Date   

Re: FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

colevalleygirl@colevalleygirl.co.uk
 

Adrian, I’ve always considered the Access Date as telling people ‘well, it was there when **I** looked at it’, having been burned in the past by vanishing websites and people complaining that my sources were wrong as a result.

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Adrian Bruce

Personally, I wouldn't put the Year of Access in either. We had a discussion about this in the User Group, IIRC, and some people said that the Access Date was an analogy for the Edition of a book and should appear by that analogy. My own view is that's a misleading analogy because I can go and consult a different edition (sometimes) whereas there is no way that I can consult that collection in anything other than the current year, so the Year of Access is useless data. But if it's in the ESM format, you may want to stick to that! 

 


Re: FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

Adrian Bruce
 

I can't comment on whether that's an optimal choice of template but my comment about what's written is that your bibliography entry goes right to the specific entry, whereas surely the bibliography only needs to specify the collection? Something like:
"New York Records of the State National Guard 1906-1954." database with images. FamilySearch. 2021”
would suffice I would have thought. As it is, it's rather like having a bibliography entry for each page in a book. It may make little difference to you now, but if you have more references to that collection of images....

Personally, I wouldn't put the Year of Access in either. We had a discussion about this in the User Group, IIRC, and some people said that the Access Date was an analogy for the Edition of a book and should appear by that analogy. My own view is that's a misleading analogy because I can go and consult a different edition (sometimes) whereas there is no way that I can consult that collection in anything other than the current year, so the Year of Access is useless data. But if it's in the ESM format, you may want to stick to that! 


Re: FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

Dennis
 

Hi Kai:
Based on your suggestions, I used the Advanced derivative template (Databases, Online) and came up with this which pretty much matches the way FamilySearch constructed it. Or should I use a different derivative advanced template?
Original FamilySearch Citation:
 "New York Records of the State National Guard, 1906-1954," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVJY-NCWM : 8 March 2021), Wm Frederick Beatley, 29 Jan 1937; citing Military Service, Brooklyn, , New York, United States, New York State Archives, Albany.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Footnote

"New York Records of the State National Guard 1906-1954," database with images, FamilySearch (https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVJY-NCWM: accessed 10 May 2021), Wm Frederick Beatley; citing Military Service, Brooklyn, , New York, United States, New York State Archives, Albany.

Short Footnote

"New York Records of the State National Guard 1906-1954," database with images Wm Frederick Beatley.

Bibliography

"New York Records of the State National Guard 1906-1954." database with images. FamilySearch. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVJY-NCWM: 2021.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What is your opinion? Also, any input from the FH experts would be beneficial.

--
Regards, Dennis. Surnames of interest: Beatley & Evans originating in Great Britain ->-> Colonial US New York / Maryland.


Re: FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

Dennis
 

Hi Kai. 

Thanks for your suggestions! I will look into that template as well as the clone variant. 

EE kindle downloading atm. 

Again, thanks. Cheers 🍻
--
Regards, Dennis. Surnames of interest: Beatley & Evans originating in Great Britain -> colonial US New York / Maryland.


Re: FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

Kai Chandler
 

I've been using one of the Advanced | Derivative templates for my  layered citations as the derivative ones include the semicolon. Not ideal but it seems to work. You could perhaps take one, clone and edit it into something closer to what you need.  I'm curious to see what the FH experts suggest.

As an aside, I'd certainly recommend getting the latest Evidence Explained, perhaps in Kindle format, though there are lots of great citation examples on the Evidence Explained website.

Kai

On 09/05/2021 21:37, Dennis wrote:
Good Evening All!
I've been a FH user since version 6 and have since migrated to version 7. I'm currently redoing/converting my research from "conclusion based" to a evidence-based (or as FH7 calls it "Source-driven Data Entry") as I believe that is best for my way of thinking/methodology. FH7 includes the "Essential" templates based on CP research with the Genealogy Programme of the University of Strathclyde whereas the "Advanced" collection is modeled on Elizabeth Shown Mills book Evidence Explained (EE). Now I've been using the Essential templates for most of my birth/marriage/death type sources but I've been at a lost to select a proper evidence based template (a la EE) for the following source from FamilySearch:

"New York Records of the State National Guard, 1906-1954," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVJY-NCWM : 8 March 2021), Wm Frederick Beatley, 29 Jan 1937; citing Military Service, Brooklyn, , New York, United States, New York State Archives, Albany.

