Date   

Re: spam from cia

Jonathan Sivier
 

Other people may run into this sort of problem, so I'm replying to the whole group. We may need to take the discussion off-line to spend a lot of time trying to figure out the problem.

Many ISP's (Internet Service Providers) have a way you can specify that a given address is OK and messages from that source aren't spam. This is sometimes called a "whitelist" and sometimes has other names. However, the idea is that you can tell your ISP not to mark any messages from that source as spam.

One thing to be sure is that you don't allow the messages that get marked as spam to be deleted from your mail until you have marked them as not being spam (or more likely unmarked them as spam). Many ISP's have a policy that if mail from a given address is marked as being spam they send a complaint to the source of the mail and the way Groups.io is handling those complaints is to remove the person complaining from the list. The thinking is that if you consider mail from a list to be spam, then you don't want to be on the list.

Jonathan


On 1/23/2021 11:06 AM, Gary Slater wrote:
I have never had problems getting emails from group members, until now.  Suddenly in the past week I am receiving all emails from members marked as spam.  I have moved to Mattoon and although my provider has changed my email address has not.
Any recommendations?  I am computer illiterate for the most part about these things.
Thanks,
gary


Re: spam from cia

Randy Milliken
 

My suggestion is to get a gmail account. At that point your email address is not tied to any ISP. (That makes changing providers easier if something better comes along.)
Gmail is also better at processing what is and what isn't SPAM. 
It's also easy to whitelist addresses so they always get through without being processed.

That being said, you still need to be very careful opening any emails nowadays. 
If anything in the subject line or body of the message doesn't sound right, definitely don't click on any links.

I deal with cybersecurity for a living. 
The Internet is a scary thing when you analyze log files and see what's out there. 

Randy

 

------ Original Message ------
From: "Gary Slater" <gws77@...>
Sent: 1/23/2021 12:06:53 PM
Subject: [cia-rocketry] spam from cia

I have never had problems getting emails from group members, until now.  Suddenly in the past week I am receiving all emails from members marked as spam.  I have moved to Mattoon and although my provider has changed my email address has not.  
 
Any recommendations?  I am computer illiterate for the most part about these things.  
 
Thanks,
gary


spam from cia

Gary Slater
 

I have never had problems getting emails from group members, until now.  Suddenly in the past week I am receiving all emails from members marked as spam.  I have moved to Mattoon and although my provider has changed my email address has not.  
 
Any recommendations?  I am computer illiterate for the most part about these things.  
 
Thanks,
gary


rocket launches

Jonathan Sivier
 

For the last few months we have not been able to hold any launches due to the increased COVID restrictions. Now that our area has moved back to the Phase 4 level of restrictions we should be able to start holding launches again. We don't plan on holding a launch tomorrow, but starting in February we will try to hold the launches listed in the calendar, depending on the weather of course.

These events will follow the same rules we used in launches we were able to hold in the summer and fall. Masks will be required and we will ask people to maintain social distancing as much as possible. It seemed to work well for the launches we were able to hold last year and so we will continue to follow those rules until further notice. You can find a list of the rules at "http://www.ciarocketry.org/covid.html"

Jonathan


calendar of events for 2021

Jonathan Sivier
 

We are in the process of putting together the calendar of events for the new year. As you can imagine this is a bit of a challenge since we don't know when we will be able to start holding launches or meetings again. We are hopeful that we'll be able to hold some launches starting in the spring, but it will probably be a longer time before we are able to hold meetings and workshops and other in person, indoor events.

Until we are able to meet at the Springer Center again we plan on holding all of our meetings on the first Tuesday of each month on Zoom. To a large extent these are likely to be just a chance to get together and chat about rockets. However, it may be possible to put together some presentations about particular topics. If you have a rocket related topic you would like to learn more about, or if you have something you would like to present to the group, let us know.

GARLO 2021 is scheduled for Saturday, June 26 with a rain date on Saturday, July 10. The theme this year will be "Recovery". The theme contest will be for imaginative or unusual recovery methods for your rockets. A secondary contest will be "Mars Lander". This could be a version of the Estes kit, or something of your own design. Landing upright will also be awarded a prize.

Be sure to check out VIrtual NARCON on January 29-31. More info can be found at
https://www.nar.org/narcon-2021/

We are working on updating the online calendar on the web site. It will take a while to get it finished for the year and there will likely be major changes to the calendar throughout the year as the situation changes.

Jonathan


Re: May the fun begin

Tim Dixon
 

Yeah Mike, hotels are kinda out of the question right now per my doctor.

