Topics

SOG Exit

Bennett Family
 



On our 2015 Carthago Compactline the exit for the SOG is also in the end cap and out through the roof. That seems to work well. I bought a spare standard cassette and just transfer the end cap from the full cassette to the empty one to allow the empty one to connect to the SOG. 
Having it in the end cap seems a better idea to me. 

Martin 

On 26 Sep 2019, at 07:26, Carol Weaver via Groups.Io <corconx@...> wrote:

ALAN

We bought a new spare cassette and whilst here in Germany we happened on the SOG factory and wanted a new cap for it to fit the SOG. It is in the end cap unlike the 200 model.  

Carol

On Wed, 25 Sep 2019 at 22:27, Alan Morris <alan.g4ens@...> wrote:
On Wed, 25 Sep 2019 at 10:18, Brent <brentiow.c@...> wrote:

> Hymer

My parents bought my first tent when I was about 10 years old.  I bought my first caravan in 1967 - a new Sprite Alpine for £315.  Many tents and caravans later in 1998, we started to plan for when I would retire in 2003.

As Land Rover enthusiasts we attended a few international LR rallies in 1998, to celebrate LR's 50th Anniversary.  At a week long rally In Germany, we saw many modified LRs converted for various levels of camping comfort.  We decided that we would get a motorhome and started looking.

At one UK MH show, I used my Philips pocket memo recorder to make notes about various MHs, new and s/hand that we saw and liked.  Back home my wife transcribed to paper.  We were both surprised that they were all Hymer.

We looked at many MHs at many places, but none ticked every box, so we decided to build on a commercial vehicle.  No UK company was prepared to quote for building a basic body for us.  Then in my LR I drove to a show at Bad Kissingen, Germany, where I saw many makers of a suitable vehicle and they were built on Land Rovers ideal!

<https://www.abenteuer-allrad.de/en/>

At the end of 2002, we ordered a LR Defender 130 dual cab hi-cap pickup.  Bought from a dealer in The Netherlands as we wanted a LHD, that was not possible in the UK.  I did some of the conversion and a company in Germany built the body, to our specification.



Unfortunately, in 2011 I developed a major eye problem, resulting in almost five years of inactivity.  As can be seen in the photo, the habitation door is high off the ground.  To lock up at night, I would lock the over-lock on the outside of the door and climb up into the cabin as the step was manual.  In the morning I would jump down to the ground.  (Unfortunately, I had rejected an electrically operated one, incase a flat battery resulted in the step remaining down!)

In those five years, we had both aged more than expected due to lack of any exercise.  So a few modifications, such an electric step, would be required.

In early 2016 we were deciding whether to keep the 14 year old motor, which was EU3, and spend much on updating or buy a new MH.  Brexit forced a quick decision and we bought an ex-stock Hymer EX-SIS T 578 Auto.  After taking delivery and back home, we started to discover disadvantages.

 Only one key fob and not the normal two was supplied.  An extra one would cost about £350, including programming it.

When I weighed it, the payload was very small.  The very thick instruction book advised travelling with an empty fresh water tank.  In the LR we always filled to full at every opportunity.  Like the LR MH, the Hymer has water level indicators in the fresh and grey tanks.  Sadly the Hymer's are useless.  We were able to know very accurately the changing levels in the LR.  I have had to buy a water flow meter for use in filling the Hymer.

During the first night, I discovered that the Thetford toilet would not flush.  In the morning I discovered that the water pump switch above the habitation door switched off the pump, as expected; but there was no bypass switch to keep the Thetford working, as we had on the previous MH.

In the morning the cabin was cold as we woke-up.  Previously, we could reach the simple rotary control switch while still in bed.  In the Hymer with the beds at the back one had to go to the front and over the habitation door to operate a complex digital control system.

We learnt that the insulation of the Hymer was very poor, when compared to the previous MH.  With it arriving back to a cold MH late evening in winter, the heater would only need to run for 5 to 10 minutes before the cabin became too hot.  The Hymer takes a very long time and needs to be kept running.

The Hymer fridge uses LPG at an alarming rate and together with the poor insulation, we need to refill both 11kg Gaslow cylinders after a couple of winter weekends.  In the LR, it could last for 18 months before needing a refill of it's 2 x 11kg Gaslows.

