Date   

Re: Import - multiple copes of media?

Mike Tate
 

Welcome Sally,

You have done nothing wrong except expose an annoying feature of FH that has been reported to Calico Pie but so far ignored.

I believe RootsMagic uses local Media attached to each Citation which FH converts to Media records on import.

However, FH does not recognise duplicates and creates a separate Media record and file for each copy.

You would have to manually merge the copies or somebody needs to write a Plugin to automate that process.

I suggest you complain to Calico Pie via their Support Centre ticket system and let us know what they say.

http://www.calico-pie.com/osticket/open.php

 

Mike Tate

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of Sally Lloyd
Sent: 06 March 2021 09:14
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: [family-historian] Import - multiple copes of media?

 

I'm a new FH user.  A couple of weeks ago I imported a GEDCOM from RootsMagic. Looking at Media in FH I see I have multiple copies of some Media files, one for each associated citation. In RM I have 3,000+ files linked to this tree, in FH I have 15,000+. 

I must have done something wrong during in the import process, but what?
Many thanks, Sally


Re: Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

Mike Tate
 

Dave, If you are interested in writing a Plugin to report such conflicts then I an happy to give some tips & guidance.

I suggest it is called ‘Find Duplicate Place Names’ to tie in with all the other ‘Find Duplicate…’ Plugins.

 

Mike Tate

 


Re: Gedcom help

Mike Tate
 

Helena,

The FH PDF Report problems in FH V7 are well known and the subject of much discussion in the FHUG Forums.

https://www.fhug.org.uk/forum/

“V7 PDF creation very slow, creating huge files”

“No searchable text in PDF reports”

 

I have installed the TV Trial version which has all the features of the Premium & Basic editions for 30 days.

Its user interface is quite neat but there are many GEDCOM compatibility issues that I will be reporting.

 

Give them a chance to fix the missing ‘Details’ problem before spending a lot of time re-entering the data.

The ‘Details’ are omitted from every Fact and not just Occupation which is a major oversight.

 

Mike


Re: Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

Paul Sillitoe
 

I've been following these data standards queries with great interest since joining the list a few months ago. They are the sort of data management issues that I have been working with as an archivist over the last three decades. My approach has distilled down to a couple of over-riding principles.

1. Where a national or international data standard already exists, go with it. If it doesn't exactly meet your particular needs, work with others to change the standard, not make individual local changes on the fly. To do so reduces general interoperability and creates data migration problems, such have been noted on this list.
Of course, nothing mandates anyone to do anything other than what they wish to do; its just that an individualised approach can result in the sorts of issues lately raised.

2. Manage data to the lowest level of granularity. Again, this facilitates easier data management and migration. For example, in this context, splitting down place names into individual units of administration, with qualifiers. I'm not familiar with the standard that cites "Salford,  Lancashire [Id 403] would tidy to Salford, Lancashire [Id 167]", but have, for example, recently had to deal with instances of "Salford, Lancashire" and "Salford, Manchester" in the same set of records. Generally, I qualify a local administrative unit place name with the dates of existence of that unit.

So much that can be said on this fascinating topic. Its not that it gets in the way of the actual research, but rather, minimises individual issues at the data entry stage, which might otherwise aggregate into macro problems across a large dataset.

Best regards 

Paul Sillitoe


Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone but not so smart as to usefully auto-correct the typos from my large fingers 🙂


-------- Original message --------
From: Andrew Braid <Jamesandrewbraid@...>
Date: 06/03/2021 09:14 (GMT+00:00)
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

Mike

Have you tried clicking the Reverse Display Order box in the bottom right hand corner of the Place List window? It might help you the easily merge some of the entries.

Andrew

On 05/03/2021 23:02, dave@... wrote:
Mike,

What I am trying to achieve is to identify where tidying a place name would bring it into conflict with an existing record.
e.g. Salford,  Lancashire [Id 403] would tidy to Salford, Lancashire [Id 167]

The owner of the file often makes little errors like this and I am looking for a way to find them easily.

The gedcom currently has in excess of 13,000 place entries (unfortunately they use Place as a combination of Address and Place).

However what you have said has given me some pointers and so I'll have a go.

Many thanks

Dave


Import - multiple copes of media?

Sally Lloyd
 

I'm a new FH user.  A couple of weeks ago I imported a GEDCOM from RootsMagic. Looking at Media in FH I see I have multiple copies of some Media files, one for each associated citation. In RM I have 3,000+ files linked to this tree, in FH I have 15,000+. 