Either I'm missing something or I'm not making the connection as to which template to use. I'm a newbie to the whole evidence-based workflow method as well as the book EE which I have on my wish list.

Any help and/or suggestions from the community is greatly appreciated.

--
Regards, Dennis. Surnames of interest: Beatley & Evans originating in Great Britain -> colonial US New York / Maryland / Virginia & surrounds.


FH7 Evidence Based (Source-driven Data Entry) Templates

Dennis
 

Good Evening All!
I've been a FH user since version 6 and have since migrated to version 7. I'm currently redoing/converting my research from "conclusion based" to a evidence-based (or as FH7 calls it "Source-driven Data Entry") as I believe that is best for my way of thinking/methodology. FH7 includes the "Essential" templates based on CP research with the Genealogy Programme of the University of Strathclyde whereas the "Advanced" collection is modeled on Elizabeth Shown Mills book Evidence Explained (EE). Now I've been using the Essential templates for most of my birth/marriage/death type sources but I've been at a lost to select a proper evidence based template (a la EE) for the following source from FamilySearch:

"New York Records of the State National Guard, 1906-1954," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVJY-NCWM : 8 March 2021), Wm Frederick Beatley, 29 Jan 1937; citing Military Service, Brooklyn, , New York, United States, New York State Archives, Albany.

Either I'm missing something or I'm not making the connection as to which template to use. I'm a newbie to the whole evidence-based workflow method as well as the book EE which I have on my wish list.

Any help and/or suggestions from the community is greatly appreciated.

--
Regards, Dennis. Surnames of interest: Beatley & Evans originating in Great Britain -> colonial US New York / Maryland / Virginia & surrounds.


Re: Media Window Problem

Andrew Braid
 

Mike

I realised that I had not restarted my machine after the upgrade. Now I have all is well.

Always look for the simplest solution!

Thanks for your help.

Andrew

On 08/05/2021 12:20, Mike Tate wrote:

This is a scenario where screenshots would be invaluable, but attaching them to these Emails requires manual admin review which can delay things.

The FHUG Forum has no such problems with screenshots.

 

I cannot follow your descriptions and cannot find anything that fails.

 

The Media Window workspace is opened by clicking the View Media camera icon in the main FH toolbar.

But that does not have a ‘Show Media’ icon.

Do you mean the ‘Open Editor/Player’ ‘Play’ icon of green circle & black triangle?

That is greyed out until an image is selected. It then always displays the selected Media file for me.

 

In the Property Box, you are talking about the yellow Source Citation List Pane and its ‘Show Media’ toolbar icon.

That opens the floating yellow Citation Window and the ‘Open Editor/Player’ icon of green circle & black triangle always displays my selected Media file.

For me it works regardless of whether a Source Record or Citation-specific Media file.

 

All I can suggest is to re-install FH v7.0.5 and see if that fixes it. Otherwise, I am baffled.

 

I presume you have a standard up-to-date Windows PC and have not changed any Media playing tools.

 

Mike Tate

 


Re: FInding an individual on a diagram

Trevor Rix
 

The Focus Window was introduced following my suggestion that people who loved Generations v8.5a were looking for another program with a similar interface showing three generations as a family page.


Re: FInding an individual on a diagram

duncan mcmillan
 

In the end I found it quicker for me to keep an outline tree on genesreunited,(my preference) or ancestry open when I am working in family historian, as I have found it very difficult to quickly navigate on a line in FH as I move backwards and forwards and up and down on a line updating references for many individuals

On 08 April 2021 at 01:44 "Lorna Craig via groups.io" <l.m.craig@...> wrote:


Actually Neil, the Focus Window (which I guess is what you mean by the
'family page') was not introduced into FH until about V4 (as far as I
remember), so traditionally it didn't use the family page approach at
all!   Many of us who started using FH with earlier versions were
attracted to it because of its dynamic diagrams, and I, like Adrian and
many others, still use diagram based editing, using the drag-and-drop
method to add new individuals.  I have FH set to open on the Records
window, and hardly ever use the Focus window at all.