To have a shower in the LR MH,one could go into the wet room, undress and place ones clothes in a dry place.  Then pull the shower curtain around and have a shower.  Then reach through a gap and grab a towel off a hook and dry oneself etc. before leaving the wet room.

In the Hymer one has to undress in the middle of the cabin having relocated a rigid wall and placed it across the middle of the wet room.  Enter the shower area and close the wet room door.  After showering, one has to step out of the wet room, then relocate the wall to be able to remove ones towel from it's hook in the wet room.  Discussing this recently on a CMC site with another Hymer retired couple, they told me that they never use their shower, always using the campsite's.

In 2016 how many MH users don't use a mobile phone, tablet or laptop?  Hymer makes no provision for charging these devices.  There is only one 12 volt socket, fitted on the side of the kitchen worktop.  No USB socket.  So adaptors and a collection of cables have to dangle in the doorway while being charged.  The domestic battery compartment, accessed from outside, is below a passenger seat behind the table.  I would expect multiple 12 volt sockets and multiple USB sockets be to available for devices on the table.

As well as the driver's and navigator's swivel seats, there are two seat belted seats facing forward behind the table.  There is only leg room for one at this corner bench seat.  To make room for the fourth seat belted person's legs, one has to crawl under the table that is not removable.  Then remove the side facing 5th seat base and backrest.  Then remove the under seat cupboard top and also it's front panel, or sit with the left leg inside the cupboard with the right leg outside.  Using this cupboard to store anything is not practical as it's access is extremely difficult.

Clearly Hymer have used separate designers (teams or individuals) for the many parts of the MH, without any coming together before proceeding to manufacture.  No experience of use has been used in the design - but it looks great in a showroom!

The Hymer has a factory fitted (not Lowdhams installed) TV dish system.  After using it for a while, I checked the battery voltages in the display panel above the habitation door.  The pair of habitation batteries (I had Lowdhams install a second battery in the provided position) were almost fully charged, but the starter battery was low.  Why did the Hymer factory connect the TV system to the starter battery?

Fortunately, I had Lowdhams install a solar panel with a controller that diverted power to the starter battery when the habitation battery was full.  I would add that Lowdhams failed to locate this controller, as indicated in the manufacturer's documentation, close to the battery.  It was located in a roof locker close the the solar panel.  Thus the battery never gets a full charge due to voltage drop on the long cable between controller and battery.

While mentioning Lowdhams failures, they did not complete the Gaslow installation correctly.  They fitted the wrong SOG product, drilling a hole in the cassette emptying cap rather than over the pressure vent's bayonet non-drill correct place.  When I advised them, I was told that it was correct.  It took months before they accepted their mistake and corrected it.  Even then they failed to give us the required blanking cap, until we complained again.

Twice on habitation annual checks Lowdhams have messed about with the Hymer/Fiat built-in GPS/radio/rear camera system.  The first time the system crashed.  It's a Windows CE embedded system and as a PC expert, I was able to download from the maker's website the files required to get it working again.  The second time, it would appear that Lowdhams disconnected the starter battery (the cab floor cover had not been re-fitted correctly).  I had to reset all the options as there had been a factory cold reset.  Lowdhams denied this, but the evidence suggests that I was was correct.

The final problem is that being LR owners we are used to the advantages of a 4x4.  The Fiat is font wheel drive and not very good on less than perfect sites.  We have almost traction on a few campsites and on one we required the owner's tractor to pull us out.  We have therefore lost faith in driving on any ground that is not perfect!  Otherwise the Fiat is an excellent base cab and handles very well.

Alan.

Attachments:

--
--
Carol WeaverAires photos here|. www.carolweaver.co.uk/Travel
Plusnet -cardun if you sign up recommend me please

Carol Weaver
 

Ours is still vented out the cassette door

Carol 

On Thu, 26 Sep 2019 at 08:58, Bennett Family <martin@...> wrote:


On our 2015 Carthago Compactline the exit for the SOG is also in the end cap and out through the roof. That seems to work well. I bought a spare standard cassette and just transfer the end cap from the full cassette to the empty one to allow the empty one to connect to the SOG. 
Having it in the end cap seems a better idea to me. 

Martin 

On 26 Sep 2019, at 07:26, Carol Weaver via Groups.Io <corconx@...> wrote:

ALAN

We bought a new spare cassette and whilst here in Germany we happened on the SOG factory and wanted a new cap for it to fit the SOG. It is in the end cap unlike the 200 model.  

