Date   
Re: Progress report pictures

Tim Dixon
 

Cool Mark!

I too am building although it is a bit tough while moving to a new location and getting things unpacked and set up. But, have a BSD Thor in a naked state, and a Mach 1 Daedalus in primer/filler.


On Wed, May 6, 2020, 5:35 PM Mark Joseph <markjos@...> wrote:
Well, since you asked...and just to point out that I really do build rockets sometimes - here's an impulse buy/project that I worked on over the weekend. It's a Mach 1 Trivecta 324 in progress. I've been interested in taking a look at his kits for a little while, so here it is - suddenly jumped to the head of the build pile. It was therapeutic to stop other things and mix some epoxy.

Thanks for asking, Gary!

Mark

________________________________________
From: cia-rocketry@groups.io <cia-rocketry@groups.io> on behalf of Gary Slater <gws77@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 4:11 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] Progress report pictures

Wondering if anyone has been working on rocket builds and or repairs beside Steve and I.

Care to share with some photos or are you saving for GARLO? Although I fear at this point a GARLO in June is in jeopardy.

Re: Progress report pictures

Mark Joseph
 

Well, since you asked...and just to point out that I really do build rockets sometimes - here's an impulse buy/project that I worked on over the weekend. It's a Mach 1 Trivecta 324 in progress. I've been interested in taking a look at his kits for a little while, so here it is - suddenly jumped to the head of the build pile. It was therapeutic to stop other things and mix some epoxy.

Thanks for asking, Gary!

Mark

________________________________________

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io <cia-rocketry@groups.io> on behalf of Gary Slater <gws77@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 4:11 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] Progress report pictures

Wondering if anyone has been working on rocket builds and or repairs beside Steve and I.

Care to share with some photos or are you saving for GARLO? Although I fear at this point a GARLO in June is in jeopardy.

Re: Progress report pictures

Rick Lyons
 

4" Madcow Nike Smoke, 2.6" Loc Precision AMRAAM AIM 120 C, and the Leviathan. I just finished the 4" Loc AMRAAM AIM 120 C, but am waiting for brown stripes from Stickershock instead of the incorrect blue stripes that came with the kits. Ready to do some flying.

On Wednesday, May 6, 2020, 4:11:56 PM CDT, Gary Slater <gws77@...> wrote:


Wondering if anyone has been working on rocket builds and or repairs beside Steve and I.

Care to share with some photos or are you saving for GARLO? Although I fear at this point a GARLO in June is in jeopardy.

Progress report pictures

Gary Slater
 

Wondering if anyone has been working on rocket builds and or repairs beside Steve and I.

Care to share with some photos or are you saving for GARLO? Although I fear at this point a GARLO in June is in jeopardy.

Re: Elastic for Masks

Wes Cravens
 

Yes, yes it did.  Thank you so very very much!!!

Osj is going to do a promotional write up to thank everyone that has helped make this happen for them. She's waiting on the masks to be delivered so that she can take some pictures and thank everyone at the same time along with photos of the results.  When she's got that ready I'll send it to the group for pre-approval for publication.

All the best,

Wes

On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 8:18 AM edwin hartle via groups.io <ed46112=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Greetings Wes!

Did it get there OK?

On Friday, April 24, 2020, 09:57:17 AM EDT, Wes Cravens <wcravens@...> wrote:


Many thanks!!! That is much appreciated.  You can send it to me at 811 Trailway Drive, Champaign, IL 61822.

Wes

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 6:56 AM edwin hartle via groups.io <ed46112=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Greetings Wes!

I have at least one 1/4 inch roll of elastic I can send. Please shoot me an e-mail and I can get it in the mail no later than Monday!

Evil Ed

On Thursday, April 23, 2020, 11:05:59 PM EDT, William Carney via groups.io <willcarney=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:


My role is fabric sewing elastic.  I could send a few feet by mail.  Just where?
William

In a message dated 4/23/2020 11:45:59 AM Central Standard Time, jsivier@... writes:

Aren't the Estes shock cords just rubber, rather than fabric sewing elastic? If those would work I have a bag of them we have replaced at workshops.

