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New to the group and experiencing a problem


N3EA
 

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the info. Your setup is pretty much how the setup is here at the CERT station that we have at our HOA clubhouse except we have a different power supply. So far, no problems with that one. The 7000 I have in the car is just connected directly to the vehicle battery with the two automotive type fuses in line located right near the battery. So, the only places that might have started to oxidize would be at the connector on the back of the rig or in the fuse holders. I haven't had a chance to look into it yet. BTW..I use a Samlex SEC-1223 at my station at home and it's been very reliable for a long time. I've even taken on a couple of holiday style DXpeditions because it's not too heavy to carry around.

73,

Al, N3EA


Tony
 

Hi
I use the 7000 and AH4 and experience the power regularly if SWR is high. The 7000 is designed that way to protect the rig.
Testing on dummy load will confirm this.
Remember the AH4 will not tune everything. The antenna has to be nearly matched at least before the AH4 can do its work
Regards
Tony
MW0TRO


Terry Y
 

Hi Al,

I install Anderson Powerpole connectors on any 12VDC connector that comes into my possession.  So, I reseated the Powerpole connectors at the back of my radio that goes to my power source.  That power source includes a West Mountain Rigrunner 4004U, West Mountain PWRgate 40S, a deep cycle Marine AGM battery, and a Samlex SEC1223 regulated power supply.  

Initially the 7000 power was set to 100% because I participate in a NTS net with stations from Colorado, Utah, Arizona, Washington, and California.  As part of my troubleshooting I wondered if the 7000 at 22 amps output was too much for the SEC 1223 which is rated at 23 amps, so I reduced the 7000 to 75% power out (changed radio settings not by measurement).  No change.  Then I reseated the Powerpole connector at the back of the radio to the Rigrunner 4004U.  Then I reseated all the Powerpole connectors and the 7000 has since failed again; the connectors were not the problem.  

After additional troubleshooting, I am inclined to believe the battery, which is about a 2014 vintage, is my problem.  I bypassed the PWRgate 40S (the battery connects to and provides the 12VDC to the Rigrunner 4004U where the radio is plugged into) and I have not had a failure since.

This is a longer answer then you were looking for, but it's for the benefit of everyone following this thread and especially those that have conributed suggestions.

Good luck with your power reduction problem.

Terry, n0ve


Chuck Scott <cscott@...>
 

All:

One thing to remember about the AH-4 is that it always presents a low SWR to the radio while it's tuning, so you can't use that as an indication for how well it's doing. After tuning, if it found a solution, the SWR the radio sees is with the solution the AH-4 found.

This is also why you should always tune the AH-4 with reduced power to protect the pad it puts in the line, which the Icom radios seem to do. If you adapted the tuner to another type of radio you may have to reduce the power manually.

Chuck - N8DNX


 

Terry,
The loading coil is superfluous if you have a tuner like the AH-4 that can be mounted directly at the base. In the case of the loading coil it has losses and does not radiate much if any and it's function can be completely replaced by the AH-4 and then you only have the losses in the tuner instead of the losses for the tuner and the loading coil.
The tuner will automatically add the necessary inductive or capacitive reactance to present a 50 Ohm load to the transmission line and the transceiver. The only real problem might be if you have a bad connection on the coax or a bad coax. Try the suggested dummy load at the coax end at the tuner and check with your analyzer to see if you have a 1:1 SWR at 50 ohms then. 
That would be the starting point.
After proving that the coax was OK try adding the AH-4 with the dummy load between the antenna and ground connection and it should tune and also present a 50 ohm load to the transceiver or analyzer. The AH-4 should make a straight pass through connection when powered off (I think I remember correctly).
When you have proven that the above is correct then just connect the antenna wire to the antenna out on the AH-4 and the ground to a ground stake (the counterpoise can be connected as well to serve as a ground return radial and reduce ground losses. More are better. This will basically give you a longwire antenna which in my estimation is just as good as any other given that the wire is the radiator and the rest of the "stuff" exists just to match the coax better. 
The basic setup for this antenna is to give a close enough match to use an indoor tuner or no tuner, but the SWR can cause more losses in the coax than they save in the long run.
Let me know what you find.

