23 cms Mobile Antenna designs


TODD NORTHOVER <TODD.NORTHOVER@...>
 

Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
Anything appreciated .
Regards Todd


John Quarmby
 

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally polarised so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be suitable, it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave manuals.

73

John G3XDY

----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@NTLWORLD.COM>
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs


Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
Anything appreciated .
Regards Todd




Yahoo! Groups Links



Chris Bartram <yahoo@...>
 

When I was last active mobile on 23cm mobile - I hate to think how many years
ago - I used a cloverleaf. I still have it somewhere. Although 'Alford' slot
antennas have a bit more gain, they are pretty unwieldy beasties at 1.3GHz,
particularly when mounted on cars... A cloverleaf, mounted on a 10mm dia mast
- which can be made to fit safely on a standard gutter mount - can easily sit
a couple of wavelengths above the roof of the vehicle, ensuring that most of
the energy is on the horizon, not wasted in high angle lobes. The relatively
high phase centre also means that the antenna has a reasonable chance of
seeing over hedges.

I couldn't recommend it now, but at one stage I had the cloverleaf mounted on
a 1.5m mast fixed to the centre of the roof of the muTek Transit van. It was
guyed to the four corners of the roof. I seem to remember G4SJP working a
French station at 4-500km with that and a 2W transverter while we were
driving up the M5 in Somerset one year during VHF NFD...

Vy 73

Chris
GW4DGU


Chris G8BKE
 

I used a Big Wheel antenna quite successfully mobile for some time...the design originated in VHF Comms magazine Edition 4, 1979. It comprised 3 wire loops each 22.2cm long in a clover leaf configuration soldered to a N type bulkhead connector, on end of each loop soldered to the centre spigot, the other 3 ends soldered to ground.

As its quite a compact antenna they can be stacked too.

One can also re-dimension a 2meter halo antenna for 23 cms too.

Both are for horizontal polarisation operation.

73 de Chris G8BKE

Web Site:-
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/g8bke/




Mobile Antenna designs

Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
Anything appreciated .
Regards Todd


SAM JEWELL
 

I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading memory...........

73 de Sam


G3XDY wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@NTLWORLD.COM>
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>



Alan Melia
 

Hi Todd, with a table next to kent at the MH Round Table I remember seeing
something like a pcb "cloverleaf" ...it isn't that desgn but has the same
sort of profile and should be easy to put in a weather resistant "radome" I
think Sam G4DDK often keeps samples of Kent's wares.

Cheers de Alan G3NYK


Ian Lamb <ianlamb@...>
 

Hi Sam,

Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?

Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical polarisation on GB3FM
[1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it was replaced with
a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home stations are
hearing it better than ever now.

It may be the case that the group were to report back but in reality I have never
heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.

Hope this helps?

73 .. Ian
G8KQW



________________________________

From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs



I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading memory...........

73 de Sam


G3XDY <g3xdy@btinternet.com> wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@NTLWORLD.COM <mailto:TODD.NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com <mailto:ukmicrowaves%40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


SAM JEWELL
 

Yes, Farnham. My error.

Also, yes, I have stock of  Kent's 1296MHz PCB big wheel antennas at 8UKP inc P&P. I accept Paypal......

We have a pair of these on the Ipswich 23cm digital ATV repeater, which is currently being tested. You may have seen it at Martlesham, last weekend, if you went to see the beacons.

73 de Sam




Ian Lamb wrote:

Hi Sam,

Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?

Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical polarisation on GB3FM
[1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it was replaced with
a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home stations are
hearing it better than ever now.

It may be the case that the group were to report back but in reality I have never
heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.

Hope this helps?

73 .. Ian
G8KQW



________________________________

From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading memory...........

73 de Sam

G3XDY <g3xdy@btinternet.com> wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@NTLWORLD.COM NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com s%40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>





mikeg3pfr@...
 

In a message dated 14/11/2007 15:35:19 GMT Standard Time, jewell@... writes:
I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading memory...........
Quite correct, Sam! I might remember wrongly, but I seem to think that the "diehards" (those who had practised some /M operation on 23cm) stuck out for horizontal polarisation, on the grounds that an Alford Slot was a suitable antenna, as were the "clover-leaf" or "Big Wheel" and, maybe even a version of the "halo" or "Squarial".
 
Too long ago - my memory fades....!
 
Regards, Mike, G3PFR


mikeg3pfr@...
 

In a message dated 14/11/2007 23:20:38 GMT Standard Time, mjniman@... writes:
"Antennas (Mandatory)
Vertical polarisation must be used for all speech repeaters unless
explicitly authorised. The height of the antenna must be no greater
than that specified on the NOV, and the polar diagram must not be
changed without written permission."
How/When did this one creep in? News to me!
 