Jonathan

On 4/23/2020 12:03 AM, Wes Cravens wrote:
I think that the 1/8 will be fine.  Osj thought it might be a bit small... but my thinking is that anything that works will work.  She's worried that if people are wearing them all day that it might feel uncomfortable.  But again, what works will work.  And it beats a respirator no matter what!!!

Wes

On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 11:28 PM Christopher Deem <chris-deem@... <mailto:chris-deem@...>> wrote:

If your wife can use 1/8th inch elastic., I have some pre cut Estes shock cords. I will see how many I can dig up, some of them are 1/4 inch.



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Wes Cravens <wcravens@... <mailto:wcravens@...>>
Date: 4/22/20 4:52 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io <mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io>
Subject: [cia-rocketry] Elastic for Masks

Hello everyone,

My Wife works for Courage Connection, the Champaign-Urbana domestic violence shelter.  They have someone making masks for them but they are short on elastic.  Osj (my wife) checked the local hobby craft stores and haberdasheries but can't find any.  We raided a little bit from my rocket supplies.

If anyone has any elastic ribbon or rubber that they would be willing to share it would help them out a lot. Let me know.

All the best,

Wes

Re: Elastic for Masks

edwin hartle
 

Greetings Wes!

Did it get there OK?

On Friday, April 24, 2020, 09:57:17 AM EDT, Wes Cravens <wcravens@...> wrote:


Many thanks!!! That is much appreciated.  You can send it to me at 811 Trailway Drive, Champaign, IL 61822.

Wes

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 6:56 AM edwin hartle via groups.io <ed46112=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Greetings Wes!

I have at least one 1/4 inch roll of elastic I can send. Please shoot me an e-mail and I can get it in the mail no later than Monday!

Evil Ed

On Thursday, April 23, 2020, 11:05:59 PM EDT, William Carney via groups.io <willcarney=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:


My role is fabric sewing elastic.  I could send a few feet by mail.  Just where?
William

In a message dated 4/23/2020 11:45:59 AM Central Standard Time, jsivier@... writes:

Aren't the Estes shock cords just rubber, rather than fabric sewing elastic? If those would work I have a bag of them we have replaced at workshops.

Jonathan

On 4/23/2020 12:03 AM, Wes Cravens wrote:
I think that the 1/8 will be fine.  Osj thought it might be a bit small... but my thinking is that anything that works will work.  She's worried that if people are wearing them all day that it might feel uncomfortable.  But again, what works will work.  And it beats a respirator no matter what!!!

Wes

On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 11:28 PM Christopher Deem <chris-deem@... <mailto:chris-deem@...>> wrote:

If your wife can use 1/8th inch elastic., I have some pre cut Estes shock cords. I will see how many I can dig up, some of them are 1/4 inch.



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Wes Cravens <wcravens@... <mailto:wcravens@...>>
Date: 4/22/20 4:52 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io <mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io>
Subject: [cia-rocketry] Elastic for Masks

Hello everyone,

My Wife works for Courage Connection, the Champaign-Urbana domestic violence shelter.  They have someone making masks for them but they are short on elastic.  Osj (my wife) checked the local hobby craft stores and haberdasheries but can't find any.  We raided a little bit from my rocket supplies.

If anyone has any elastic ribbon or rubber that they would be willing to share it would help them out a lot. Let me know.

All the best,

Wes

Re: New again, with a little modification

Daniel Greuel
 

Neat build. 


On May 1, 2020, at 5:49 PM, Gary Slater <gws77@...> wrote:


Several years ago I built the unpainted rocket, a Flis Kits Borealis. It flew well the first flight at the scout event in Rantoul although not too high.  So I put a bigger motor in it for the second flight. Going from B to C who would have thought?  Just goes to show you, those tubes just weren't up to the higher thrust and you can see the result. And that can apply either way, too much or not enough.  It has sat around ever so slowly tilting more and more over the years.  