Had to take a bit of a redirect on the build as I slipped and fell during the ice storm doing a number on my back/ribs. So instead of trying to manhandle the bulky fin can while dealing with spasms, I decided to move to a smaller item/task, the av-bay mechanics. This delay was OK though as after doing a fit of the booster airframe, I decided to go a different direction on the attachment points; upgrading to #10 pan head screws for more surface area, so awaiting a parts delivery on that change anyway.

So, the av-bay is nothing special. In fact, my general direction for this project has been to keep it as simple as possible. I did consider the use of Rouse-tech CO2 ejection, but given the low altitude, it was hard to justify, especially given max black powder is "only" 6 grams due to the large surface area of the bulkheads. I say "only" because, although I have never used that much BP in my life, I have seen some of the QCRS guys using 6 gram charges in airframes of half the diameter, albeit a fiberglass airframe that could survive such a shock.

So the following pictures should be pretty familiar and explanatory. Actually, the real trick in this step was dealing with the inherent slop in the Sonotube dimensions. Since this is one of the two critical slip joints, I had to finesse a couple of more layers of fiberglass laminate to get a more accurate fit. After that, minor adjustments were also required on the bulkhead pairs which was done with a combination of a router pass and some light sanding. Hardware is all 3/8-16 which is sized for the weight and gee forces expected. Outside of that, believe me, I am a recovering over-builder, so am trying to use the minimum of epoxy and reinforcement throughout this and every build I've done for the past 10 years. Saying that I do have reinforcement at critical stress areas, e.g., the bulkhead hardware attachment point where I'm using a swatch of 10oz Kevlar. The fairly large charge holders may or may not be familiar--you can get this large size and a number of smaller sizes at dirt cheap prices by searching for "pill canisters" on eBay. Finally, on the aft bulkplate you see an aluminum plate for the antenna attachment. I now have that drilled for with #2 hardware in the four corners, and the wimpy antenna shown will probably be upgraded to something more stout given the space I have in the airframe. Finally, the last picture is after adding labels and a thin layer of epoxy for ding durability and ease of cleanup.


Tuesday meeting on Zoom #Meeting #VirtualEvent

Mark Joseph
 

Here is the Zoom invitation for Tuesday's CIA regular meeting.

Note that participants will enter via a waiting room once approved, and your microphone and video will be muted when you first enter.

Please let me know if you have questions, and I'll do my best to get you going.

Mark

-----

Mark Joseph is inviting you to a scheduled Zoom meeting.

Topic: Central Illinois Aerospace - January 2021
Time: Jan 5, 2021 07:00 PM Central Time (US and Canada)

Join Zoom Meeting
https://illinois.zoom.us/j/88959450754?pwd=R1o3eVRreDZhcDZJNVptUFlEYTE5UT09

Meeting ID: 889 5945 0754
Password: 634125

One tap mobile
+13126266799,,88959450754# US (Chicago)
+17866351003,,88959450754# US (Miami)

Dial by your location
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Meeting ID: 889 5945 0754
Password: 634125
Find your local number: https://illinois.zoom.us/u/khwcoiVf9

Join by SIP
88959450754@...


Zoom #Meeting on Tuesday #Meeting #VirtualEvent

Jonathan Sivier
 

Our January meeting will be held on Zoom on Tuesday, January 5 at 7 p.m. Stayed tuned for details on how to join the meeting. Everyone is invited to join us to talk about rockets and the possibilities for our activities this coming year.

Jonathan


Happy New Year!

Jonathan Sivier
 

Welcome to 2021! The less said about 2020 the better. :-( Hopefully this year will be better than last year.

I hope everyone has survived last night's ice storm. I know some of us had power outages earlier today. Hopefully, they have all been taken care of, or will be very soon.

With some luck the COVID vaccine will be generally available in a few months. The sooner we all get vaccinated the sooner we'll be able to get back to a regular schedule of meetings and launches. I suspect we won't be able to hold indoor meetings until much later in the year, but we may be able to hold some launches again, as we did in the late summer and fall, once the weather improves in the spring.

Stay safe until we can all get together again.

Jonathan


Re: May the fun begin

M
 

Not building out of a Hotel room? I am having a hard time following!..

 

I LIKE IT!

