Electricity EHU cables


Sandytrax
 

I’ve often read that it’s an important or even essential  safety Issue to uncoil your ehu cable to prevent overheating.

In Europe that simply never seems to be the case. Almost everyone has a tight reel.
Some use aircon.

Does the law of physics vary according to country??
Or are European vans burning all over the place?!
safe travels
Brian


Derek Sims
 

The heating effect will depend on the volts drop in the cable. If they’ve got fat cable loosely wound on an open-centred reel in a strong breeze on a cool day and they’re not drawing much power, they might get away with it. Otherwise, they’ve got a nice electric fire, unless they’ve used superconductors in their cables. Of course the laws of Physics are different in Paris. The Eiffel Tower’s still upright and French women can walk down the Champs Elysee in stilettos without tottering.

We watched a ‘van going up in flames in Morocco. Scary! It wasn’t on a hook-up, but developed a fault in the gas fridge or it’s supply whilst the owner was away having Sunday Lunch. We watched the event unfold from above. All the Europeans ran away to move their ‘vans, but the Moroccan site staff saved the day. In no time at all they’d run out a large fire hose and drowned out the fire. The owner returned from his lunch to find a large charred hole in the side of his nice A Class. But he’d saved a pound by not having a hookup ;-) it inspired Chis Robinson to design an automatic drenching system for his ‘van.

I’ll keep unwinding our EHU cable - not too many Moroccan staff on UK sites. The British would let your motorhome burn to a cinder while they completed the Health and Safety Risk Assessment form before having a committee meeting to decide whether to call a fire engine. And if the wrong corner of your “unit” was parked against the white post, then forget about help - you’ll have to pay for redecorating the post.

Stay Sane

Derek

Sent using the GMX mail app


On 19/08/2020 at 19:18, Sandytrax wrote:

From: "Sandytrax" <brianinspain12@...>
Date: 19 August 2020
To: motorhome-list@groups.io
Cc:
Subject: [motorhome-list] Electricity EHU cables

I’ve often read that it’s an important or even essential  safety Issue to uncoil your ehu cable to prevent overheating.

In Europe that simply never seems to be the case. Almost everyone has a tight reel.
Some use aircon.

Does the law of physics vary according to country??
Or are European vans burning all over the place?!
safe travels
Brian


Steve Pyke
 

Hi,

Most of the motorhomes we see abroad seem to have coils of quite lightweight cable under their vans usually on a metal reel. I guess they don't have high amperage needs generally. We have short medium and long cables.

You forgot to mention the covid-19 risk assessment that would now be required before getting involved!-). 

We missed the peg by a metre at the latest CMC site visit and parked the wrong way round (having an offside door).

Take care

Steve


M Stevenson
 

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max


timsinc Sinclair
 

"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So, yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me 26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@...> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max



Peter S
 

When a bollard on a CMC site was not working they gave me a cable to join to mine so as I could reach another bollard. I always carry two cables but have only used the second one once in about 20 years. We were in Germany where there was a central bollard with multiple outlets. At that time I usually checked for reversed polarity (gave this up about 19 years ago!) so I had my reversed connection lead and two normal cables to reach the bollard.

 

I first came across the locking of the bollard in Germany. The site was one where they charged for the amount of leccy used and a chap came down to unlock the box and then take a reading. I have come across sites where they charge by the unit but ask you to take the readings to give to them when you come to pay on leaving.

 

Peter S

 

From: motorhome-list@groups.io [mailto:motorhome-list@groups.io] On Behalf Of timsinc Sinclair
Sent: 23 August 2020 13:18
To: motorhome-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [motorhome-list] Electricity EHU cables

 

"Summer not much demand for heating".....

 

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

 

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So, yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me 26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own extension from somewhere!

 

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

 

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

 

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@...> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max

 


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Bennett Family
 

Tim,

Do you wind it like this?


Martin


On 23 Aug 2020, at 13:18, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:


"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So, yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me 26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@...> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max



Carol Weaver
 

Well no Duncan doesn't do that,, but a a seaman, used to using ropes, he has no problem really with the way the dirt farmer did it - don't know why he did.  Ours doesn't twist itself 

Carol


Click here  For Motorhome Owners here is a link to photographs of aires, stellplatz, chateaux, wargraves, NT properties etc.  








On Sun, 23 Aug 2020 at 15:05, Bennett Family via groups.io <martin.bennett47=me.com@groups.io> wrote:
Tim,

Do you wind it like this?


