Date   
Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
Look at the line which contains his e-mail address or should be. The
list server bot substitutes an = sign for an @ one. It does that to
protect our e-mail addresses. And in that case you will be able to
e-mail friend regarding his collection of WW sockets. I would of
course, but at the moment I do not need an amazing collection like
that. Sadly my CDP1802 based project idea decided to become a former
project. (It was not based on that fellow's idea to use an Arduino to
do the heavy lifting and the CDP1802 sat on it as part of a shield.)
Oddly enough it was based on that fellow's idea to use the S100 bus
for the CDP1802 and I could not find a source of prototype boards for
that size and a good backplane.

Actually Bill it now seems as if that terminal as a CDP1802 generic
system seems to be more and more interesting. I'll e-mail about that
one later on.

-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 8:56 PM the-eagle@... <The-Eagle@...> wrote:

Is this a private email server forum, OR a public open website forum? Just my two cent question.

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
Normally I'd snap up this offer. But I'd rather these sockets go to
someone who either has or will have an active ELF (Or CDP1802 based)
project taking shape.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 6:41 PM Hank Riley via Groups.Io
<n1ltv=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Mark,

If you look closely at the email sender you'll see Scott's email address in faint gray.

Change the = symbol to the @ symbol to get his real address. That = substitution is done by groups.io.

[Mark does receive email from this group.]

Hank
________________________________________________________________________


On Friday, October 18, 2019, 01:41:21 PM EDT, Mark Huffstutter <mhuffstutter@...> wrote:


Hi Scott,

I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Hank Riley
 

Mark,

If you look closely at the email sender you'll see Scott's email address in faint gray.

Change the = symbol to the @ symbol to get his real address.  That = substitution is done by groups.io.

[Mark does receive email from this group.]

Hank
________________________________________________________________________


On Friday, October 18, 2019, 01:41:21 PM EDT, Mark Huffstutter <mhuffstutter@...> wrote:


Hi Scott,

          I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Lee Hart
 

somaspack via Groups.Io wrote:
Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had
bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an Elf. I never
used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me
privately. Scott
Hi Scott,

I still build things with wire-wrap, so I'd be more than happy to take you up on your offer. The last thing I built was a vintage Elf for VCFMW <www.sunrise-ev.com/vcf-elf.htm> :-)

My address is in my signature lines below. I can Paypal you the funds for postage if you provide a Paypal address, or can mail them to you if you send me your mailing address.

--
There is a computer disease that anybody who works with computers knows
about. It's very serious, and interferes completely with your work. The
trouble with computers is that you 'play' with them! (Richard Feynman)
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Mark Huffstutter
 

Hi Scott,

I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had
bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an  Elf. I never
used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me
privately. Scott



FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

somaspack
 

Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an  Elf. I never used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me privately. Scott

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

RE: Eprom programmers. 

the problem is I have 4 of them, one lives on S100 bus and can do any 27xxx part
thats handy for a lot of parts even programming 8755 and 8748/9.
Another requires a PC with parallel port and old Winders (98 and maybe XP) ,
Fortunately I have a box for that.   A stand alone Kontron that can only do
2708 and 2716, and a Arduino USB serial gadget made for 27C256.

I have nothing that is for linux and USB save for the Arduino based quickie unit.

And I've generally move to 28xxx parts EEPROM and flash so one off
programmers are generally the rule now.  Arduino makes that fairly easy.

Allison

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

awasson2001
 

Holy smokes. Good work on getting the group moved early on Dave. I’m sure a lot of groups are just now busy jumping through hoops to manage that. I’m in several other Yahoo Groups that have not done so and as of yet, there is no discussion to do so. Kudos for taking the initiative to move us when you did. 

Cheers,
Andrew



On Oct 16, 2019, at 5:08 AM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

bill rowe
 

Wow! I guess they were so hurt when we moved that they just couldn’t keep going!

Seriously though, this will be a big deal - lots of groups still there.

On Oct 16, 2019, at 8:08 AM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

--
Bill Rowe
Olduino - an arduino for the first of us
https://olduino.wordpress.com/about-2/about/

Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

Dave Ruske
 

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

Jeff Truck
 

Allison,

Regarding your comment on loose wires with Frankie.   Yes - they pop up from time to time and I have to deal with that when it happens.  It helps to have super accurate mapping documents which I maintain on record just in case.   

The UART and Video boards utilize strip boards for which the wires and sockets are all soldered.  No loose wires in this case.   Since these functions came later in Frankie's life I have learned from the burn of using breadboards hence the usage of strip boards.  As additional circuits on the breadboard mature, they will be converted over to strip board as well.   I have two major projects planned for Frankie and they will also be strip board.