Carol

On Wed, 25 Sep 2019 at 22:27, Alan Morris <alan.g4ens@...> wrote:
On Wed, 25 Sep 2019 at 10:18, Brent <brentiow.c@...> wrote:

> Hymer

My parents bought my first tent when I was about 10 years old.  I bought my first caravan in 1967 - a new Sprite Alpine for £315.  Many tents and caravans later in 1998, we started to plan for when I would retire in 2003.

As Land Rover enthusiasts we attended a few international LR rallies in 1998, to celebrate LR's 50th Anniversary.  At a week long rally In Germany, we saw many modified LRs converted for various levels of camping comfort.  We decided that we would get a motorhome and started looking.

At one UK MH show, I used my Philips pocket memo recorder to make notes about various MHs, new and s/hand that we saw and liked.  Back home my wife transcribed to paper.  We were both surprised that they were all Hymer.

We looked at many MHs at many places, but none ticked every box, so we decided to build on a commercial vehicle.  No UK company was prepared to quote for building a basic body for us.  Then in my LR I drove to a show at Bad Kissingen, Germany, where I saw many makers of a suitable vehicle and they were built on Land Rovers ideal!

<https://www.abenteuer-allrad.de/en/>

At the end of 2002, we ordered a LR Defender 130 dual cab hi-cap pickup.  Bought from a dealer in The Netherlands as we wanted a LHD, that was not possible in the UK.  I did some of the conversion and a company in Germany built the body, to our specification.

image.png

Unfortunately, in 2011 I developed a major eye problem, resulting in almost five years of inactivity.  As can be seen in the photo, the habitation door is high off the ground.  To lock up at night, I would lock the over-lock on the outside of the door and climb up into the cabin as the step was manual.  In the morning I would jump down to the ground.  (Unfortunately, I had rejected an electrically operated one, incase a flat battery resulted in the step remaining down!)

In those five years, we had both aged more than expected due to lack of any exercise.  So a few modifications, such an electric step, would be required.

In early 2016 we were deciding whether to keep the 14 year old motor, which was EU3, and spend much on updating or buy a new MH.  Brexit forced a quick decision and we bought an ex-stock Hymer EX-SIS T 578 Auto.  After taking delivery and back home, we started to discover disadvantages.

 Only one key fob and not the normal two was supplied.  An extra one would cost about £350, including programming it.

When I weighed it, the payload was very small.  The very thick instruction book advised travelling with an empty fresh water tank.  In the LR we always filled to full at every opportunity.  Like the LR MH, the Hymer has water level indicators in the fresh and grey tanks.  Sadly the Hymer's are useless.  We were able to know very accurately the changing levels in the LR.  I have had to buy a water flow meter for use in filling the Hymer.

During the first night, I discovered that the Thetford toilet would not flush.  In the morning I discovered that the water pump switch above the habitation door switched off the pump, as expected; but there was no bypass switch to keep the Thetford working, as we had on the previous MH.

In the morning the cabin was cold as we woke-up.  Previously, we could reach the simple rotary control switch while still in bed.  In the Hymer with the beds at the back one had to go to the front and over the habitation door to operate a complex digital control system.

We learnt that the insulation of the Hymer was very poor, when compared to the previous MH.  With it arriving back to a cold MH late evening in winter, the heater would only need to run for 5 to 10 minutes before the cabin became too hot.  The Hymer takes a very long time and needs to be kept running.

The Hymer fridge uses LPG at an alarming rate and together with the poor insulation, we need to refill both 11kg Gaslow cylinders after a couple of winter weekends.  In the LR, it could last for 18 months before needing a refill of it's 2 x 11kg Gaslows.

To have a shower in the LR MH,one could go into the wet room, undress and place ones clothes in a dry place.  Then pull the shower curtain around and have a shower.  Then reach through a gap and grab a towel off a hook and dry oneself etc. before leaving the wet room.

In the Hymer one has to undress in the middle of the cabin having relocated a rigid wall and placed it across the middle of the wet room.  Enter the shower area and close the wet room door.  After showering, one has to step out of the wet room, then relocate the wall to be able to remove ones towel from it's hook in the wet room.  Discussing this recently on a CMC site with another Hymer retired couple, they told me that they never use their shower, always using the campsite's.