I must have done something wrong during in the import process, but what?
Many thanks, Sally


Re: Gedcom help

Helena Coney
 

Thank you for your help Mike, I am now staying with FH, I like the Outline Descendant’s report, is a UK programme and does what I require and now I am a registered One name study it will help with that.  I have transferred the RM version to FH no problem as the occupation and census remain.  I have created an outline report in TV (1000 pages) and the same in FH (975 pages) in PDF and will go through and compare.  Although I have saved the report to PDF and it opens, there is no text but there are 975 pages there! Manged to work as a RTF.  From memory most of the changes I did were fairly recent but I can check.  A long job but this way I won’t lose any data.

 

Tree View do have a free trial but a lot of features were locked which was my mistake

 

Thank you once again and I will be sticking with FH!

 

 

Helena

 

The bladon family history study

Registered with the Guild of One-Name Studies

https://bladonfamilyhistory.wordpress.com
 

 

 

From: Mike Tate
Sent: 05 March 2021 17:02
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Gedcom help

 

Helena,

I recommend you spend some time checking as much as possible of what TV does not export.

Report everything you find to S&N and hopefully they will fix them.

Otherwise, you are going to have a great deal of work to re-enter all the missing information.

In future try and choose products that have a better track record and remember to check their import and export capabilities.

You always need to make sure you have an exit strategy.

 

I think TV has a free trial that I might find time to investigate to see if there are any workarounds.

 

I don’t think it matters much which order you perform the merge.

But check the advice in FHUG Knowledge Base ‘Merge/Compare File’ advice:

https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/merge-compare-file/

 

Mike

 

 


Re: Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

Andrew Braid
 

Mike

Have you tried clicking the Reverse Display Order box in the bottom right hand corner of the Place List window? It might help you the easily merge some of the entries.

Andrew

On 05/03/2021 23:02, dave@... wrote:
Mike,

What I am trying to achieve is to identify where tidying a place name would bring it into conflict with an existing record.
e.g. Salford,  Lancashire [Id 403] would tidy to Salford, Lancashire [Id 167]

The owner of the file often makes little errors like this and I am looking for a way to find them easily.

The gedcom currently has in excess of 13,000 place entries (unfortunately they use Place as a combination of Address and Place).

However what you have said has given me some pointers and so I'll have a go.

Many thanks

Dave


Re: Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

dave@...
 

Mike,

What I am trying to achieve is to identify where tidying a place name would bring it into conflict with an existing record.
e.g. Salford,  Lancashire [Id 403] would tidy to Salford, Lancashire [Id 167]

The owner of the file often makes little errors like this and I am looking for a way to find them easily.

The gedcom currently has in excess of 13,000 place entries (unfortunately they use Place as a combination of Address and Place).

However what you have said has given me some pointers and so I'll have a go.

Many thanks

Dave


Re: Place Names Changing Over Time

David Wilkinson
 


My policy is to record the address and place as it was at the time of the fact. A good example is London. Up to 31st March 1889 London was just the "square mile" and many places were in their respective counties of Middlesex, Kent, Surrey etc. The County of London was formed of 1st April 1889 and continued until 31st March 1965 when Greater London was created.

I include in the place record notes field the dates that place was valid for and why it changed. As others have said, what ever you do be consistent.

David Wilkinson

On 04/03/2021 23:49, rcook@... wrote:

In many cases, place names in source documents change over time. In many cases, I have started out with one place name, only to change at a later time.

Example: Scott Twp., Ontario Co., Ontario, Canada is now Durham Region, Ontario, Canada as of January 1, 1974.

 

As well, many of the townships have been changed, amalgamated or dropped.

 

I have reviewed the guidance in  https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/working-with-places-and-addresses-for-new-users/  But geocoding may be problematic.

 

What do other FH7 users do to accommodate changing place names?

 

Thanks

Rob


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Gedcom help

Mike Tate
 

Mike,

You are correct that many (most) products do not implement GEDCOM well.

That is further confused by the two standards GEDCOM 5.5 and GEDCOM 5.5.1 that differ somewhat.

Add to that the custom features that each product uses and it gets very complex.

 

Many products convert local Notes to shared Note records and sometimes add a blank first line.

