Logic Analyzer Recommendations?


Richard R. Pope
 


Dave Casey
 

I have been very happy with my HP 1650A, though it has plenty of
limitations. However, it was cheap.

Up to 64 channels is usually not a problem. What I have found the most
limiting is acquisition memory. I was trying to analyze an unknown serial
bus and just couldn't get a long enough acquisition in timing mode to
understand what was going on. I actually ended up cracking that one with a
TDS754C, as I could do a long enough acquisition to see several "packets"
and zoom in to read the bits.

The 1650A has been great for state analysis (i.e. getting a PC readout from
a microcontroller).

The best advice you will get is to buy something complete with probes as
finding the probes separately is generally a chore. Also, many systems
(1650A included) require a floppy with the OS installed in order to boot
and be useful. A lot of that stuff is archived, but it's a lot easier to
deal with if the one you buy either comes with a working floppy disc or
doesn't require one.

The 16500 series is super versatile as you can add cards of different types
to do different things. If I were shopping for one again, I'd be looking at
that series. The dumber ones like my 1650A can be had very reasonably (less
than $100) if you're patient.

Dave Casey

On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 3:14 AM, Richard R. Pope <mechanic_2@...>
wrote:

Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does
anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend
one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_
RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&
geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=
usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_
rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+
cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=
0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-
sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!




Harvey White
 

On Sun, 11 Feb 2018 01:14:18 -0800, you wrote:

Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!
I'd personally stick with either Tek or HP. Of the two, as I've
mentioned before, TEK drives me up a wall with how it works, and I'm
fine with HP.

Most logic analyzers of the type you'd want to deal with have an
operating system. It's nicest if you have a hard drive, it speeds
loading and gives you storage space for programs.

The TeK 308/318/338? series is small, cute, but quite limited. Have
one and don't really use the 308. It will do signature analysis,
though.

The 1650 series uses dual floppies, which for my own purposes, I'd
avoid.

The 1660 series has an internal hard drive with a keyboard input
(keyboard may or may not be on the front panel). If the keyboard is
on the front panel, it is much better than a jogwheel and press for
letter selection. Pay attention to which model you look at for the
number of channels.

1670 can be color (which is nice) and has a larger acquisition depth.
16500 comes in A/B/C. The A has two floppies, the B has a hard drive
and floppy, as does the C. The C has better connectivity from what I
know. I'd avoid the A, myself. The displays are color with an IR
matrix touchscreen. Works well enough.

16500 series analyzers (and up) use blades, allowing you to configure
your logic analyzer with the depth and channels you want. You can
also add an oscilloscope blade and a signal source blade.

16700 analyzers have better connectivity, and may or may not have
screens, touch may be available, or a front panel keyboard. Some
don't have displays and are meant for use with external monitors and
keyboards. All have hard drives. Some of the blades for the 16500
series don't work in the 16700.

I use a 16702B myself, and have a (currently unused) 16500B.

Harvey







Paul Amaranth
 

I'll agree with everything Harvey said and add a couple items:

If you are absolutely sure you can live with 16 lines, you can find
something like a HP54620a. Another option is an MSO like the
HP 54645d or it's successors. That's useful since you get 2
analog channels and a bunch of triggering options. Early MSOs
did not do serial decoding, although they may allow for triggering.

If you need serial decoding, you'll either need a later model
analyzer, one that allows software porgramming or something like
a Bus Pirate. The 16700, for example, can do i2c decoding using
a software extension available on github (disclaimer - I haven't
tried it yet)

Whatever you decide, make sure the unit comes with pods and cables.
If you end up buying an LA without those, it's pretty much useless
and buying them separate can cost as much or more than the instrument
itself - when you can find them.

The advantage of the smaller LA or MSO is that it's easy to set
up and use. The greater flexibility in the 16500/16700 makes
setup more complicated.

If you're choosing between a 16500 and a 16700, go for the 16700.
It has later software, runs on an embedded HPUX system that can
be easily hacked and all the software option keys are available.

