Date   
Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

thinkpast
 

On Sat, Oct 19, 2019 at 01:18 AM, Dave Ruske wrote:
I'd just add that there are a lot of different email clients out there --- not
all of them make the actual email address obvious, even knowing about that "="
substitution. It's hard to guess what a message is looking like on someone
else's system.
I'll add some more. Some of us, do not receive this group by email. I read these messages through the Web "server" at groups.io for cosmacelf with my Web browser. That's my choice. Reasons include: groups.io archives all the emails I want; I can read them on their site when I want; less email for me to process and delete. Why is this mode so hard to for others to consider as a plausible means for other people?

Also: people who are not members of this group, read archived messages also via Web pages. Web search with the added " site:groups.io cosmacelf" will find specific groups.io messages with some cosmacelf flavors (and when you add additional search terms of course). Web search may be how "new people" find this group.

So: telling (people like) me repeatedly "just look", is not helpful. If those posting, are not familiar with the Web interface and display for groups.io's support of cosmacelf, ahem, "just look". what you'll see, is what will be archived and is available to "the world". For the most part, email addresses are obscured on the Web-interface of groups.io messages.

regards
Herb Johnson

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
Yes indeed.
However.... In truth they are becoming an incompetent list server
service, instead of an incompetent list server service and badly done
file hosting service for it. There's a <DELETED!> big mess being
raised on a lot of the others I belong to who have not moved. Or do
not know how, which is worse.

Bill can you e-mail later regarding that CDP1802 based bar code reader
device off list if you want, but we can keep in here, and with the
right subject. I still do not have the right hardware for making
EPROMS and even to erase them...........

Now that I've read again what I do have on it, I know now what I want
to try and get to do with it.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Sun, Oct 20, 2019 at 8:48 AM joshbensadon via Groups.Io
<joshbensadon=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Bill,

That's too funny! But indeed, I think Dave saw the writing on the wall and made a great choice to move ahead of the inevitable shutdown.

Things keep going this way, then someday there will be a new world wide web and they can finally close the internet.
Perhaps they should call it Earth Everywhere and sites can start with ee.???? See, it's already 1/3 more efficient than www.????

Cheers,
Josh





On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 8:14:29 AM EDT, bill rowe <@bill2009> wrote:


Wow! I guess they were so hurt when we moved that they just couldn’t keep going!

Seriously though, this will be a big deal - lots of groups still there.

On Oct 16, 2019, at 8:08 AM, Dave Ruske <@druske> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave


--
Bill Rowe
Olduino - an arduino for the first of us
https://olduino.wordpress.com/about-2/about/

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

joshbensadon
 

Bill, 

That's too funny! But indeed, I think Dave saw the writing on the wall and made a great choice to move ahead of the inevitable shutdown.

Things keep going this way, then someday there will be a new world wide web and they can finally close the internet.
Perhaps they should call it Earth Everywhere and sites can start with ee.????  See, it's already 1/3 more efficient than www.????

Cheers,
Josh





On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 8:14:29 AM EDT, bill rowe <bill_rowe_ottawa@...> wrote:


Wow! I guess they were so hurt when we moved that they just couldn’t keep going!

Seriously though, this will be a big deal - lots of groups still there.

On Oct 16, 2019, at 8:08 AM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

--
Bill Rowe
Olduino - an arduino for the first of us
https://olduino.wordpress.com/about-2/about/

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
It actually helps a lot. Thanks, That does explain a lot regarding
what is going on here. To the TheEagle, take a look at what he wrote.
And I can actually see the footer functions that Dave mentioned.
Depending on what client you are using look at the footer.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Sat, Oct 19, 2019 at 1:18 AM Dave Ruske <@druske> wrote:

I'd just add that there are a lot of different email clients out there --- not all of them make the actual email address obvious, even knowing about that "=" substitution. It's hard to guess what a message is looking like on someone else's system. This is especially true on a site geared towards lovers of vintage computing equipment, who may be using a machine that the rest of the world considers obsolete!

One other thing that can be done to contact someone: in the footer of emails from the cosmacelf group you'll usually see some links --- though exactly what displays and how seems to vary a little, probably due to individual user settings, whether the message originated from the web interface, email, etc. I confess I don't know the formula, but the links are useful when present.