Regards, Mike, G3PFR


Murray Niman <mjniman@...>
 

Dont count on Horizontal from 23cm repeaters !
The Ofcom spec for all voice repeaters says:

"Antennas (Mandatory)
Vertical polarisation must be used for all speech repeaters unless
explicitly authorised. The height of the antenna must be no greater
than that specified on the NOV, and the polar diagram must not be
changed without written permission."


Murray



--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, SAM JEWELL <jewell@...> wrote:

Yes, Farnham. My error.

Also, yes, I have stock of Kent's 1296MHz PCB big wheel antennas at
8UKP inc P&P. I accept Paypal......

We have a pair of these on the Ipswich 23cm digital ATV repeater,
which is currently being tested. You may have seen it at Martlesham,
last weekend, if you went to see the beacons.

73 de Sam




Ian Lamb <ianlamb@...> wrote: Hi Sam,

Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?

Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical
polarisation on GB3FM
[1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it was
replaced with
a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home
stations are
hearing it better than ever now.

It may be the case that the group were to report back but in
reality I have never
heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.

Hope this helps?

73 .. Ian
G8KQW



________________________________

From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were
approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice
repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile operation
easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on results.
I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee was
disbanded it would have become a victim of fading memory...........

73 de Sam

G3XDY <g3xdy@...> wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally
polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be
suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@...
<mailto:TODD.NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:ukmicrowaves%40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


TODD NORTHOVER <TODD.NORTHOVER@...>
 

Hi there sam i wouldnt mind one of those .
Please send me your address i havent got paypal at the mo .
Thank,s for your help as well .
73 de Todd G0TOD

--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, SAM JEWELL <jewell@...> wrote:

Yes, Farnham. My error.

Also, yes, I have stock of Kent's 1296MHz PCB big wheel antennas
at 8UKP inc P&P. I accept Paypal......

We have a pair of these on the Ipswich 23cm digital ATV repeater,
which is currently being tested. You may have seen it at Martlesham,
last weekend, if you went to see the beacons.

73 de Sam




Ian Lamb <ianlamb@...> wrote: Hi Sam,

Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?

Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical
polarisation on GB3FM
[1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it
was replaced with
a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home
stations are
hearing it better than ever now.

It may be the case that the group were to report back but in
reality I have never
heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.

Hope this helps?

73 .. Ian
G8KQW



________________________________

From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were
approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice
repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile
operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on
results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee
was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading
memory...........

73 de Sam

G3XDY <g3xdy@...> wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally
polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be
suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave
manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@...
<mailto:TODD.NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com <mailto:ukmicrowaves%
40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any
designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


TODD NORTHOVER <TODD.NORTHOVER@...>
 

Hi all just to clear things up a bit GB3BK is/Will be hor/pol.
I have a antenna for mobile use which is a diamond tribander but its
too cumbersome for my works Vehicle .
Hence a Smaller antenna needed .
Sorry for any confusion .
Regards Todd G0TOD.



--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, "TODD NORTHOVER"
<TODD.NORTHOVER@...> wrote:

Hi there sam i wouldnt mind one of those .
Please send me your address i havent got paypal at the mo .
Thank,s for your help as well .
73 de Todd G0TOD

--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, SAM JEWELL <jewell@> wrote:

Yes, Farnham. My error.

Also, yes, I have stock of Kent's 1296MHz PCB big wheel
antennas
at 8UKP inc P&P. I accept Paypal......

We have a pair of these on the Ipswich 23cm digital ATV
repeater,
which is currently being tested. You may have seen it at
Martlesham,
last weekend, if you went to see the beacons.

73 de Sam




Ian Lamb <ianlamb@> wrote: Hi Sam,

Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?

Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical
polarisation on GB3FM
[1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it
was replaced with
a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home
stations are
hearing it better than ever now.

It may be the case that the group were to report back but in
reality I have never
heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.

Hope this helps?

73 .. Ian
G8KQW



________________________________

From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were
approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM
voice
repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile
operation easier and more effective. ?
The group involved were to report back to the Committee on
results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee
was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading
memory...........

73 de Sam

G3XDY <g3xdy@> wrote:

Hi Todd

As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are
horizontally
polarised
so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might
be
suitable,
it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave
manuals.

73

John G3XDY
----- Original Message -----
From: "TODD NORTHOVER" <TODD.NORTHOVER@
<mailto:TODD.NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com <mailto:ukmicrowaves%
40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

> Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any
designs
> please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> Anything appreciated .
> Regards Todd
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


Murray Niman <mjniman@...>
 

That wording is from the latest edition of the Repeater licensing
guide, (not the woolly old RA version) and shows the value of keeping
an eye over related parts of the hobby for when the next little trap
pops up:)

It seems reasonable as a default for mobiles, unless a
keeper/application has requested it otherwise in his app/NoV

Murray

--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, mikeg3pfr@... wrote:


In a message dated 14/11/2007 23:20:38 GMT Standard Time, mjniman@...
writes:

"Antennas (Mandatory)
Vertical polarisation must be used for all speech repeaters unless
explicitly authorised. The height of the antenna must be no greater
than that specified on the NOV, and the polar diagram must not be
changed without written permission."