Thank you regarding your comments on the wire colors and work of art.   It does indeed look colorful.  I tried to keep colors grouped based on origination points.   The art effect just comes around naturally.   Jameco has certainly had a good year of sales when it comes to wire thanks to me.

Jeff


Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

somaspack
 

For me an EPROM programmer is a required tool. I highly recommend "mcumall dot com" and their 'true USB Willem' EPROM/EEPROM programmer for $95. I've had one of these for near a decade and it works great - programs dang near anything on the planet from 2716 up.

Scott

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

First that board bis both a horror and beautiful. ;)

The horror is that troublshooting a loose wire is likely unfun.
That and for many years it was told you must use short leads and watch 
for crosstalk...

But the color and diversity of wires is art.  Also a reflection of patience.

Plan A, use Arduino:
My approach to buttons and switches is elsewhere but one adopted is 
using a common Arduino Nano as a loader host.  While I may tire and 
grump about finger pain of pushing buttons the Arduino will do it for me
willingly.  Since there is enough flash in the Arduino I can have it load 
the serial binload, tbx, or whatever.

Why do that?  More people can program (as in insert code into the flash)
an Arduino with ease (free software and the nano or uno has programming
port).  WHere programming a 2716 (if you have them) or any other part
(2732,2764, and EEprom parts) requires a more specific programmer
or homebrew hardware.  Where a low cost nano has it and all you need
is a USB to microUSB cable and the free Arduino IDE.  That and it
replaces the switches!

It is set up as 8bits of port as binary output and a few single pins to push
the load (DMAin) and load mode.  The nice part is unlike EPRom the 
loaded code is not resident so problem of address conflicts with eproms
are avoided.

Allison

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

thinkpast
 

On Thu, Oct 3, 2019 at 05:01 PM, cmdrcosmac wrote:


How to "get it in" in the first place?? That is an issue all Elf wranglers
face.
On the Retrotechnology site are a few suggestions, most will need extra
hardware and something on a PC to send the code to some kind of loader
which is toggled into the Elf. Chuck Yakym and David Madole have done
work in this area. It would be nice if someone would make available
a programmed (E)EPROM with a monitor, to get a user started. I suggest
IDIOT because it is object-relocatable, easy to use, and historically
relevant. Once you have IDIOT you can load anything else.
-Chuck
http://www.retrotechnology.com/memship/mship_binloader.html

covers in excruciating detail, the business of a "binary loader" that can be toggled into a COSMAC's RAM, to read EF3 serial data. Then one can load some monitor through a serial or USB to serial port. It's about 30 bytes of loading code; kinda tedious, but you knew that going in, right? ;)

If you need to build a serial hardware interface, that's covered in a number of documents on my Web site; an index to them is linked-to as "hardware" on the "binloader" Web page.

For the most part, however, most COSMAC owners replicate and burn a ROM from some COSMAC product and run that, with the serial interface of that product. So there's not been much development of toggle-in serial loaders over the last several years. (Parallel or Arduino loaders have had some development. Web search is your friend to find those; even on my Web site.) USB-to-serial dongles, have become cheap and usable under various "pee-cee" operating systems. I cover them too, on my Web site. Web search will find content on my site, if you add the phrase "site:retrotechnology.com"

Regards,
Herb Johnson

Re: Elf2k ...use of either SWITCHES control planel / HEX keypad but not both

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 
Edited

One further comment I'd add...

With the EELF2k not blikin lights, the terminal and monitor and gets used
more as a result.  With the Original ELF nothing but switches and lights. 
I still pull mine out to play.  Elk2k I don't use the switches but the leds
are useful at times to see loops.

Takes me back to Altair8800, hated the switches they made the fingers
hurt after entering the loader for the fifth time.  But with new software
the leds would easily show it looping on the IO port address even if
it was not the actual port address, so patching to code for the available
hardware was easier.  That was right up until a resident monitor, the
leds made it easy to see loops and tight sections of code but the
monitor with search for byte value made it faster to patch.

For me the experience is a thing that got old and the fingers remember
the pain.   It also taught me that even simple software and a terminal
I could gain experience with the hardware and programming faster.

If you never used switches its interesting and maybe you should as
then you appreciate the value of a debug monitor brings.  At the same
time switches and light gets one very close to the metal.

So the side effect is I have an Altair8800, CosmacELF, and a 8039 (8048/9)
simple low parts count  machine like a ELF all with switches and lights.
I also have for over three decades the grandaddy of the front panel system
the PDP-8 which if anything had a nice switches that didn't cause pain.