In 2016 how many MH users don't use a mobile phone, tablet or laptop?  Hymer makes no provision for charging these devices.  There is only one 12 volt socket, fitted on the side of the kitchen worktop.  No USB socket.  So adaptors and a collection of cables have to dangle in the doorway while being charged.  The domestic battery compartment, accessed from outside, is below a passenger seat behind the table.  I would expect multiple 12 volt sockets and multiple USB sockets be to available for devices on the table.

As well as the driver's and navigator's swivel seats, there are two seat belted seats facing forward behind the table.  There is only leg room for one at this corner bench seat.  To make room for the fourth seat belted person's legs, one has to crawl under the table that is not removable.  Then remove the side facing 5th seat base and backrest.  Then remove the under seat cupboard top and also it's front panel, or sit with the left leg inside the cupboard with the right leg outside.  Using this cupboard to store anything is not practical as it's access is extremely difficult.

Clearly Hymer have used separate designers (teams or individuals) for the many parts of the MH, without any coming together before proceeding to manufacture.  No experience of use has been used in the design - but it looks great in a showroom!

The Hymer has a factory fitted (not Lowdhams installed) TV dish system.  After using it for a while, I checked the battery voltages in the display panel above the habitation door.  The pair of habitation batteries (I had Lowdhams install a second battery in the provided position) were almost fully charged, but the starter battery was low.  Why did the Hymer factory connect the TV system to the starter battery?

Fortunately, I had Lowdhams install a solar panel with a controller that diverted power to the starter battery when the habitation battery was full.  I would add that Lowdhams failed to locate this controller, as indicated in the manufacturer's documentation, close to the battery.  It was located in a roof locker close the the solar panel.  Thus the battery never gets a full charge due to voltage drop on the long cable between controller and battery.

While mentioning Lowdhams failures, they did not complete the Gaslow installation correctly.  They fitted the wrong SOG product, drilling a hole in the cassette emptying cap rather than over the pressure vent's bayonet non-drill correct place.  When I advised them, I was told that it was correct.  It took months before they accepted their mistake and corrected it.  Even then they failed to give us the required blanking cap, until we complained again.

Twice on habitation annual checks Lowdhams have messed about with the Hymer/Fiat built-in GPS/radio/rear camera system.  The first time the system crashed.  It's a Windows CE embedded system and as a PC expert, I was able to download from the maker's website the files required to get it working again.  The second time, it would appear that Lowdhams disconnected the starter battery (the cab floor cover had not been re-fitted correctly).  I had to reset all the options as there had been a factory cold reset.  Lowdhams denied this, but the evidence suggests that I was was correct.

The final problem is that being LR owners we are used to the advantages of a 4x4.  The Fiat is font wheel drive and not very good on less than perfect sites.  We have almost traction on a few campsites and on one we required the owner's tractor to pull us out.  We have therefore lost faith in driving on any ground that is not perfect!  Otherwise the Fiat is an excellent base cab and handles very well.

Alan.

Attachments:

--
--
Carol WeaverAires photos here|. www.carolweaver.co.uk/Travel
Plusnet -cardun if you sign up recommend me please

--
--
Carol WeaverAires photos here|. www.carolweaver.co.uk/Travel
Plusnet -cardun if you sign up recommend me please

Alan Morris
 

On Thu, 26 Sep 2019 at 06:58, Bennett Family <martin@...> wrote:

On our 2015 Carthago Compactline the exit for the SOG is also in the end cap and out through the roof. That seems to work well. I bought a spare standard cassette and just transfer the end cap from the full cassette to the empty one to allow the empty one to connect to the SOG.
Having it in the end cap seems a better idea to me.
My first SOG was fitted to a C400 cassette. This cassette is vented
from below and connects to the exit tube automatically when inserted
and closed when the cassette is removed. That to me is ideal.
Nothing to fiddle with!

Thetford introduced the C500 cassette and like so many good design
ideas, the lower automatic vent was removed. In place there is a
bayonet connection on the top.

I asked a Thetford salesman what was the difference between the series
C400 and series C500. The C500 is more up-market. I however consider
it a backward step. He had no explanation for the vent change.

The early C200 smaller capacity cassettes required a hole to be drilled.

I now have to keep a small sealed box in the cassette compartment to
hold the vent cap.

Fortunately both C400 and C500 series are still being sold by Thetford.

