Date   
Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,
I'll think about that possibility, as it'll affect all my add-ons
(WinTenApps isn't the only one with this capability). Thanks for reminding
me.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of James Scholes
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2020 8:16 AM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

> The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug -
you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit
NVDA dialog unless an update is pending).

This is a weird decision, and not particularly user-friendly if the exit
dialog is disabled. Those users would need to first go and enable that
dialog, at which point they may as well just turn on debug logging anyway.
Suggest a rethink on this one.

Regards,

James Scholes

On 25/03/2020 at 11:44 pm, Joseph Lee wrote:
Hi,

The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug
- you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in
Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending). This choice is
intentional - it eases debugging by letting users restart with a
dedicated debug logging mode without having to set log level to debug.
The debug printout will then show up via log viewer and the text
starts with "W10: ".

Cheers,

Joseph

*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> *On Behalf Of *Bill
Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:38 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

OK, I've installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials
add-on and set my log level to "debug". To test, I opened up cmd (with
UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I
don't see any UIA events. I'd expect to see several textChange events
if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?

Thanks,

Bill

*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
<nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of
*Joseph Lee
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 01:31
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events
generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to
using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate
certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App
Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
<nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of
*Bill Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

Bill

*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
<nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of
*Joseph Lee
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 01:27
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode
(restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events
fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event
(which we don't care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app
module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the
last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented
to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
<nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of
*Bill Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Hello,

I'm working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases,
messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified
by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the
list view is updated with these messages. I'd like to have NVDA
automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn't seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are
added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when
subscribing to display model notifications for the list with
displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What's the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly
poll the list?

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

James Scholes
 

The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to
debug – you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending).

This is a weird decision, and not particularly user-friendly if the exit dialog is disabled. Those users would need to first go and enable that dialog, at which point they may as well just turn on debug logging anyway. Suggest a rethink on this one.

Regards,

James Scholes

On 25/03/2020 at 11:44 pm, Joseph Lee wrote:
Hi,
The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug – you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending). This choice is intentional – it eases debugging by letting users restart with a dedicated debug logging mode without having to set log level to debug. The debug printout will then show up via log viewer and the text starts with “W10: “.
Cheers,
Joseph
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> *On Behalf Of *Bill Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:38 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
OK, I’ve installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials add-on and set my log level to “debug”. To test, I opened up cmd (with UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I don’t see any UIA events. I’d expect to see several textChange events if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?
Thanks,
Bill
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io> <nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of *Joseph Lee
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 01:31
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
Hi,
AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.
Cheers,
Joseph
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io> <nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of *Bill Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
What is AccEvent?
Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).
Bill
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io> <nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of *Joseph Lee
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 01:27
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
Hi,
What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).
Which apps are you writing app modules for?
Cheers,
Joseph
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io> <nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>> *On Behalf Of *Bill Dengler
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
Hello,
I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.
It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).
What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?
Thanks,
Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

James Scholes
 

Is there an area of the app which displays some information which does update in line with the content of the list view, such as an unread messages indicator or counter? If that fires a change event, you could then respond and check the list view for new content rather than constantly polling it.

Regards,

James Scholes

On 26/03/2020 at 2:32 am, Bill Dengler wrote:
Thanks!
Is there any way to tell when an application loses focus? I don’t seem to be getting loseFocus events on the main window…
Bill
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> *On Behalf Of *Leonard de Ruijter
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 03:28
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
You would have to write a script that overrides the tab and either implement your own tab traversal, or when pressing tab, execute the tab gesture as long as you reached the right element. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.
On 26/03/2020 08:16, Bill Dengler wrote:
Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell
Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit
tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the
blanks).
Bill
*From:*nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
<nvda-devel@groups.io> <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io> *On Behalf Of
*Leonard de Ruijter
*Sent:* 26 March 2020 03:12
*To:* nvda-devel@groups.io <mailto:nvda-devel@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items
Hey Bill,
I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the
fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP,
there's not much else to do other than polling.
Regards,
Leonard
On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:
Hello,
I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both
cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely
identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new
messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages.
I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar
to Skype/Miranda.
It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items
are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed
when subscribing to display model notifications for the list
with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).
What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to
constantly poll the list?
Thanks,
Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Good point


I believe lose focus is only called on real focus objects. There is no negated version of focusEntered.

If you need to track a lose focus of a main window within the app, event_foreground globally on the module is probably your best friend. Otherwise, there is event_appModule_loseFocus that's called when you move out of the app.

if you look in appModuleHandler.py, there seems to be an event_appLoseFocus event. I think that's a bug and should be event_appModule_loseFocus as well.