That is why the FH Plugin ‘Clean Up Notes’ is so popular and recommended after importing a GEDCOM.

 

Mike Tate


Re: Gedcom help

Mike Tate
 

Helena,

I recommend you spend some time checking as much as possible of what TV does not export.

Report everything you find to S&N and hopefully they will fix them.

Otherwise, you are going to have a great deal of work to re-enter all the missing information.

In future try and choose products that have a better track record and remember to check their import and export capabilities.

You always need to make sure you have an exit strategy.

 

I think TV has a free trial that I might find time to investigate to see if there are any workarounds.

 

I don’t think it matters much which order you perform the merge.

But check the advice in FHUG Knowledge Base ‘Merge/Compare File’ advice:

https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/merge-compare-file/

 

Mike

 


Re: Gedcom help

Mike C
 

TreeView is not alone in incorrectly implementing the GEDCOM standard. Reunion behaves similarly to TV in the subject under discussion.

Someone using Reunion v12.0 proof-read one of my FH gedcom files, and re-exported it to gedcom.
The original FH gedcom contained the likes of :
  0 @I1@ INDI
  1 NAME Richard /Arnold/
  ...
  1 NOTE Haberdasher on Ludgate Hill.

but the Reunion export appeared as :
  0 @I1@ INDI
  1 NAME Richard /Arnold/
  ...
  1 NOTE @N1@
  ...
  ...
  0 @N1@ NOTE
  1 CONT Haberdasher on Ludgate Hill.

So, Reunion has incorrectly converted a single-line Note into a multi-line Note, with the first line as <Blank>. Similar behaviour to TV.
Reunion has also converted the Note from being localised to Richard into a general Note linked to Richard. This has somewhat changed the meaning of Note.
When loaded back into FH, the Reunion gedcom now shows the Note on the Records>Notes tab and not in the Propertybox tab Main.Note for Richard.
This was a simple gedcom, only having Notes, but no other facts like OCCU, so I cannot comment on Reunion in respect of those.

Following this discovery, my son tested the freeware Gramps, and found that Gramps does likewise, converting local notes into general notes.
However, Gramps does export  the Note correctly as :
  0 @N0001@ NOTE Haberdasher on Ludgate Hill.

MikeC


Re: Gedcom help

Helena Coney
 

Hello Mike

 

I have spent the last two days inputting the occupations manually in the new FH files but still have the main file of over 17000 names to do!  I am still waiting a reply from S&N.  The only other missing information is relating to the census – the date and address are there but not the age or description/occupation – this is in FH.

 

I received Tree View for Christmas and transferred all my files from Roots magic, hence me still having a back up of the Roots magic files.  However I have made various updates since then (no record kept) so would prefer to use the TV Gedcom and merge it in either FH with the RM Gedcom or in RM and then transfer to FH!

 

Which is the best way to merge in FH?  The TV into the RM or RM into TV?

 

 

Helena

 

The bladon family history study

Registered with the Guild of One-Name Studies

https://bladonfamilyhistory.wordpress.com
 

 

 

From: Mike Tate
Sent: 05 March 2021 10:50
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Gedcom help

 

Hi Helena,

There is a little confusion between the Occupation Fact and the Occupation Details but I understand now what you mean by empty.

 

TreeView is exporting the 1 OCCUpation fact but leaving out the ‘Details’ that should be on the same line. i.e. It is empty.

e.g. It should be like:

1 OCCU Doctor

 

Are there any other facts like that with ‘Details’ that are being omitted from the GEDCOM and need reporting to S&N?

Does it make any difference if such facts also have a value for Date, Place, Notes, etc?

 

FYI: In FH the Occupation shown on the Main tab is derived from the 1st Occupation fact listed on the Facts tab.

They are both the same entity. Most information on the Main tab is just a filtered view of details shown elsewhere.

 

I’m getting a bit confused about what data you have in TreeView, RootsMagic and FH.

Are you saying that RootsMagic does have the Occupation facts with their ‘Details’ included?

Does the merged RM & TV data in the FH Facts tab have both RM Occupations with ‘Details’ and similar TV Occupations but without ‘Details’?

If so, then it would be easy to delete all the TV Occupation facts without ‘Details’ in FH.

e.g. You could manually delete the empty Occupation for Thomas Bladon and then the RM Occupation Details will appear on the Main tab.

