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DSA 602 "partial enhanced accuracy" at each startup


 

Hi,

I had to open my 602 because it started acting up due to a low NVRA-battery. Not a big deal, new battery, all well.

But I wonder why this unit always executes a "new configuration" and "partial enhanced accuracy" on startup. It have another 602 that is ready immediately after self test.
Why? I thought that might be related to some other batteries, but all 3 batteries (with 4C option) are OK now.
Can this be related to the plugins not retaining their data?

cheers
Martin


 

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 07:33 PM, Martin wrote:


But I wonder why this unit always executes a "new configuration" and "partial
enhanced accuracy" on startup. It have another 602 that is ready immediately
after self test
Do they have the same F/W versions ?
I seem to remember that being a F/W bug but at the moment I can't find any info
about which version it was. The latest version I know of, and probably the last,
is 2.23, same as the A-model.
/Håkan


David DiGiacomo
 

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:18 PM zenith5106 <hahi@...> wrote:

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 07:33 PM, Martin wrote:


But I wonder why this unit always executes a "new configuration" and "partial
enhanced accuracy" on startup. It have another 602 that is ready immediately
after self test
Do they have the same F/W versions ?
I seem to remember that being a F/W bug but at the moment I can't find any info
about which version it was. The latest version I know of, and probably the last,
is 2.23, same as the A-model.
Data point: my DSA602A with version 2.23 does this, my DSA602 with
version 1.3 does not.

Definitely a bummer when the final firmware version has a serious bug :(


 

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 10:34 PM, David DiGiacomo wrote:


Definitely a bummer when the final firmware version has a serious bug :(
Strange ..... I have two DSA602 non-A with 2.23 and neither of them do this unless the plugins
has been changed during power off.
/Håkan


Egge Siert
 

Hi,

My DSA602A (B051047) with FW 2.2 does the same during Start-Up. Till now I thought is has to do with the missing extra NVSRAM. But now it seems it doesn't. Modules are fine.

Greetings,

Egge Siert


 

Hi all,

I re-checked both my DAS602 (without A, unfortunately):

#1 (doing partial enhanced accuracy at each startup)
Executive 2.2, Digitizer 2.2, Display 2.3
11A34 with F3.3
11A72 with F2.11
11A33 with F2.4
all checks passed on all modules

#2 (immediate measurement after startup)
Executive 2.23, Digitizer 2.23, Display 2.3
11A72 with F2.11 and "fuse test failed"
11A33 with 2.4 OK
no module in right slot

Before the NVRAM-Battery-message I thought that one of the two other batteries was flat making the scope forget its configuraton. But they all tested fine.
Would the module throw an error message if its Dallas-chip-battery is gone?

cheers
Martin


 

I forgot: both DSAs have the 4C option.


Tom Norman
 

"Would the module throw an error message if its Dallas-chip-battery is gone? "

The 11A34 extended service manual indicates that if the U801 "dallas" chip battery is failing, the plugin will generate a "CKSM Plug" failure. It goes on to note that "In firmware versions of 3.4 or greater, the CKSM Plug diagnostic is not run as a power-up self-test, but is run to decide whether Enhanced Accuracy status has been retained".

I do not know for certain, but I suppose it might be possible that failing the CKSM Plug test request from the mainframe in firmware 3.4, could trigger a partial EA at startup. Your 11A34 is F3.3, so this doesn't seem to be your issue, as it sounds like it would report this as a self test error. I don't think there is extended service info for the 11A33 and 11A72, so uncertain if there is a similar FW difference for those amplifiers.

Have you tried installing only one amp at a time to see if you get the same results of a partial EA at startup (after the initial partial EA due to the reconfiguration)?

Also, as an additional data point, my DSA has FW 2.23, and doesn't have the issue you describe. It has however done a spurious "TekSecure" erase 2 or 3 times in the last 5 years or so.