Anyway, I just happened to have another kit I've had for at least five years, laying around, waiting. I decided not to make the same mistake twice. So I modified it a bit. I think it still looks good and it will handle that higher thrust motor thus reach a higher altitude without any problems.

Waiting for GARLO!


<old Borealis.jpg>
<Borealis Done.jpg>

Rocket modification

Gary Slater
 

Trying this again.

Several years ago I built the unpainted rocket, a Flis Kits Borealis. It flew well the first flight at the scout event in Rantoul although not too high. So I put a bigger motor in it for the second flight. Going from B to C who would have thought? Just goes to show you, those tubes just weren't up to the higher thrust and you can see the result. And that can apply either way, too much or not enough. It has sat around ever so slowly tilting more and more over the years.

Anyway, I just happened to have another kit I've had for at least five years, laying around, waiting. I decided not to make the same mistake twice. So I modified it a bit. I think it still looks good and it will handle that higher thrust motor thus reach a higher altitude without any problems.

Waiting for GARLO!

Re: Buzz Bomb in Milford

Greg Smith
 

It’ll need a new coat of paint first.

 

I’ve always wondered if they named the JB-2 the Loon to try and convince the public that its sound was not really as offensive as it seemed (it was). It’s a lot less musical than the call of a real loon, but if you think of them both as “flying objects that make weird and loud sounds” then it may make some sense. It’s also less likely to upset the civilians than “buzzing white-hot purveyor of random death from the sky,” which would be the technical name for it.

 

- GDS

 

 

 

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io [mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Deem
Sent: Friday, May 01, 2020 5:58 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: Re: [cia-rocketry] Buzz Bomb in Milford

 

We can make it fly.

 

 

 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...>

Date: 5/1/20 5:53 PM (GMT-06:00)

To: CIA Email List <cia-rocketry@groups.io>

Subject: [cia-rocketry] Buzz Bomb in Milford

 

After 7 weeks of solitary confinement I broke down and make a break for it this afternoon. It was a nice day, so I took a drive to Milford, IL (about 70 miles from C-U depending on how you go) to take a look at the JB-2 Buzz Bomb they have on display. It is in a park on the west side of Route 1, just north of the Milford Elementary School and south of the Casey's. It is a very small park. If you blink you'll miss it.

The JB-2 was an American knock-off of the German V-1. Here is one of the pictures I took.

Jonathan

Re: Buzz Bomb in Milford

Christopher Deem
 

We can make it fly.



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...>
Date: 5/1/20 5:53 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: CIA Email List <cia-rocketry@groups.io>
Subject: [cia-rocketry] Buzz Bomb in Milford

After 7 weeks of solitary confinement I broke down and make a break for it this afternoon. It was a nice day, so I took a drive to Milford, IL (about 70 miles from C-U depending on how you go) to take a look at the JB-2 Buzz Bomb they have on display. It is in a park on the west side of Route 1, just north of the Milford Elementary School and south of the Casey's. It is a very small park. If you blink you'll miss it.

The JB-2 was an American knock-off of the German V-1. Here is one of the pictures I took.

Jonathan

Re: New again, with a little modification

Christopher Deem
 

Cool, can't wait to see it fly.



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Gary Slater <gws77@...>
Date: 5/1/20 5:50 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] New again, with a little modification

Several years ago I built the unpainted rocket, a Flis Kits Borealis. It flew well the first flight at the scout event in Rantoul although not too high.  So I put a bigger motor in it for the second flight. Going from B to C who would have thought?  Just goes to show you, those tubes just weren't up to the higher thrust and you can see the result. And that can apply either way, too much or not enough.  It has sat around ever so slowly tilting more and more over the years.  

