Topics

Soda pop II troubleshooting

Gwen Patton
 

Ok... Just finished assembly of the soda pop II kit I've been plugging away at. It passed the smoke test, but the display is completely lit up, all segments, all decimals. There's no indication it's in calibration mode, but I checked the LO test point and found no signal there.

The processor is correctly inserted in the socket. How would I tell if the crystal is oscillating, and if not, how do I proceed? Is there anything else I can test at this point?

There is a thump in headphones when it turns on, and touching the pins on the LM386 produces a but of squealing. But no hiss. What do these conditions signify, and where should I look?

73,
Gwen, NG3P

Marty NR3Z
 

Gwen,
     There should be a control to reduce the intensity of the LED.  Try lowering that to see if you can see anything on the LED.
72,
Marty NR3Z
Skitch@...
NR3Z@...



On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 8:10 PM Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:
Ok... Just finished assembly of the soda pop II kit I've been plugging away at. It passed the smoke test, but the display is completely lit up, all segments, all decimals. There's no indication it's in calibration mode, but I checked the LO test point and found no signal there.

The processor is correctly inserted in the socket. How would I tell if the crystal is oscillating, and if not, how do I proceed? Is there anything else I can test at this point?

There is a thump in headphones when it turns on, and touching the pins on the LM386 produces a but of squealing. But no hiss. What do these conditions signify, and where should I look?

73,
Gwen, NG3P

Gwen Patton
 

Marty, there's no such control in the manual that I can see. Do you know what control does this, because I can't find one. It's a segmented LED display, not an LCD text display with a pot on the back.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 7:27 AM Marty NR3Z <skitch@...> wrote:
Gwen,
     There should be a control to reduce the intensity of the LED.  Try lowering that to see if you can see anything on the LED.
72,
Marty NR3Z
Skitch@...
NR3Z@...



On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 8:10 PM Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:
Ok... Just finished assembly of the soda pop II kit I've been plugging away at. It passed the smoke test, but the display is completely lit up, all segments, all decimals. There's no indication it's in calibration mode, but I checked the LO test point and found no signal there.

The processor is correctly inserted in the socket. How would I tell if the crystal is oscillating, and if not, how do I proceed? Is there anything else I can test at this point?

There is a thump in headphones when it turns on, and touching the pins on the LM386 produces a but of squealing. But no hiss. What do these conditions signify, and where should I look?

73,
Gwen, NG3P

Alan Sorenson
 

You should have 10 mhm at the LO test point, if you don’t then you have a problem with the Si5351 circuit. 

73

WB5RGC


On Jun 2, 2020, at 10:28 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Marty, there's no such control in the manual that I can see. Do you know what control does this, because I can't find one. It's a segmented LED display, not an LCD text display with a pot on the back.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 7:27 AM Marty NR3Z <skitch@...> wrote:
Gwen,
     There should be a control to reduce the intensity of the LED.  Try lowering that to see if you can see anything on the LED.
72,


On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 8:10 PM Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:
Ok... Just finished assembly of the soda pop II kit I've been plugging away at. It passed the smoke test, but the display is completely lit up, all segments, all decimals. There's no indication it's in calibration mode, but I checked the LO test point and found no signal there.

The processor is correctly inserted in the socket. How would I tell if the crystal is oscillating, and if not, how do I proceed? Is there anything else I can test at this point?

There is a thump in headphones when it turns on, and touching the pins on the LM386 produces a but of squealing. But no hiss. What do these conditions signify, and where should I look?

73,
Gwen, NG3P





Marty NR3Z
 

Gwen,
    Sorry I was thinking of a LCD screen not the LED display.  Sorry about that but I don't have any other suggestions.
72,
Marty NR3Z
Skitch@...
NR3Z@...



On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 11:28 AM Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:
Marty, there's no such control in the manual that I can see. Do you know what control does this, because I can't find one. It's a segmented LED display, not an LCD text display with a pot on the back.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 7:27 AM Marty NR3Z <skitch@...> wrote:
Gwen,
     There should be a control to reduce the intensity of the LED.  Try lowering that to see if you can see anything on the LED.
72,
Marty NR3Z
Skitch@...
NR3Z@...



On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 8:10 PM Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:
Ok... Just finished assembly of the soda pop II kit I've been plugging away at. It passed the smoke test, but the display is completely lit up, all segments, all decimals. There's no indication it's in calibration mode, but I checked the LO test point and found no signal there.

