Topics

Inability to record any messages at all with YaDD

vlfman
 

Hello everyone,

I finally have everything setup for my first attempt at recording live DSC.
Equipment here is: Icom IC-7200 transceiver,  YaDD program,  SignalLink USB radio/computer interface 
 
After waiting a considerable amount of time for some decent DSC signals, strong signals eventually came in on 8414.5  Everything appeared to be in order and YaDD seems to be working as it should.  However, I have not been able to get a single recorded message to show up on the Spectrum/Msgs screen.  Nothing.
 
Audio input is set to:  Line (USB AUDIO CODEC)
Auto tuning is ON
RX Frequency is:  8414.5
Signal polarity:  Normal (USB)
Input level: Varies between 30 and 80
SNR:  Varies between 1 and 70
CPU: About 20%
 
Signal Spectrum shows a good signal  (Upper most area on Spectrum/Msgs screen).  And I ran a Signal calibration.
 
Does anyone have any ideas on why no messages are showing up at all?  Thank you.
 
- Pete
 

Rosario
 

On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 05:06 PM, vlfman wrote:
I finally have everything setup for my first attempt at recording live DSC.
Equipment here is: Icom IC-7200 transceiver,  YaDD program,  SignalLink USB radio/computer interface 
Hello pete,

for USB reception it is necessary to tune the receiver to 8,412.8 or 1.7  hz  less than the nominal frequency.

Others from the most qualified group will be able to explain you better.

Regards

Rosario

vlfman
 

I will do that.  Thank you Rosario!
 
- Pete
 

From: ros.palermo via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 11:38 AM
To: dsc-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [dsc-list] Inability to record any messages at all with YaDD
 
On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 05:06 PM, vlfman wrote:
I finally have everything setup for my first attempt at recording live DSC.
Equipment here is: Icom IC-7200 transceiver,  YaDD program,  SignalLink USB radio/computer interface
Hello pete,

for USB reception it is necessary to tune the receiver to 8,412.8 or 1.7  hz  less than the nominal frequency.

Others from the most qualified group will be able to explain you better.

Regards

Rosario

John Pumford-Green
 

Pete,

From your description I believe you are not using the IC-7200's own internal USB Codec, but have an audio feed from the IC-7200 to the SignalLinkUSB and then the Signallink is connected to the PC by USB?

What mode is the IC-7200 in? If you set YaDD for "Normal Polarity" then the radio should be in USB mode and tuned "1.7kHz low".

You say you've done a Signal Calibration. How did you do it?

The best way is to tune to a strong stable NAVTEX transmission on 518kHz, as they last for several minutes and are more likely to give a better result. This is fine, because NAVTEX and DSC use the same over-the-air FSK protocol - 100baud/170Hz shift.

Trying to find the optimum sample-rate correction on a short DSC transmission is always tricky. If in doubt set the correction to 1.0 and save this, rather than risk using a wildly inaccurate one set during an attempt at calibration. In my experience you'll always decode a good signal with the calibration at 1.0, tweaking it just improves things if the soundcard is very poor.

If you are using USB mode on the IC-7200 and receiving on 8414.5 you'll need to set the dial on the IC-7200 1.7kHz low, to 8412.8kHz (8.4128MHz). This will put the audio of received DSC signals at 1.7kHz.

When receiving a good signal you should see a pair of spikes on the spectrum either side of 1700Hz. The red cursor line should be on 1700 Hz and the two yellow cursors should sit where the spikes on the spectrum are. If not, click on 1700 with the mouse to move the cursor there.

When receiving a signal you should see numbers scrolling across the small window below the clock/signal meters and the "LED" flashing green to indicate correct decoding.

Attached is a screenshot of my copy of YaDD receiving a signal.

You might be better to turn off "Autotuning" too, to remove another variable. When set properly, with the red cursor on the centre of the incoming FSK signal, and the yellow lines on top of the two peaks in the spectrum things should just work....

Of course - if you want to use the IC-7200's variable DSP IF Filtering you might choose to use an offset of 1.5kHz, as that's the centre frequency of the DSP filters in the IC-7200 - in which case you need to tune 1.5kHz low of 8414.5kHz - i.e. 8413.0kHz, and then you need to click on the YaDD spectrum to set the decoder/cursor to 1500Hz.

If all the above is already done, and you're still not decoding anything there may be something else amiss outside of YaDD - perhaps clipping in the SignallinkUSB from overdriving - but I've never had that happen before.

I also have an IC-7200, but would generally use its internal USB soundcard, and save my SignallinkUSB for radios that don't....