On 26/03/2020 09:32, Bill Dengler wrote:

Thanks!

Is there any way to tell when an application loses focus? I don’t seem to be getting loseFocus events on the main window…

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:28
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

You would have to write a script that overrides the tab and either implement your own tab traversal, or when pressing tab, execute the tab gesture as long as you reached the right element. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.

On 26/03/2020 08:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the blanks).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

derek riemer
 

event_appModule_loseFocus

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 2:32 AM Bill Dengler <codeofdusk@...> wrote:

Thanks!

Is there any way to tell when an application loses focus? I don’t seem to be getting loseFocus events on the main window…

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:28
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

You would have to write a script that overrides the tab and either implement your own tab traversal, or when pressing tab, execute the tab gesture as long as you reached the right element. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.

On 26/03/2020 08:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the blanks).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill



--
Derek Riemer
Improving the world one byte at a time!        ⠠⠊⠍⠏⠗⠕⠧⠬ ⠮ ⠸⠺ ⠐⠕ ⠃⠽⠞⠑ ⠁⠞ ⠁ ⠐⠞⠖
•    Accessibility enthusiast.
•    Proud user of the NVDA screen reader.
•    Open source enthusiast.
•    Skier.

•    Personal website: https://derekriemer.com




Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Thanks!

Is there any way to tell when an application loses focus? I don’t seem to be getting loseFocus events on the main window…

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:28
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

You would have to write a script that overrides the tab and either implement your own tab traversal, or when pressing tab, execute the tab gesture as long as you reached the right element. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.

On 26/03/2020 08:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the blanks).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

You would have to write a script that overrides the tab and either implement your own tab traversal, or when pressing tab, execute the tab gesture as long as you reached the right element. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.

On 26/03/2020 08:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the blanks).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Also, is there a way to remove elements from the tab order? Dell Mobile Connect has several empty elements, so you often have to hit tab three or four times to move between elements (to skip over the blanks).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Yes, that’s what I’ve done.

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Leonard de Ruijter
Sent: 26 March 2020 03:12
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,

 

I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.

 

Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hey Bill,


I assume you have used Windows 10 app essentials to track down the fact that you don't receive any events. In that case, for UWP, there's not much else to do other than polling.


Regards,

Leonard

On 26/03/2020 06:16, Bill Dengler wrote:

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Nope, even that isn’t consistent: you have to focus the list once first, and even that doesn’t guarantee you’ll get name change events. To get them consistently you need to scroll the list.

Any other ideas?

 

Thanks,

Bill

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler via Groups.Io
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:57
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Works, thanks!

Seems the list items send nameChange events, but not the list itself. I think I can work with that.

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:44
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug – you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending). This choice is intentional – it eases debugging by letting users restart with a dedicated debug logging mode without having to set log level to debug. The debug printout will then show up via log viewer and the text starts with “W10: “.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:38 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

OK, I’ve installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials add-on and set my log level to “debug”. To test, I opened up cmd (with UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I don’t see any UIA events. I’d expect to see several textChange events if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?

 

Thanks,

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:31
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Works, thanks!

Seems the list items send nameChange events, but not the list itself. I think I can work with that.

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:44
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug – you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending). This choice is intentional – it eases debugging by letting users restart with a dedicated debug logging mode without having to set log level to debug. The debug printout will then show up via log viewer and the text starts with “W10: “.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:38 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

OK, I’ve installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials add-on and set my log level to “debug”. To test, I opened up cmd (with UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I don’t see any UIA events. I’d expect to see several textChange events if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?

 

Thanks,

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:31
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

The debug printout will not show up if you just set log level to debug – you must restart NVDA with debug logging enabled (the last option in Exit NVDA dialog unless an update is pending). This choice is intentional – it eases debugging by letting users restart with a dedicated debug logging mode without having to set log level to debug. The debug printout will then show up via log viewer and the text starts with “W10: “.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:38 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

OK, I’ve installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials add-on and set my log level to “debug”. To test, I opened up cmd (with UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I don’t see any UIA events. I’d expect to see several textChange events if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?

 

Thanks,

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:31
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

OK, I’ve installed the latest version of the Windows 10 app essentials add-on and set my log level to “debug”. To test, I opened up cmd (with UIA console), ran some commands, and looked at the NVDA log, but I don’t see any UIA events. I’d expect to see several textChange events if the add-on is writing to the NVDA log. Where are UIA events logged?