The processor is correctly inserted in the socket. How would I tell if the crystal is oscillating, and if not, how do I proceed? Is there anything else I can test at this point?

There is a thump in headphones when it turns on, and touching the pins on the LM386 produces a but of squealing. But no hiss. What do these conditions signify, and where should I look?

73,
Gwen, NG3P

Gwen Patton
 

Ok. I've checked the connections to the clock chip and the crystal next to it, and touched them up with my iron. I also touched up the processor socket connections, and a couple of diodes that didn't look well soldered. I'm still getting the same behavior. The docs say that on power up, it flashes all the segments on the display for a second. It seems that it's sticking at that point and not going past it to the calibration step. There's no signal on the LO test point at all. There is no hiss, but it does give a thump when I turn it on, and the LM386 squeals when I touch the pins, so something is active in there.

I'm still learning about the actual theory involved in this, so please, if anyone can suggest something more than what's in the troubleshooting guide at this point, I'd really appreciate it, since there is actually no entry in the guide that matches what I'm seeing. I suppose I can go through and just retouch every solder joint, but that seems inefficient. I'm willing to give anything a try, I just have no idea what TO try. I've looked around the clock chip and see nothing amiss. Could the processor itself be roached, or the code in it? It doesn't seem to get past what would be POST in a PC.

Sorry, but I can't look at the schematic and puzzle it out. I don't know that much about electronics yet.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P

Steven Weber
 

Does the segment test (all segments on) stay on indefinitely or does it change to something which looks odd after a second? 
I just discovered the letters C and A don't display correctly, but the L does. So if the display changes to |. _. L  then it is in CAL mode. 

I just uploaded corrected firmware to the sodapop2 folder. If you have a UNO board you can reprogram the chip. If not, I'll send you one. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

Steven Weber
 

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point. 

Gwen Patton
 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

Thanks, Steve.

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:
BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point. 

Steven Weber
 

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that.

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it.

73, Steve KD1JV

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point. 

 

Gwen Patton
 

There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that.

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it.

73, Steve KD1JV

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point. 

 

Gwen Patton
 

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that.

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it.

73, Steve KD1JV

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point. 

 

Alan Sorenson
 

Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

Good luck

73 
WB5RGC

On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 






Gwen Patton
 

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

20200607_113509.jpg
20200607_113531.jpg

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:
Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

Good luck

73 
WB5RGC

On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 






Alan Sorenson
 

Ok, Your board looks good.  I would check the diodes D2 D3 for proper polarity.  Also D6- D10.  I can’t tell from the picture.  
Take a look at Q3, looks like it may not be centered on the pads.  

AL

On Jun 7, 2020, at 11:59 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

<20200607_113509.jpg>
<20200607_113531.jpg>

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:
Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

Good luck

73 
WB5RGC

On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 









Alan Sorenson
 

I keep looking, C40 does not look flat on the board. 


On Jun 7, 2020, at 11:59 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

<20200607_113509.jpg>
<20200607_113531.jpg>

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:
Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

Good luck

73 
WB5RGC

On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 









Don, ND6T
 

Gwen,

Do you have an oscilloscope? If so check U5 pins 9 and 10 to see if the clock is oscillating.

If all else fails, I can give the repair a try. 73, Don, ND6T

Steven Weber
 

The main question is why is it stuck in the display test mode? Until it gets past there, nothing is going to work. I have not been able to duplicate that failure mode. Gwen, can you try the processor which came with the UNO? In theory it won’t make a difference, but one never knows..

 

Steve KD1JV

 

Ok, Your board looks good.  I would check the diodes D2 D3 for proper polarity.  Also D6- D10.  I can’t tell from the picture.  

Take a look at Q3, looks like it may not be centered on the pads.  

 

AL



On Jun 7, 2020, at 11:59 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

 

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

 

<20200607_113509.jpg>

<20200607_113531.jpg>

 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

 

On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:

Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

 

Good luck

 

73 

WB5RGC



On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

 

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

 

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

 

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

 

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

 

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

 

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

 

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

 

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gwen Patton
 

Sure, I can try the Uno's processor.

I'll look at C40, and put my wiggle scope on those pins.

