Find My Past hints


Brian Bottomley
 

Can anyone explain why FMP hints via Family Historian  sometimes produce superior results over the same data entered into the normal FMP search page?
For instance, FH hints offered an image in addition to the transcription from the Yorkshire Baptisms record set which is unavailable when the same record set is accessed via the traditional FMP search page - only the transcription is available. Have Calico Pie negotiated some augmented records access?

Thanks
Brian


John Hanson
 

Brian

Assuming that you did them both at the same time then you can’t be entering the same parameters as the plugin is

 

I would suggest running the plugin and then compare what it has submitted as the search compared with what you would enter

 

Sometimes we try to be too explicit

 

If you search a specific set but it searches elsewhere it might have found the BT version which is in a different records office

 

Regards
John Hanson - researching the Halstead/Holstead/Alstead names
Researcher, the Halsted Trust - https://www.halsted.org.uk
Research website - https://www.halstedresearch.org.uk

2021 Family History Conference - https://www.elizabethanancestors.org.uk

 

 

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Bottomley via groups.io
Sent: 29 March 2021 10:10
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: [family-historian] Find My Past hints

 

Can anyone explain why FMP hints via Family Historian  sometimes produce superior results over the same data entered into the normal FMP search page?
For instance, FH hints offered an image in addition to the transcription from the Yorkshire Baptisms record set which is unavailable when the same record set is accessed via the traditional FMP search page - only the transcription is available. Have Calico Pie negotiated some augmented records access?

Thanks
Brian


Trevor Rix
 

Brian, could you provide the details of your search so that we can check our end?


Brian Bottomley
 

Hi Trevor
My G3 grandfather Samuel Oldfield was born in 1775 and FH displays the FMP hints thus:
 
Opening the Yorkshire Baptisms hint I get

 and can open the image


Damn...and now FMP is showing me the option for the transcription AND the image which it didn't last night!!



It feels like FMP will reveal its secrets once it knows you know they're there! Definitely an FMP issue rather than FH. Just curious as to understand what was happening.

Brian


Trevor Rix
 

When I search FMP for Samuel Oldfield born 1775 - filtered by parish baptisms - I receive four hits including the record with the image that you mention. So, no problem that I can see.


Brian Bottomley
 

John

I wonder given your suggestion, if perhaps when I did a specific search on Yorkshire baptisms in FMP it brought up No.1 whereas there are two apparently similarly named record sets and FH brought up the results of  No.2

t
As you say, maybe I was being too exact in my search but never thought there were two identically named record sets in FMP. I believe there is a transcription error indicating he was baptised on 7/3/1776 which is compounded by the two different Julian/Gregorian calendars. Was it the old March 1775 or should it be viewed as the current calendar as March 1776? I find it difficult to believe that a child of the same name was born and baptised to the same father (Coley is a small hamlet so chances of two Thos Oldfields are remote) virtually 12 months apart.

Brian


John Hanson
 

Brian

As the West Riding archive material is new to FMP and they are still adding material on a daily basis it is always possible that the image was loaded overnight
Regards

John

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Bottomley via groups.io
Sent: 29 March 2021 11:35
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Find My Past hints

 

Hi Trevor
My G3 grandfather Samuel Oldfield was born in 1775 and FH displays the FMP hints thus:
 
Opening the Yorkshire Baptisms hint I get

 and can open the image


Damn...and now FMP is showing me the option for the transcription AND the image which it didn't last night!!



It feels like FMP will reveal its secrets once it knows you know they're there! Definitely an FMP issue rather than FH. Just curious as to understand what was happening.

Brian

 


Adrian Bruce
 

The 3 Samuel Oldfield baptisms in Yorkshire each have a **different** origin - you need to check the bottom of the transcript and the image to see where it's come from. In summary, they all refer to the same event.