DE KE4MD


Terry Y
 

J.D.,

Yeap, I'm still here, just outside working the problem.  The counterpoise is in the antenna manufacturer's recommended range of 50' to 55'.

Can you explain in more detail what you mean by the AH-4 replacing the antenna loading coil?  I wish, back in the early 1970's when I learned basic electronics and communications concepts, that learned more, or remembered more about antenna transmission and propagation.


Thanks,
Terry, n0ve


Joe
 

On 4/25/2020 8:56 AM, Terry Y wrote:
I'm still working on the analyzer problem.  The SWR reading are in the 3.0:1 range on all bands when I connected directly to the antenna.  So I'm still looking for information about the effect on any effort to analyze the SWR through the AH-4.
After tuning with the IC-7000 are you leaving power on the radio when you disconnect the tuner and connect the analyzer?  I would imagine that you should be doing this to keep the tuner powered up. If you are using the standard ICOM cable the tuner gets the power from the radio.

You might find some of the information here interesting.

<https://wp.hamoperator.com/?page_id=1043>

<https://hamoperator.com/HF/AH-4_Design_and_Operation.pdf>

73, Joe, K1ike


N3EA
 

Terry,

Been following this thread. I have a '7000 in my car and have noticed that on HF the power output is down to around 80 watts. It used to be 100 watts. Can you tell me which power connection
you had to clean to fix the oxidation problem? I do not use Power Poles. The power cable from the rig goes directly to the vehicle battery but there are fuses in the line.

Tnx & 73,

Al, N3EA


 

What I intended to say was now that your radio is working tune the antenna using the tune button on the IC-7000 and then disconnect the IC-7000 and hook up the analyzer and see what it says. As long as you don't power down the AH-4 will maintain the tune your radio is seeing. Do not disconnect the 4 pin connector on the radio.
If you don't have power on the AH-4 it should directly connect the input to the output without tuning.
It is possible that the SWR reading on the IC-7000 is incorrect as it uses the power direction within to derive it in the CPU.
The tune should be correct for the transmitted signal and of course higher for other frequencies.
Glad you found your power problem. At 3:1 the IC-7000 should fold back the power to protect the final transistors.


Terry Y
 

Hi Howard,

Thanks for the suggestion about going into a dummy load.  The fuses are good and I think you are on the right track that the power problem was a voltage drop.  I re-seated the power connection a couple of times and that resolved the power cycle problem.

Thanks,

Terry, n0ve


Terry Y
 

Ron,

Yes, I was looking at the individual responses and working the problem.  I have resolved the power issue and I'm still working the tuner issue.


Thanks,
Terry, n0ve


Terry Y
 

Hi J.D.,

In my experience, you are correct about the AH-4 or the 7000 not maintaining the tuned settings once the 7000 is powered off and the AH-4 gets its power from the 7000 so it powers off as well,

The power problem was an oxidized power connection.  I use Anderson Powerpole connectors on all my equipment for universal connectivity and when I initially reconnected the 7000 after sitting effectively idle for over three years, it worked on two nets.  Then I connected the HF side and the power problems started so I didn't immediately think it was a power problem.

I'm still working/researching the tuner/analyzer issue.

Thanks for your response,
Terry, n0ve


Terry Y
 

Hi Ron,

Yes, there is a loading coil on the EMCOMM II.  Yes, I am using the EMCOMM II and the AH-4 together (at the same time).  And, yes, you got it correct, after transmitting resulted in the power cycle, I disconnected the HF antenna and AH-4 and tried to transmit on UHF, which resulted in the same power off and immediate power back on cycle.

You are correct, the problem was an oxidized connection on the Anderson Powerpole connectors in the power cable.  By disconnecting and reconnecting them several times, the power problem was resolved.