Does that sound like a solution? If so, then I can explain how to bulk delete all those empty Occupation facts.

The only caveat is that any Occupation ‘Details’ added in TV since December will get deleted and need adding manually.

 

The alternative is to wait and see if S&N can fix the GEDCOM export fault.

 

Mike

 

 


Re: Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

Mike Tate
 

Dave,

I’m not sure what you mean by “identifies similar places”.

Are you thinking of the Conflicting Place Record Names warning with ‘Result Set’ and ‘Acknowledge’ options?

If you choose the ‘Result Set’ option then it does list them.

 

The plugin removes blank comma-separated Place parts and ensures every comma is followed by a space.

That is essentially the same Place name tidying that FH performs in Diagrams and Reports.

If the Plugin exported GEDCOM includes Place records, and the tidied Place names of two records are the same, then it raises the warning.

 

So is it only a list of such conflicting Place record names that you are proposing would be useful?

Why not use the Result Set produced by the Export Gedcom File plugin?

I suspect a review of Tools > Work with Data > Places or the Records Window Places tab would soon spot such conflicts.

 

As a challenge, why not write the Plugin yourself?

 

Mike

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of dave@...
Sent: 04 March 2021 23:41
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: [family-historian] Export Gedcom File - Place Tidy

 

Mike

There is a routine in the plugin that identifies similar places and tidies them as part of the export.

Would it be possible to extract that routine to identify such places, but not correct them?

I feel that that would be a useful plugin in its own right.

Many thanks

Dave
FH v7


Re: Place Names Changing Over Time

Victor Markham
 

Whatever place name you use it needs to be consistent. If these have changed over time I would add a note about the change but keep the original name.

In Yorkshire one could put a place name say Scalby, Yorkshire, England. Problem her is there are 2 places in Yorkshire called Scalby. So it could be either Scalby, North Yorkshire or Scalby, East Yorkshire.

I would prefer to use township rather than twp. When it comes to places in Durham I alwaysa use County Durham as that is the full title for the county.

Whatever one does it is their choice but just make it consistent that is when the same place name is used use the same description.

I am not bothered about long/lat element

Victor

On 05/03/2021 10:57 am, Adrian Bruce wrote:
Just to be both pedantic and clear, if you have events at both Scott twp and Durham reg and you want to use the place name contemporary with the event (usually considered best practice), then you record events over time using both names. This will give you two place records (correctly). The place record for Scott twp then needs to have its Standardised name set to (the current value of) Durham reg. 


Re: Place Names Changing Over Time

Adrian Bruce
 

Just to be both pedantic and clear, if you have events at both Scott twp and Durham reg and you want to use the place name contemporary with the event (usually considered best practice), then you record events over time using both names. This will give you two place records (correctly). The place record for Scott twp then needs to have its Standardised name set to (the current value of) Durham reg. 


Re: Gedcom help

Mike Tate
 

Hi Helena,

There is a little confusion between the Occupation Fact and the Occupation Details but I understand now what you mean by empty.

 

TreeView is exporting the 1 OCCUpation fact but leaving out the ‘Details’ that should be on the same line. i.e. It is empty.

e.g. It should be like:

1 OCCU Doctor

 

Are there any other facts like that with ‘Details’ that are being omitted from the GEDCOM and need reporting to S&N?

Does it make any difference if such facts also have a value for Date, Place, Notes, etc?

 

FYI: In FH the Occupation shown on the Main tab is derived from the 1st Occupation fact listed on the Facts tab.

They are both the same entity. Most information on the Main tab is just a filtered view of details shown elsewhere.

 

I’m getting a bit confused about what data you have in TreeView, RootsMagic and FH.

Are you saying that RootsMagic does have the Occupation facts with their ‘Details’ included?

Does the merged RM & TV data in the FH Facts tab have both RM Occupations with ‘Details’ and similar TV Occupations but without ‘Details’?

If so, then it would be easy to delete all the TV Occupation facts without ‘Details’ in FH.

e.g. You could manually delete the empty Occupation for Thomas Bladon and then the RM Occupation Details will appear on the Main tab.

Does that sound like a solution? If so, then I can explain how to bulk delete all those empty Occupation facts.

The only caveat is that any Occupation ‘Details’ added in TV since December will get deleted and need adding manually.

 

The alternative is to wait and see if S&N can fix the GEDCOM export fault.

