Help with Queries


Beverly Smallwood
 

On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 05:07 AM, Mike Tate wrote:

Looking at existing Queries is a good tactic but may not explain how & why certain codes work.

See the FHUG Knowledge Base section on Searching and Querying in particular An Overview of Queries:

https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/an-overview-of-queries/

It has a cross-reference to the FH Help page for The Query Window.

That same Help page can be opened from the FH Query Window by clicking the F1 key on your keyboard.

(BTW that works for most FH windows that have no Help button and is a standard Windows feature.)

I played with this a little.  After one of the videos about the 1901 census I attempted to build one for the 1900 US census.  It only found the two entries, but not all the people attached as "witnesses" - wives, sons, daughters, etc.

Do you normally enter the census fact for each person in the household or enter it once and link people via the shared button?  If the latter, how do I query for them too?

Bev


colevalleygirl@colevalleygirl.co.uk
 

I (and many others) give each individual their own census fact, rather than add (say) a census event for the head of household and add everyone else as witnesses.

 

Among other advantages, it makes querying on census events more straightforward. It’s also the case the most reports (well, all of them except narrative reports don’t include Witnessed Events.)

 

 

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Beverly Smallwood
Sent: 22 October 2022 17:47
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: [family-historian] Help with Queries

 

On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 05:07 AM, Mike Tate wrote:

Looking at existing Queries is a good tactic but may not explain how & why certain codes work.

See the FHUG Knowledge Base section on Searching and Querying in particular An Overview of Queries:

https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/an-overview-of-queries/

It has a cross-reference to the FH Help page for The Query Window.

That same Help page can be opened from the FH Query Window by clicking the F1 key on your keyboard.

(BTW that works for most FH windows that have no Help button and is a standard Windows feature.)

I played with this a little.  After one of the videos about the 1901 census I attempted to build one for the 1900 US census.  It only found the two entries, but not all the people attached as "witnesses" - wives, sons, daughters, etc.

Do you normally enter the census fact for each person in the household or enter it once and link people via the shared button?  If the latter, how do I query for them too?

Bev

_._,_._,_


Beverly Smallwood
 

On Sat, Oct 22, 2022 at 12:12 PM, colevalleygirl@... wrote:

I (and many others) give each individual their own census fact, rather than add (say) a census event for the head of household and add everyone else as witnesses.

 

Among other advantages, it makes querying on census events more straightforward. It’s also the case the most reports (well, all of them except narrative reports don’t include Witnessed Events.)

Hi Helen
I can see the utility of doing so in terms of gedcom etc. but how are you recording the relationship to the head of household in that case?

Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred?

Thank you
Bev


Adrian Bruce
 

On Sat, 22 Oct 2022 at 21:13, Beverly Smallwood <bevsmallwood@...> wrote:
...
Hi Helen
I can see the utility of doing so in terms of gedcom etc. but how are you recording the relationship to the head of household in that case?

Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred?

Thank you
Bev
 
Obviously I'm not Helen but I do what she does - each person in the household has their own census event as far as I'm concerned. As for your question about relationships, for the most part, the relationship is just that defined by the family structure in your file - the head of the household will be the father (or occasionally the mother, of course) and the "son", "daughter", etc, in the census schedule will normally be the son and daughter in the family. For me, having the relationship documented in the image (or transcription) suffices. There will be occasional oddities, of course - lodgers who turn out to be grandchildren, for instance. I'll just record that odd relationship in the notes for the census or whatever event. So I'm not recording the relationship as a witness role or whatever, because that normally just repeats the transcript or image.

" Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred"  Not sure whether you're talking just about censuses or more generally but I wouldn't use "sharing" of facts (i.e. witnesses) for census events. Although.... There is the long-running question of how we record grandchildren in a household when you don't know who the parents are. Some of us create a dummy person to act as a temporary parent until the real parent is found. The dummy is set to be the parent of the grandchild and the child of the grandparents. Some people dislike this intensely because it creates a person who isn't real - it might be that setting the grandchild (with unknown parents) to be a witness to the head of household's census event might be more acceptable. However, I'm still not very keen on that idea because it doesn't easily appear in charts or ordinary (non-narrative) reports.

More widely, there are lots of cases where I'm using witnesses now (having been reluctant to start with) - usually these are cases where I want to get the details against more than one person - a deceased person whose estate has just got probate, for instance - the deceased is the principal and the executors are witnesses. Or witnesses at weddings... Or people selling land to another person in my database.

Cases where I personally don't use witnesses to share events include military battles - X and Y may both have been at the same battle but I don't try to "share" the details because I can't cope with designating one of them as the principal and "demoting" the others to witnesses.

Does this help?

