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475 Probe Calibration problem with x10 probes

n2msqrp
 

I have two 475 scopes. Both have developed a similar probe calibration problem on one channel. I am using the scope calibration signal. I have verified results with multiple probes

First scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 and x10 probles. Channel 2 calibration tests fine with a x1 probe but the waveform has a sloped rise and fall time when testing with a x10 probe on a vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above.

Second scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 probes but the waveform is a spike when testing with a x10 probe with vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above. Channel 2 probe calibration works fine with x1 and x10 probes.

Has anyone seen this problem?

Mike N2MS

ef804s tubes
 

I have two 475 scopes. Both have developed a similar probe calibration problem on one channel. I am using the scope calibration signal. I have verified results with multiple probes

First scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 and x10 probles. Channel 2 calibration tests fine with a x1 probe but the waveform has a sloped rise and fall time when testing with a x10 probe on a vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above.

Second scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 probes but the waveform is a spike when testing with a x10 probe with vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above. Channel 2 probe calibration works fine with x1 and x10 probes.

Has anyone seen this problem?

Mike N2MS

Hi,

please clean the attenuator contacts ans the pins of the attenuator blocks as well.

Fred

Colin Herbert
 

This might indeed help, but be cautious when doing it. There are posts on this forum where the correct technique is laid out - it is very easy to damage the cam-operated contacts. Also, note that the material of the attenuator board is a bit special and is easily damaged by heat and various solvents. Briefly, the technique is to put a little IPA (isopropyl alcohol) onto a sliver of ordinary paper and use that to clean the contacts. Check that the contacts are open, slide the ipa-wetted paper between them, close the contacts and then carefully pull the paper out level with the board, as far as possible. This can be done a few times to get all the contaminants off. You can probably ascertain which of the attenuator contacts need cleaning by checking in the service manual as to which attenuators are in circuit when the poor bandwidth is seen.
Good Luck, Colin.

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of ef804s tubes
Sent: 24 October 2018 14:27
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 475 Probe Calibration problem with x10 probes

I have two 475 scopes. Both have developed a similar probe calibration problem on one channel. I am using the scope calibration signal. I have verified results with multiple probes

First scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 and x10 probles. Channel 2 calibration tests fine with a x1 probe but the waveform has a sloped rise and fall time when testing with a x10 probe on a vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above.

Second scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 probes but the waveform is a spike when testing with a x10 probe with vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above. Channel 2 probe calibration works fine with x1 and x10 probes.

Has anyone seen this problem?

Mike N2MS

Hi,

please clean the attenuator contacts ans the pins of the attenuator blocks as well.

Fred

n2msqrp
 

Thanks. Has anyone tried Caig Labs Deoxit?

Mike N2MS


On October 24, 2018 at 9:44 AM "Colin Herbert via Groups.Io" < colingherbert=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io
wrote:

This might indeed help, but be cautious when doing it. There are posts on
this forum where the correct technique is laid out - it is very easy to
damage the cam-operated contacts. Also, note that the material of the
attenuator board is a bit special and is easily damaged by heat and
various solvents. Briefly, the technique is to put a little IPA (isopropyl
alcohol) onto a sliver of ordinary paper and use that to clean the
contacts. Check that the contacts are open, slide the ipa-wetted paper
between them, close the contacts and then carefully pull the paper out
level with the board, as far as possible. This can be done a few times to
get all the contaminants off. You can probably ascertain which of the
attenuator contacts need cleaning by checking in the service manual as to
which attenuators are in circuit when the poor bandwidth is seen.
Good Luck, Colin.

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto: TekScopes@groups.io ] On Behalf Of
ef804s tubes
Sent: 24 October 2018 14:27
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 475 Probe Calibration problem with x10 probes

I have two 475 scopes. Both have developed a similar probe calibration
problem on one channel. I am using the scope calibration signal. I have
verified results with multiple probes

First scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 and x10
probles. Channel 2 calibration tests fine with a x1 probe but the waveform
has a sloped rise and fall time when testing with a x10 probe on a
vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above.

Second scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 probes but
the waveform is a spike when testing with a x10 probe with vertical
sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above. Channel 2 probe calibration
works fine with x1 and x10 probes.

Has anyone seen this problem?

Mike N2MS

Hi,

please clean the attenuator contacts ans the pins of the attenuator blocks
as well.

Fred





 

n2msqrp
Oct 23 #151898

I have two 475 scopes. Both have developed a similar probe calibration problem on >one channel. I am using the scope calibration signal. I have verified results with >multiple probes

First scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 and x10 probles. Channel 2 >calibration tests fine with a x1 probe but the waveform has a sloped rise and fall time >when testing with a x10 probe on a vertical sensitivity setting of .5v/div and above.
Second scope - Channel 1 probe calibration tests fine with x1 probes but the >waveform is a spike when testing with a x10 probe with vertical sensitivity setting of >.5v/div and above. Channel 2 probe calibration works fine with x1 and x10 probes.

Has anyone seen this problem?

Mike N2MS
(quote doesn't seem to work so I put the little arrows in like Usenet, hope it is clear enough)

Unless those switches are dirty at many ranges or something it is not really likely they need to be cleaned and that is it. Therefore, troubleshooting is in order.

A look at the front end on the print tells that in .5V/div and up the X100 attenuator is switched in the circuit. It is bypassed at the more sensitive rages. I assume here that when you wrote "and up" you meant higher in V/div. because "sensitivity" could be expressed the other way, more sensitive being <V/div.

Also note that the X100 is the first in line so is most prone to damage by ridiculously high voltages. (that can happen when they DO NOT LISTEN ! - KEEP IT IN 10X AT ALL TIMES UNLESS YOU REALLY NEED THE GAIN. Better to fry the 9 meg or whatever resistance in the probe than the front end of the scope.

The print does not give details on the internal of the attenuators, and with further examination I find that they are a unit, encapsulated and everything. I'm sure you'll find plenty in the hen's teeth department.

As such, I say most likely there is a resistor in there that is blown open. I also say that most likely it simply goes from the input to the output. Its value should be calculable using the resistance of the output of the attenuator to common. (ground) Maybe 99X that measured value ?

What it is not saying is if all these attenuators are in one package. All but the X10 show no connection to common. (ground) This is more than unlikely so I suspect there is simply an attenuation "block" of sorts. You'll have to determine which pins need the resistor.

Either that or replace it/them. If there are separate ones for each channel at least you can make one good scope out of the pair. If there is only one for both channels you are up the creek.

Actually it occurs to me now that you HAVE a good channel, a precision ohmmeter will tell you the value of resistor you would need to jump it out in the bad channel. You'll have to build that no doubt, unless you know where to buy like a 9.04256 megohm or whatever it is. Be mindful of RF/EMI, keep the leads short and straight as possible.