Allison

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

cmdrcosmac
 

It's been dead around here...
 I now have a working adaptation of IDIOT for use with a UART.
The mods are simple. They poll the UART status register 'till
a byte comes in or the transmitter register is empty, then do
an I/O to the data register.

 First,the equates for the I/O are defined...

0000 ;               0067      .. I/O
0000 ;               0068      ..
0000 ;               0069             UCTRL= #03     .. UART CTRL/STATUS REGISTER
0000 ;               0070             UDATA= #02     .. UART DATA REGISTER
0000 ;               0071             GSEL= #07     .. SYSTEM I/O GROUP SELECT REGISTER (ADDED HARDWARE)
0000 ;               0072             UGRP= #01     .. I/O GROUP CONTAINING THE UART

 Next, the Group register and the UART control register are initialized.

0000 ;               0088      .. HRJ for Membership Card
0000 71;             0089  RESET:     DIS       ..   DISABLE INTERRUPTS
0001 00;             0090             ,#00
0002 6701;           0091             OUT GSEL ,UGRP     .. SETUP I/O GROUP
0004 6313;           0092             OUT UCTRL ,7N1     .. 7 BITS DATA, NO PARITY, 1 STOPBIT

 The READ patch is placed... Note the reader control code commented out.
Note the BR BZ, the ORG statement, and the BZ label. This is so the original code
stays where it was.

0148 ;               0343      .. LSNZ    .. IF TTYRED,
0148 ;               0344      .. OUT 7    .. TURN READER ON
0148 ;               0345      .. ,#80
0148 ;               0346      ..
0148 ;               0347      .. UART INPUT CODE HERE
0148 ;               0348      ..
0148 E2;             0349             SEX SP
0149 6B;             0350  KEY1:      INP UCTRL           ..  GET DA BIT FROM
014A F6;             0351             SHR     .. UART STATUS BYTE
014B 3B49;           0352             BNF KEY1     .. WAIT 'TILL DATA AVAIL.
014D ;               0353      ..
014D 12;             0354             INC SP
014E 6A;             0355             INP UDATA     .. GET DATA
014F 52;             0356             STR SP
0150 62;             0357             OUT UDATA     .. ECHO
0151 22;             0358             DEC SP
0152 BF;             0359             PHI ASCII
0153 22;             0360             DEC SP
0154 3079;           0361             BR BZ
0156 ;               0362 
0156 ;               0363             ORG= (RESET + #0179)     .. CONTINUATION OF ORIGINAL CODE
0179 ;               0364      ..
0179 3243;           0365  BZ:        BZ READ2      ..   REPEAT IF 00=NULL
                                ..    (Original code continues)

 The TYPE patch is placed. as above, a branch instruction and an ORG statement keep
things where they belong.

01BE F80B;           0455  TY2:       LDI #0B      ..     ELSE SET CODE=BYTE, 11 BITS
01C0 AF;             0456  TY3:       PLO ASCII      ..   SAVE CODE BYTE
01C1 ;               0457 
01C1 ;               0458      ..
01C1 ;               0459      .. BEGIN SERIAL OUTPUT (DELAY + 44 MACHINE CYCLES PER LOOP)
01C1 ;               0460      .. NO DELAY ANYMORE, THE CODE BELOW DRIVES THE UART.
01C1 ;               0461      ..
01C1 ;               0462 
01C1 E2;             0463  BEGIN2:    SEX SP
01C2 6B;             0464             INP UCTRL     .. Check UART ready.
01C3 FE;             0465             SHL
01C4 3BC1;           0466             BNF BEGIN2
01C6 ;               0467      ..
01C6 12;             0468  OUTPUT:    INC SP
01C7 8D;             0469             GLO D
01C8 52;             0470             STR SP
01C9 62;             0471             OUT UDATA     .. Send character from stack.
01CA 22;             0472             DEC SP
01CB 22;             0473             DEC SP
01CC 8F;             0474             GLO ASCII
01CD FF0B;           0475             SMI #0B
01CF AF;             0476             PLO ASCII
01D0 30DD;           0477             BR NXCHAR
01D2 ;               0478      ..
01D2 ;               0479             ORG= (RESET + #01DD)     .. CONTINUATION OF ORIGINAL CODE
01DD ;               0480      ..
01DD 8F;             0481  NXCHAR:    GLO ASCII      ..   GET CODE BYTE;
                                ..    (Original code continues)

 Then TIMALC and DELAY can be removed. Then patch the SEP instruction so you go straight to the
monitor.

00BD B3;             0249          PHI    3        ..  CALL TIMALC; IT RETURNS WITH "SEP R5",
00BE ;               0250      ..    SEP    3        ..  SO IT WILL RETURN TO "ENTRY"
00BE D5;             0251          SEP    5        .. Straight to Monitor.