Adrian



Beverly Smallwood
 

On Sat, Oct 22, 2022 at 04:23 PM, Adrian Bruce wrote:
" Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred"  Not sure whether you're talking just about censuses or more generally but I wouldn't use "sharing" of facts (i.e. witnesses) for census events. Although.... There is the long-running question of how we record grandchildren in a household when you don't know who the parents are. Some of us create a dummy person to act as a temporary parent until the real parent is found. The dummy is set to be the parent of the grandchild and the child of the grandparents. Some people dislike this intensely because it creates a person who isn't real - it might be that setting the grandchild (with unknown parents) to be a witness to the head of household's census event might be more acceptable. However, I'm still not very keen on that idea because it doesn't easily appear in charts or ordinary (non-narrative) reports.
 
More widely, there are lots of cases where I'm using witnesses now (having been reluctant to start with) - usually these are cases where I want to get the details against more than one person - a deceased person whose estate has just got probate, for instance - the deceased is the principal and the executors are witnesses. Or witnesses at weddings... Or people selling land to another person in my database.
 
Cases where I personally don't use witnesses to share events include military battles - X and Y may both have been at the same battle but I don't try to "share" the details because I can't cope with designating one of them as the principal and "demoting" the others to witnesses.
 
Does this help?
 
Adrian
Thank you.  I had been getting away from "shared/witnessed" events in RootsMagic.  I shall do the same here.  It just seems easier.

As for grandchildren, I do create a fictitious child to pass them through until I can nail down where they sprouted.  At that point, in RootsMagic anyway, it was a simple thing to unlink from this one and attach to that one.

The only place I'd been using witnesses was in obituaries.  I don't really care if they print out for the witnesses, it is really just a placeholder that on this date they were regarded as living or deceased and their proximate relationship to the deceased.  Being able to view the obituary from each person is helpful.

The other place I started using witnesses is with DNA matches.  I enter the match in the person's facts and through witnesses define who she/he matches of my kits; our most recent common ancestor(s); and those between the two of us and those ancestors that passed that bit of DNA along.  Again - helpful to me but not intended to be on reports or charts.

Bev


Edward Sneithe
 

I began using shared events back about 1995 with TMG. It just seemed logical to me that when multiple people share the same event that I should also share it in , now FH.

I use sharing for many events including birth, deaths, census, obituaries, etc. I have created and heirloom fact that I share with all the recipients. I have created many custom sentences to get the output that I want. With my census fact I can preserve the family structure since I use that to confirm that the next census is the one I want. This is an example of one. Each shared person also gets a fact but not the complete census. If i record the census facts for each person I need to enter that may a dozen times and if I need to change the census I need to change it twelve times. This is how that appears in my narrative report:

Caroline appeared in the 1870 census as head of household in East Jaffrey. The census was enumerated on July 5, 1870.    Other household members were:

              • Daughter: Lizzie Lancaster BROWN

              • Sister: Cynthia Augusta ADAMS

              • BrotherinLaw: John May WALES

Caroline was listed with $4,000 of real estate and $4,000 of personal wealth.    She was also living with her sister Cynthia Adams Wales and her husband John.



I also use this same concept for Heirlooms so that I can show the complete chain of custody for an item.

Just my way of doing things


On Saturday, October 22, 2022 at 07:25:56 PM EDT, Beverly Smallwood <bevsmallwood@...> wrote:


On Sat, Oct 22, 2022 at 04:23 PM, Adrian Bruce wrote:
" Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred"  Not sure whether you're talking just about censuses or more generally but I wouldn't use "sharing" of facts (i.e. witnesses) for census events. Although.... There is the long-running question of how we record grandchildren in a household when you don't know who the parents are. Some of us create a dummy person to act as a temporary parent until the real parent is found. The dummy is set to be the parent of the grandchild and the child of the grandparents. Some people dislike this intensely because it creates a person who isn't real - it might be that setting the grandchild (with unknown parents) to be a witness to the head of household's census event might be more acceptable. However, I'm still not very keen on that idea because it doesn't easily appear in charts or ordinary (non-narrative) reports.
 
More widely, there are lots of cases where I'm using witnesses now (having been reluctant to start with) - usually these are cases where I want to get the details against more than one person - a deceased person whose estate has just got probate, for instance - the deceased is the principal and the executors are witnesses. Or witnesses at weddings... Or people selling land to another person in my database.
 
Cases where I personally don't use witnesses to share events include military battles - X and Y may both have been at the same battle but I don't try to "share" the details because I can't cope with designating one of them as the principal and "demoting" the others to witnesses.
 
Does this help?
 
Adrian
Thank you.  I had been getting away from "shared/witnessed" events in RootsMagic.  I shall do the same here.  It just seems easier.

As for grandchildren, I do create a fictitious child to pass them through until I can nail down where they sprouted.  At that point, in RootsMagic anyway, it was a simple thing to unlink from this one and attach to that one.