 

Thanks,

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:31
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

AccEvent is a Windows SDK tool that will report accessibility events generated by MSAA/UIA servers (apps and controls). I usually resort to using AccEvent if I need information for new events and/or investigate certain events further. For the most part, I use Windows 10 App Essentials add-on debug printout for UIA event tracking.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:28 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

What is AccEvent?

Unigram (Telegram) and Dell Mobile Connect (iMessage).

 

Bill

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: 26 March 2020 01:27
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hi,

What does AccEvent and Windows 10 App Essentials add-on in debug mode (restarting NVDA with debug logging enabled) tell you about events fired by the message list/items? Apart from structure change event (which we don’t care about), the way I did for old UWP Skype app module was to look at events from other UIA elements and announce the last message accordingly (a variant of this algorithm was implemented to let NVDA announce text responses from Cortana 2 in Version 2004).

Which apps are you writing app modules for?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda-devel@groups.io <nvda-devel@groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Dengler
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2020 10:17 PM
To: nvda-devel@groups.io
Subject: [nvda-devel] UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

UIA: monitoring a list view for new items

Bill Dengler
 

Hello,

I’m working on app modules for two UWP messaging apps. In both cases, messages are presented in list views that can be uniquely identified by obj.UIAElement.CachedAutomationID. When new messages arrive, the list view is updated with these messages. I’d like to have NVDA automatically read these messages, similar to Skype/Miranda.

It doesn’t seem like any NVDA events are executed when new items are added to the list, and no textChange events are executed when subscribing to display model notifications for the list with displayModel.requestTextChangeNotifications(obj, True).

What’s the best way to detect new list items? Do I need to constantly poll the list?

 

Thanks,

Bill

Re: Statement from Joseph Lee regarding NVDA add-ons and Windows XP support requests: no more, period

Brian's Mail list account
 

I'd like to add two things to this.
1. Outlook Express is still used by me, and can be modified to work on both windows 7 and 10, but I'd not expect anyone to add features to any screenreader to make it work better or differently as most of us who use it understand it could stop at any day, particularly in 10.
2 Windows XP most browsers work so slowly, if they work at all on many web sites, as to make them unusable.
Many third party software releases no longer work either including many anti virus solutions such as the Microsoft one, which only seems able to update one of its parts, and hence leaves gaps in protection. Many machines running the older AMD chipset cannot even run security essentials, or malwarebytes modern code and ccleaner either.
It is, sadly, time to relegate xp to simply a file server here, and then only on line for brief periods in case of drive by infection.

I also want to point out that Microsoft, though not officially supporting windows 7, did recently send me an update and continue to do so on security essentials and make their new Edge Browser work on 7, so we have a way to go yet here, but I expect the time will come to ditch that as well. If only Microsoft did not effectively do a reinstall every few months on windows 10, it would suit me fine, but as it is with so many legacy bits of software its a major pain to get everything back after an update.
OK I'm going back to sleep now!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
Newsgroup monitored: alt.comp.blind-users

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <@joslee>
To: <nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2020 10:01 PM
Subject: [nvda-devel] Statement from Joseph Lee regarding NVDA add-ons and Windows XP support requests: no more, period


Hello NVDA users and add-on developers,



First, I would like to reiterate how important it is that everyone listen to
advice from reputable sources regarding COVID-19, including public health
officials recommending folks to exercise social distancing for a while. Even
if you do not feel sick, please help others by washing hands, practice
social distancing, and monitor the situation regarding the pandemic and
community spread. And since the NVDA community is a global movement, please
support each other.



Onto the matter at hand: for several days I have received requests about
NVDA add-ons and Windows XP support. Requests have included making add-ons
compatible with Windows XP again, compatibility issues, and backporting
newer NVDA bug fixes and features to users of NVDA 2017.3, the last version
compatible with Windows XP.



At the moment there is no community guidance on support for Windows XP, with
many people asking others to upgrade to newer Windows releases. But as an
individual add-on author and a contributor to NVDA screen reader project, I
would like to take this time to make the following personal announcement:



Effective April 15, 2020, if you ask me to do one or more of the following
for Windows XP users, the answer you will get is, "sorry, no more, period."
These include:



* Making add-ons compatible with Windows XP, Server 2003, Vista, and
Server 2008
* Fixing compatibility issues and non-working add-ons after you
knowingly install newer add-on releases on NVDA 2017.3 or earlier
* Backporting features and bug fixes from newer NVDA releases to NVDA
2017.3
* Maintaining a long-term support version of NVDA for Windows
XP/Server 2003/Vista/Server 2008 users



Most importantly, I will flatly say "no" if you ask me privately to ask NV
Access and/or add-on developers about Windows XP support. Many features
introduced in newer NVDA releases cannot be backported for various reasons,
including risk of crashing NVDA (grammar error announcement, for example),
incompatibility with Python 2 (broader Unicode support, for example),
features that will not work properly with XP (screen curtain, for example),
support for apps no longer recommended for wider use (outlook Express, for
example), and broad changes that alters how add-ons work (speech refactor
and multi-category settings dialog, for example). Several add-on authors
have indicated reluctance to support XP, and in case of add-ons I'm either
maintaining or have passed onto the community, none of them support NVDA
2019.2.1 or earlier, let alone Windows XP and friends.