There is usually a link for "View/Reply Online" that'll open the message in a browser. At the top of the message on the groups.io site, there's a link to the sender; click it and you should see some information about the user, and very likely a button to email the individual.

Even better, there is usually a link in the footer that says "Reply To Sender"; click that one, and a modern email client should open up a window to let you compose a new email response directly to the sender. (I think that link is a general feature and not just something exposed to a moderator or list owner --- but I'm not 100% certain and I'm too dead tired to make a fake account and test it right now, so please forgive me if I'm mistaken!)

Hope this helps a little! :)

Dave



On Oct 18, 2019, at 10:47 PM, Gregg Levine <gregg.drwho8@...> wrote:

Look at the line which contains his e-mail address or should be. The
list server bot substitutes an = sign for an @ one. It does that to
protect our e-mail addresses. And in that case you will be able to
e-mail friend regarding his collection of WW sockets.


Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Dave Ruske
 

I'd just add that there are a lot of different email clients out there --- not all of them make the actual email address obvious, even knowing about that "=" substitution. It's hard to guess what a message is looking like on someone else's system. This is especially true on a site geared towards lovers of vintage computing equipment, who may be using a machine that the rest of the world considers obsolete!

One other thing that can be done to contact someone: in the footer of emails from the cosmacelf group you'll usually see some links --- though exactly what displays and how seems to vary a little, probably due to individual user settings, whether the message originated from the web interface, email, etc. I confess I don't know the formula, but the links are useful when present.

There is usually a link for "View/Reply Online" that'll open the message in a browser. At the top of the message on the groups.io site, there's a link to the sender; click it and you should see some information about the user, and very likely a button to email the individual.

Even better, there is usually a link in the footer that says "Reply To Sender"; click that one, and a modern email client should open up a window to let you compose a new email response directly to the sender. (I think that link is a general feature and not just something exposed to a moderator or list owner --- but I'm not 100% certain and I'm too dead tired to make a fake account and test it right now, so please forgive me if I'm mistaken!)

Hope this helps a little! :)

Dave



On Oct 18, 2019, at 10:47 PM, Gregg Levine <gregg.drwho8@...> wrote:

Look at the line which contains his e-mail address or should be. The
list server bot substitutes an = sign for an @ one. It does that to
protect our e-mail addresses. And in that case you will be able to
e-mail friend regarding his collection of WW sockets.

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
Look at the line which contains his e-mail address or should be. The
list server bot substitutes an = sign for an @ one. It does that to
protect our e-mail addresses. And in that case you will be able to
e-mail friend regarding his collection of WW sockets. I would of
course, but at the moment I do not need an amazing collection like
that. Sadly my CDP1802 based project idea decided to become a former
project. (It was not based on that fellow's idea to use an Arduino to
do the heavy lifting and the CDP1802 sat on it as part of a shield.)
Oddly enough it was based on that fellow's idea to use the S100 bus
for the CDP1802 and I could not find a source of prototype boards for
that size and a good backplane.

Actually Bill it now seems as if that terminal as a CDP1802 generic
system seems to be more and more interesting. I'll e-mail about that
one later on.

-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 8:56 PM the-eagle@... <The-Eagle@...> wrote:

Is this a private email server forum, OR a public open website forum? Just my two cent question.

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Gregg Levine
 

Hello!
Normally I'd snap up this offer. But I'd rather these sockets go to
someone who either has or will have an active ELF (Or CDP1802 based)
project taking shape.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 6:41 PM Hank Riley via Groups.Io
<n1ltv=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Mark,

If you look closely at the email sender you'll see Scott's email address in faint gray.

Change the = symbol to the @ symbol to get his real address. That = substitution is done by groups.io.

[Mark does receive email from this group.]

Hank
________________________________________________________________________


On Friday, October 18, 2019, 01:41:21 PM EDT, Mark Huffstutter <mhuffstutter@...> wrote:


Hi Scott,

I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Hank Riley
 

Mark,

If you look closely at the email sender you'll see Scott's email address in faint gray.

Change the = symbol to the @ symbol to get his real address.  That = substitution is done by groups.io.

[Mark does receive email from this group.]