Like Adrian, I create diagrams of whichever family groups I am working
on.  (A single huge diagram is out of the question when you have
thousands of individuals in your file.)

Lorna

On 07/04/2021 12:29, Neil Grantham via groups.io wrote:
.......I’m just used to using the program model that traditionally
uses the family page approach like FH.




Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Thanks for your help and patience Mike.
We got their in the end!
Regards
John


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

Mike Tate
 

Move the duplicate FH Project File sitting in the subfolder to the Desktop alongside the Gedcom File you moved earlier.

That Gedcom File dates from 21 March 2021 and is significantly smaller than your genuine Gedcom File.

 

The rogue Gedcom File has 7 & 8 May 2021 dates due to the recent strange symptoms that we cannot explain.

i.e. It got created in error yesterday somehow.

The rogue FH Project File has 17 Feb 2021 dates and not modified or accessed later.

 

These two files may be needed by CP.

 

Mike

 


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Great Mike,
got that and wont delete anything without being absolutely clear.
Well I appear to have a duplicate project file sitting in the subfolder but not causing a problem.
The Gedcom which I removed to my desktop and renamed just as FIRR Gedcom 1 has a very odd set of dates:
Created 07 May 2021
Modified 21 March 2021
Accessed 08 May 2021
it is 1 480, 247 bytes

The Gedcom which I am clear now should be kept is as previously stated:
FIRR database master gedcom file - createde17 Feb 21, modified 08 May 21 and accessed 08 May 21 size 1579kb

Sorry if I am getting tied in knots here and as I say it does seem to be fine now.
Appreciate your hanging in there.
regards
John Firr


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

Mike Tate
 

No, No, No.

 

There are two different file types but both with the same filename ‘FIRR Database Master’:

  1. Family Historian Project File whose icon has blue, red & yellow linked rectangles.
  2. Gedcom File whose icon has three green linked rectangles.

 

1) Family Historian Project File should only exist in the …\FIRR Database Master\ folder.

This is a tiny file that just holds a few settings but is essential for correct Project operation.

 

2) Gedcom File should only exist in the\FIRR Database Master\FIRR Database Master.fh_data\ folder.

This holds ALL YOUR PROJECT DATA and is quite large. Do NOT discard it or your Project is gone!

 

You said there was a stray Gedcom File there which you moved out.

It would have a slightly different filename ‘FIRR Database Master (1)’ with a suffix.

How does this Gedcom File that you moved compare in size with the real Gedcom File above?

 

Mike

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of johnfirr via groups.io
Sent: 08 May 2021 16:45
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Strange Project has appeared?

 

Hi again Mike,
apologies I am not particularly techie but will try to explain.
I do not have two gedcom files ( only one) but I have two project files.

They are all called FIRR Database master.

In the correct project folder I now have:
FIRR Databse Master project File - created 17 Feb 21 Modified 08 May 21 accessed 08 May 21 size 1kb

In the sub-folder ( where there should be none as I understand) I currently have:
FIRR database master project file - created 17 Feb 21 ( properties offered no other dates for this file) size 1kb
FIRR database master gedcom file - createde17 Feb 21, modified 08 May 21 and accessed 08 May 21 size 1579kb

I am assuming that although the programme is now working fine and is clearly picking up the main folder project file, the two files in the sub folder should be taken away and stored elsewhere?

sorry if that is still not clear but whatever the issue was it now seems fine and its never happened before,
john


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Hi again Mike,
apologies I am not particularly techie but will try to explain.
I do not have two gedcom files ( only one) but I have two project files.

They are all called FIRR Database master.

In the correct project folder I now have:
FIRR Databse Master project File - created 17 Feb 21 Modified 08 May 21 accessed 08 May 21 size 1kb

In the sub-folder ( where there should be none as I understand) I currently have:
FIRR database master project file - created 17 Feb 21 ( properties offered no other dates for this file) size 1kb
FIRR database master gedcom file - createde17 Feb 21, modified 08 May 21 and accessed 08 May 21 size 1579kb

I am assuming that although the programme is now working fine and is clearly picking up the main folder project file, the two files in the sub folder should be taken away and stored elsewhere?

sorry if that is still not clear but whatever the issue was it now seems fine and its never happened before,
john


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

Mike Tate
 

To get a better idea of dates. Right-click the file, choose Properties and it gives three dates: Created, Modified & Accessed.

