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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
BOB KISS
I recall chatting with Judy Seigel at her west village home one afternoon when she repeated an adage that she has used many times, "I refuse to work in any process where the chemicals to make a print cost more than the chemicals in my body!" The human body chems are worth about $9 so I guess, as long as we make 8X10s Pt/Pds or smaller, she won't do a "roll over Beethoven"! But she would have been REALLY pissed at me for making 20X24 Pt/Pd prints with mostly Pd!!! And I won't even MENTION my uranotypes! LOL!!!
From: altphotolist@groups.io [mailto:altphotolist@groups.io] On Behalf Of Christina Z. Anderson
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 12:13 PM To: Alt List Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
Thanks for this clarification, Don! It is so strange, isn’t it (and what is the reason behind) that a Troy ounce is different than a US ounce.
Gives new meaning to that YouTube video of the guy making huge palladium prints that Mark Nelson sent to me.
SO by my calculations, $2390.50/31.103 is $76.8575 per g. Palladium is 5 g per 55 ml so that would be $384.28 per 55 ml or 55 8x10 prints or $6.9877 a print. BW paper is about $1 an 8x10 today.
When I first started teaching palladium in 2006 I used to buy powder for the whole class from Englehard at $13 a gram, mix up a liter of the stuff and divvy it up, which made an 8x10 print $1.18. That, of course, went by the wayside years ago, somewhere around when Englehard went to BASF or something.
Now I am having four students split a palladium kit and make only 4x5 prints.
I do prefer the warm tones of palladium but heck, at palladium double the cost of platinum it seems platinum is now the way to go.
Chris
On Jan 19, 2021, at 8:42 AM, Don Nelson <ac7zg@...> wrote:
Precious metals prices are in Troy Ounces, not US ounces. A Troy ounce is 31.103 grams whereas a US ounce is 28.349 grams.
So a US pound of precious metals would be 14.5833 Troy ounces.
Don Nelson On Jan 19, 2021, at 7:07 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Don Nelson
Not really – gold is trading at around $1842 per troy ounce. Platinum currently around $1093, Palladium currently $2386, Silver $25.33
So Platinum would be the process for permanent prints, with Gold and Palladium being very expensive
Don
From: altphotolist@groups.io <altphotolist@groups.io> On Behalf Of BOB KISS
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 8:46 AM To: altphotolist@groups.io Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
And it makes Aurotypes and other gold based processes look downright reasonable! LOL!!!
From: altphotolist@groups.io [mailto:altphotolist@groups.io] On Behalf Of Christina Z. Anderson
Thanks for this clarification, Don! It is so strange, isn’t it (and what is the reason behind) that a Troy ounce is different than a US ounce.
Gives new meaning to that YouTube video of the guy making huge palladium prints that Mark Nelson sent to me.
SO by my calculations, $2390.50/31.103 is $76.8575 per g. Palladium is 5 g per 55 ml so that would be $384.28 per 55 ml or 55 8x10 prints or $6.9877 a print. BW paper is about $1 an 8x10 today.
When I first started teaching palladium in 2006 I used to buy powder for the whole class from Englehard at $13 a gram, mix up a liter of the stuff and divvy it up, which made an 8x10 print $1.18. That, of course, went by the wayside years ago, somewhere around when Englehard went to BASF or something.
Now I am having four students split a palladium kit and make only 4x5 prints.
I do prefer the warm tones of palladium but heck, at palladium double the cost of platinum it seems platinum is now the way to go.
Chris
On Jan 19, 2021, at 8:42 AM, Don Nelson <ac7zg@...> wrote:
Precious metals prices are in Troy Ounces, not US ounces. A Troy ounce is 31.103 grams whereas a US ounce is 28.349 grams.
So a US pound of precious metals would be 14.5833 Troy ounces.
Don Nelson
On Jan 19, 2021, at 7:07 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Christina Z. Anderson
How do you know all this? Are you in this metals biz or was this just for your palladium printing research?
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This is quite useful for my class so I thank you! Chris
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Don Nelson
From the JM Bullion Website: (https://www.jmbullion.com/investing-guide/types-physical-metals/troy-oz/) History of the Troy Ounce No one knows for sure when and where the Troy weight system was born, but the most commonly held explanation is that its name is derived from Troyes, a trade market in France. Merchants came from all over the world to buy and sell goods, so a standardized weight system would have made doing business much easier. Later, many places in Europe came up with their own version of the troy ounce, but the French troy is believed to be the system most closely related to the one that we use today. If we care to trace the origins of the troy even further back, we could look to the Roman monetary system. Romans used bronze bars as currency, and the bar that was equal to one pound today was referred to as an “aes grave.” A twelfth of that was called an “uncia,” or ounce. Today, a troy ounce is a twelfth of a troy pound.