Martin


On 23 Aug 2020, at 13:18, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:


"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So, yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me 26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@...> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max



Derek Sims
 

I believe our solar panel has assisted the hookup on every van we've had. It can't provide AC mains voltage, but the solar charge feeds from the MPPT controller into the main charger to help charge the leisure batteries and in our case, though not always, the starter battery.
Our Esterel incorporated an excellent (for its day) smart charger with a direct connection for a solar panel to a (pre-MPPT) charge controller.
Without some similar arrangements there must be a risk of overcharging the batteries.
Derek

--
Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

On 23/08/2020, 13:18 timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:
"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So, yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me 26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@...> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands, so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max



timsinc Sinclair
 

I would be in a poor 3g data signal area, and the video on your link,
Martin, refuses to load. But from its description that sounds right,
although I think "wind" the wrong word! There are quite a few u-tube
vids demonstrating the technique.

Second nature to me after first couple of times, is quick and been
admired few times by questioning pitch neighbours.

Tim

On 23/08/2020, Bennett Family via groups.io
<martin.bennett47=me.com@groups.io> wrote:
Tim,

Do you wind it like this?

https://youtu.be/eTpbh2zJGhA

Martin
On 23 Aug 2020, at 13:18, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@gmail.com> wrote:


"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So,
yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour
blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me
26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here
I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own
extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in
storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of
storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or
stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric
use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim
On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@gmail.com> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are
fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some
sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter
reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for
keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands,
so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over
consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max




--

*It'll all be OK in the end. If it's not OK, it's not the end*


timsinc Sinclair
 

Still flummoxed, but then I'm no sparky. When I'm on hook-up, as well
as powering everything 12volt, the charger keeps two lesisure
batteries and engine one topped up - with presumably greater oomph and
out-doing the solar input.

My MPPT controller panel visibly indicates when and how much is going
in from solar panels but that's to the batteries - not direct to the
12v pumps, fridge etc. When on hook-up I've never seen that MPPT
action.

Solar kept me going for two weeks after dodgy Moroccan fried my
charger last year. But only by keeping my batteries topped up, not
powering anything else.

So on metred supply (been on quite a few such pitches) my solar panels
wouldn't have subsided me by one single watt.

Tim

On 23/08/2020, Derek Sims <derek.sims@gmx.com> wrote:
I believe our solar panel has assisted the hookup on every van we've had. It
can't provide AC mains voltage, but the solar charge feeds from the MPPT
controller into the main charger to help charge the leisure batteries and in
our case, though not always, the starter battery.
Our Esterel incorporated an excellent (for its day) smart charger with a
direct connection for a solar panel to a (pre-MPPT) charge controller.
Without some similar arrangements there must be a risk of overcharging the
batteries.
Derek

--
Sent from my Android phone with GMX Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
On 23/08/2020, 13:18 timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@gmail.com> wrote:

"Summer not much demand for heating".....

... but maybe for roof-top air con?

Not, though, on my camper. My heaviest draw is my 900 watt kettle. So,
yes, I have a 16-metre "thin" (ie, home 13amp plug extension like) colour
blue aboard. Plus the standard c'van thick yellow cable 10m long. Gives me
26m in all, but not on CMC sites who ban on-field connections. And here
I'm on an independent campsite where I have had to plug into their own
extension from somewhere!

My choice and why my standard heavy, awkward 25m cable is forgotten in
storage. And I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of
storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or
stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

Don't understand though, Max, your solar panels subsidising your electric
use - when I'm on hook-up the solar part is over-ridden.

Tim

On 22 August 2020 9:38:51 pm "M Stevenson" <atcop.co@gmail.com> wrote:

That's my impression too. They seem to have wind out reels, some are
fixed into lockers with an exit hole.
Long reels, thin cable, and usually black.
Many sites are 6amp only and metered.
Some junction boxes are a good way off,
We've needed two 25m cables in line before now to reach, and on some
sites the junction box and your cable is then locked after initial meter
reading.
Mind you, in summer use there is not much demand for heating, mainly for
keeping the fridge going.
Even on metered hookups, our solar panels will meet most of our demands,
so charges are consequently negligible.
I tend to just loosely lay excess coils on ground and don't over
consume/abuse hookups.

Cheers
Max
--

*It'll all be OK in the end. If it's not OK, it's not the end*


Ernest Bull
 

On 23 Aug 2020, at 13:18, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:

I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

And Martin asked; - 

Do you wind it like this? https://youtu.be/eTpbh2zJGhA

Actually, no, Martin. Although it is another way of stopping the tangle when unrolling it, it is not easy to store. Other than hanging it in the wardrobe. OTOH, when deployed, it will stay cool if not totally pulled out, but I actually preferred this method: -


Just as handy whether rolling up a Hook-up cable or a tiny USB, an HDMI or an antenna cable.

