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> The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that
I will second this. Everything I found out while trying to back up my disks indicates that most USB floppy drives can't read RAW sectors. Also, many cannot write 720kb disks.
-William
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message -------- From: krzysztof.cylkowski@... Date: 3/22/21 6:20 AM (GMT-08:00) To: korg01w-list@groups.io Subject: Re: [korg01w-list] Sequence Bounce Request
Hello everyone (excuse me for my English), I think it's the drive and not the interface. The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that. The software had to be recompiled, just with new compiler. Mike W are you still registered here?
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Hey. Do we know which usb drives do read raw sectors? I'm about to test one, it's a Raayoo and cost me $30.
> The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that
I will second this. Everything I found out while trying to back up my disks indicates that most USB floppy drives can't read RAW sectors. Also, many cannot write 720kb disks.
-William
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message -------- Date: 3/22/21 6:20 AM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Re: [korg01w-list] Sequence Bounce Request
Hello everyone (excuse me for my English), I think it's the drive and not the interface. The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that. The software had to be recompiled, just with new compiler. Mike W are you still registered here?
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Hi Devan,
Do try the RawWrite program I've mentioned.
No dia 22/03/2021, às 18:24, Devan <devanphenix@...> escreveu:
Hey. Do we know which usb drives do read raw sectors? I'm about to test one, it's a Raayoo and cost me $30.
> The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that
I will second this. Everything I found out while trying to back up my disks indicates that most USB floppy drives can't read RAW sectors. Also, many cannot write 720kb disks.
-William
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message -------- Date: 3/22/21 6:20 AM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Re: [korg01w-list] Sequence Bounce Request
Hello everyone (excuse me for my English), I think it's the drive and not the interface. The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that. The software had to be recompiled, just with new compiler. Mike W are you still registered here?
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Hello! I'm here to give a quick update regarding my request. We have been successful and when I say we, I mostly mean Antonio. Here's what we know:
*A Raayoo USB floppy drive works using *RawWrite using a supported os.
So, I imaged the disks, sent the files to Antonio who proceeded to save the data to a physical disk, load it in his Korg and record the stereo out.
One thing of note is I'm almost positive one of the disks that I imaged was a disk that had no longer worked in my Korg of yore, but I had saved it in case smart people in the future could retrieve it which is what just happened. So, maybe Antonio can expand a little more on what he did on his side.
I feel very grateful someone from this group helped me. This has renewed a bit of optimism in the interwebs for me. Thank you, Antonio! Best of luck, everyone.
Hi Devan,
Do try the RawWrite program I've mentioned. Hey. Do we know which usb drives do read raw sectors? I'm about to test one, it's a Raayoo and cost me $30.
> The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that
I will second this. Everything I found out while trying to back up my disks indicates that most USB floppy drives can't read RAW sectors. Also, many cannot write 720kb disks.
-William
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message -------- Date: 3/22/21 6:20 AM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Re: [korg01w-list] Sequence Bounce Request
Hello everyone (excuse me for my English), I think it's the drive and not the interface. The drive most likely needs to read RAW sectors and not all USB devices can do that. The software had to be recompiled, just with new compiler. Mike W are you still registered here?
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Just a couple of notes:
For some undetermined reason, almost none of the disk images had the expected 720 KB. One had as few as 416 KB, others had as much as 736 KB. In the latter, the extra 16 KB were filled with 0xAA bytes, which is the same way a normal disk ends. I have no explanation for that, whether it's a bug with the imaging software, an issue with the floppy drive itself, or - could it be? something in the original disks. What I do know is that I only had to adjust the size to 720 KB (in some cases adding 0x00 bytes, in others trimming the length) in order for the disk images to work. There were no missing or wrong bytes (the KB that were missing from some of the disks were likely all empty). It may have helped that in all cases there was no SEQ FileB (which is in the end of the disk), but my suspicion is that if there were, its data likewise would be correctly read. I didn't use physical disks, I just put the disk images in my 01/W's gotek drive, but that's not relevant. (The firmware on the gotek (FlashFloppy) wouldn't accept the images unless they were 720 KB.) I think Devan mentioned that RawWrite didn't work correctly under Windows 10, but it worked on Vista. I can't tell because I have neither Windows nor USB floppy; I do know raw access to disk volumes has been restricted by Windows, but supposedly that started with Vista. There's always http://www.dmares.com/maresware/html/ntimage.htm but again you have to be very careful with it. I've been tempted to write a minimal graphical utility that can only READ and only if it's a floppy, but having neither Windows 10 nor one of those drives it would be too much guesswork, all the more since I'm not sure there is demand for it.
In the end it was quite easy to get this going, and it's always nice to be able to make use of the mix of old and new tech to help others out :)
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I only just joined this list so apologies for butting in on the discussion and if I mentioned something already discussed.
but I’ve had success backing up corrupted old floppies with Omniflop using a combination of slow step rate or filling bad sectors with 0’s. It’s kind of up to chance whether filling bad sectors with 0’s will keep your disk working or render the image useless. It’s helped me save a lot of almost gone forever disks, though.