From: altphotolist@groups.io <altphotolist@groups.io> On Behalf Of Christina Z. Anderson
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 8:13 AM To: Alt List <altphotolist@groups.io> Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
Thanks for this clarification, Don! It is so strange, isn’t it (and what is the reason behind) that a Troy ounce is different than a US ounce.
Gives new meaning to that YouTube video of the guy making huge palladium prints that Mark Nelson sent to me.
SO by my calculations, $2390.50/31.103 is $76.8575 per g. Palladium is 5 g per 55 ml so that would be $384.28 per 55 ml or 55 8x10 prints or $6.9877 a print. BW paper is about $1 an 8x10 today.
When I first started teaching palladium in 2006 I used to buy powder for the whole class from Englehard at $13 a gram, mix up a liter of the stuff and divvy it up, which made an 8x10 print $1.18. That, of course, went by the wayside years ago, somewhere around when Englehard went to BASF or something.
Now I am having four students split a palladium kit and make only 4x5 prints.
I do prefer the warm tones of palladium but heck, at palladium double the cost of platinum it seems platinum is now the way to go.
Chris
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Don Nelson
The cross over occurred back in February 2019 – where Palladium Troy Ounce was more than Platinum Troy Ounce. It is driven by two primary factors – the autocatalytic market (notably USA and China where Diesel isn’t used compared to the Diesel vehicles in Europe and elsewhere which don’t use the metals), and at times, temporary mine closures in Russia ( 40% of the global Pd ) and South Africa (supplies 75% of the global Pt and 38% of the global Pd. A mine closure in May, 2020 sent Pd prices soaring.) Here’s the historical prices followed by a graph of Pd prices divided by Pt prices (so 1 is the crossover point)
Don
From: altphotolist@groups.io <altphotolist@groups.io> On Behalf Of Don Nelson
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 7:43 AM To: altphotolist@groups.io Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
Precious metals prices are in Troy Ounces, not US ounces. A Troy ounce is 31.103 grams whereas a US ounce is 28.349 grams.
So a US pound of precious metals would be 14.5833 Troy ounces.
Don Nelson
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
BOB KISS
And it makes Aurotypes and other gold based processes look downright reasonable! LOL!!!
From: altphotolist@groups.io [mailto:altphotolist@groups.io] On Behalf Of Christina Z. Anderson
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 12:13 PM To: Alt List Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
Thanks for this clarification, Don! It is so strange, isn’t it (and what is the reason behind) that a Troy ounce is different than a US ounce.
Gives new meaning to that YouTube video of the guy making huge palladium prints that Mark Nelson sent to me.
SO by my calculations, $2390.50/31.103 is $76.8575 per g. Palladium is 5 g per 55 ml so that would be $384.28 per 55 ml or 55 8x10 prints or $6.9877 a print. BW paper is about $1 an 8x10 today.
When I first started teaching palladium in 2006 I used to buy powder for the whole class from Englehard at $13 a gram, mix up a liter of the stuff and divvy it up, which made an 8x10 print $1.18. That, of course, went by the wayside years ago, somewhere around when Englehard went to BASF or something.
Now I am having four students split a palladium kit and make only 4x5 prints.
I do prefer the warm tones of palladium but heck, at palladium double the cost of platinum it seems platinum is now the way to go.
Chris
On Jan 19, 2021, at 8:42 AM, Don Nelson <ac7zg@...> wrote:
Precious metals prices are in Troy Ounces, not US ounces. A Troy ounce is 31.103 grams whereas a US ounce is 28.349 grams.
So a US pound of precious metals would be 14.5833 Troy ounces.
