How to deal with an engagement when the couple never marry


simon pugh <polydorus1@...>
 

I am using the trial version of Family historian and have imported a Master Genealogist database.
I have an woman who was engaged to a man, but she jilted him and married someone else.
The engagement has been imported but then the man automatically becomes a spouse when there is no marriage record. I am unclear how to deal with this except by removing the engagement and putting it in as note. 


Ros
 

Just set the "status" on the main tab of the Property box as either "Unmarried couple" or "Never Married"


MARGARET LAWRENCE
 

I haven’t got access to FH at the moment, but if you still want to show that the couple got engaged I think that there is an ‘Engaged’ fact.

Margaret.


On 14 Feb 2020, at 11:03, Ros <ros@...> wrote:

Just set the "status" on the main tab of the Property box as either "Unmarried couple" or "Never Married"


simon pugh <polydorus1@...>
 

"Just set the "status" on the main tab of the Property box as either "Unmarried couple" or "Never Married""

Thank you, so simple when you know!


Victor Markham
 

In the focus window under the marriage details open the menu and select unmarried couple

On 14 Feb 2020, at 10:51, simon pugh <polydorus1@...> wrote:
I am using the trial version of Family historian and have imported a Master Genealogist database.
I have an woman who was engaged to a man, but she jilted him and married someone else.
The engagement has been imported but then the man automatically becomes a spouse when there is no marriage record. I am unclear how to deal with this except by removing the engagement and putting it in as note. 


uhkh3tsccmz9@beconfidential.com
 

Part of the problem is that broken-engagement "couples" show as a "couple" in diagrams (albeit with the link line double dashed rather than double lined). Where people live together this is probably OK (mark as "Unmarried couple"), but where someone was jilted (or the engagement was mutually ended) it sometimes seems strange for the "couple" to appear as such in diagrams.

I suppose it depends whether you want the couple to show as a couple (especially if there are children) - in which case create a "spouse"* but mark them as "never married" - and add an engagement fact for the couple (if possible with from-to dates) to make clear the reason for the never married clear.

* I think many genealogy programs have historically tended to show anyone who shares couple facts as a "spouse".

The alternative is to create a custom fact for "Engagement (single)" where you add the temporary fiancé as a witness to the fact. The fiancé as a witness can be just a "name" or can be a link to someone else in the file.


simon pugh <polydorus1@...>
 

Thank you, using the witness field to link two people seems like a good work around to connect two people who aren't a couple. It could be used for a number of things.


Brian Horridge
 

Why not use the "Associated Person" fact (under "Miscellaneous - Add Associated Person") as this is a more general link.  You can add details of the connection in some of the sub-fields

Brian

On 14/02/2020 14:51, simon pugh wrote:
Thank you, using the witness field to link two people seems like a good work around to connect two people who aren't a couple. It could be used for a number of things.

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Mike Tate
 

Just be aware that Fact Witnesses are a non-standard GEDCOM feature and not supported by many other products.

Alternatively, Associated Person although a standard GEDCOM feature, is still not well supported by other products.

Using the Family relationship and Engagement Event are standard GEDCOM features and universally supported.

So if exporting to other products such as Ancestry, FindMyPast, TNG, etc, then bear those options in mind.

 

Regards, Mike Tate

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of simon pugh
Sent: 14 February 2020 14:52
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] How to deal with an engagement when the couple never marry

 

Thank you, using the witness field to link two people seems like a good work around to connect two people who aren't a couple. It could be used for a number of things.

_._,_._,_

,_._,_


simon pugh <polydorus1@...>
 

That sounds good, but I am don't know how to find the associated person fact. It doesn't seem to be in the list of facts, would that be because I am using the trial version at the moment.


