Date   

Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Brian Howie GM4DIJ
 

In message <1505174528.1976936.1570103507833@...>, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE=aol.com@groups.io> writes
How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?
 
Al G0XBV
I wondered about that. I first thought of a small turbine, but it turns out there's a battery, which will have to be replaced eventually.

Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie


Re: Any GM's in the Glasgow area free for 3cm's R.S. sked tonight?

Mark GM4ISM
 

Hi Nick and Denis / all
I am going to  put out some CW on bearing of 166 ETN, toward the rain
I’m on KST (but meep not working) in theory also on Zello SHF chat but not moderated yet
 
Mark GM4ISM
 

Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2019 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Any GM's in the Glasgow area free for 3cm's R.S. sked tonight?
 
That's great Mark.

My takeoff is very poor and all my 3cm's has been /p except to GI where my take off is pretty good. Hence wanting to try Rainscatter or as you suggest AS.

Someone else mentioned the two Central Scotland Beacons, I had settled on looking for CSB this evening as there were no recent reports of BIG on Beaconspot, so it's good to hear from you that they are both QRV.

2.7w and 60cm dish here BTW.

I'll message you this evening and and maybe Denis can join in :)

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Andy G4JNT
 

Remember Fri 9 August, when 10% of the country was deliberately switched off by automatic load-shedding.
Just think if they could do that by randomly selecting 10% of households in the UK

Joking apart, there are rules in place about that remote cut off ability.   It amounts te the same in law as if they disconnect you 'normally' by coming to the house and removing the service fuse.

(There was a VERY long discussion about smart meters on RSGB-Technical a year or so back, a lot of details were given)



Virus-free. www.avg.com


On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 at 16:00, Stephen Tompsett <stephen@...> wrote:

If you do want one, make sure that you get a SMETS-2 meter instead of an obsolete/non-upgradable/non-transferable meter. I  think they still haven't got the infrastructure installed to allow first generation meters to be transferred to a new supplier.

Personally I would prefer not to have a remote electricity supply disconnect relay installed in my electricity supply - strange how they don't mention that capability of 'smart' meters.

On 03/10/2019 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io wrote:
I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail
-- 
Stephen Tompsett
Tel: 01788 578940
Mob: 07956 855816
Eml: stephen@...


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Stephen Tompsett
 

If you do want one, make sure that you get a SMETS-2 meter instead of an obsolete/non-upgradable/non-transferable meter. I  think they still haven't got the infrastructure installed to allow first generation meters to be transferred to a new supplier.

Personally I would prefer not to have a remote electricity supply disconnect relay installed in my electricity supply - strange how they don't mention that capability of 'smart' meters.

On 03/10/2019 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io wrote:
I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail
-- 
Stephen Tompsett
Tel: 01788 578940
Mob: 07956 855816
Eml: stephen@...


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Andy G4JNT
 

Oh Dear ... ;-(

You don't have to have it switched on



On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 at 15:38, Adrian G4UVZ via Groups.Io <adrianwhatmore248=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:

What is quantifiable, however, is the the power consumed by the display units at the consumer's expense!



Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Adrian G4UVZ
 

Lies and statistics.......Whilst the wonder new meters will be powered from the Supplier side of the mains, it

would be interesting to know how much they consume from the grid compared with an old style Ferraris disk

meter?

What is quantifiable however is the the power consumed by the display units, at the consumes expense!

Ok, maybe the consumption is only 1 watt in which case the annual consumption will be a shade under 9 KWh

per year, so £1-2 a year per household.

From another angle .....Sept 2018 there were 12.8 million smart meters installed.. every million translates to

an extra MEGAWATT of generation required from the grid!

Lies and Statistics!


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Alan G0XBV
 

Thanks for the info, Tim.  I have an LCD electric meter and that seems to have a clock that runs @ 99KHz.  Audible from 198KHz up!
Al
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 15:29
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

Hi Alan, no the Gas meter has an inbuilt (I assume) High capacity battery guaranteed for 10 years, I did ask the question of the first installer and they have never changed one.

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 15:06, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE@...> wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Tim Hague M0AFJ
 

Hi Alan, no the Gas meter has an inbuilt (I assume) High capacity battery guaranteed for 10 years, I did ask the question of the first installer and they have never changed one.

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 15:06, Alan G0XBV via Groups.Io <ALANNOTTAGE@...> wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Alan G0XBV
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Hague M0AFJ via Groups.Io <m0afj@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 13:02
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms.
 
Thanks, Tim.  Does the gas box require external power?
 
...wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation.
Ditto here.  It's S7 minimum during the daytime here and bizarrely after dark too (do some have batteries which run the inverter after sun-down?). 
 
Al G0XBV


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: 23cm Circulator - Wanted

alwyn.seeds1
 

Dear Andy,



However, at the power level you need, I have not found better value than the ones Bert sells, which have worked well with PE1RKI amplifiers and similar for us.

Regards,

Alwyn G8DOH

ps Very much looking forward to QSOs with you using the new amplifier.


___________________________________________________________________

A. J. Seeds, FREng, FIEEE, FIET, CEng,
Professor of Opto-electronics,
Department of Electronic and Electrical Engineering,
University College London,
Torrington Place,
London, WC1E 7JE, England.

Tel.: +44 (0)20 7679 7928           Fax.: +44 (0)20 7388 9325          http://www.ee.ucl.ac.uk
____________________________________________________________________



_____________________________________________________

Alwyn Seeds, Director
114 Beaufort Street (Management) Company Ltd.,
114 Beaufort Street,
London,
SW3 6BU

+44 020 7376 4110

114 Beaufort Street (Management) Company Ltd., Registered in England and Wales: No. 02797775 Registered Office Address: 114 Beaufort Street, London, SW3 6BU
______________________________________________________


Re: 13 GHz Frequency Counter

Gordon REASON
 

Thanks Bob .. you are obviously more organised than I will ever be .....!

I've just found it , and it's  Triple Line Reciever ....  NOT a divider ..... why did I ever buy it ????????

Oh well ..............it's the thought that counts .............

On 03 October 2019 at 13:46 Bob Lockley VK6KW <rlockley@...> wrote:

Hi Gordon,

Try this site,

https://www.datasheetarchive.com/?q=MC10H116P

Just scroll down to the Motorola page and get the good gen.

I suggest you save/bookmark the home page in your “favourites” – it is in mine!

 

73,

Bob.

 

From: UKMicrowaves@groups.io [mailto:UKMicrowaves@groups.io] On Behalf Of Gordon REASON via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2019 8:14 PM
To: UKMicrowaves@groups.io
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] 13 GHz Frequency Counter

 

In my spares box , I have an unused , DIL  16 pin , IC , Motorola    MC10H116P .  date code    ?    FMR 9741

I believe it's  an ECL Divider ,  Divide x 10 ???   but I can't remember , and I can't find anything on Google , oddly ...

so if it's usefull , or if anyone knows what it is ....

I must have bought it when i began messing around with synthersizers , many years ago ....

On 02 October 2019 at 17:30 "geoffrey pike via Groups.Io" <gi0gdp@...> wrote:

 

Hi Dave,

My divide by 10 ( 2 then 5) 10 GHz prescaler using Hittite dividers merrily oscillates at 1/2 a GHz if i remember and then locks

and behaves from inputs at about -15dBm onwards.

I think there are lots of microwave dividers that oscillate and you just accept it ( it does at least let you know its working when switched on)

 

cheers

Geoff

GI0GDP

 

On Wednesday, 2 October 2019, 17:05:24 BST, David <manoirdisp@...> wrote:

 

 

I'm in the process of building a counter for frequencies higher than my existing Racal frequency meter.
It follows the usual prescaler approach as per a design in www.qsl.net -
HMC363S8G front end  /by 8
MB506 - / by 64
74HCxx  logic  - / by 1.953125
Counter  required to measure up to approx 13 MHz

The MB506 board I've used is one of these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/264302801467?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=264302801467&targetid=539715492471&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9046061&poi=&campaignid=1669190333&mkgroupid=67214010920&rlsatarget=pla-539715492471&abcId=578896&merchantid=113711165&gclid=EAIaIQobChMInqSw7-X95AIVCJ3VCh3lxA_0EAQYAyABEgJQ2fD_BwE
It looks good, double sided PCB - lots of via s - input protection.  A feature it also has is that, with no input it oscillates at approx 18MHz. Quick attempts to 'tame' it - more decoupling and a ferrite bead on the supply to the board have no effect.

So, my question is, "Has anyone else used one of these?  Have you stopped it oscillating? "  .. and if so, how?  Is it necessary to do so?
Despite this, the whole system works as expected showing the input signal frequency divided by 1000.

73 Dave G3WUN


 


 

 



 


 


Re: 13 GHz Frequency Counter

Bob Lockley VK6KW
 

Hi Gordon,

Try this site,

https://www.datasheetarchive.com/?q=MC10H116P

Just scroll down to the Motorola page and get the good gen.

I suggest you save/bookmark the home page in your “favourites” – it is in mine!