 The SEP 3 originally went to TIMALC, which then did a SEP 5, and went to the Monitor.
We now do a SEP 5, straight to the Monitor.

 Note that Jeff's hardware uses the flags to sense the /DA and /THRE, whereas this code reads the
UART status register shifts, and branches on the DF. THis way, Mode 1 is utilized, and the flags
are freed up.

 All the original ORG statements are left unchanged.
If you try this, let us know how it works.
-Chuck

Re: Max Image Size in Email #ThisGroup

somaspack
 

Hi Dave,

I sympathize as the moderator of a Yahoo sailing group there's always a few who aren't happy about something. One of the gripes people have about Yahoo was that attachments couldn't be sent via email and sorting through the Files was hard. One of the most enjoyable features of this group is seeing what people are talking about in the discussion

I also sympathize with people who don't have significant bandwidth. But there do seem to be several ways to avoid getting dumped by big downloads, including 'plain digest' and 'daily summary' or even nothing at all. I'm not sure those options have been tried and are acceptable for the those with limited bandwidth.

I'd also just like to mention that 1280x800 is the same number of pixels as 1024x1024 but is a more natural image dimension. This would typically render a better image since it retains more data as less is being cropped to fit into 1024x1024.

Thanks for everything you do!

Scott

Re: Max Image Size in Email #ThisGroup

Arthur Elsenaar
 


An option to remedy the problem is to disable loading images or 'remote content' in your email application.
Arthur


‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐

On Monday, October 7, 2019 10:25 PM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

A few people have emailed me about the occasional large photo attachments showing up in their inboxes (and I've been *slow* to respond --- sorry!). The main issue raised has been one of bandwidth: for people without good broadband pipes or for those who might check their email over a cellular connection, some of these attachments get to be time consuming to download. Cellular plans can also be pricey.

At the same time, I think everyone generally loves to see photos of our varied COSMAC creations --- I know I do! There have been some *great* photos in recent threads.

In an attempt to strike a balance, I've tweaked the group settings to automatically resize photo attachments to a maximum of 1024 x 1024 pixels --- still a very good resolution for on-screen viewing, but substantially smaller than a modern, unedited camera image. For the time being, I haven't put any such resizing on photos uploaded to the Photos area on the group.

Along the same lines, please consider whether you need to include images when responding to messages that have them attached; by deleting the images when you make your reply, you can keep people from receiving multiple copies of images in their inboxes. It's not a rule or anything, just a friendly suggestion for message responses.

Sorry for the admin crud in your email. Now back to vintage computing messages and photos! :)

Cheers,
Dave

Max Image Size in Email #ThisGroup

Dave Ruske
 

A few people have emailed me about the occasional large photo attachments showing up in their inboxes (and I've been *slow* to respond --- sorry!). The main issue raised has been one of bandwidth: for people without good broadband pipes or for those who might check their email over a cellular connection, some of these attachments get to be time consuming to download. Cellular plans can also be pricey.

At the same time, I think everyone generally loves to see photos of our varied COSMAC creations --- I know I do! There have been some *great* photos in recent threads.

In an attempt to strike a balance, I've tweaked the group settings to automatically resize photo attachments to a maximum of 1024 x 1024 pixels --- still a very good resolution for on-screen viewing, but substantially smaller than a modern, unedited camera image. For the time being, I haven't put any such resizing on photos uploaded to the Photos area on the group.

Along the same lines, please consider whether you need to include images when responding to messages that have them attached; by deleting the images when you make your reply, you can keep people from receiving multiple copies of images in their inboxes. It's not a rule or anything, just a friendly suggestion for message responses.

Sorry for the admin crud in your email. Now back to vintage computing messages and photos! :)

Cheers,
Dave

Re: Elf2k ...use of either SWITCHES control planel / HEX keypad but not both

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

By time I built a PE-ELF i'd suffered from binary digits, the soreness that ones
digits get from flipping toggle switches.  An Altair early adopter.

As to "part of the experience"  learn to ride a bicycle by falling off.  
Its part of the experience and painful as well so you learn to not
fall off but you get less riding time in as recovery takes time from it. ;)

Hex (or octal) keypads are better but inefficient when program development
gets to a level of maybe 100-150 bytes.

So the experience is gained is why they (toggle switches and hexkeypads)
became extinct fairly fast.  It was inexpensive Eprom that may be the factor.

So as a result every thing I build has a serial port and eprom monitor. 
I don't include the terminal as that can be moved between systems. 
That and once off the toggle switches program development and
understanding of same accelerated.

Allison