And when it comes to keeping MH batteries topped up, then, as the little old lady said, “Every Little helps.” Solar panels are now dirt cheap. My 100w panel kit cost me about £700/800 some 15 years ago and it was worth every penny. If I had a van today I would fit the biggest panel that the payload and the roof could handle. And I would fit the best MPPT charge regulator I could find.

I would only add that extended tours, "Sans 'ook-ups,” can be aided by the way you travel. Like, in the winter when keeping the van warm is a problem, I used to travel in the dark to both charge the batteries and to “cook" the van using the cab heater. Turning in in an already warm van without fear of the the battery failing is a big comfort and the cold is easier to manage in the day when fully dressed and active. Plus the coldest nights happen under clear skies and the sun is usually enough to keep things going during the day.

And the opposite during the summer. Get the miles done during the afternoon with the cab air-con on <Full> and get a set of mini battery powered window alarms so that you can sleep with the widows open enough to get a well ventilated, but secure sleep.

HTH

ErnB








Bennett Family
 

Thanks Ern - that explains it well and gives an easier finished coil that I can hang up.I tried it on my 25m & 10m cables - so far -so good!

For years I had an Australian made plastic reel that was lightweight, compact and worked like magic. I broke it and have never been able to find anything anywhere near as good. 

Martin

On 24 Aug 2020, at 08:37, Ernest Bull <ernb32@...> wrote:

On 23 Aug 2020, at 13:18, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:

I never 'coil' my cables. I use the trade professional way of storing - the sort of slip-knot looping Ern knows well. No tangles or stiff, heavy winding drums to handle.

And Martin asked; - 

Do you wind it like this? https://youtu.be/eTpbh2zJGhA

Actually, no, Martin. Although it is another way of stopping the tangle when unrolling it, it is not easy to store. Other than hanging it in the wardrobe. OTOH, when deployed, it will stay cool if not totally pulled out, but I actually preferred this method: -


Just as handy whether rolling up a Hook-up cable or a tiny USB, an HDMI or an antenna cable.

And when it comes to keeping MH batteries topped up, then, as the little old lady said, “Every Little helps.” Solar panels are now dirt cheap. My 100w panel kit cost me about £700/800 some 15 years ago and it was worth every penny. If I had a van today I would fit the biggest panel that the payload and the roof could handle. And I would fit the best MPPT charge regulator I could find.

I would only add that extended tours, "Sans 'ook-ups,” can be aided by the way you travel. Like, in the winter when keeping the van warm is a problem, I used to travel in the dark to both charge the batteries and to “cook" the van using the cab heater. Turning in in an already warm van without fear of the the battery failing is a big comfort and the cold is easier to manage in the day when fully dressed and active. Plus the coldest nights happen under clear skies and the sun is usually enough to keep things going during the day.

And the opposite during the summer. Get the miles done during the afternoon with the cab air-con on <Full> and get a set of mini battery powered window alarms so that you can sleep with the widows open enough to get a well ventilated, but secure sleep.

HTH

ErnB








timsinc Sinclair
 

On 24/08/2020, Ernest Bull <ernb32@gmail.com> wrote:
... Martin asked; -

Do you wind it like this? https://youtu.be/eTpbh2zJGhA
<https://youtu.be/eTpbh2zJGhA>
Tim replies:
YES. Except no need to plug male female end together.

Ern says:
Actually, no, Martin. Although it is another way of stopping the tangle when
unrolling it, it is not easy to store.
Tim says:
NO, completely disagree.

Ern says:
Other than hanging it in the
wardrobe.
Tim says:
Happen I'm lucky that when I open camper tailgate I have hooks and
depth of van to hang it, BUT before that I just folded into locker,
like that video said, you could put it in a drawer.

Ern said:
but I actually preferred this method: -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2SUoAvGxVs
Tim says:
Looks fine for thin musician cables - but a heavyweight 25m cable?
Give my arms a rest! Plus this method requires whole cable to be
uncoiled before use (back to heating up problem). Where as with the
looping method (top one), if the bollard is only a couple of metres
behind you, you don't have to open up whole 25 metres. The loose
"knitting" of the unneeded part of cable in no danger of overheating.

QED


Ernest Bull
 

On 24 Aug 2020, at 14:09, timsinc Sinclair <timsinc@...> wrote:

Happen I'm lucky that when I open camper tailgate I have hooks and
depth of van to hang it, BUT before that I just folded into locker,
like that video said, you could put it in a drawer.

Lucky you, I only had two drawers on my Tramp, Tim. A knife draw in the kitchen and a shallow, gap-filling one under the fridge. It would have to have gone under the bed where there was already more than enough jumbled together, without getting it all tangled up in hook up cables. 

But MH'ing is all about compromises, isn’t it?
_______

ErnB