The only place I'd been using witnesses was in obituaries.  I don't really care if they print out for the witnesses, it is really just a placeholder that on this date they were regarded as living or deceased and their proximate relationship to the deceased.  Being able to view the obituary from each person is helpful.

The other place I started using witnesses is with DNA matches.  I enter the match in the person's facts and through witnesses define who she/he matches of my kits; our most recent common ancestor(s); and those between the two of us and those ancestors that passed that bit of DNA along.  Again - helpful to me but not intended to be on reports or charts.

Bev


Adrian Bruce
 



On Sun, 23 Oct 2022, 01:20 Edward Sneithe via groups.io, <truthfor16=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
.... If i record the census facts for each person I need to enter that may a dozen times and if I need to change the census I need to change it twelve times. ...
That's a good argument for the use of witnesses. I had to document the transfer of some land between uncle and nephew - there were about a dozen patches of land in the transfer and they might turn out to be crucial in identifying other relatives. But I didn't want to write the whole text out twice, especially if some patches might need to be annotated in the future. So I just decided that one party would be the principal and the other a witness. (An arbitrary decision which was which). Then the witness sentence just referred to the Note against the principal's event, where I'd documented the land. 

Adrian 


Richard Scantlebury
 

Bev, I use witnesses certainly in Censuses and have done since I started using FH. I started using witnesses in TMG and the use of witnesses in FH was one of the main reasons for the change.

I think the use of witnesses tends to define the structure of a family although with the 1841 Census & 1939 Register the roles aren’t defined so I use “member of household” with the other censuses I use the principal as the head of the household use the roles of wife, son, daughter, father etc.

There is no right or wrong way/method just a way/method that suits you, doubtless over time your method/way will evolve & develop it’s a personnel thing and certainly not anything to with age seeing that I’m the same vintage ish as John Hanson but unlike John I wasn’t in the IT world but an agricultural engineer. I only started using computers when I started genealogy & my ONS.

Just experiment & play with witnesses it’s the best way to learn & develop.

 

 

Best wishes and Kind regards

Rich Scantlebury

 In global pursuit of Scantleburys & Skentelberys for a one name study - 3209

http://scantlebury.one-name.net/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/richscats/

 

 

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Beverly Smallwood
Sent: Saturday, 22 October 2022 21:14
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Help with Queries

 

On Sat, Oct 22, 2022 at 12:12 PM, colevalleygirl@... wrote:

I (and many others) give each individual their own census fact, rather than add (say) a census event for the head of household and add everyone else as witnesses.

 

Among other advantages, it makes querying on census events more straightforward. It’s also the case the most reports (well, all of them except narrative reports don’t include Witnessed Events.)

Hi Helen
I can see the utility of doing so in terms of gedcom etc. but how are you recording the relationship to the head of household in that case?

Are there any instances you can think of where sharing a fact is preferred?

Thank you
Bev


Brent Tapscott
 

Bev - in terms of recording relationships, I use AS to capture the Census information and have modified the Census Templates such that columns such as Relationship are set to Column Type "Generic".  Together with the option to append to local note it means that each Census Fact that is generated for each individual has a Local Note that includes (for my setup) the Relationship, Occupation, Marital Status (and where relevant) the 1911 UK Census information re children in the marriage, etc.   Thus the sentence output (as setup on my website which has a specific grouping for Census records) shows as    " 1911: at 8 Windsor TerraceG in Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorganshire, WalesG. Relationship to Head of Family: Wife, Marital Status: Married, Completed years the present Marriage has lasted: 25, Total number of Children Born Alive: 2, Total number of Children still Living: 2."

The underlying Source record has a grid (again generated by AS) that mirrors the Census schedule and thus shows all the details for all the individuals in that schedule.


colevalleygirl@colevalleygirl.co.uk
 

Brent, absolutely nothing to do with the matter at hand, but...

 

In 1911 my grandfather and his parents were at 6 Milton Terrace aka Windsor Terrace Merthyr Tydfil. Next door at number 7 was his grandmother and her husband.

 

A small world.

 

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Brent Tapscott
Sent: 23 October 2022 07:53
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Help with Queries

 

Bev - in terms of recording relationships, I use AS to capture the Census information and have modified the Census Templates such that columns such as Relationship are set to Column Type "Generic".  Together with the option to append to local note it means that each Census Fact that is generated for each individual has a Local Note that includes (for my setup) the Relationship, Occupation, Marital Status (and where relevant) the 1911 UK Census information re children in the marriage, etc.   Thus the sentence output (as setup on my website which has a specific grouping for Census records) shows as    " 1911: at 8 Windsor TerraceG in Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorganshire, WalesG. Relationship to Head of Family: Wife, Marital Status: Married, Completed years the present Marriage has lasted: 25, Total number of Children Born Alive: 2, Total number of Children still Living: 2."

The underlying Source record has a grid (again generated by AS) that mirrors the Census schedule and thus shows all the details for all the individuals in that schedule.