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Flying


Sarah Abbott
 

Friends

As I mentioned, we flew to Adelaide at the weekend to visit Jonothan's family. His brother has had health issues and it was his niece's 50th birthday. Everyone appreciate our visit a lot.

My nephew Tom has some interest in Buddhism (and used to write on DSG a little), wrote:

"Sarah I'm sure you would know this would wind me up. Of course the cause is good but you've got to stop flying. I don't understand how knowingly destroying the planet is compatible with buddhism."

It would be helpful if  some of you write a reply here to him (avoiding Pāli terms). 

I wrote that life comes down to this very moment of thinking.
 
Whilst one is getting wound up by this or that issue, getting more and more disturbed, one is not seeing that the real problem is the unwholesome states of mind at the present moment. We think about letting go of material baggage, but the real baggage in life is the present clinging, aversion when we don't get what we cling to and ignorance about life now.
 
Life exists in a moment and it's the intention now that's important. If there is the intention to help others, if there is kindness, if there is understanding now, there is no disturbance at all. However much one justifies one's annoyances, one is not seeing the real root of one's problems in life if there is no understanding of the truth at this moment.
 
Each moment of seeing, hearing or thinking arises by conditions. Understanding this, there is more tolerance, more kindness and more consideration for others. 
 
This is the Buddha's teaching. 

Sarah


tadao
 

Well said, Sarah. tadao


Azita Gill
 

Hallo Sarah and Tom,

Tom:   "Sarah I'm sure you would know this would wind me up. Of course the cause is good but you've got to stop flying. I don't understand how knowingly destroying the planet is compatible with buddhism."

Reading thro the posts yesterday and this one got me!   I have a great interest in the environment and occasionally despair at the way we humans behave in relation to our environment.......However,  the more I listen to Dhamma and begin to understand little by little that 'I' can do nothing to save the planet or anything else because there is no 'I' in reality to do anything.

This does not mean that my behaviour becomes careless towards caring for the planet or the beings that inhabit it.  I like the Vinaya ruling re the rainy season where the Buddha requested monks stay in one area during this time rather than wandering the countryside.  The reason (as I understand) was to prevent damage to crops and ire from farmers.

I believe the more understanding of the Dhamma, of the realities that arise and fall away now, the possibility of more caring and compassion for our fellow beings - both human and animal (including cockroaches! )
Knowing that we cannot force others to think/ behave like us, because all realities are conditioned and well beyond anyone's control.
This moment arises because the last one fell away and will never arise again;  and how quickly this happens is almost beyond imagination. 

Here's a quote from Jon that I found on one of my 'bits of paper' :

"we spend a lot of time wondering about what we should be doing, or thinking about what we would like to do, or worrying about what we are not doing, and we have no understanding of what is actually happening at the present moment.....seeing, hearing, tasting, smelling, touching and a lot of mind-door activity.   The decisions we make are just another moment of thinking, conditioned by our accumulations to do many other things."

Live for understanding the Truth
Azita


szmicio
 

Hi Sarah (and Jon, Tom)

Sarah: As I mentioned, we flew to Adelaide at the weekend to visit Jonothan's family. His brother has had health issues and it was his niece's 50th birthday. Everyone appreciate our visit a lot.

Lukas: Nice you both come to visit your's family. Sorry to hear that Jon's brother has a health issues. Hope it's not too serious. Does Jon's brother ever come across the Dhamma or Buddhism? Hope all will be well to your common family, guys. I wish all good to Jon's brother and hopefully his quick recovery. metta

Sarah: My nephew Tom has some interest in Buddhism (and used to write on DSG a little), wrote:

"Sarah I'm sure you would know this would wind me up. Of course the cause is good but you've got to stop flying. I don't understand how knowingly destroying the planet is compatible with buddhism."

Lukas: So to Jon Nephew(Tom?):

<Lukas: (Flying) It's not really a big problem if you ever have heard about Theravada Buddhism(or The Buddha Teachings)? Or if not you can check it on your own, we follow Buddha, and Buddha had never had any issue with flying. I hope you could check it on your own, and know for yourself. Buddha said in Kalama Sutta: Never do or believe something that is said by your teacher, or your authority or priest or by anyone else (than you). Just always check everything. Don't believe because something sounds or seems familiar or reasonable And always check and do what is good, and good always brings benefit to you, and others. So this is a teaching of the BUddhas, always to check it with and on your own, not follow any believes or speculations or what seems true for a first glance.>
Wish you well. And the reference is Kalama Sutta. All imagination, because Buddha never ever has taught about not flying, not eating meat, or I don't know don't cut trees or don't burn forests. It's all big misunderstanding, what people think and said, has nothing to do what Buddha said or taught.