My personal statement above will not be in effect until April so that you
can help others going through COVID-19 and for my statement as an individual
developer to sink in. Note that I'm not speaking on behalf of other
developers - others have their own policies regarding support for Windows
XP. NV Access does provide a download link for NVDA 2017.3, the last version
compatible with Windows XP.



I know my statement is a huge blow to many of you. As much as I wanted folks
to understand that end of support means end of support, and I understand
that many of you cannot afford newer equipment and software releases
(including moving to newer Windows releases), I felt it is time to make a
bold statement and say "no" to Windows XP support. In the past, I did note
on various NVDA forums that my add-ons will not and does not support Windows
XP, but didn't announce a statement like this then, hoping that folks will
understand the reality at last. But alas, it is time to officially close the
doors to Windows XP support from my end - once again, this is an individual
developer saying this, not on behalf of the community at large, knowing that
others will make statements on their own.



Thank you for understanding.

Cheers,

Joseph



Statement from Joseph Lee regarding NVDA add-ons and Windows XP support requests: no more, period

 

Hello NVDA users and add-on developers,

 

First, I would like to reiterate how important it is that everyone listen to advice from reputable sources regarding COVID-19, including public health officials recommending folks to exercise social distancing for a while. Even if you do not feel sick, please help others by washing hands, practice social distancing, and monitor the situation regarding the pandemic and community spread. And since the NVDA community is a global movement, please support each other.

 

Onto the matter at hand: for several days I have received requests about NVDA add-ons and Windows XP support. Requests have included making add-ons compatible with Windows XP again, compatibility issues, and backporting newer NVDA bug fixes and features to users of NVDA 2017.3, the last version compatible with Windows XP.

 

At the moment there is no community guidance on support for Windows XP, with many people  asking others to upgrade to newer Windows releases. But as an individual add-on author and a contributor to NVDA screen reader project, I would like to take this time to make the following personal announcement:

 

Effective April 15, 2020, if you ask me to do one or more of the following for Windows XP users, the answer you will get is, “sorry, no more, period.” These include:

 

  • Making add-ons compatible with Windows XP, Server 2003, Vista, and Server 2008
  • Fixing compatibility issues and non-working add-ons after you knowingly install newer add-on releases on NVDA 2017.3 or earlier
  • Backporting features and bug fixes from newer NVDA releases to NVDA 2017.3
  • Maintaining a long-term support version of NVDA for Windows XP/Server 2003/Vista/Server 2008 users

 

Most importantly, I will flatly say “no” if you ask me privately to ask NV Access and/or add-on developers about Windows XP support. Many features introduced in newer NVDA releases cannot be backported for various reasons, including risk of crashing NVDA (grammar error announcement, for example), incompatibility with Python 2 (broader Unicode support, for example), features that will not work properly with XP (screen curtain, for example), support for apps no longer recommended for wider use (outlook Express, for example), and broad changes that alters how add-ons work (speech refactor and multi-category settings dialog, for example). Several add-on authors have indicated reluctance to support XP, and in case of add-ons I’m either maintaining or have passed onto the community, none of them support NVDA 2019.2.1 or earlier, let alone Windows XP and friends.

 

My personal statement above will not be in effect until April so that you can help others going through COVID-19 and for my statement as an individual developer to sink in. Note that I’m not speaking on behalf of other developers – others have their own policies regarding support for Windows XP. NV Access does provide a download link for NVDA 2017.3, the last version compatible with Windows XP.

 

I know my statement is a huge blow to many of you. As much as I wanted folks to understand that end of support means end of support, and I understand that many of you cannot afford newer equipment and software releases (including moving to newer Windows releases), I felt it is time to make a bold statement and say “no” to Windows XP support. In the past, I did note on various NVDA forums that my add-ons will not and does not support Windows XP, but didn’t announce a statement like this then, hoping that folks will understand the reality at last. But alas, it is time to officially close the doors to Windows XP support from my end – once again, this is an individual developer saying this, not on behalf of the community at large, knowing that others will make statements on their own.

 

Thank you for understanding.

Cheers,

Joseph