I'm still researching the analyzer and AH-4 problem.

Thanks again,
Terry, n0ve


 

Terry, the AH-4 will maintain it's settings after tuning as long as the power is kept on. If you tune pressing the tune button on the IC-7000 and then disconnect the PL-259 on the IC-7000 and connect your analyzer you should be able to check the SWR at that frequency. 
The AH-4 should give you a better SWR than 3:1 unless you happen to have a length of wire that is 1/2 wave on the frequency you want or the AH-4 is not working correctly.
Do you have a ground at the AH-4? What is the length of the wire?
The antenna should tune OK on every band if it is 43' or longer, except if it is 1/2 wave resonant.
Are you getting the red tune light on the panel, indicating that the tuner has properly tuned the antenna?

JD
KE4MD


Terry Y
 

Hi Prabhu,

Thanks for the reply.  The power off/power on cycle was due to a poor DC connection.  What threw me was that the 7000 worked during two nets and all I did was plug it back into power with no problems.  The first thing I do with new eqipment is replace the power connectors with Anderson Powerpole connectors and fuses.  Turns out the power problem was oxidation on the Powerpole connectors, which I disconnected and reconnected several times after which the problem went away.


Thanks again,
Terry, n0ve


Terry Y
 

Hi Marnus,

Thanks for the reply.  The power off/power on cycle was due to a poor DC connection.  What threw me was that the 7000 worked during two nets.  I replace the power connectors with Anderson Powerpole connectors and fuses.  Turns out the power problem was oxidation on the Powerpole connectors, which I disconnected and reconnected several times after which the problem went away.


Thanks again,
Terry, n0ve


Terry Y
 

Hi Dennis,

Thanks for the reply; you were spot on.  The power off/power on cycle was due to a poor DC connection.  What threw me was that the 7000 worked during two nets.  I replace the power connectors with Anderson Powerpole connectors and fuses.  Turns out the power problem was oxidation on the Powerpole connectors, which I disconnected and reconnected several times after which the problem went away.

I'm still working on the analyzer problem.  The SWR reading are in the 3.0:1 range on all bands when I connected directly to the antenna.  So I'm still looking for information about the effect on any effort to analyze the SWR through the AH-4.

Thanks again,
Terry, n0ve


Steve Murphy
 

Hi Terry,

This sounds like the classic IC-7000 low voltage reset problem. High SWR can make the situation worse.

I eliminated the lousy glass fuse holders used on the OEM power cord replacing them with Bussman/ Littlefuse ATC in line holders. I have not had a reset since. I had a low power issue with one of my HF rigs a couple of years ago. Again, the cheap glass fuse holders were dropping nearly half a volt each!

In fact, the fuse holder swap is the first thing I do when I get a new radio.

Good luck solving your problem.

Steve
73 DE KD6NQA




On April 23, 2020 12:50:30 AM EDT, Terry Y <tkyoung2009@...> wrote:
I just subscribed to the group this evening; my name is Terry Young, call sign n0ve

I'm looking for help with a problem.  I've had my IC-7000 since 2011 and an AH-4 since 2012.  For about the past three and half years the 7000 has been used once or twice a year for UHF/VHF only and the AH-4 hasn't been used.  About a week ago I reinstalled the 7000 & over the past couple of days I reinstalled the AH-4 along with a new Chameleon EMCOMM II.  The EMCOMM II is a 60 foot wire antenna that covers 6M to 160 M, the manufacturer recommends a 50 to 55 foot counterpoise, and an external tuner is required.  I installed a 58 foot counterpoise figuring I would put an analyzer on it and trim it back until I got an acceptable SWR reading.

Since reinstalling the 7000 I have participated in a couple of UHF/VHF nets with no problems; the most recent net being last Sunday evening.