Best wishes and no probs,
Lukas


Vincent Chen
 

Hi Sarah, Tom


Tom:   "Sarah I'm sure you would know this would wind me up. Of course the cause is good but you've got to stop flying. I don't understand how knowingly destroying the planet is compatible with buddhism."

This may be similar to the case of eating the meat. In MN 55, "In three cases, Jivaka, I say that meat may be eaten: when it has not been seen, heard, or suspected (that the animal was killed for oneself)."  Here we see that the intention counts. 

It is absolutely admiring to cultivate an agreeable environments for the welfare of the beings. Yet, for any individual being to have pleasant or unpleasant moments of experiences, it all comes down to the result of past deeds and thinking (pure or evil). I guess what we can do is at least having no deliberate intention to harm the planet. 

There can be moments of caring about the planet and other moments not happy about the situation. But, it is the anger that gradually destroy the planet inside, the one that each individual actually live with, the one that really matter, which we usually have difficult time to take care, if without the understanding and confidence of the words of the Buddha !  

Best
Vincent 
 
 


szmicio
 

Vincent

Vincent: This may be similar to the case of eating the meat. In MN 55, "In three cases, Jivaka, I say that meat may be eaten: when it has not been seen, heard, or suspected (that the animal was killed for oneself)."  Here we see that the intention counts.

L: Here you really take out of context what Buddha really said, and I think you misinterpret what Buddha said to Jivaka Komaarabhacca.

You see even in times of Buddha there were different sectarians, that today can be called vegetarians(not all of the vegetarians of course-there are wise vegetarians also but a few). The point with Vegetarians is that they are mostly sectarian, so that means they believe wrongly with the wrong view. NOt sure if you agree with me. But let me ponder further.

You see in the Sutta MN.55 that is Okay to eat meat, only the case when you make an intentional killing request the animal to be killed for you to eat it. (This is not ordering a pig/pork from slaughter house to have food for your family, but only the case when you order to kill it for your need, as I reckon)It has nothing to do of not eating meat because people think now in capitalism when you go shopping and buy meat for you and kids then you intend to kill or whatever and this is madness.(it's not true) You can goo to shop and buy a meat to eat. And all according to buddha teachings. And Really This is not true like people say that I make a demand for a supply of meat and maybe some cow is killed for you. Nothing like that. Buddha in that sutta only points a direct intentional killing of an animal to satisfy your needs for nutrition. Nowadays if you go to the shop and buy pork chops or some other part of an animal, is all good. It's nothing about the intention to kill. Just only my ops.

Thanks
Lukas

P.s
Personally I think there is a lot of misunderstanding in today's Buddhism, and also some prominent monks deepen that issues. Me e.g I am an eating meat issue free


tadao
 

On Tue, Oct 13, 2020 at 03:03 PM, Azita Gill wrote:
I believe the more understanding of the Dhamma, of the realities that arise and fall away now, the possibility of more caring and compassion for our fellow beings - both human and animal (including cockroaches! )
Well said, Azita; Anumodana. tadao


Vincent Chen
 

Hi Lukas,


L: You see in the Sutta MN.55 that is Okay to eat meat, only the case....  Nowadays if you go to the shop and buy pork chops or some other part of an animal, is all good. 
-------------
Lukas, I did not see any disagreement with you (or I did not get your points?). I had a colleague, when he heard the squeaking of a pig from a slaughterhouse at age 12, he could not take the meat anymore. He ate a lot of fries instead.  


L: Personally I think there is a lot of misunderstanding in today's Buddhism, and also some prominent monks deepen that issues. Me e.g I am an eating meat issue free
-------
Same here in Taiwan. I enjoy meat, have to have it. But who knows, it might just change suddenly, like the coming of death.

Best
Vincent  


 


Vincent Chen
 

Hi Lukas,


V:  Lukas, I did not see any disagreement with you (or I did not get your points?). 
-----
This morning the thought about this topic occurred and I guess I get what your were saying. When I said intention counts, I did not mean only the intention to kill directly, but also the indirect harming, still want to enjoy the meat even when the killing is seen, heard or suspected. This is evil intention because the enjoyment, or even for the cure of the disease of hunger, is based on the cost of other being's life. So I was saying it is Ok to eat meat if there is no intention to kill or harm based on the Teaching. I hope I replied to your point?

Best
Vincent