Later model large LAs tend to run Windows as a base OS. The 16700
is the latest model I'm aware of that runs a variant of Unix if
that makes a difference to you.

If anyone wants a 16500a or 16500b configured with blades, cables
and pods for cheap, drop me a note. Shipping is the real problem
with them.

Paul

On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 01:14:18AM -0800, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!





!DSPAM:5a8005ff223525978627994!
--
Paul Amaranth, GCIH | Rochester MI, USA
Aurora Group, Inc. | Security, Systems & Software
paul@... | Unix & Windows


Richard R. Pope
 

Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/11/2018 10:53 AM, Paul Amaranth wrote:
I'll agree with everything Harvey said and add a couple items:

If you are absolutely sure you can live with 16 lines, you can find
something like a HP54620a. Another option is an MSO like the
HP 54645d or it's successors. That's useful since you get 2
analog channels and a bunch of triggering options. Early MSOs
did not do serial decoding, although they may allow for triggering.

If you need serial decoding, you'll either need a later model
analyzer, one that allows software porgramming or something like
a Bus Pirate. The 16700, for example, can do i2c decoding using
a software extension available on github (disclaimer - I haven't
tried it yet)

Whatever you decide, make sure the unit comes with pods and cables.
If you end up buying an LA without those, it's pretty much useless
and buying them separate can cost as much or more than the instrument
itself - when you can find them.

The advantage of the smaller LA or MSO is that it's easy to set
up and use. The greater flexibility in the 16500/16700 makes
setup more complicated.

If you're choosing between a 16500 and a 16700, go for the 16700.
It has later software, runs on an embedded HPUX system that can
be easily hacked and all the software option keys are available.

Later model large LAs tend to run Windows as a base OS. The 16700
is the latest model I'm aware of that runs a variant of Unix if
that makes a difference to you.

If anyone wants a 16500a or 16500b configured with blades, cables
and pods for cheap, drop me a note. Shipping is the real problem
with them.

Paul


On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 01:14:18AM -0800, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!





!DSPAM:5a8005ff223525978627994!


Paul Amaranth
 

I'd avoid a 16500a. They boot off a floppy and are very slow
to come up. The floppies are in LIF format and can be difficult
to deal with. You need the Agilent LIFUTIL software to deal
with those on a PC.

Look for a 16500b with the network option or a 16500c if you
want the 16500 series.

Network connectivity makes these MUCH more useful.

The blades are nice and are mostly compatible across the 16500/16700
line with some exceptions. There's a compatiblity matrix available
that shows which work with what. For the most part, blades are not
terribly repairable; they generally consist of a few large ASICs
and not much else. I did repair a 16534a DSO card once by replacing
the NVRAM.

Paul

On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 04:55:17PM -0600, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he
says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It
has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one
easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!
< text snipped >
--
Paul Amaranth, GCIH | Rochester MI, USA
Aurora Group, Inc. | Security, Systems & Software
paul@... | Unix & Windows


Richard R. Pope
 

Paul,
What about the 16500b that you have? I would rather buy from someone on the group than just any old Ebay seller. I am coming into a little bit of money in a few weeks and it would be nice to have a logic analyzer to use for S-100 computer work that I am doing.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/11/2018 10:53 AM, Paul Amaranth wrote:
I'll agree with everything Harvey said and add a couple items:

If you are absolutely sure you can live with 16 lines, you can find
something like a HP54620a. Another option is an MSO like the
HP 54645d or it's successors. That's useful since you get 2
analog channels and a bunch of triggering options. Early MSOs
did not do serial decoding, although they may allow for triggering.

If you need serial decoding, you'll either need a later model
analyzer, one that allows software porgramming or something like
a Bus Pirate. The 16700, for example, can do i2c decoding using
a software extension available on github (disclaimer - I haven't
tried it yet)

Whatever you decide, make sure the unit comes with pods and cables.
If you end up buying an LA without those, it's pretty much useless
and buying them separate can cost as much or more than the instrument
itself - when you can find them.