Tom


 

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 03:33 AM, Tom Norman wrote:


It has however done a spurious "TekSecure" erase 2 or 3 times in the last 5 years or so.
That was interesting info ...
In the early 90's we had a customer with a DSA601 purchased in 89 with F/W 1.2. It soon started doing exactly that, mostly at power
up but occasionally also during operation. The customer wasn't very happy since it could destroy a whole days work which sometimes
couldn't be repeated. Beaverton had never heard of this problem and recommended a F/W update to 1.3. It didn't solve the problem.
I think we then went trough every new F/W version and also some board exchange without success. I think one of these versions may
have had Martin's problem but I'm not sure which one, possibly 2.2. The story ends more than two years from the initial fault report
when the scope was sent to Beaverton for a free upgrade to the A hardware, i.e. floppy drive so the customer could save his important
data on floppies instead. After that I didn't hear anything more from the customer about this problem.

/Håkan


 

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 03:33 AM, Tom Norman wrote:
Have you tried installing only one amp at a time to see if you get the same
results of a partial EA at startup (after the initial partial EA due to the
reconfiguration)?
Yes, I tried exactly that, with each of the 3 modules. No change, partial EA at each and every startup!

cheers
Martin


Tom Norman
 

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 09:08 AM, Martin wrote:


Yes, I tried exactly that, with each of the 3 modules. No change, partial EA
at each and every startup!
Well, that would seem to exonerate the amps then. Might be worth a try burning a set of 2.23 ROMs, or transplanting ROMs from your V2.23 unit to test the theory. It would be interesting to nail down if it is a V2.2 issue.

KO4BB's website, at the following link, has the V2.23 images, with a PDF document tying IC numbers (Uxxx) to image files, The document also has check sums. I used these when I upgraded my 602A .

http://www.ko4bb.com/getsimple/index.php?id=download&file=01_ROM_Images_and_Drivers/Tektronix_DSA602A.zip

Håkan- That's really good information. I was thinking of trying a methodical board swap, but the erase glitch happens so infrequently, it might take 5 years before I knew for certain it was fixed! Nothing important to lose, just have to get my color scheme back...

Tom


Egge Siert
 

Hi,

And David DiGiacomo's DSA602A with FW 2.23 does it also!! Maybe it is SN (thus Board PN) dependent? By the way I can live with it. After 20 minutes you also must start the EA procedure for maximum accuracy.

Greetings,

Egge Siert


Tom Norman
 

Dang. That would have been too easy, and I should have read the thread more carefully. Thanks Egge!

Seems like a good idea that it might be related to board revision. Don't know how far anyone wants to go down the rabbit hole on this, but I'd be more than willing to hoist my 602A down off the workbench shelf and catalog board revisions. Might be more useful to have those with the partial EA problem catalog theirs to see if there is a particular board rev or combination that pops out....might be a snipe hunt though.

Tom


 

Hi, what is a snipe hunt?

I had both DSAs side by side many months ago. Now one is in the basemant and one in 6th floor.
To maintain center of gravity between 2nd and 3rd floor.
You probably know what I mean...

I might do the FW swap, but have to repair some HP stuff first to clean up the bench.

cheers
Martin


Jim Ford
 

Hi, Martin.

A snipe hunt is a useless exercise. Snipe being an imaginary animal pesky kids are told to go hunt sometimes, mostly to get them away from their parents. Although there is actually a bird called the snipe (so the joke is on the jokesters!)

Jim Ford

------ Original Message ------
From: "Martin" <@musaeum>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: 6/17/2020 12:02:03 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] DSA 602 "partial enhanced accuracy" at each startup

Hi, what is a snipe hunt?

I had both DSAs side by side many months ago. Now one is in the basemant and one in 6th floor.
To maintain center of gravity between 2nd and 3rd floor.
You probably know what I mean...

I might do the FW swap, but have to repair some HP stuff first to clean up the bench.

cheers
Martin





Jack2015
 

Hi Martin,

I have two Tek 11403a,I remember that if I replace a NVRAM in the module I have to reprogram the module ID into the new NVRAM.
otherwise 11403a couldn't recognize the "new" module.

Jack