 

Mike Z

 

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io [mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io] On Behalf Of Tim Dixon
Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 2020 4:54 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: Re: [cia-rocketry] May the fun begin

 

OK, fin can is structurally complete, with only minimal gaps and excepting a few smudges of blood. Don't have enough left in me to take it apart and show the inside. Maybe tomorrow. Have a few details on the fit of the fins outside of the tabs (want them solidly mating the internal rings, but then stepped up to accommodate the airframe. After that, it will be drilling/installing rivets all around to attach the airframe. Once the booster is done, then lots of internal structural work on subsequent couplers and airframes, and given those steps are new build techniques, I'm not sure how fast or slow that will go.


another Zoom meeting next week #Meeting #VirtualEvent

Jonathan Sivier
 

We will be holding our monthly meeting on Zoom again next week on Tuesday, January 5 at 7 p.m. As with our December meeting everyone is invited to join us and we will be sending out the details on how to join the meeting, probably the day before.

We don't have any particular subjects for our meetings in 2021 scheduled yet. If anyone has a topic they would like to see addressed and discussed let us know. Particularly if you have something you would like to present to the group. If you have a new rocket you are working on or some other project this might be a good chance to show it off.

Our January meetings in the past have been about books and videos, so perhaps Greg or someone will have a video or two to show.

I hope everyone will plan to join us for a virtual gathering next Tuesday.

Jonathan


Re: May the fun begin

Christopher Deem
 

Looking good.



Sent from my Galaxy


-------- Original message --------
From: Tim Dixon <dixontj936@...>
Date: 12/29/20 4:54 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: Re: [cia-rocketry] May the fun begin

OK, fin can is structurally complete, with only minimal gaps and excepting a few smudges of blood. Don't have enough left in me to take it apart and show the inside. Maybe tomorrow. Have a few details on the fit of the fins outside of the tabs (want them solidly mating the internal rings, but then stepped up to accommodate the airframe. After that, it will be drilling/installing rivets all around to attach the airframe. Once the booster is done, then lots of internal structural work on subsequent couplers and airframes, and given those steps are new build techniques, I'm not sure how fast or slow that will go.


Re: May the fun begin

Tim Dixon
 

OK, fin can is structurally complete, with only minimal gaps and excepting a few smudges of blood. Don't have enough left in me to take it apart and show the inside. Maybe tomorrow. Have a few details on the fit of the fins outside of the tabs (want them solidly mating the internal rings, but then stepped up to accommodate the airframe. After that, it will be drilling/installing rivets all around to attach the airframe. Once the booster is done, then lots of internal structural work on subsequent couplers and airframes, and given those steps are new build techniques, I'm not sure how fast or slow that will go.


Re: (Junior?) HPR Certification

George Stevens
 

Thanks again for the help Mark and Jonathan! I will look at those books and the NAR website and will probably come back with a lot more questions than this time. I’ll also definitely be reconsidering making more sugar rockets, although I did already know about the safety issues which come with them.

Thanks!
George Stevens

On Mon, Dec 28, 2020 at 4:14 PM Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...> wrote:
I'll second the recommendation of these books. I'm glad Mark mentioned them since I failed to do so.

Jonathan

On 12/28/2020 3:02 PM, Mark Joseph wrote:

Please take a look at the NAR resources on HPR activities and certification at https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/, and perhaps look into a couple of great books, "Make: High Power Rocketry," and "Modern High Power Rocketry 2." Both are great guides to the process of designing, building, and flying high power rockets. The second book is getting a bit old, but still has a lot of great information.

Mark


Re: (Junior?) HPR Certification

Jonathan Sivier
 

I'll second the recommendation of these books. I'm glad Mark mentioned them since I failed to do so.

Jonathan


On 12/28/2020 3:02 PM, Mark Joseph wrote:

Please take a look at the NAR resources on HPR activities and certification at https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/, and perhaps look into a couple of great books, "Make: High Power Rocketry," and "Modern High Power Rocketry 2." Both are great guides to the process of designing, building, and flying high power rockets. The second book is getting a bit old, but still has a lot of great information.

Mark


Re: (Junior?) HPR Certification

Mark Joseph
 

Hi George,

Welcome! Your use of the email group is just fine.

There are many things to say in response to your questions, and my reply certainly won't cover everything. We would love to help you get started in high power rocketry, but not with sugar motors.

Both NAR and Tripoli have some Junior HPR Certification programs. Neither will allow the use of sugar motors, or any non-commercial, non-certified motors for any high power certification flight.

Central Illinois Aerospace is an NAR "section" or club. NAR launches and activities include the use of commercially manufactured, certified motors, only. Amateur, Research, or EXperimental motors are not permitted at NAR launches.