Alan.

timsinc Sinclair
 

On 26/09/2019, Alan Morris <alan.g4ens@...> wrote:

My first SOG was fitted to a C400 cassette. This cassette is vented
from below and connects to the exit tube automatically when inserted
and closed when the cassette is removed. That to me is ideal.
Interesting. Know nothing about SOGs, never looked into it as not had
whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing. But I think my 2014
Westfalia camper's Thetford has the system you describe.

TimS

Bennett Family
 

“as not had whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.”

I think a visit to a friendly ENT Consultant could be called for ;-)

Although lack of smelling ability is a useful asset in a Motorhome ;-).

Martin

On 26 Sep 2019, at 18:25, timsinc Sinclair via Groups.Io <timsinc=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

as not had
whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.

timsinc Sinclair
 

Oh, I can certainly smell when grey waste is discharged. Why I
kitchen-roll wipe plates, utensils before washing up.

TimS

On 26/09/2019, Bennett Family <martin@...> wrote:
“as not had whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.”

I think a visit to a friendly ENT Consultant could be called for ;-)

Although lack of smelling ability is a useful asset in a Motorhome ;-).

Martin

On 26 Sep 2019, at 18:25, timsinc Sinclair via Groups.Io
<timsinc=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

as not had
whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.


--

*It'll all be OK in the end. If it's not OK, it's not the end*

Neill King \(MH-List\)
 

Bio-wash used intermittently is good in grey tanks (black too according to some). The Lidl tablets used to be favourite being both convenient and cheap - but discontinued I think in favour of the more expensive 'pods'. Not tried those.

There may be other tablets but any bio should work in the same way, its just a question of finding that convenient and cheap combination.

Best regards

Neill
----------------------------------------------
www.motorcaravanning.co.uk 01789-778825 551345165
neill@... motorcaravanning@...
---------------------------------------------------------
A great on-line motorhome parts & accessory shop & reference

-----Original Message-----
From: motorhome-list@groups.io [mailto:motorhome-list@groups.io] On Behalf Of timsinc Sinclair
Sent: 26 September 2019 19:20
To: motorhome-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [motorhome-list] SOG Exit

Oh, I can certainly smell when grey waste is discharged. Why I
kitchen-roll wipe plates, utensils before washing up.

TimS

On 26/09/2019, Bennett Family <martin@...> wrote:
“as not had whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.”

I think a visit to a friendly ENT Consultant could be called for ;-)

Although lack of smelling ability is a useful asset in a Motorhome ;-).

Martin

On 26 Sep 2019, at 18:25, timsinc Sinclair via Groups.Io
<timsinc=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

as not had
whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.



--

*It'll all be OK in the end. If it's not OK, it's not the end*

Bennett Family
 

I use bio (washing machine) pods successfully in the cassette but not tried them in the grey tank, however I will.


Martin

On 27 Sep 2019, at 10:38, Neill King &#92;(MH-List&#92;) via Groups.Io <yahoo=motorcaravanning.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

Bio-wash used intermittently is good in grey tanks (black too according to some). The Lidl tablets used to be favourite being both convenient and cheap - but discontinued I think in favour of the more expensive 'pods'. Not tried those.

There may be other tablets but any bio should work in the same way, its just a question of finding that convenient and cheap combination.

Best regards

Neill
----------------------------------------------
www.motorcaravanning.co.uk 01789-778825 551345165
neill@... motorcaravanning@...
---------------------------------------------------------
A great on-line motorhome parts & accessory shop & reference




-----Original Message-----
From: motorhome-list@groups.io [mailto:motorhome-list@groups.io] On Behalf Of timsinc Sinclair
Sent: 26 September 2019 19:20
To: motorhome-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [motorhome-list] SOG Exit

Oh, I can certainly smell when grey waste is discharged. Why I
kitchen-roll wipe plates, utensils before washing up.

TimS

On 26/09/2019, Bennett Family <martin@...> wrote:
“as not had whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.”

I think a visit to a friendly ENT Consultant could be called for ;-)

Although lack of smelling ability is a useful asset in a Motorhome ;-).

Martin

On 26 Sep 2019, at 18:25, timsinc Sinclair via Groups.Io
<timsinc=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

as not had
whiff of a stink in nearly 30 years m-homing.



--

*It'll all be OK in the end. If it's not OK, it's not the end*