When I finished installing the antenna this morning I connected an antenna analyzer though the AH-4 with unsuccessful results.  On 7.240 MHz I got back a reading of infinate SWR.  So, dialed in the High Noon Net (7.240 MHz) and just listening worked fine  I turned on the tuner - no problems.  When I pressed the push-to-talk button/lever the radio shut off and immediately restarted.  I turned the power down to 75% and again, when I pressed push-to-talk same results.  I disconnected the HF antenna and the tuner cable and tried a UHF frequency (70cm) with the same results.  Before anyone asks, befoe I proceeded with the antenna installation I verifyed the AH-4 us compatible with a long-wire antenna and after the problem I did verify I have the UHF/VHF plugged into Ant-2 and the HF antenna plugged into Ant-1.

Will an antenna analyzer not work going though the AH-4?  Has anyone experienced this problem?  What did you find the solution to be?  Or, any thoughts on what the problem might be?

Thanks,
Terry, n0ve

--
Sent from my Android device.


 

Tap,tap,tap...Terry??
Terry there is no trimming the counterpoise for SWR as the tuner will mask anything that you do up to the point that it is outside of it's range to correct.
The AH-4 would replace the coil in the ENCOMM if you wanted as all it would need is the wire and a good ground at the antenna and to improve the ground losses a counterpoise or radials connected there. 
However, since we haven't heard back from you we wonder if anything has worked?
Trying the IC-7000 into a dummy load is a very good idea as is checking the fuse connectors as many have had problems there.
The VHF/UHF have completely separate finals, both driven by the same driver transistor. 
Tap, tap, tap,....You there, Terry???


Howard Jones
 

Hi Terry strongly recommend you carry out initial measurements into a dummy load. First radio direct to load, then via Ah4. Also check your do fuses for voltage drop, very common problem wit 7000.good luck. 


On Fri., 24 Apr. 2020, 09:20 Ronald Baran, <ronbaran@...> wrote:
Any success, Terry?

Ron 
W9XS




From: ic7000@groups.io <ic7000@groups.io> on behalf of Terry Y <tkyoung2009@...>
Sent: Wednesday, April 22, 2020 11:50 PM
To: ic7000@groups.io <ic7000@groups.io>
Subject: [ic7000] New to the group and experiencing a problem
 
I just subscribed to the group this evening; my name is Terry Young, call sign n0ve

I'm looking for help with a problem.  I've had my IC-7000 since 2011 and an AH-4 since 2012.  For about the past three and half years the 7000 has been used once or twice a year for UHF/VHF only and the AH-4 hasn't been used.  About a week ago I reinstalled the 7000 & over the past couple of days I reinstalled the AH-4 along with a new Chameleon EMCOMM II.  The EMCOMM II is a 60 foot wire antenna that covers 6M to 160 M, the manufacturer recommends a 50 to 55 foot counterpoise, and an external tuner is required.  I installed a 58 foot counterpoise figuring I would put an analyzer on it and trim it back until I got an acceptable SWR reading.

Since reinstalling the 7000 I have participated in a couple of UHF/VHF nets with no problems; the most recent net being last Sunday evening.

When I finished installing the antenna this morning I connected an antenna analyzer though the AH-4 with unsuccessful results.  On 7.240 MHz I got back a reading of infinate SWR.  So, dialed in the High Noon Net (7.240 MHz) and just listening worked fine.  I turned on the tuner - no problems.  When I pressed the push-to-talk button/lever the radio shut off and immediately restarted.  I turned the power down to 75% and again, when I pressed push-to-talk same results.  I disconnected the HF antenna and the tuner cable and tried a UHF frequency (70cm) with the same results.  Before anyone asks, befoe I proceeded with the antenna installation I verifyed the AH-4 us compatible with a long-wire antenna and after the problem I did verify I have the UHF/VHF plugged into Ant-2 and the HF antenna plugged into Ant-1.

Will an antenna analyzer not work going though the AH-4?  Has anyone experienced this problem?  What did you find the solution to be?  Or, any thoughts on what the problem might be?

Thanks,
Terry, n0ve