Did you check the size of the real and rogue Gedcom Files as requested?

What did you discover?

Don’t get rid of the rogues as CP may need them.

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of johnfirr via groups.io
Sent: 08 May 2021 15:50
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Strange Project has appeared?

 

Thanks Mike thats really useful.

Ok I can see that there is a FIRR Database master file in the correct folder with the correct date and this is the one that the programme is now picking up ( its only 1KB?)
In the subfolder I have the rogue file - now being ignored but with a 22/03 date on it so presumably it was created sometime ago.

The rogue gedcom has todays date so im guessing that it is a result of my cackhanded messing today.

All is well now and I know which are the rogues and can be got rid off thanks to your advice but I will report to Calico Pie as you suggest.

regards
John Firr


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Thanks Mike thats really useful.

Ok I can see that there is a FIRR Database master file in the correct folder with the correct date and this is the one that the programme is now picking up ( its only 1KB?)
In the subfolder I have the rogue file - now being ignored but with a 22/03 date on it so presumably it was created sometime ago.

The rogue gedcom has todays date so im guessing that it is a result of my cackhanded messing today.

All is well now and I know which are the rogues and can be got rid off thanks to your advice but I will report to Calico Pie as you suggest.

regards
John Firr


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

Mike Tate
 

No,

In that …/Family Historian Projects/FIRR Database Master/FIRR Database Master.fh_data subfolder:

There was the rogue FIRR Database Master (1).ged Gedcom File

There is also a rogue FIRR Database Master.fh_proj Family Historian Project File

 

The FIRR Database Master.fh_proj Family Historian Project File must only exist in the parent folder …/Family Historian Projects/FIRR Database Master

 

So something has copied the FH Project File into the subfolder.

Also, something has duplicated the Gedcom File but is it a copy of the genuine Gedcom File?

 

What is the size of the rogue Gedcom File compared to the size of the genuine Gedcom File?

 

When similar symptoms have happened before the rogue file is sometimes virtually empty.

 

It may be worth reporting the symptoms to Calico Pie as they have arisen a few times.

 

Mike

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of johnfirr via groups.io
Sent: 08 May 2021 14:47
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Strange Project has appeared?

 

Hi Mike,
yes there was a stray gedcom in there which I have moved out and all seems well now. Dont know quite how it got there to be honest.
It all seems well but I just wanted to doublecheck.
I opened the correct project, checked it out and added a test person and saved.
now if I open the folder:
Family Historian projects/ FIRR Database Master/ FIRR Database Master,fh_data
there are a number of folders and then two files:
FIRR Database Master 22/03/2021 09.15 Family Historian project File 1KB
FIRR Database Master 08/05/2021 14:04 Gedcom File  1579 KB

Does this look like the correct structure?

thanks
John


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Hi Mike,
yes there was a stray gedcom in there which I have moved out and all seems well now. Dont know quite how it got there to be honest.
It all seems well but I just wanted to doublecheck.
I opened the correct project, checked it out and added a test person and saved.
now if I open the folder:
Family Historian projects/ FIRR Database Master/ FIRR Database Master,fh_data
there are a number of folders and then two files:
FIRR Database Master 22/03/2021 09.15 Family Historian project File 1KB
FIRR Database Master 08/05/2021 14:04 Gedcom File  1579 KB

Does this look like the correct structure?

thanks
John


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Hi Mike,
apologies just saw your reply. I will follow your instructions and see where it gets me,
thanks
John


Re: Strange Project has appeared?

johnfirr@...
 

Hi Helena,
looks like you are right.it seems to have picked up a standalone GEDCOM that I created in March of this year. I dont understand why it should randomly appear in my FH startup project listing some two months later, I use FH pretty much every day and its never appeared before. I also dont understand why it got a 1971 date on. But at least I now know what it is and how to get rid of it!
Thanks
John

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