Let us know how you get on. Some screenshots perhaps of the various settings you have might help us diagnose a problem?

Good luck.

YaDD has always "just worked" for me.

Oh - jusgt remembered something else ---->>

I assume you've installed it AWAY FROM THE WINDOWS "PROGRAM FILES" folder?

I always make a new directory such as:

C:\YaDD

and install YaDD there.

I'm still on WindowsXP on the laptop that runs YaDD, but I believe other people have had problems running YaDD on newer versions of Windows, it they install in the Program Files directory due to YaDD trying to write data into it's own directory and not having sufficient permission unless running as Adminstrator.

Installing in another place solves this....


Cheers,

John
GM4SLV



When receiving a signal

On 10/12/2019 16:06, vlfman wrote:
Hello everyone,
I finally have everything setup for my first attempt at recording live DSC.
Equipment here is: Icom IC-7200 transceiver,  YaDD program,  SignalLink USB radio/computer interface
After waiting a considerable amount of time for some decent DSC signals, strong signals eventually came in on 8414.5  Everything appeared to be in order and YaDD seems to be working as it should.  However, I have not been able to get a single recorded message to show up on the Spectrum/Msgs screen.  Nothing.
Audio input is set to:  Line (USB AUDIO CODEC)
Auto tuning is ON
RX Frequency is:  8414.5
Signal polarity:  Normal (USB)
Input level: Varies between 30 and 80
SNR:  Varies between 1 and 70
CPU: About 20%
Signal Spectrum shows a good signal  (Upper most area on Spectrum/Msgs screen).  And I ran a Signal calibration.
Does anyone have any ideas on why no messages are showing up at all? Thank you.
- Pete

vlfman
 

Hello John,

Thank you for your very informative message.

You are correct. I have an audio feed from the accessory socket of the
IC-7200 to the Signalink, which in turn is connected to my PC.

Also, when I said that I did a calibration, I probably actually didn’t. I
did what I thought was a calibration but in fact it most likely wasn’t. I
will do it correctly according to your suggestion.

And yes, I did install it in C:\YaDD

In addition, I changed my receive frequencies to 1.7 kHz below the given
frequency.

A combination of the information you have provided and help that others
provided has finally resulted in success! Things are working much better
now and I am finally recording live DSC messages. Quite exciting. I
finally have something interesting to receive on HF! And I thank you and
the other members who have helped me get to this point very much for your
assistance.

73,

Pete, W3DKV

-----Original Message-----
From: John Pumford-Green
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 12:21 PM
To: dsc-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [dsc-list] Inability to record any messages at all with YaDD


Pete,

From your description I believe you are not using the IC-7200's own
internal USB Codec, but have an audio feed from the IC-7200 to the
SignalLinkUSB and then the Signallink is connected to the PC by USB?

What mode is the IC-7200 in? If you set YaDD for "Normal Polarity" then
the radio should be in USB mode and tuned "1.7kHz low".

You say you've done a Signal Calibration. How did you do it?

The best way is to tune to a strong stable NAVTEX transmission on
518kHz, as they last for several minutes and are more likely to give a
better result. This is fine, because NAVTEX and DSC use the same
over-the-air FSK protocol - 100baud/170Hz shift.

Trying to find the optimum sample-rate correction on a short DSC
transmission is always tricky. If in doubt set the correction to 1.0 and
save this, rather than risk using a wildly inaccurate one set during an
attempt at calibration. In my experience you'll always decode a good
signal with the calibration at 1.0, tweaking it just improves things if
the soundcard is very poor.

If you are using USB mode on the IC-7200 and receiving on 8414.5 you'll
need to set the dial on the IC-7200 1.7kHz low, to 8412.8kHz
(8.4128MHz). This will put the audio of received DSC signals at 1.7kHz.

When receiving a good signal you should see a pair of spikes on the
spectrum either side of 1700Hz. The red cursor line should be on 1700 Hz
and the two yellow cursors should sit where the spikes on the spectrum
are. If not, click on 1700 with the mouse to move the cursor there.

When receiving a signal you should see numbers scrolling across the
small window below the clock/signal meters and the "LED" flashing green
to indicate correct decoding.

Attached is a screenshot of my copy of YaDD receiving a signal.

You might be better to turn off "Autotuning" too, to remove another
variable. When set properly, with the red cursor on the centre of the
incoming FSK signal, and the yellow lines on top of the two peaks in the
spectrum things should just work....