Don Nelson On Jan 19, 2021, at 7:07 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Christina Z. Anderson
Thanks for this clarification, Don! It is so strange, isn’t it (and what is the reason behind) that a Troy ounce is different than a US ounce.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Gives new meaning to that YouTube video of the guy making huge palladium prints that Mark Nelson sent to me. SO by my calculations, $2390.50/31.103 is $76.8575 per g. Palladium is 5 g per 55 ml so that would be $384.28 per 55 ml or 55 8x10 prints or $6.9877 a print. BW paper is about $1 an 8x10 today. When I first started teaching palladium in 2006 I used to buy powder for the whole class from Englehard at $13 a gram, mix up a liter of the stuff and divvy it up, which made an 8x10 print $1.18. That, of course, went by the wayside years ago, somewhere around when Englehard went to BASF or something. Now I am having four students split a palladium kit and make only 4x5 prints. I do prefer the warm tones of palladium but heck, at palladium double the cost of platinum it seems platinum is now the way to go. Chris
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Don Nelson
Precious metals prices are in Troy Ounces, not US ounces. A Troy ounce is 31.103 grams whereas a US ounce is 28.349 grams.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
So a US pound of precious metals would be 14.5833 Troy ounces. Don Nelson
On Jan 19, 2021, at 7:07 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Clay Harmon
A single palladium print can cost about the same as a comparably sized polymer plate, so yeah. Additional prints are only the paper cost plus some ink.
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C
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
I guess this is why I am getting so many questions about photopolymer gravures.
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Greg
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Clay Harmon
Just an FYI for the list - I was cleaning out my darkroom and discovered that I have far too much palladium solution and PdCl for me to realistically use because I am doing far more polymer photogravure nowadays.
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I plan on selling my stock. Anyone interested in buying it at 95% of the current going price, get in touch with me. I have 600ml of lithium palladium solution and 295ml of sodium palladium solution along with 13.5g of palladium chloride. I will sell quantities as small as 25ml. It is stupid for me to keep this when I am not using it. Clay
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
BOB KISS
$US/ounce
From: altphotolist@groups.io [mailto:altphotolist@groups.io] On Behalf Of Pablo,
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 10:56 AM To: altphotolist@groups.io Subject: Re: [altphotolist] METAL PRICES!!!
Bob,
That is why everybody’s doing 100% platinum now! What’s the unit for those prices ?
Pablo
On Jan 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
NUTTIER AND NUTTIER (please forgive me, Charles Lutwidge Dodgson). This is insane for those of us who used a high palladium to platinum ration for warm print color, etc!
<image001.jpg>
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Anne Eder
UGH Don't I know it. Just taught a Ziatype workshop and even the LiPd has shot up in price. Anne
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 9:57 AM Diana Bloomfield, <dlhbloomfield@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Diana Bloomfield,
Yikes. Happy New Year, Bob! Lucky for me, I guess, that I don’t like that warm color and am in the more affordable money-saving platinum consumer group. :)
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 9:51 AM BOB KISS <bobkiss@...> wrote:
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Re: METAL PRICES!!!
Pablo,
Bob,
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That is why everybody’s doing 100% platinum now! What’s the unit for those prices ? Pablo
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METAL PRICES!!!
BOB KISS
NUTTIER AND NUTTIER (please forgive me, Charles Lutwidge Dodgson). This is insane for those of us who used a high palladium to platinum ration for warm print color, etc!
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Re: Largest size paper for gum printing
Hi Brittany and all,
As Jacques Kevers wrote in the previous post, if you do not want to fight against aper rolls curvatures, you might also go with the beautiful Arches Platine 310g/m². You may buy it in 76 x 112 cm sheets with 4 deckled edges. Alt cheers from France, Le 19/01/2021 à 12:51, Jacques Kevers a
écrit :
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Re: Largest size paper for gum printing
Jacques Kevers
If you prefer rolls, I would suggest Fabriano Artistico - as other did before me. Paper from rolls can be hard to get flat... My friend Jean Janssis (http://www.lagalerie.be/jeanjanssis/) is making large format gum prints on Hahnemuhle Fine Art engraving Paper ( https://tinyurl.com/hahngrav ) It comes in 56x76cm sheet, but also in 78x106cm. The latter is not pure white though, but "cream". Best, Jacques Jacques Kevers Beau Site+32 2 653 56 02
Le lun. 18 janv. 2021 à 15:34, Brittany Nelson, <brittanynelsonstudio@...> a écrit : Hi list,
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Re: Largest size paper for gum printing
davidh Hatton
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Re: Largest size paper for gum printing
Dr Edward Draper,
Brittany, hi
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My paper of choice for gum printing is Saunders Waterford 190gsm HP - it comes in a 10m roll I hope this helps, Edward
On 18 Jan 2021, at 14:34, Brittany Nelson, <brittanynelsonstudio@gmail.com> wrote:
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