Anyway, I just happened to have another kit I've had for at least five years, laying around, waiting. I decided not to make the same mistake twice. So I modified it a bit. I think it still looks good and it will handle that higher thrust motor thus reach a higher altitude without any problems.

Waiting for GARLO!


Re: New again, with a little modification

Jonathan Sivier
 

Looks nice.

Jonathan


On 5/1/2020 5:49 PM, Gary Slater wrote:
Several years ago I built the unpainted rocket, a Flis Kits Borealis. It flew well the first flight at the scout event in Rantoul although not too high.  So I put a bigger motor in it for the second flight. Going from B to C who would have thought?  Just goes to show you, those tubes just weren't up to the higher thrust and you can see the result. And that can apply either way, too much or not enough.  It has sat around ever so slowly tilting more and more over the years.

Anyway, I just happened to have another kit I've had for at least five years, laying around, waiting. I decided not to make the same mistake twice. So I modified it a bit. I think it still looks good and it will handle that higher thrust motor thus reach a higher altitude without any problems.

Waiting for GARLO!


Buzz Bomb in Milford

Jonathan Sivier
 

After 7 weeks of solitary confinement I broke down and make a break for it this afternoon. It was a nice day, so I took a drive to Milford, IL (about 70 miles from C-U depending on how you go) to take a look at the JB-2 Buzz Bomb they have on display. It is in a park on the west side of Route 1, just north of the Milford Elementary School and south of the Casey's. It is a very small park. If you blink you'll miss it.

The JB-2 was an American knock-off of the German V-1. Here is one of the pictures I took.

Jonathan

New again, with a little modification

Gary Slater
 

Several years ago I built the unpainted rocket, a Flis Kits Borealis. It flew well the first flight at the scout event in Rantoul although not too high.  So I put a bigger motor in it for the second flight. Going from B to C who would have thought?  Just goes to show you, those tubes just weren't up to the higher thrust and you can see the result. And that can apply either way, too much or not enough.  It has sat around ever so slowly tilting more and more over the years.  

Anyway, I just happened to have another kit I've had for at least five years, laying around, waiting. I decided not to make the same mistake twice. So I modified it a bit. I think it still looks good and it will handle that higher thrust motor thus reach a higher altitude without any problems.

Waiting for GARLO!


Re: true strength of shock cord ???

Gary Slater
 

I agree about the U-bolt Greg. I found this (https://giantleaprocketry.com/products/components_recovery.aspx) at Giant Leap and am considering it.  It's only about $7-8.  Have to use JB Weld.  I would also put a small ring above it.  I don't know the weight but I can also move it as far forward as allowable for the chute and shock cord.  A U-bolt for a 54mm tube will be problematic with a 29mm MMT.  A U- bolt for the  2.56 tube might be easier to find.  


On April 30, 2020 at 5:54 PM Greg Smith <gregs@...> wrote:

I have used 1500 pound test Kevlar in rockets up to about 4” diameter with no problems whatsoever.

 

I would rethink the idea of not using a U-bolt, however. It will make it nearly impossible to replace the Kevlar cord if it does wear out. Both of the two video camera rockets of mine that you have seen frequently are 2.14” diameter with a 29mm motor mount, and have a U-bolt in the front centering ring. The trick is to find a small enough U-bolt – and a great source for these is to disassemble a small (1/8” or ¼”) wire rope clip. Check them out at the hardware store and see if you can find one that will work. Lots of epoxy is recommended, and a time or two, I have had to slightly grind down the edge of one of the nuts where it protruded outside the edge of the centering ring, but it can be made to fit.

 

- GDS

 

 

 

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io [mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io] On Behalf Of Gary Slater
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2020 5:20 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] true strength of shock cord ???