 

73,

Bob.

 

From: UKMicrowaves@groups.io [mailto:UKMicrowaves@groups.io] On Behalf Of Gordon REASON via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2019 8:14 PM
To: UKMicrowaves@groups.io
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] 13 GHz Frequency Counter

 

In my spares box , I have an unused , DIL  16 pin , IC , Motorola    MC10H116P .  date code    ?    FMR 9741

I believe it's  an ECL Divider ,  Divide x 10 ???   but I can't remember , and I can't find anything on Google , oddly ...

so if it's usefull , or if anyone knows what it is ....

I must have bought it when i began messing around with synthersizers , many years ago ....

On 02 October 2019 at 17:30 "geoffrey pike via Groups.Io" <gi0gdp@...> wrote:

 

Hi Dave,

My divide by 10 ( 2 then 5) 10 GHz prescaler using Hittite dividers merrily oscillates at 1/2 a GHz if i remember and then locks

and behaves from inputs at about -15dBm onwards.

I think there are lots of microwave dividers that oscillate and you just accept it ( it does at least let you know its working when switched on)

 

cheers

Geoff

GI0GDP

 

On Wednesday, 2 October 2019, 17:05:24 BST, David <manoirdisp@...> wrote:

 

 

I'm in the process of building a counter for frequencies higher than my existing Racal frequency meter.
It follows the usual prescaler approach as per a design in www.qsl.net -
HMC363S8G front end  /by 8
MB506 - / by 64
74HCxx  logic  - / by 1.953125
Counter  required to measure up to approx 13 MHz

The MB506 board I've used is one of these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/264302801467?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=264302801467&targetid=539715492471&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9046061&poi=&campaignid=1669190333&mkgroupid=67214010920&rlsatarget=pla-539715492471&abcId=578896&merchantid=113711165&gclid=EAIaIQobChMInqSw7-X95AIVCJ3VCh3lxA_0EAQYAyABEgJQ2fD_BwE
It looks good, double sided PCB - lots of via s - input protection.  A feature it also has is that, with no input it oscillates at approx 18MHz. Quick attempts to 'tame' it - more decoupling and a ferrite bead on the supply to the board have no effect.

So, my question is, "Has anyone else used one of these?  Have you stopped it oscillating? "  .. and if so, how?  Is it necessary to do so?
Despite this, the whole system works as expected showing the input signal frequency divided by 1000.

73 Dave G3WUN


 


 


Re: 13 GHz Frequency Counter

Gordon REASON
 

In my spares box , I have an unused , DIL  16 pin , IC , Motorola    MC10H116P .  date code    ?    FMR 9741

I believe it's  an ECL Divider ,  Divide x 10 ???   but I can't remember , and I can't find anything on Google , oddly ...

so if it's usefull , or if anyone knows what it is ....

I must have bought it when i began messing around with synthersizers , many years ago ....

On 02 October 2019 at 17:30 "geoffrey pike via Groups.Io" <gi0gdp@...> wrote:

 
Hi Dave,
My divide by 10 ( 2 then 5) 10 GHz prescaler using Hittite dividers merrily oscillates at 1/2 a GHz if i remember and then locks
and behaves from inputs at about -15dBm onwards.
I think there are lots of microwave dividers that oscillate and you just accept it ( it does at least let you know its working when switched on)

cheers
Geoff
GI0GDP

On Wednesday, 2 October 2019, 17:05:24 BST, David <manoirdisp@...> wrote:


I'm in the process of building a counter for frequencies higher than my existing Racal frequency meter.
It follows the usual prescaler approach as per a design in www.qsl.net -
HMC363S8G front end  /by 8
MB506 - / by 64
74HCxx  logic  - / by 1.953125
Counter  required to measure up to approx 13 MHz

The MB506 board I've used is one of these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/264302801467?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=264302801467&targetid=539715492471&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9046061&poi=&campaignid=1669190333&mkgroupid=67214010920&rlsatarget=pla-539715492471&abcId=578896&merchantid=113711165&gclid=EAIaIQobChMInqSw7-X95AIVCJ3VCh3lxA_0EAQYAyABEgJQ2fD_BwE
It looks good, double sided PCB - lots of via s - input protection.  A feature it also has is that, with no input it oscillates at approx 18MHz. Quick attempts to 'tame' it - more decoupling and a ferrite bead on the supply to the board have no effect.

So, my question is, "Has anyone else used one of these?  Have you stopped it oscillating? "  .. and if so, how?  Is it necessary to do so?
Despite this, the whole system works as expected showing the input signal frequency divided by 1000.