Hank
________________________________________________________________________


On Friday, October 18, 2019, 01:41:21 PM EDT, Mark Huffstutter <mhuffstutter@...> wrote:


Hi Scott,

          I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Lee Hart
 

somaspack via Groups.Io wrote:
Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had
bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an Elf. I never
used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me
privately. Scott
Hi Scott,

I still build things with wire-wrap, so I'd be more than happy to take you up on your offer. The last thing I built was a vintage Elf for VCFMW <www.sunrise-ev.com/vcf-elf.htm> :-)

My address is in my signature lines below. I can Paypal you the funds for postage if you provide a Paypal address, or can mail them to you if you send me your mailing address.

--
There is a computer disease that anybody who works with computers knows
about. It's very serious, and interferes completely with your work. The
trouble with computers is that you 'play' with them! (Richard Feynman)
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

Re: FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

Mark Huffstutter
 

Hi Scott,

I would love to have the sockets, but I can't find Your private
email addie in the header to reply.

Thank You,
Mark

Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had
bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an  Elf. I never
used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me
privately. Scott



FREE: Wire-wrap sockets need home

somaspack
 

Cleaning out my boxes of stuff found a set of wire wrap sockets I had bought about ten years ago with the intention of making an  Elf. I never used them and never will. FREE + $8 USPS shipping in US. Contact me privately. Scott

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

RE: Eprom programmers. 

the problem is I have 4 of them, one lives on S100 bus and can do any 27xxx part
thats handy for a lot of parts even programming 8755 and 8748/9.
Another requires a PC with parallel port and old Winders (98 and maybe XP) ,
Fortunately I have a box for that.   A stand alone Kontron that can only do
2708 and 2716, and a Arduino USB serial gadget made for 27C256.

I have nothing that is for linux and USB save for the Arduino based quickie unit.

And I've generally move to 28xxx parts EEPROM and flash so one off
programmers are generally the rule now.  Arduino makes that fairly easy.

Allison

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

awasson2001
 

Holy smokes. Good work on getting the group moved early on Dave. I’m sure a lot of groups are just now busy jumping through hoops to manage that. I’m in several other Yahoo Groups that have not done so and as of yet, there is no discussion to do so. Kudos for taking the initiative to move us when you did. 

Cheers,
Andrew



On Oct 16, 2019, at 5:08 AM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

Re: Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

bill rowe
 

Wow! I guess they were so hurt when we moved that they just couldn’t keep going!

Seriously though, this will be a big deal - lots of groups still there.

On Oct 16, 2019, at 8:08 AM, Dave Ruske <dave@...> wrote:

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

--
Bill Rowe
Olduino - an arduino for the first of us
https://olduino.wordpress.com/about-2/about/

Yahoo Groups Closing, Please Update Links #ThisGroup

Dave Ruske
 

I don't think there's much impact to our community as we've migrated all content to groups.io, but I wanted to make everyone aware that Yahoo Groups will be closing and removing content on December 14th, 2019. Here's their announcement:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

The only impact of note is that people who might follow an old hyperlink to the Yahoo group won't see our "we've moved" notice anymore. I'd ask people with content on the web that might link to the group to check and see if the links are up-to-date. The link to the cosmacelf group here should be:
https://groups.io/g/cosmacelf

Thanks,
Dave

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

Jeff Truck
 

Allison,

Regarding your comment on loose wires with Frankie.   Yes - they pop up from time to time and I have to deal with that when it happens.  It helps to have super accurate mapping documents which I maintain on record just in case.   

The UART and Video boards utilize strip boards for which the wires and sockets are all soldered.  No loose wires in this case.   Since these functions came later in Frankie's life I have learned from the burn of using breadboards hence the usage of strip boards.  As additional circuits on the breadboard mature, they will be converted over to strip board as well.   I have two major projects planned for Frankie and they will also be strip board.

Thank you regarding your comments on the wire colors and work of art.   It does indeed look colorful.  I tried to keep colors grouped based on origination points.   The art effect just comes around naturally.   Jameco has certainly had a good year of sales when it comes to wire thanks to me.

Jeff


Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

somaspack
 

For me an EPROM programmer is a required tool. I highly recommend "mcumall dot com" and their 'true USB Willem' EPROM/EEPROM programmer for $95. I've had one of these for near a decade and it works great - programs dang near anything on the planet from 2716 up.