 

I am building two small diameter rockets, both scratch.  One is 2.56 ID the other 2.14 ID, both have 29 mm motor tubes.  So there is little room for eye bolts down there.  I have seen lots of build threads on TRF where Kevlar cords are epoxied to the motor tube, which is what I am considering for both.  Some make these just long enough to come to top of air frame where you can reach it to attach a shock cord like nylon.  I have found some braided Kevlar cord on ebay rated at 2000 #.  It's only 3.5 mm.  But there is also a note that states "NOTE! Safe Working Load: 20% of original strength".  Both rockets are going to be in the 2-4 pound range.  The 2000 # rating seems quite adequate but that 20% is bothersome.  Are all cords really only that good?  Would any of you use this product?  

 



 

Re: true strength of shock cord ???

Greg Smith
 

I have used 1500 pound test Kevlar in rockets up to about 4” diameter with no problems whatsoever.

 

I would rethink the idea of not using a U-bolt, however. It will make it nearly impossible to replace the Kevlar cord if it does wear out. Both of the two video camera rockets of mine that you have seen frequently are 2.14” diameter with a 29mm motor mount, and have a U-bolt in the front centering ring. The trick is to find a small enough U-bolt – and a great source for these is to disassemble a small (1/8” or ¼”) wire rope clip. Check them out at the hardware store and see if you can find one that will work. Lots of epoxy is recommended, and a time or two, I have had to slightly grind down the edge of one of the nuts where it protruded outside the edge of the centering ring, but it can be made to fit.

 

- GDS

 

 

 

From: cia-rocketry@groups.io [mailto:cia-rocketry@groups.io] On Behalf Of Gary Slater
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2020 5:20 PM
To: cia-rocketry@groups.io
Subject: [cia-rocketry] true strength of shock cord ???

 

I am building two small diameter rockets, both scratch.  One is 2.56 ID the other 2.14 ID, both have 29 mm motor tubes.  So there is little room for eye bolts down there.  I have seen lots of build threads on TRF where Kevlar cords are epoxied to the motor tube, which is what I am considering for both.  Some make these just long enough to come to top of air frame where you can reach it to attach a shock cord like nylon.  I have found some braided Kevlar cord on ebay rated at 2000 #.  It's only 3.5 mm.  But there is also a note that states "NOTE! Safe Working Load: 20% of original strength".  Both rockets are going to be in the 2-4 pound range.  The 2000 # rating seems quite adequate but that 20% is bothersome.  Are all cords really only that good?  Would any of you use this product?  

Re: true strength of shock cord ???

Daniel Greuel
 

I’ve read it should be 50times the static weight of the rocket. So 200# for 4# rocket. What you got should be plenty. I run 1/4 tubular on my 38mm and it is overkill and takes up valuable space. 1/8” would be plenty in a 2# rocket. I like to Brummell splice my ends and 1/4” is about as small as I can handle splicing loops. I also use electric shrink wrap to hold the Brummell splice and to protect Kevlar where it rubs on the end of a tube. 

Dan


On Apr 30, 2020, at 5:33 PM, Wes Cravens <wcravens@...> wrote:


I think that the primary reason that they don't go all the way out of the body tube is that it's really easy for kevlar to cut a line in your rocket like cheese wire.  Usually because they are so thin.  3.5mm Kevlar is probably overkill for sub 4"-5" rockets.  I could be wrong, but my instinct is that you can get away with much smaller.  Of course, it it was my rocket, I'd be doing math too.

Working load is probably the weight that the cord can carry day in day out forever.  So 20% of 2000# forever is a bunch more than 2-4 lbs.  I've not done much research into the impulse strength of kevlar.  Probably not as good as dyneema but still probably better than just about any other material that you're likely to put into a mid sized rocket.

So yes, I would trust the product you are describing, but I also think that you are at least an order of magnitude (or two) over engineered.