Adrian Bruce
 

Because it's so obscure, Associated Person isn't in the normal user
interface. You have to bring up the property box for the individual,
click the All tab, right click the person's name (i.e. the top of
their tree of data) then choose Add Miscellaneous / Add Associated
Person and then add a link to an existing person or create a new one
with a link. (So this isn't an event or attribute as such)

There are several really obscure GEDCOM items that can only be added
in this way - via the All Tab. I actually added a new / custom tab to
the Individual's property box specifically devoted to Associated
person and a couple of other odd items. NB - adding the association
link from A to B doesn't add a link from B to A. Might seem a pain but
there are cases where the naming on the link is different depending on
the direction.

Adrian

On Fri, 14 Feb 2020 at 16:10, simon pugh <polydorus1@gmail.com> wrote:

That sounds good, but I am don't know how to find the associated person fact. It doesn't seem to be in the list of facts, would that be because I am using the trial version at the moment.


uhkh3tsccmz9@beconfidential.com
 

You need to explore the wonders of the "All" tab on the properties box.

In the All Tab, right click on the Name, select Add Miscellaneous and then select Associated Person. This creates a link to the Associated Person who has to be a person in the main file and not just a name (you have the option to create a new individual record). Once Associated you can add the relationship detail in the next field down in the All Tab under Associated Person.

Note, that if in the all tab you click on the name of the associate you get taken to their property box; there you will observe that the association is "one-way". If necessary you have to create an associated person back the other way.


Linda Reinfeld
 

Great new info - the Add Miscellaneous right click in the All tab. However I can only get that info to print using Publish/record detail reports/record details - individuals. I can’t get it to print on individual narrative report. 

Linda Reinfeld


On Feb 14, 2020, at 11:50 AM, "uhkh3tsccmz9@..." <uhkh3tsccmz9@...> wrote:

You need to explore the wonders of the "All" tab on the properties box.

In the All Tab, right click on the Name, select Add Miscellaneous and then select Associated Person. This creates a link to the Associated Person who has to be a person in the main file and not just a name (you have the option to create a new individual record). Once Associated you can add the relationship detail in the next field down in the All Tab under Associated Person.

Note, that if in the all tab you click on the name of the associate you get taken to their property box; there you will observe that the association is "one-way". If necessary you have to create an associated person back the other way.


Adrian Bruce
 

Yes, the problem with the Associated person link is that it appears in very, very few places. I have it set to appear on a custom tab on the individual's property box, and have it in a text scheme for my diagrams but that's about it. This very thing was mentioned in the FH User Group recently and I don't think that I've missed anything significant. 


Mike Tate
 

Yes, this is related to my earlier reply to be aware of the lack of support for some features.

Using the Family partnership and Engagement Event is well supported in FH Diagrams and Reports.

Fact Witnesses are only supported in Narrative Reports although FH V7 due this year is reputed to support them in all Reports.

Associated Person cannot easily be added to Narrative Reports because they do not involve a Fact that has a Sentence Template.

So the solution is to create an Associated Person custom fact and in its Sentence Template refer to the Associated Person link.

Alternatively, forget about the Associated Person, created a custom Engagement individual fact with a Fact Witness for the other person, and then they will appear in Narrative Reports.

 

Regards, Mike Tate

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Linda Reinfeld
Sent: 14 February 2020 17:31
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] How to deal with an engagement when the couple never marry

 

Great new info - the Add Miscellaneous right click in the All tab. However I can only get that info to print using Publish/record detail reports/record details - individuals. I can’t get it to print on individual narrative report. 

 

Linda Reinfeld


On Feb 14, 2020, at 11:50 AM, "uhkh3tsccmz9@..." <uhkh3tsccmz9@...> wrote:

You need to explore the wonders of the "All" tab on the properties box.

In the All Tab, right click on the Name, select Add Miscellaneous and then select Associated Person. This creates a link to the Associated Person who has to be a person in the main file and not just a name (you have the option to create a new individual record). Once Associated you can add the relationship detail in the next field down in the All Tab under Associated Person.

Note, that if in the all tab you click on the name of the associate you get taken to their property box; there you will observe that the association is "one-way". If necessary you have to create an associated person back the other way.

_._,_._,_


simon pugh <polydorus1@...>
 

That's great, thank you. I wonder how long it would have taken for me to find that!