Topics

Smart Electricity Meter


g4zod@btinternet.com
 

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Andy G4JNT
 

No. They use mobile phone bands and home RF (= 432/864MHz etc ISM)
No RFI mechanism

They're a novelty to play with and doesn't cost you anything
Despite the paranoia discussed about them - on various Groups in the past.



Virus-free. www.avg.com


On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:
I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Neil Smith G4DBN
 

Ask them to confirm it is a SMETS2 model and that there is full portability if you change supplier. If they try to palm you off with anything else, tell them to go away. 
The meters I have been involved with have up to five different comms methods depending on where you live.
Neil G4DBN

-------- Original message --------
From: "g4zod@... via Groups.Io" <g4zod@...>
Date: 03/10/2019 11:49 (GMT+00:00)
To: ukmicrowaves@groups.io
Subject: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Gordon REASON
 

JUST  HAD ONE FITTED .. ALL QUIET HERE IN THE SOUTH MIDLANDS ...............

On 03 October 2019 at 11:49 "g4zod@... via Groups.Io" <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Brian Howie GM4DIJ
 

In message <CAA8k23TfqoA=+jaRV8TMouHEn3UJaF7fp-bckx975JVA_mJ7pw@...>, Andy G4JNT <andy.g4jnt@...> writes
No. They use mobile phone bands and home RF (= 432/864MHz etc ISM)
No RFI mechanism

They're a novelty to play with and doesn't cost you anything
Despite the paranoia discussed about them - on various Groups in the past.

Andy
www.g4jnt.com
I've not noticed anything, but RFI is pretty dire here anyway.

I'll need to look for mine on the bands you mentioned on the funcube dongle. The Scottish Power site however says:-

"The short range radio signal is similar to wifi and bluetooth, but is actually a low energy system called Zigbee."


My electric meter is in a metal box, but the RF seems to get out. The gas one is plastic.

I was disappointed that you can't access the meter data from the module even though there's a USB lead. It would have been nice to plot it over time. My computer can see the USB port as unrecognised, so it is doing more than the charging power.

73 Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie


Alan G0XBV
 

How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?
 
Al G0XBV
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Howie GM4DIJ <brian@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 12:49
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

In message
<CAA8k23TfqoA=+jaRV8TMouHEn3UJaF7fp-bckx975JVA_mJ7pw@...>,
Andy G4JNT <andy.g4jnt@...> writes
>No. They use mobile phone bands and home RF (= 432/864MHz etc ISM)
>No RFI mechanism
>
>They're a novelty to play with and doesn't cost you anything
>Despite the paranoia discussed about them - on various Groups in the past.
>
>Andy
>www.g4jnt.com

I've not noticed anything, but RFI is pretty dire here anyway.

I'll need to look for mine on the bands you mentioned on the funcube
dongle. The Scottish Power site however says:-

"The short range radio signal is similar to wifi and bluetooth, but is
actually a low energy system called Zigbee."


My electric meter is in a metal box, but the RF seems to get out. The
gas one is plastic.

I was disappointed that you can't  access the meter data from the module
even though there's a USB lead. It would have been nice to plot it over
time.  My computer can see the USB port as unrecognised, so it is doing
more than the  charging power.

73 Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie




Tim Hague M0AFJ
 

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms..wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation..

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Alan G0XBV
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Tim Hague M0AFJ
 

Hi Alan, no the Gas meter has an inbuilt (I assume) High capacity battery guaranteed for 10 years, I did ask the question of the first installer and they have never changed one.

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 15:06, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE@...> wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Alan G0XBV
 

Thanks for the info, Tim.  I have an LCD electric meter and that seems to have a clock that runs @ 99KHz.  Audible from 198KHz up!
Al
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 15:29
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

Hi Alan, no the Gas meter has an inbuilt (I assume) High capacity battery guaranteed for 10 years, I did ask the question of the first installer and they have never changed one.

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 15:06, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE@...> wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Adrian G4UVZ
 

Lies and statistics.......Whilst the wonder new meters will be powered from the Supplier side of the mains, it

would be interesting to know how much they consume from the grid compared with an old style Ferraris disk

meter?

What is quantifiable however is the the power consumed by the display units, at the consumes expense!

Ok, maybe the consumption is only 1 watt in which case the annual consumption will be a shade under 9 KWh

per year, so £1-2 a year per household.

From another angle .....Sept 2018 there were 12.8 million smart meters installed.. every million translates to

an extra MEGAWATT of generation required from the grid!

Lies and Statistics!


Andy G4JNT
 

Oh Dear ... ;-(

You don't have to have it switched on



On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 at 15:38, Adrian G4UVZ via Groups.Io <adrianwhatmore248=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:

What is quantifiable, however, is the the power consumed by the display units at the consumer's expense!



Virus-free. www.avg.com


Stephen Tompsett
 

If you do want one, make sure that you get a SMETS-2 meter instead of an obsolete/non-upgradable/non-transferable meter. I  think they still haven't got the infrastructure installed to allow first generation meters to be transferred to a new supplier.

Personally I would prefer not to have a remote electricity supply disconnect relay installed in my electricity supply - strange how they don't mention that capability of 'smart' meters.

On 03/10/2019 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io wrote:
I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail
-- 
Stephen Tompsett
Tel: 01788 578940
Mob: 07956 855816
Eml: stephen@...