Tripoli does accommodate research motors under certain conditions, and only a *very* specific type of sugar motor. Research motor activity, even under Tripoli, requires a Level 2 certification. When one does start exploring experimental motors, the very best way is to get connected with an experienced mentor.

I know that sugar motors are an attractive route to start, as it appears to be inexpensive and accessible - with a lot of info on the Web. But please, PLEASE beware. The danger to you, your friends, family, and home is very real. Restrictions on sugar motors are in place because they pose several, difficult to control risks in the fabrication process and use. Some of those include melting point very close to flash point (sudden fire), likelihood of large voids in the solid propellant (sudden over-pressure), fragmentation of the most commonly used casting or motor case material (PVC), causing very serious injuries.

Please take a look at the NAR resources on HPR activities and certification at https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/, and perhaps look into a couple of great books, "Make: High Power Rocketry," and "Modern High Power Rocketry 2." Both are great guides to the process of designing, building, and flying high power rockets. The second book is getting a bit old, but still has a lot of great information.

**Ah, I see that Jonathan has replied with lots of good info while I was writing this. I'll stop here, and just say that we look forward to meeting you, working with you, and seeing you at a launch.

Mark


________________________________________

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io <cia-rocketry@groups.io> on behalf of George Stevens <geostevens888@...>
Sent: Monday, December 28, 2020 2:09 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] (Junior?) HPR Certification

First of all, I apologize if I’m using this incorrectly, I’ve never used an email group like this before.

I’m a high school student and I’ve been launching small model rockets for a couple years now, and recently got started making small sugar rockets with a friend. I’m looking to start working on my HPR certification, but I’m not really sure where I have to start, especially because I’m not 18 so I think I have to get a Junior HPR cert instead of a regular one.

I have two main questions: what should I start doing to work toward an HPR certification, and would it be possible to use sugar rockets to get my certification?

Thank you for any help you can provide!
-George Stevens


Re: (Junior?) HPR Certification

George Stevens
 

Thanks you for all of the information! I will start looking at the links you sent!

On Mon, Dec 28, 2020 at 3:42 PM Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...> wrote:
I think you will need a mentor who is certified to fly high power in order to get a junior high power certification. My understanding is that your mentor will need to be the one who purchases and prepares the motor. You may already have looked at it but there is information on this on the NAR web site at the following page, about halfway down the page.

https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/

An overview of the program is at
https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/formal-participation-procedure/

The first thing you need to do is join the NAR. Then I would recommend building and flying mid power rockets (E, F and G motors) to get experience in building and flying larger rockets. Then, with the assistance of your mentor, choose a rocket to build for a high power certification flight. There are several very good kits that will work well for this. We often recommend 4" diameter cardboard tube kits such as the LOC EZI. They go together much like the smaller rockets you have made in the past, but are larger and use some different techniques that you may have gained experience with building those mid power rockets.

Depending on where you live you may be able to find a member of our club who is willing to be your mentor. Even if there isn't anyone nearby I think we can probably work something out to help you, though it will be a bit more challenging to do so remotely.

You will need the permission of your parents to participate in the program. It might be helpful for us to be in touch with them. Have them contact us.

As far as sugar motors go I think most of us would say DON'T DO IT! This is very dangerous. There are ways to go about designing and making your own motors, but that is only for very experienced, knowledgeable and advanced rocketeers. Even then sugar motors are more dangerous than other types of motors. The melting point (in order to mix the oxidizer into the sugar) and the flashpoint (where the mixture catches fire) are very close together. This is a good way to burn your house down. There are much safer ways to go about making your own motors, but you should wait until you have gained a lot more experience before trying anything like that.

Non-commercial motors are not allowed at any of our launches. You would not be allowed to use a homebrew motor to certify for high power in any case. Tripoli does have an Experimental program which allows for the construction and flying of non-commercial motors, but I think you need to have a Level 2 certification before you are allowed to do that and the rockets can only be flown at certain special launches, not at regular club launches.

At the moment we aren't holding any launches due to the COVID restrictions. Hopefully, things will get better in the new year and we can start holding launches again. You should bring your rockets and fly then at our launches and get to know some of the people in the club. This is a good way to gain experience with smaller, and then gradually larger, rockets to pave the way to your high power certification.

I hope this is helpful. Feel free to post any additional questions you may have.

Jonathan

On 12/28/2020 2:09 PM, George Stevens wrote:
First of all, I apologize if I’m using this incorrectly, I’ve never used an email group like this before.

