone know if Yahoo mail is just dying out there?  Is there one e-mail that is considered the "best"?

Thanks!

Carole


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Mary E
 

Your advice has been invaluable for me, Jim. I appreciate learning how all the levels of the internet are working, especially how much info they are collecting on us regular folks 
Mary


On Wednesday, January 10, 2018, <onlinesewing@...> wrote:
< Long Rant>
Many years ago, perhaps an eon in Internet time, I joined an email list run by a couple in Virginia. This was known as the "Wades' List", following the name of the couple. Through that list I met a number of friends, and even attended a "gathering" of members. Eventually the company that hosted that list was absorbed by Yahoo. After the introduction of the Memory Craft 12000 I created a new group for support, and extended it to eventually include all of the 9mm embroidery-capable models. Last year Verizon consumed Yahoo, as we move ever closer to one gigantic corporation that owns everything in the world. I blissfully ignored that, until my dear friend Maggie alerted me that Verizon has no intention of supporting Yahoo Groups. Using the tools provided, I migrated the group to Groups.io, which you are now in if you are reading this. This company still provides a free service, with some restrictions. As we move forward I will probably adopt one of their commercial plans just for the convenience of the additional features.

Meanwhile, down in the (Silicon) Valley another gigantic entity called Facebook also provides groups. These are not email-based, but rather feed into your Facebook daily feed. It's very close to real time, meaning that questions asked there are often answered within a few minutes - no need to wait for email, especially if you only get a daily digest of posts here. A group focused on the Janome 15000 was created, which I joined. I should point out that being the administrator of a group does require a time commitment, especially if it has a lot of members. I have one group that I administer, but it's small and devoted to one of our iPad apps. I don't post as often as I should, but that's mostly because I am over-committed in other areas. What I have noticed in very large Facebook groups is that there is a lot of impatience. When the same question is posted for the third or fourth time, snarky comments follow. This is partly because Facebook is like a stream. Things go floating by and they disappear. You can't search to see if a question has been asked before. Searching a mailing list is not particularly rewarding either, but there is some hope of finding what you want. Not so on Facebook - if you see it and you think you might want it later, you have to save it. I think this is why a lot of groups tend to get "mean" over time. This has happened to two groups I am in that are devoted to humor. New people don't know what's already been posted, so they post things they like, not knowing they've been seen by almost all the members multiple times. This leads to nasty comments and requests that the administrator change the rules regarding new posts. As members are chastised for innocent behavior, they leave and often form a new "nice" group. This process can repeat many times.

This is not quite the same behavior as what has happened in the "Janome Horizon MC 15000" group, but it's similar. Moderating a group means you may have a member who has little to no dealer support, and you get peppered with questions that have already been answered before. I learned early on that creating this group would mean I would be fulfilling the dealer's role of support without any compensation. It's worth it to me in order to keep in touch with you, as friends AND as customers. We do have an income stream from our apps, which is sufficient for us to avoid food stamps, but not enough for a weekend in Maui. You have been very loyal to us, and have recommended us to countless others, for which we are very grateful. That's why we're here.

All that having been said, we need to say something about Facebook. It's a completely free service, yet the founder is one of the richest men in the world. How is this possible? On the Internet, which you cannot see where the money comes from, it's YOU! Not only does Facebook relentlessly watch your every click so they can craft ads just for you, they also mine an enormous amount of data regarding your likes, dislikes, and general interests. This is shared (for money) with many other companies so they can market to you. That's the price of using this "free" service. With all the furor over the CIA and NSA capturing data on citizens, I would venture to say that Facebook already has far more information than the government has ever collected. And they are working non-stop on new methods to capture even more data. I'm not trying to prevent you from using Facebook. It's too late for that, we're all in now! I just wanted to offer a bit of perspective to increase understanding. The unintended consequence of the always-connected nature of the Internet tends to split people up into polarized camps. That's why I don't use Twitter - everything said leads to one group loving it and another hating it! I don't have a solution. I think it's inherent to the Internet itself. It's much easier to chew someone out through a keyboard, rather than face to face over the back fence.

</ Long Rant>


Re: On the proliferation of groups

Dottie Newkirk
 

Thanks for your note ("rant", LOL), Jim......I'm one of those fortunate to have met you and Diane (as well as Stan from Australia) many, many years ago at the Virginia get-together.

You and Diane have been so very, very helpful to Janome owners/users for many years and y'all are very appreciated!!!  Happy 2018 and looking forward to more help and humor this year.  Dottie (now in Texas)


Re: A new Facebook group...

Cheryl Paul
 

Diane and Jim - you are the best, I love the group and especially Jim’s humour.

To others - let’s not bring bad stuff to the group as it can create such chaos - we need that time to learn and to sew more.

Cheryl - Saskatoon

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