In detail for each FMP index / transcript:

1. "Yorkshire Baptisms" collection
First name(s) Sam'L
Last name Oldfield
Baptism place Coley, St John
Mother's first name(s) -
Father's first name(s) Tho's
Baptism date 07 Mar 1776
Church St John
Checked Y
Registry number -
Notes Coley Register missing - only shown in St John Halifax register
Transcriptions © Calderdale Family History Society

This is a transcript ONLY. Coley was a chapelry in the parish of Halifax. Judging by the note, as often happens, the chapel's baptisms were entered in both its own register (I assume) and in the parent parish register (St. John, Halifax). This is a transcript (it says) from the Halifax register.

2. "Yorkshire Baptisms" collection
First name(s) Samuel
Last name Oldfield
Baptism place Halifax
Mother's first name(s) -
Father's first name(s) Thomas
Baptism date 17 Mar 1775
Archive Borthwick Institute for Archives

This has both transcript and image. When you go to the image, you find that this is an image of the Bishop's Transcript. It appears to be the BTs of the Halifax register again (i.e. the parental parish register) with the Coley entries at the right, labelled thus. Samuel is 3rd last (important to note that) in the Coley entries - it just says

Mar. 17. Sam'l. [son of] Tho's Oldfield

This has been transcribed as 17 March 1775 - if you look carefully, that is wrong. Yes, the column is headed "1775 Bap'd at Coley" but the point is that, as with so many BTs of this era, the 12 months are NOT for one calendar year but for the church year which still started some time in March. (It might start 25 March, or it might start some time around Easter - I've not checked - or it might simply be 12m since the last copies were produced.) The point is that it starts 1775 at the top but slides round into January 1776 towards the bottom. It's not a difference between the Gregorian and Julian calendars - that was 22y before, but it is a carry over from the old church year that drove the Julian calendar.

So the year should be 1776, as per item 1, and since 2 such baptisms 10d apart really is pushing it, both clearly refer to the same event.

3. "England Births & Baptisms 1538-1975"
First name(s) Samuel
Last name Oldfield
Baptism date 17 Mar 1776
Place Coley
County Yorkshire
Country England
Father's first name(s) Thomas
Father's last name Oldfield

This is a FamilySearch index. It doesn't make clear which register or BT this comes from - FamilySearch does have a 17 Mar 1776 baptism for Samuel taken from "film" 7588418, which is the Halifax BTs, so that's probably where this comes from. In other words, this is indexing the same image as #2 above, except FS got the date right!

Whether the Coley chapel register does exist for this date, I have no idea.

But that's the explanation for the different entries.

Adrian



Brian Bottomley
 

Adrian

Thank you for that very comprehensive explanation into the discrepancies I was encountering. 

It's an excellent example of why a view of the original document should be obtained if at all possible. 

I'm still not sure why FH hints only brings up the Bishop's Transcript in this instance when there are obviously several versions on FMP, but glad that it did!

Thank you everyone for your input. As always this forum is a mine of helpful information.

Brian


stephen.challis@...
 

Brian

 

It is perfectly possible that the first child died within weeks of birth, and the second was given the same name a year later.

 

It has happened in my family; it is beyond doubt as there is a record of the death of the first child.

 

Kind regards

 

Stephen Challis

Please reply to Stephen.Challis@...

 

From: family-historian@groups.io [mailto:family-historian@groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Bottomley via groups.io
Sent: 29 March 2021 12:08
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Find My Past hints

 

John

I wonder given your suggestion, if perhaps when I did a specific search on Yorkshire baptisms in FMP it brought up No.1 whereas there are two apparently similarly named record sets and FH brought up the results of  No.2

t
As you say, maybe I was being too exact in my search but never thought there were two identically named record sets in FMP. I believe there is a transcription error indicating he was baptised on 7/3/1776 which is compounded by the two different Julian/Gregorian calendars. Was it the old March 1775 or should it be viewed as the current calendar as March 1776? I find it difficult to believe that a child of the same name was born and baptised to the same father (Coley is a small hamlet so chances of two Thos Oldfields are remote) virtually 12 months apart.

Brian

 


Brian Bottomley
 

Stephen

Thanks, yes possible  (pity his wife though) but can't see any records of burials of a Samuel Oldfield during that 12 month period. In this instance I'm favouring a transcription error until evidence persuades me otherwise.

Regards
Brian