Scott

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 

First that board bis both a horror and beautiful. ;)

The horror is that troublshooting a loose wire is likely unfun.
That and for many years it was told you must use short leads and watch 
for crosstalk...

But the color and diversity of wires is art.  Also a reflection of patience.

Plan A, use Arduino:
My approach to buttons and switches is elsewhere but one adopted is 
using a common Arduino Nano as a loader host.  While I may tire and 
grump about finger pain of pushing buttons the Arduino will do it for me
willingly.  Since there is enough flash in the Arduino I can have it load 
the serial binload, tbx, or whatever.

Why do that?  More people can program (as in insert code into the flash)
an Arduino with ease (free software and the nano or uno has programming
port).  WHere programming a 2716 (if you have them) or any other part
(2732,2764, and EEprom parts) requires a more specific programmer
or homebrew hardware.  Where a low cost nano has it and all you need
is a USB to microUSB cable and the free Arduino IDE.  That and it
replaces the switches!

It is set up as 8bits of port as binary output and a few single pins to push
the load (DMAin) and load mode.  The nice part is unlike EPRom the 
loaded code is not resident so problem of address conflicts with eproms
are avoided.

Allison

Re: Frankenstein UART Board #Serial #Homebrew

thinkpast
 

On Thu, Oct 3, 2019 at 05:01 PM, cmdrcosmac wrote:


How to "get it in" in the first place?? That is an issue all Elf wranglers
face.
On the Retrotechnology site are a few suggestions, most will need extra
hardware and something on a PC to send the code to some kind of loader
which is toggled into the Elf. Chuck Yakym and David Madole have done
work in this area. It would be nice if someone would make available
a programmed (E)EPROM with a monitor, to get a user started. I suggest
IDIOT because it is object-relocatable, easy to use, and historically
relevant. Once you have IDIOT you can load anything else.
-Chuck
http://www.retrotechnology.com/memship/mship_binloader.html

covers in excruciating detail, the business of a "binary loader" that can be toggled into a COSMAC's RAM, to read EF3 serial data. Then one can load some monitor through a serial or USB to serial port. It's about 30 bytes of loading code; kinda tedious, but you knew that going in, right? ;)

If you need to build a serial hardware interface, that's covered in a number of documents on my Web site; an index to them is linked-to as "hardware" on the "binloader" Web page.

For the most part, however, most COSMAC owners replicate and burn a ROM from some COSMAC product and run that, with the serial interface of that product. So there's not been much development of toggle-in serial loaders over the last several years. (Parallel or Arduino loaders have had some development. Web search is your friend to find those; even on my Web site.) USB-to-serial dongles, have become cheap and usable under various "pee-cee" operating systems. I cover them too, on my Web site. Web search will find content on my site, if you add the phrase "site:retrotechnology.com"

Regards,
Herb Johnson

Re: Elf2k ...use of either SWITCHES control planel / HEX keypad but not both

ajparent1/kb1gmx
 
Edited

One further comment I'd add...

With the EELF2k not blikin lights, the terminal and monitor and gets used
more as a result.  With the Original ELF nothing but switches and lights. 
I still pull mine out to play.  Elk2k I don't use the switches but the leds
are useful at times to see loops.

Takes me back to Altair8800, hated the switches they made the fingers
hurt after entering the loader for the fifth time.  But with new software
the leds would easily show it looping on the IO port address even if
it was not the actual port address, so patching to code for the available
hardware was easier.  That was right up until a resident monitor, the
leds made it easy to see loops and tight sections of code but the
monitor with search for byte value made it faster to patch.

For me the experience is a thing that got old and the fingers remember
the pain.   It also taught me that even simple software and a terminal
I could gain experience with the hardware and programming faster.

If you never used switches its interesting and maybe you should as
then you appreciate the value of a debug monitor brings.  At the same
time switches and light gets one very close to the metal.

So the side effect is I have an Altair8800, CosmacELF, and a 8039 (8048/9)
simple low parts count  machine like a ELF all with switches and lights.
I also have for over three decades the grandaddy of the front panel system
the PDP-8 which if anything had a nice switches that didn't cause pain.

Allison