Gwen, NG3P

On Sun, Jun 7, 2020, 2:35 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

The main question is why is it stuck in the display test mode? Until it gets past there, nothing is going to work. I have not been able to duplicate that failure mode. Gwen, can you try the processor which came with the UNO? In theory it won’t make a difference, but one never knows..

 

Steve KD1JV

 

Ok, Your board looks good.  I would check the diodes D2 D3 for proper polarity.  Also D6- D10.  I can’t tell from the picture.  

Take a look at Q3, looks like it may not be centered on the pads.  

 

AL



On Jun 7, 2020, at 11:59 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

 

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

 

<20200607_113509.jpg>

<20200607_113531.jpg>

 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

 

On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:

Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

 

Good luck

 

73 

WB5RGC



On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

 

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

 

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

 

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

 

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

 

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

 

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

 

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

73,

Gwen, NG3P

 

 

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

dyerhard1972
 

It's not a very clear picture when I blow it up but look at the transistor between I think c38 and c15. It looks placed to far up and maybe the single electrode at the top is not soldiered to the pad. It could just be an optical illusion from the picture also. 
Jeff ke4fwe 



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

-------- Original message --------
From: Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...>
Date: 6/7/20 12:59 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: kd1jvdesigns@groups.io
Subject: Re: [kd1jvdesigns] Soda pop II troubleshooting

OK, here's pictures of the top and bottom of the board. I've already done most of what you suggested at least once.

20200607_113509.jpg
20200607_113531.jpg

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 9:52 AM Alan Sorenson <alsoren@...> wrote:
Post a close up picture of your board.  We might be able to spot the problem.  Check all of the transistors, they are easy to mount upside down.  Use a jewelers loop to look at the tops of them, you should be able to read the numbers on top.  The transistors gave me lots of trouble, the pins are really small and and the component has to be placed exactly correct.  

Good luck

73 
WB5RGC

On Jun 7, 2020, at 8:16 AM, Gwen Patton <ardrhi@...> wrote:

Well, I reflashed the processor on my Uno, and there's no change when I put the processor back on the radio. I'm going through the solder joints AGAIN, resoldering anything that doesn't look perfect.

It's times like this I wish I could actually analyze a circuit in a schematic, and know what voltages should be at what points, but I think I can spell Kirchoff correctly, and maybe I remember the rules named for him, but I'm still really new at that. I can tell what part in looking at, and whether the schematic matches or not, but unless I know what values I should be finding at any given point, I don't know what to look for.

There's some good info in the troubleshooting section, but it only gets you started, the big points. If it's a bad transistor, or a wrong valued cap or something, I'll never find it (especially since the caps have no markings).

So if you can think of anything to test or check beyond what's in the troubleshooting guide, let me know, I'll be more than glad to try it.

I'm almost to the point of sending it to someone to fix at this point. If someone wants like the equivalent of a case of beer or something to figure out what I messed up and make this thing work, then explain what I did wrong so I can learn, I'll certainly entertain it.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 11:23 AM Gwen Patton via groups.io <ardrhi=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
There are 5 crystals of one type above the display, and one different one below. Then there's the little silver thing next to the 5351 that I THINK is installed correctly, but except for being parallel to the 5351, there was no indication  on how to install it. Maybe I got it turned 180 degrees?

There's nothing on either the LO or TX test points with my frequency counter. This makes me think that the processor isn't getting out of POST so it doesn't progress to the point where the signal would be generated. I'll try reflashing the processor, once I set up to do it.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
73,
Gwen, NG3P


On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:16 AM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

If you mixed up the 16 MHz xtal with one of the 4.9152 MHz xtals, that would make the processor run quite a bit slower then it should so the segment test would last longer, but it should eventually come out of it. But if that were the case, the digits would flicker as the multiplexing would be running very slow too. There are no external conditions like a stuck button which would case the program to hang up in the display test mode, so I’m stumped as to what might cause that. 

 

Hopefully reflashing the processor will fix it. 

73, Steve KD1JV 

 

 

As far as I can tell, the segments and decimals all stay on indefinitely. I'll try the TX point tomorrow and report back.

 

I saw the new firmware, I downloaded it, and do have an Uno. I'll read the manual on how to program that chip using the Uno, and if I have trouble, I'll let you know.

 

Thanks, Steve.

 

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 11:59 PM Steven Weber <steve.kd1jv@...> wrote:

BTW, there must be a typo in the manual, the 10 MHz cal signal is on the TX test point, not the LO test point.