“ For some undetermined reason, almost none of the disk images had the expected 720 KB. One had as few as 416 KB, others had as much as 736 KB. In the latter, the extra 16 KB were filled with 0xAA bytes, which is the same way a normal disk ends. I have no explanation for that, whether it's a bug with the imaging software, an issue with the floppy drive itself, or - could it be? something in the original disks. ”
The 01w floppy format is a plain IBM / DOS compatible 720k disk with its own headers on top. Are you working with img files? It seems like you may be if the files themselves are 720k. I prepared a bunch of HFE format disks for my own 01wfd but later learned that due to HFE files being too big for the Gotek’s RAM, it has to constantly stream them from the usb drive, meaning extra heat and power consumption. I now only use IMG files on my 01wfd usb floppy Emulator.
If someone could send me a link to that usb drive that can read raw formats, that would be amazing, I would really appreciate it since I have two clunker desktops under my desk solely for the purpose of reading out old disks usb floppy drives can’t handle...
Just a couple of notes:
For some undetermined reason, almost none of the disk images had the expected 720 KB. One had as few as 416 KB, others had as much as 736 KB. In the latter, the extra 16 KB were filled with 0xAA bytes, which is the same way a normal disk ends. I have no explanation for that, whether it's a bug with the imaging software, an issue with the floppy drive itself, or - could it be? something in the original disks. What I do know is that I only had to adjust the size to 720 KB (in some cases adding 0x00 bytes, in others trimming the length) in order for the disk images to work. There were no missing or wrong bytes (the KB that were missing from some of the disks were likely all empty). It may have helped that in all cases there was no SEQ FileB (which is in the end of the disk), but my suspicion is that if there were, its data likewise would be correctly read. I didn't use physical disks, I just put the disk images in my 01/W's gotek drive, but that's not relevant. (The firmware on the gotek (FlashFloppy) wouldn't accept the images unless they were 720 KB.) I think Devan mentioned that RawWrite didn't work correctly under Windows 10, but it worked on Vista. I can't tell because I have neither Windows nor USB floppy; I do know raw access to disk volumes has been restricted by Windows, but supposedly that started with Vista. There's always http://www.dmares.com/maresware/html/ntimage.htm but again you have to be very careful with it. I've been tempted to write a minimal graphical utility that can only READ and only if it's a floppy, but having neither Windows 10 nor one of those drives it would be too much guesswork, all the more since I'm not sure there is demand for it.
In the end it was quite easy to get this going, and it's always nice to be able to make use of the mix of old and new tech to help others out :)
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Hi. This is the one I used.
Devan
On Tue, Mar 30, 2021, 11:23 AM Shea Alterio < krusete@...> wrote: I only just joined this list so apologies for butting in on the discussion and if I mentioned something already discussed.
but I’ve had success backing up corrupted old floppies with Omniflop using a combination of slow step rate or filling bad sectors with 0’s. It’s kind of up to chance whether filling bad sectors with 0’s will keep your disk working or render the image useless. It’s helped me save a lot of almost gone forever disks, though.
“ For some undetermined reason, almost none of the disk images had the expected 720 KB. One had as few as 416 KB, others had as much as 736 KB. In the latter, the extra 16 KB were filled with 0xAA bytes, which is the same way a normal disk ends. I have no explanation for that, whether it's a bug with the imaging software, an issue with the floppy drive itself, or - could it be? something in the original disks. ”
The 01w floppy format is a plain IBM / DOS compatible 720k disk with its own headers on top. Are you working with img files? It seems like you may be if the files themselves are 720k. I prepared a bunch of HFE format disks for my own 01wfd but later learned that due to HFE files being too big for the Gotek’s RAM, it has to constantly stream them from the usb drive, meaning extra heat and power consumption. I now only use IMG files on my 01wfd usb floppy Emulator.
If someone could send me a link to that usb drive that can read raw formats, that would be amazing, I would really appreciate it since I have two clunker desktops under my desk solely for the purpose of reading out old disks usb floppy drives can’t handle... Just a couple of notes:
For some undetermined reason, almost none of the disk images had the expected 720 KB. One had as few as 416 KB, others had as much as 736 KB. In the latter, the extra 16 KB were filled with 0xAA bytes, which is the same way a normal disk ends. I have no explanation for that, whether it's a bug with the imaging software, an issue with the floppy drive itself, or - could it be? something in the original disks. What I do know is that I only had to adjust the size to 720 KB (in some cases adding 0x00 bytes, in others trimming the length) in order for the disk images to work. There were no missing or wrong bytes (the KB that were missing from some of the disks were likely all empty). It may have helped that in all cases there was no SEQ FileB (which is in the end of the disk), but my suspicion is that if there were, its data likewise would be correctly read. I didn't use physical disks, I just put the disk images in my 01/W's gotek drive, but that's not relevant. (The firmware on the gotek (FlashFloppy) wouldn't accept the images unless they were 720 KB.) I think Devan mentioned that RawWrite didn't work correctly under Windows 10, but it worked on Vista. I can't tell because I have neither Windows nor USB floppy; I do know raw access to disk volumes has been restricted by Windows, but supposedly that started with Vista. There's always http://www.dmares.com/maresware/html/ntimage.htm but again you have to be very careful with it. I've been tempted to write a minimal graphical utility that can only READ and only if it's a floppy, but having neither Windows 10 nor one of those drives it would be too much guesswork, all the more since I'm not sure there is demand for it.
In the end it was quite easy to get this going, and it's always nice to be able to make use of the mix of old and new tech to help others out :)
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