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Wiggio closing down

Richard Russell
 

Anybody who needs to know should already be aware that Wiggio, which hosts a BB4W support group, is closing on 17th November (I have reason to believe that this time it really will happen, unlike the false alarm in December last year!).

If you are reading this you are evidently subscribed to one of the remaining forums (Conforums or Groups.io) so from that point of view you don't need to take any action. However some of you may have used Wiggio as a files repository (I know I have) so you might want to check whether there are files there that you link to from a website or post, and if so move them elsewhere.

There are a number of files referenced at the BB4W Wiki which are stored at Wiggio so I will try to remember to move those too. If you do find any broken links let me know.

Richard.

Richard Russell
 

On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 04:26 am, Richard Russell wrote:
There are a number of files referenced at the BB4W Wiki which are stored at Wiggio so I will try to remember to move those
I remembered, but despite Wiggio not (at the time) having yet closed the files are no longer accessible; sorry.  There are now quite a lot of links at the Wiki (particularly from the 'Libraries' page) that go nowhere.  Still, if there really are fewer than 20 active users of BB4W worldwide, as seems to be widely believed, it's completely irrelevant.  I might as well close down the Wiki (that will save me some money too) and all the support groups and forums for all the difference it will make.  Farewell BBC BASIC.

Richard.

Alex Farlie
 



On 18/11/2017 17:18, Richard Russell wrote:
On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 04:26 am, Richard Russell wrote:
There are a number of files referenced at the BB4W Wiki which are stored at Wiggio so I will try to remember to move those
I remembered, but despite Wiggio not (at the time) having yet closed the files are no longer accessible; sorry.  There are now quite a lot of links at the Wiki (particularly from the 'Libraries' page) that go nowhere.  Still, if there really are fewer than 20 active users of BB4W worldwide, as seems to be widely believed, it's completely irrelevant.  I might as well close down the Wiki (that will save me some money too) and all the support groups and forums for all the difference it will make.  Farewell BBC BASIC.

If the user base has got to that point (which I don't think it has), at least consider some form of persistent permanent archive for the content, It would be a shame to loose the valuable technical content that's been contributed on the wiki and on the forums. 

It's a major pain in the [REDACTED] that wikispaces, isn't seemingly compatible with the archive.org page archiving system.   Some of the forum pages on bb4w.conforums.com and bbcbasic.conforums.com are present in archive form. but archive.org's crawler seems to also be incompatible with forum style cgi derived links (Sigh).





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Richard Russell
 

On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 12:13 pm, Alex Farlie wrote:

at least consider some form of persistent permanent archive for the content
I'm certain that a few people took their own copies when it looked like the Wiki would have to close a couple of years ago, when Wikispaces started charging for it.  Each year since the cost has gone up by more than can be justified by inflation; I think another payment must be due soon.

It's a major pain that wikispaces, isn't seemingly compatible with the archive.org page archiving system.
Is it "incompatible" or have the pages been explicitly flagged as 'do not archive'?

Richard.

Alex Farlie
 



On 18/11/2017 21:39, Richard Russell wrote:
On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 12:13 pm, Alex Farlie wrote:

at least consider some form of persistent permanent archive for the content
I'm certain that a few people took their own copies when it looked like the Wiki would have to close a couple of years ago, when Wikispaces started charging for it.  Each year since the cost has gone up by more than can be justified by inflation; I think another payment must be due soon.

Sadly I don't know of an easy to archive a copy for my use though :(

It's a major pain that wikispaces, isn't seemingly compatible with the archive.org page archiving system.
Is it "incompatible" or have the pages been explicitly flagged as 'do not archive'?


302 and incomprehensible redirection, which is good as incompatible :(




Alex Farlie

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Richard Russell
 

On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 02:24 pm, Alex Farlie wrote:
Sadly I don't know of an easy to archive a copy for my use though :(
Assuming you are a member of the Wiki, can you not see the export page ?  That used to be available to all members, but maybe I'm now the only one who can access it.

Richard.

Alex Farlie
 



On 18/11/2017 22:40, Richard Russell wrote:
On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 02:24 pm, Alex Farlie wrote:
Sadly I don't know of an easy to archive a copy for my use though :(
Assuming you are a member of the Wiki, can you not see the export page ?  That used to be available to all members, but maybe I'm now the only one who can access it.


I don't think I am a member on the Wikispaces wiki.  If it's anything like Mediawiki installs, export is per page, not per wiki though :( 

Alex Farlie.

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Richard Russell
 

On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 03:29 pm, Alex Farlie wrote:
I don't think I am a member on the Wikispaces wiki.  If it's anything like Mediawiki installs, export is per page, not per wiki though :( 
It has always been possible to export the entire BB4W Wiki, either as HTML, Wikitext or PDF.  This is one of the reasons (along with the syntax-coloured BBC BASIC code listings, and the lack of advertisements) why I considered it worthwhile to pay to continue to use the Wikispaces service.  If you aren't even a member of the Wiki, I don't think you can really complain about any shortcomings it may have!

Perhaps somebody who has actually bothered to join the Wiki (and there are currently 148 members) can check whether they are able to access the export page or not.  If it turns out that only organisers can (which means me and Jonathan Harston), it isn't exactly difficult to contact one or other of us to arrange an export.  In the past such exports were copied to the Files area of the group (the old Yahoo! group at the time) but I don't think anybody has asked since we migrated to Groups.io.

Richard.

Neil Murray
 

I became a member, opened 'BB4W Wiki' and signed in.
Then from groups.io, clicked the link 'export page'.
I received the information message at the top right 'You must be an organizer to access that page'.

Richard Russell
 

On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 11:18 am, Neil Murray wrote:
I received the information message at the top right 'You must be an organizer to access that page'.
Thanks for the confirmation.  Obviously at some point Wikispaces has introduced that restriction (one can understand why).  Requesting Jonathan or myself to do an export - so long as it's only infrequently - is a practical solution.

Richard.

dai_m_leeds
 

On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 09:18 am, Richard Russell wrote:
There are now quite a lot of links at the Wiki (particularly from the 'Libraries' page) that go nowhere.

Hi Richard,

Maybe it's not a total disaster: I've got some of the libraries, and others may well also have some. Maybe if you post a list of the (most important?) "missing" files, we can try to reconstruct the archive?

I've got Jon Ripley's Cardlib, and the BB4WMAPMLIB, and various versions of David Williams' GFXLib and GLib, for example, if that's useful.

Best wishes,

D

Richard Russell
 

On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 09:24 am, dai_m_leeds wrote:
I've got Jon Ripley's Cardlib, and the BB4WMAPMLIB, and various versions of David Williams' GFXLib and GLib, for example, if that's useful.
Those specific libraries were only ever available from the authors' own sites, not from Wiggio.  They must not be uploaded to a public repository without the explicit permission of the copyright holders.

Richard.