I’m a high school student and I’ve been launching small model rockets for a couple years now, and recently got started making small sugar rockets with a friend. I’m looking to start working on my HPR certification, but I’m not really sure where I have to start, especially because I’m not 18 so I think I have to get a Junior HPR cert instead of a regular one.

I have two main questions: what should I start doing to work toward an HPR certification, and would it be possible to use sugar rockets to get my certification?

Thank you for any help you can provide!
-George Stevens


Re: (Junior?) HPR Certification

Jonathan Sivier
 

I think you will need a mentor who is certified to fly high power in order to get a junior high power certification. My understanding is that your mentor will need to be the one who purchases and prepares the motor. You may already have looked at it but there is information on this on the NAR web site at the following page, about halfway down the page.

https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/

An overview of the program is at
https://www.nar.org/high-power-rocketry-info/formal-participation-procedure/

The first thing you need to do is join the NAR. Then I would recommend building and flying mid power rockets (E, F and G motors) to get experience in building and flying larger rockets. Then, with the assistance of your mentor, choose a rocket to build for a high power certification flight. There are several very good kits that will work well for this. We often recommend 4" diameter cardboard tube kits such as the LOC EZI. They go together much like the smaller rockets you have made in the past, but are larger and use some different techniques that you may have gained experience with building those mid power rockets.

Depending on where you live you may be able to find a member of our club who is willing to be your mentor. Even if there isn't anyone nearby I think we can probably work something out to help you, though it will be a bit more challenging to do so remotely.

You will need the permission of your parents to participate in the program. It might be helpful for us to be in touch with them. Have them contact us.

As far as sugar motors go I think most of us would say DON'T DO IT! This is very dangerous. There are ways to go about designing and making your own motors, but that is only for very experienced, knowledgeable and advanced rocketeers. Even then sugar motors are more dangerous than other types of motors. The melting point (in order to mix the oxidizer into the sugar) and the flashpoint (where the mixture catches fire) are very close together. This is a good way to burn your house down. There are much safer ways to go about making your own motors, but you should wait until you have gained a lot more experience before trying anything like that.

Non-commercial motors are not allowed at any of our launches. You would not be allowed to use a homebrew motor to certify for high power in any case. Tripoli does have an Experimental program which allows for the construction and flying of non-commercial motors, but I think you need to have a Level 2 certification before you are allowed to do that and the rockets can only be flown at certain special launches, not at regular club launches.

At the moment we aren't holding any launches due to the COVID restrictions. Hopefully, things will get better in the new year and we can start holding launches again. You should bring your rockets and fly then at our launches and get to know some of the people in the club. This is a good way to gain experience with smaller, and then gradually larger, rockets to pave the way to your high power certification.

I hope this is helpful. Feel free to post any additional questions you may have.

Jonathan


On 12/28/2020 2:09 PM, George Stevens wrote:
First of all, I apologize if I’m using this incorrectly, I’ve never used an email group like this before.

I’m a high school student and I’ve been launching small model rockets for a couple years now, and recently got started making small sugar rockets with a friend. I’m looking to start working on my HPR certification, but I’m not really sure where I have to start, especially because I’m not 18 so I think I have to get a Junior HPR cert instead of a regular one.

I have two main questions: what should I start doing to work toward an HPR certification, and would it be possible to use sugar rockets to get my certification?

Thank you for any help you can provide!
-George Stevens


(Junior?) HPR Certification

George Stevens
 

First of all, I apologize if I’m using this incorrectly, I’ve never used an email group like this before.

I’m a high school student and I’ve been launching small model rockets for a couple years now, and recently got started making small sugar rockets with a friend. I’m looking to start working on my HPR certification, but I’m not really sure where I have to start, especially because I’m not 18 so I think I have to get a Junior HPR cert instead of a regular one.

I have two main questions: what should I start doing to work toward an HPR certification, and would it be possible to use sugar rockets to get my certification?

Thank you for any help you can provide!
-George Stevens


Re: May the fun begin

M
 

Watching!

 

Mike Z

 

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io [mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io] On Behalf Of Tim Dixon
Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2020 8:56 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] May the fun begin

 

Given I am banned for like life from TRF, I thought I may be able to do a few build posts here. I have finally started to assemble my Cherokee-N. The goal is to fly it at Airfest in September. Parts have been laying around for 5-plus years starting back here: 7.74X Cherokee N (Is there a mechanical engineer in the house?) After considering more than a half dozen construction options, I have settled on the "Lego" approach where piece parts will be transported and final assembly done at the launch site as Bill Good did/does with his AGM-78 Standard Arm.

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