Andy G4JNT
 

Remember Fri 9 August, when 10% of the country was deliberately switched off by automatic load-shedding.
Just think if they could do that by randomly selecting 10% of households in the UK

Joking apart, there are rules in place about that remote cut off ability.   It amounts te the same in law as if they disconnect you 'normally' by coming to the house and removing the service fuse.

(There was a VERY long discussion about smart meters on RSGB-Technical a year or so back, a lot of details were given)



Virus-free. www.avg.com


On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 at 16:00, Stephen Tompsett <stephen@...> wrote:

If you do want one, make sure that you get a SMETS-2 meter instead of an obsolete/non-upgradable/non-transferable meter. I  think they still haven't got the infrastructure installed to allow first generation meters to be transferred to a new supplier.

Personally I would prefer not to have a remote electricity supply disconnect relay installed in my electricity supply - strange how they don't mention that capability of 'smart' meters.

On 03/10/2019 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io wrote:
I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail
-- 
Stephen Tompsett
Tel: 01788 578940
Mob: 07956 855816
Eml: stephen@...


Brian Howie GM4DIJ
 

In message <1505174528.1976936.1570103507833@...>, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE=aol.com@groups.io> writes
How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?
 
Al G0XBV
I wondered about that. I first thought of a small turbine, but it turns out there's a battery, which will have to be replaced eventually.

Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie


John E. Beech
 

On the subject of remote metering, I had a water meter fitted a few months ago. I'm sure the fitter said it worked via Bluetooth, but I seem to remember that I had to have mobile phone coverage in my area when I applied for it. Anyway it hasn't caused any RFI problems.

de John G8SEQ

-------Original Message-------
From: g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod=btinternet.com@groups.io>
To: ukmicrowaves@groups.io <ukmicrowaves@groups.io>
Subject: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter
Sent: Oct 03 '19 11:49

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to
replace the recently installed standard new one.

Will it bring RFI into my station?

Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?

(It seems I can object if I contact them.)

Many thanks.

G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


alwyn.seeds1
 

Dear Andy,

The legalities are clear. The difficulty is when a malign actor or a software error causes disconnection.

What has been reported by, for example, NCSC, in the open literature about the security aspects of the UK smart metering programme is far from comforting.

I have therefore insisted (and it requires quoting the relevant legislation) on not having one of these fitted.

Regards,

Alwyn

_____________________________________________________

Alwyn Seeds, Director
SynOptika Ltd.,
114 Beaufort Street,
London,
SW3 6BU,
England.

Tel.: +44 (0) 20 7376 4110


SynOptika Ltd., Registered in England and Wales: No. 04606737
Registered Office: 114 Beaufort Street, London, SW3 6BU, United Kingdom.
_____________________________________________________


ian hope (2E0IJH)
 

As a Spark, I would never have a smart meter.
 
Too many instances of False reading's if house has lots of LED lights or switch mode supplies.
 
Too many issues with software compatibilities between operators
 
Lots of cases of software errors causing the meter to disconnect supply
 
lots of cases of meter false reporting loss of supply tampering causing the DNO to turn up on your doorstep
 
Bring back a good old fashioned meter with a spinning disc is my view and one held between lots in the electrical industry, They have been pushed by the goverment are not reliable, They dont actually save electricity, all they do is show you remotely how much you using, so you tend to turn things off, if you want a remote power meter, many about that just clip on the tails.
 
Ian
2E0IJH

 
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2019 at 9:56 AM
From: "alwyn.seeds1" <a.seeds@...>
To: "UK Microwaves groups.io" <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter
Dear Andy,
 
The legalities are clear. The difficulty is when a malign actor or a software error causes disconnection.
 
What has been reported by, for example, NCSC, in the open literature about the security aspects of the UK smart metering programme is far from comforting.
 
I have therefore insisted (and it requires quoting the relevant legislation) on not having one of these fitted.
 
Regards,
 
Alwyn
 
_____________________________________________________
 
Alwyn Seeds, Director
SynOptika Ltd.,
114 Beaufort Street,
London,
SW3 6BU,
England.

Tel.: +44 (0) 20 7376 4110


SynOptika Ltd., Registered in England and Wales: No. 04606737
Registered Office: 114 Beaufort Street, London, SW3 6BU, United Kingdom.
_____________________________________________________


Alan G0XBV
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Howie GM4DIJ <brian@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 17:38
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

In message <1505174528.1976936.1570103507833@...>, Alan G0XBV
via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE=aol.com@groups.io> writes
>How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?

>Al G0XBV

I wondered about that. I first thought of a small turbine...

I hadn't thought of that possibility!

...but it turns out there's a battery, which will have to be replaced eventually.

Thanks, Brian.

Al G0XBV


Oguzhan Kayhan
 

While I was working for an electric utility company, we were testing installations of Smart Meters and Power Line Communication modules(for high speed internet) on utility..

And they were covering the whole HF band which surely blocks any hamradio operators..

Luckly project cancelled hi hi..

Sure it was more than 10 years ago. technology changed a lot..



On Fri, Oct 4, 2019 at 2:19 PM Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Howie GM4DIJ <brian@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 17:38
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

In message <1505174528.1976936.1570103507833@...>, Alan G0XBV
via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE=aol.com@groups.io> writes
>How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?

>Al G0XBV

I wondered about that. I first thought of a small turbine...

I hadn't thought of that possibility!

...but it turns out there's a battery, which will have to be replaced eventually.

Thanks, Brian.

Al G0XBV


--
73
de TA2NC