Of course - if you want to use the IC-7200's variable DSP IF Filtering
you might choose to use an offset of 1.5kHz, as that's the centre
frequency of the DSP filters in the IC-7200 - in which case you need to
tune 1.5kHz low of 8414.5kHz - i.e. 8413.0kHz, and then you need to
click on the YaDD spectrum to set the decoder/cursor to 1500Hz.

If all the above is already done, and you're still not decoding anything
there may be something else amiss outside of YaDD - perhaps clipping in
the SignallinkUSB from overdriving - but I've never had that happen before.

I also have an IC-7200, but would generally use its internal USB
soundcard, and save my SignallinkUSB for radios that don't....

Let us know how you get on. Some screenshots perhaps of the various
settings you have might help us diagnose a problem?

Good luck.

YaDD has always "just worked" for me.

Oh - jusgt remembered something else ---->>

I assume you've installed it AWAY FROM THE WINDOWS "PROGRAM FILES" folder?

I always make a new directory such as:

C:\YaDD

and install YaDD there.

I'm still on WindowsXP on the laptop that runs YaDD, but I believe other
people have had problems running YaDD on newer versions of Windows, it
they install in the Program Files directory due to YaDD trying to write
data into it's own directory and not having sufficient permission unless
running as Adminstrator.

Installing in another place solves this....


Cheers,

John
GM4SLV



When receiving a signal
On 10/12/2019 16:06, vlfman wrote:
Hello everyone,

I finally have everything setup for my first attempt at recording live
DSC.
Equipment here is: Icom IC-7200 transceiver, YaDD program, SignalLink
USB radio/computer interface
After waiting a considerable amount of time for some decent DSC signals,
strong signals eventually came in on 8414.5 Everything appeared to be
in order and YaDD seems to be working as it should. However, I have not
been able to get a single recorded message to show up on the
Spectrum/Msgs screen. Nothing.
Audio input is set to: Line (USB AUDIO CODEC)
Auto tuning is ON
RX Frequency is: 8414.5
Signal polarity: Normal (USB)
Input level: Varies between 30 and 80
SNR: Varies between 1 and 70
CPU: About 20%
Signal Spectrum shows a good signal (Upper most area on Spectrum/Msgs
screen). And I ran a Signal calibration.
Does anyone have any ideas on why no messages are showing up at all?
Thank you.
- Pete

John Pumford-Green
 

On 10/12/2019 17:57, vlfman wrote:
Things are working much better
now and I am finally recording live DSC messages.  Quite exciting.  I
finally have something interesting to receive on HF!

Great news Pete. It'll be interesting to see what you're receiving... if you feel like contributing to the "YaDDNet" online database you can configure YaDD to upload each received DSC message to our website.

In the tab "Remote Log" enter for host : www.yaddnet.org and leave the port as 50666. Make up a suitable identifier (18 characters or fewer) for yourself in the box "RX ID" and tick the box "Enable Remote Logging".... you will have to confirm you are receiving on the frequency YaDD thinks you are... then all your data will be forwarded to the database.

Screenshot of my setup attached.


You can see what you, and others, are receiving in real time at:

http://www.yaddnet.org

If you want to dig deeper into DSC messages I have a rough draft of a guide at: http://www.yaddnet.org/pages/MF_and_HF_DSCguide.pdf

Best of luck with DSC monitoring.

Cheers,

John
GM4SLV

--
http://www.yaddnet.org/index.php

vlfman
 

OK, good. All helpful info once again. Thank you John.

73,
Pete, W3DKV

-----Original Message-----
From: John Pumford-Green
Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2019 2:56 AM
To: dsc-list@groups.io
Subject: Re: [dsc-list] Inability to record any messages at all with YaDD



On 10/12/2019 17:57, vlfman wrote:
Things are working much better
now and I am finally recording live DSC messages. Quite exciting. I
finally have something interesting to receive on HF!

Great news Pete. It'll be interesting to see what you're receiving... if
you feel like contributing to the "YaDDNet" online database you can
configure YaDD to upload each received DSC message to our website.

In the tab "Remote Log" enter for host : www.yaddnet.org and leave the
port as 50666. Make up a suitable identifier (18 characters or fewer)
for yourself in the box "RX ID" and tick the box "Enable Remote
Logging".... you will have to confirm you are receiving on the frequency
YaDD thinks you are... then all your data will be forwarded to the database.

Screenshot of my setup attached.


You can see what you, and others, are receiving in real time at:

http://www.yaddnet.org

If you want to dig deeper into DSC messages I have a rough draft of a
guide at: http://www.yaddnet.org/pages/MF_and_HF_DSCguide.pdf

Best of luck with DSC monitoring.

Cheers,

John
GM4SLV

--
http://www.yaddnet.org/index.php