 

Mike

 


Re: Place Names Changing Over Time

colevalleygirl@colevalleygirl.co.uk
 

Every place has a Standardized field. From the Help file:

 

“Auto-geocoding (see the Map Window to learn more about geocoding) is normally based on the Place field (see previous).  However, if the Standardized field is not blank, geocoding will be based on it instead.  Some historical names may not be recognised, or may be incorrectly geocoded.  In this situation, you can either simply specify the correct latitude and longitude yourself; or you can supply a modern, standardized name which will be correctly geocoded.”

 

From: family-historian@groups.io <family-historian@groups.io> On Behalf Of rcook@...
Sent: 04 March 2021 23:50
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: [family-historian] Place Names Changing Over Time

 

In many cases, place names in source documents change over time. In many cases, I have started out with one place name, only to change at a later time.

Example: Scott Twp., Ontario Co., Ontario, Canada is now Durham Region, Ontario, Canada as of January 1, 1974.

 

As well, many of the townships have been changed, amalgamated or dropped.

 

I have reviewed the guidance in  https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/working-with-places-and-addresses-for-new-users/  But geocoding may be problematic.

 

What do other FH7 users do to accommodate changing place names?

 

Thanks

Rob


Place Names Changing Over Time

rob.cook-genes@...
 

In many cases, place names in source documents change over time. In many cases, I have started out with one place name, only to change at a later time.

Example: Scott Twp., Ontario Co., Ontario, Canada is now Durham Region, Ontario, Canada as of January 1, 1974.

 

As well, many of the townships have been changed, amalgamated or dropped.

 

I have reviewed the guidance in  https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/working-with-places-and-addresses-for-new-users/  But geocoding may be problematic.

 

What do other FH7 users do to accommodate changing place names?

 

Thanks

Rob


Re: Gedcom help

Helena Coney
 

Hi Mike

 

I did Email S&N yesterday so still waiting their reply.  I have checked the reports and nothing is shown. This is the Gedcom for Thomas Bladon

 

2 FORM LINEAGE-LINKED

1 CHAR ANSI

0 @I1@ INDI

1 NAME Thomas /Bladon/

2 GIVN Thomas

2 SURN Bladon

1 SEX M

1 BIRT

2 DATE 1577

2 PLAC Findern, Derbyshire

1 BAPM

2 DATE 29 Apr 1577

2 PLAC Findern, Derbyshire

1 DEAT

2 DATE ABT 1655

2 PLAC Potter Somersal, Derbyshire

1 OCCU

2 DATE

2 PLAC

1 NOTE @N1@

1 FAMS @F1@

1 FAMC @F2@

2 PEDI birth

0 @I2@ INDI

 

This is where it gets complicated!  I do have a back up of the 30 odd Bladon trees I wish to transfer from tree View to FH which are in Roots magic dated 27 Dec 2020.  However since then I have made some changes to each of them (in tree View) as  I started my Bladon one name study and made a lot of updates.

 

I did transfer the up to date file from TV to FH then merged it in FH with the Roots magic Gedcom file hoping the occupation field would remain.  I had a sort of success.  The occupation was listed in the facts tab in the property box (along with another Occupation fact remaining blank), however the occupation entry remains blank under the main tab in the property box which I then have to manually enter.

 

Any other suggestions?  Is there a plug in I can use?  The best way seems to be via the slightly out of date roots magic file and merging

 

Helena

 

The bladon family history study

Registered with the Guild of One-Name Studies

https://bladonfamilyhistory.wordpress.com
 

 

 

From: Mike Tate
Sent: 04 March 2021 10:42
To: family-historian@groups.io
Subject: Re: [family-historian] Gedcom help

 

Hi Helena,

That confirms what I thought, that TreeView is not exporting standard OCCUpation facts in the GEDCOM.

So you could try reporting that problem to their support team.

 

Use WordPad to inspect the GEDCOM again and find the entry for 1 NAME Thomas /Bladon/

After that, there should be entries for 1 SEX M, 1 BIRT, 1 BAPM, and 1 DEAT with 2 DATE and 2 PLAC fields.

Is there anything else near there that could represent his Occupation fact?

 

After importing the GEDCOM into an FH Project…

Are there any clues in the FH Windows > Log Files > Exception Report?

Are there any Unrecognised Data Fields (UDF) listed by the Tools > Uncategorised Data command?

 

Mike Tate

 

 

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