$0.02,

Wes 

On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 5:19 PM Gary Slater <gws77@...> wrote:
I am building two small diameter rockets, both scratch.  One is 2.56 ID the other 2.14 ID, both have 29 mm motor tubes.  So there is little room for eye bolts down there.  I have seen lots of build threads on TRF where Kevlar cords are epoxied to the motor tube, which is what I am considering for both.  Some make these just long enough to come to top of air frame where you can reach it to attach a shock cord like nylon.  I have found some braided Kevlar cord on ebay rated at 2000 #.  It's only 3.5 mm.  But there is also a note that states "NOTE! Safe Working Load: 20% of original strength".  Both rockets are going to be in the 2-4 pound range.  The 2000 # rating seems quite adequate but that 20% is bothersome.  Are all cords really only that good?  Would any of you use this product?  

Re: true strength of shock cord ???

Wes Cravens
 

I think that the primary reason that they don't go all the way out of the body tube is that it's really easy for kevlar to cut a line in your rocket like cheese wire.  Usually because they are so thin.  3.5mm Kevlar is probably overkill for sub 4"-5" rockets.  I could be wrong, but my instinct is that you can get away with much smaller.  Of course, it it was my rocket, I'd be doing math too.

Working load is probably the weight that the cord can carry day in day out forever.  So 20% of 2000# forever is a bunch more than 2-4 lbs.  I've not done much research into the impulse strength of kevlar.  Probably not as good as dyneema but still probably better than just about any other material that you're likely to put into a mid sized rocket.

So yes, I would trust the product you are describing, but I also think that you are at least an order of magnitude (or two) over engineered.

$0.02,

Wes 

On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 5:19 PM Gary Slater <gws77@...> wrote:
I am building two small diameter rockets, both scratch.  One is 2.56 ID the other 2.14 ID, both have 29 mm motor tubes.  So there is little room for eye bolts down there.  I have seen lots of build threads on TRF where Kevlar cords are epoxied to the motor tube, which is what I am considering for both.  Some make these just long enough to come to top of air frame where you can reach it to attach a shock cord like nylon.  I have found some braided Kevlar cord on ebay rated at 2000 #.  It's only 3.5 mm.  But there is also a note that states "NOTE! Safe Working Load: 20% of original strength".  Both rockets are going to be in the 2-4 pound range.  The 2000 # rating seems quite adequate but that 20% is bothersome.  Are all cords really only that good?  Would any of you use this product?  

true strength of shock cord ???

Gary Slater
 

I am building two small diameter rockets, both scratch.  One is 2.56 ID the other 2.14 ID, both have 29 mm motor tubes.  So there is little room for eye bolts down there.  I have seen lots of build threads on TRF where Kevlar cords are epoxied to the motor tube, which is what I am considering for both.  Some make these just long enough to come to top of air frame where you can reach it to attach a shock cord like nylon.  I have found some braided Kevlar cord on ebay rated at 2000 #.  It's only 3.5 mm.  But there is also a note that states "NOTE! Safe Working Load: 20% of original strength".  Both rockets are going to be in the 2-4 pound range.  The 2000 # rating seems quite adequate but that 20% is bothersome.  Are all cords really only that good?  Would any of you use this product?  

Re: OR and Rocksim file swap

Gary Slater
 

I have opened .ork files in Rocksim and saved them as .rkt files.  
Conversely, I have done the same now.  I figured it out just now.  But I had to go about it a long way.  
The problem with my .rkt file is pods.  Open Rocket does not currently support pods and the pods are giving me a problem with simulations in Rocksim ver 10.  Any pro Rocksim users who know how to get pods to work please let me know.  

On April 29, 2020 at 5:13 PM Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...> wrote:

I don't think Rocksim can open OpenRocket files, but OpenRocket can load and save Rocksim files. So if you have an OpenRocket file you could re-save it as a Rocksim file and then you should be able to open it in Rocksim. Sometimes things don't transfer exactly correctly so you may have to make a few small corrections, but in general it should work.

Jonathan

On 4/29/2020 5:05 PM, Gary Slater wrote:
I know there is a way to open an Open Rocket file in Rocksim.

Is there a way to open a Ricksim file in Open Rocket ?