How/When did this one creep in? News to me!

Regards, Mike, G3PFR


mikeg3pfr@...
 

In a message dated 15/11/2007 00:46:21 GMT Standard Time, mjniman@... writes:
That wording is from the latest edition of the Repeater licensing
guide, (not the woolly old RA version) and shows the value of keeping
an eye over related parts of the hobby for when the next little trap
pops up:)

It seems reasonable as a default for mobiles, unless a
keeper/application has requested it otherwise in his app/NoV

 
 
Yea, verily! Thanks, Murray, for the info.
 
Regards, Mike, G3PFR


Graham Shirville <g.shirville@...>
 

Hi Murray...
 
uum looks wrong to me - the RMC (now ETCC) have always said Horizontal for 23cms repeaters and from memory also approved a "mixed" polarisation one some time back but this is not my area.

Suggest you contact the Chairman of ETCC who will be able to get it sorted quickly...
 
73
 
Graham

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:45 AM
Subject: [ukmicrowaves] Re: 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs

That wording is from the latest edition of the Repeater licensing
guide, (not the woolly old RA version) and shows the value of keeping
an eye over related parts of the hobby for when the next little trap
pops up:)

It seems reasonable as a default for mobiles, unless a
keeper/application has requested it otherwise in his app/NoV

Murray

--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, mikeg3pfr@... wrote:
>
>
> In a message dated 14/11/2007 23:20:38 GMT Standard Time, mjniman@...
> writes:
>
> "Antennas (Mandatory)
> Vertical polarisation must be used for all speech repeaters unless
> explicitly authorised. The height of the antenna must be no greater
> than that specified on the NOV, and the polar diagram must not be
> changed without written permission."
>
>
>
> How/When did this one creep in? News to me!
>
> Regards, Mike, G3PFR
>


SAM JEWELL
 

Hi Todd,

cheque for 8 to S Jewell
Blenheim Cottage,
Falkenham,
Ipswich, IP10 0QU

Take a look at www.wa5vjb.com  for details

73 de Sam


TODD NORTHOVER wrote:

Hi there sam i wouldnt mind one of those .
Please send me your address i havent got paypal at the mo .
Thank,s for your help as well .
73 de Todd G0TOD

--- In ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com, SAM JEWELL wrote:
>
> Yes, Farnham. My error.
>
> Also, yes, I have stock of Kent's 1296MHz PCB big wheel antennas
at 8UKP inc P&P. I accept Paypal......
>
> We have a pair of these on the Ipswich 23cm digital ATV repeater,
which is currently being tested. You may have seen it at Martlesham,
last weekend, if you went to see the beacons.
>
> 73 de Sam
>
>
>
>
> Ian Lamb > wrote: Hi Sam,
>
> Farnborough? or do you mean Farnham?
>
> Certainly my local group at Farnham used to run vertical
polarisation on GB3FM
> [1297.050 output] until recently. After the antenna went u/s it
was replaced with
> a horizontally polarised Alford slot which is why so many home
stations are
> hearing it better than ever now.
>
> It may be the case that the group were to report back but in
reality I have never
> heard of anyone mobile working through this repeater.
>
> Hope this helps?
>
> 73 .. Ian
> G8KQW
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com on behalf of SAM JEWELL
> Sent: Wed 14/11/2007 15:34
> To: ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs
>
> I seem to recall that as the RSGB Microwave Committee, we were
approached to allow vertical polarisation on at least 23cm FM voice
repeater (maybe Farnborough?) to see if it would make mobile
operation easier and more effective. ?
> The group involved were to report back to the Committee on
results. I don't believe this ever happened and when the Committee
was disbanded it would have become a victim of fading
memory...........
>
> 73 de Sam
>
> G3XDY wrote:
>
> Hi Todd
>
> As I recollect most of the 23cm voice repeaters are horizontally
polarised
> so they can be used as beacons. The Alford slot antenna might be
suitable,
> it is described in several forms in various UHF/Microwave
manuals.
>
> 73
>
> John G3XDY
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "TODD NORTHOVER" ...
NORTHOVER%40NTLWORLD.COM> >
> To: <ukmicrowaves@yahoogroups.com s%
40yahoogroups.com> >
> Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 11:01 PM
> Subject: [ukmicrowaves] 23 cms Mobile Antenna designs
>
> > Hi all in the group i wonder if any of you guys have any
designs
> > please for a 23 cms mobile ant .
> > Possibly 5/8 over 5/8 etc or somthing a bit more exotic.
> > Wanted for repeater work (GB3BK) which will be on air soon .
> > Anything appreciated .
> > Regards Todd
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>