73 Dave G3WUN


 


 


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Tim Hague M0AFJ
 

I’ve had two smart meters fitted (changed suppliers), neither have caused me any problems RFI wise, from Top Band to 23cms..wish I could say the same about the neighbours solar installation..

Best Regards
Tim Hague


On 3 Oct 2019, at 11:49, g4zod@... via Groups.Io <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Alan G0XBV
 

How is the gas one powered, OOI, Brian?
 
Al G0XBV
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Howie GM4DIJ <brian@...>
To: UKMicrowaves <UKMicrowaves@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, 3 Oct 2019 12:49
Subject: Re: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

In message
<CAA8k23TfqoA=+jaRV8TMouHEn3UJaF7fp-bckx975JVA_mJ7pw@...>,
Andy G4JNT <andy.g4jnt@...> writes
>No. They use mobile phone bands and home RF (= 432/864MHz etc ISM)
>No RFI mechanism
>
>They're a novelty to play with and doesn't cost you anything
>Despite the paranoia discussed about them - on various Groups in the past.
>
>Andy
>www.g4jnt.com

I've not noticed anything, but RFI is pretty dire here anyway.

I'll need to look for mine on the bands you mentioned on the funcube
dongle. The Scottish Power site however says:-

"The short range radio signal is similar to wifi and bluetooth, but is
actually a low energy system called Zigbee."


My electric meter is in a metal box, but the RF seems to get out. The
gas one is plastic.

I was disappointed that you can't  access the meter data from the module
even though there's a USB lead. It would have been nice to plot it over
time.  My computer can see the USB port as unrecognised, so it is doing
more than the  charging power.

73 Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie




Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Brian Howie GM4DIJ
 

In message <CAA8k23TfqoA=+jaRV8TMouHEn3UJaF7fp-bckx975JVA_mJ7pw@...>, Andy G4JNT <andy.g4jnt@...> writes
No. They use mobile phone bands and home RF (= 432/864MHz etc ISM)
No RFI mechanism

They're a novelty to play with and doesn't cost you anything
Despite the paranoia discussed about them - on various Groups in the past.

Andy
www.g4jnt.com
I've not noticed anything, but RFI is pretty dire here anyway.

I'll need to look for mine on the bands you mentioned on the funcube dongle. The Scottish Power site however says:-

"The short range radio signal is similar to wifi and bluetooth, but is actually a low energy system called Zigbee."


My electric meter is in a metal box, but the RF seems to get out. The gas one is plastic.

I was disappointed that you can't access the meter data from the module even though there's a USB lead. It would have been nice to plot it over time. My computer can see the USB port as unrecognised, so it is doing more than the charging power.

73 Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Gordon REASON
 

JUST  HAD ONE FITTED .. ALL QUIET HERE IN THE SOUTH MIDLANDS ...............

On 03 October 2019 at 11:49 "g4zod@... via Groups.Io" <g4zod@...> wrote:

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: Smart Electricity Meter

Neil Smith G4DBN
 

Ask them to confirm it is a SMETS2 model and that there is full portability if you change supplier. If they try to palm you off with anything else, tell them to go away. 
The meters I have been involved with have up to five different comms methods depending on where you live.
Neil G4DBN

-------- Original message --------
From: "g4zod@... via Groups.Io" <g4zod@...>
Date: 03/10/2019 11:49 (GMT+00:00)
To: ukmicrowaves@groups.io
Subject: [UKMicrowaves] Smart Electricity Meter

I have just had notification that they want to fit a smart meter to replace the recently installed standard new one.
Will it bring RFI into my station?
Will any RF I may generate from HF up to microwave bands affect it?
(It seems I can object if I contact them.)
Many thanks.
G4ZOD

Sent from BlueMail


Re: Any GM's in the Glasgow area free for 3cm's R.S. sked tonight?

Nick Gregory G0HIK
 

That's great Mark.

My takeoff is very poor and all my 3cm's has been /p except to GI where my take off is pretty good. Hence wanting to try Rainscatter or as you suggest AS.

Someone else mentioned the two Central Scotland Beacons, I had settled on looking for CSB this evening as there were no recent reports of BIG on Beaconspot, so it's good to hear from you that they are both QRV.

2.7w and 60cm dish here BTW.

I'll message you this evening and and maybe Denis can join in :)


23cm Circulator - Wanted

Andy GD1MIP
 

Wanted for a 150w 23cm amp build, a suitable circulator.

Other than PE1RKI does anyone know of companies making / selling such a device? 

Thanks Andy GD1MIP