The advantage of the smaller LA or MSO is that it's easy to set
up and use. The greater flexibility in the 16500/16700 makes
setup more complicated.

If you're choosing between a 16500 and a 16700, go for the 16700.
It has later software, runs on an embedded HPUX system that can
be easily hacked and all the software option keys are available.

Later model large LAs tend to run Windows as a base OS. The 16700
is the latest model I'm aware of that runs a variant of Unix if
that makes a difference to you.

If anyone wants a 16500a or 16500b configured with blades, cables
and pods for cheap, drop me a note. Shipping is the real problem
with them.

Paul


On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 01:14:18AM -0800, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!





!DSPAM:5a8005ff223525978627994!


Harvey White
 

On Sun, 11 Feb 2018 16:55:17 -0600, you wrote:

Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he
says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It
has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one
easier and cheaper in the long run.
From what I know:

1) the OS is NOT built in. This has two floppy drives, one on the
rear (for the OS) one on the front for data.

The 16510 is roughly equivalent to the 1650 series LA with the 16510,
and you have an additional 16515, which is another input blade. You
have also a 16520 and 16521 which allow you to apply a digital
stimulus waveform to your project. I don't have one, but that is a
very nice thing to have. None of these will work if you upgrade to
the 16700 series, but it's a good start for a system, and should give
you a good idea if you want to go further. IIRC, you'd need a
specific HP mouse and HP keyboard if you wanted to add them. He
includes the system disk, which is good. You'll be using a formatted
720K disk (and you need to find them, not the ones that do 720/1.44)
for data.

If he has all the cables, he might have the squid connectors.

The HP logic analyzers go out to a 40 pin connector. It is not
designed to interface to your circuits unless you add a specific RC
network to your projects and interface with that particular 40 pin
connector.

Most people use either a 40 to 20 pin adaptor (I do on some projects),
which requires you to have a built in connector on your pc board.

Others use the "squid" connector, which is a breakout with sockets
that usually (but don't have to) go to a clip connector.

Here's the issue with any of the later (1650 and up) logic analyzers.
They all require a resistive divider for the inputs. This resistive
divider is bypassed (top resistor) with a small capacitor. The lower
resistor of this divider is inside the logic analyzer. SO: (bottom
line).

You cannot connect directly to the LA without the right cable. The 40
pin connector needs to go to a board with the divider network on it
(rare!), or 20 pin connectors (you'll need an adaptor which is
generally about 20 dollars each (for 16 channels)), or a squid
connector (don't remember the price).

Anyone who deals with HP has the same situation. With Tek (IIRC)
there are specific probe boxes which MUST be included.

So: is this a good one? Looks like it, price is decent enough, the
additional blades are decent to have. Looks like it comes with most
(if not all) of the cables. Expect to (perhaps) need the squid
adaptor (most useful for most people, attaches do parts leads and
dip-clips), if you design PC boards, then you'd want the 20 pin
adaptors *in addition*. I do design PC boards, so I've got both.

My opinion, of course. Would be nicer to have an HD, but never had a
16500A, mine is a 16500 B. You may outgrow it, you may not, but it
looks like a decent start to me.

Harvey


Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/11/2018 10:53 AM, Paul Amaranth wrote:
I'll agree with everything Harvey said and add a couple items:

If you are absolutely sure you can live with 16 lines, you can find
something like a HP54620a. Another option is an MSO like the
HP 54645d or it's successors. That's useful since you get 2
analog channels and a bunch of triggering options. Early MSOs
did not do serial decoding, although they may allow for triggering.

If you need serial decoding, you'll either need a later model
analyzer, one that allows software porgramming or something like
a Bus Pirate. The 16700, for example, can do i2c decoding using
a software extension available on github (disclaimer - I haven't
tried it yet)

Whatever you decide, make sure the unit comes with pods and cables.
If you end up buying an LA without those, it's pretty much useless
and buying them separate can cost as much or more than the instrument
itself - when you can find them.

The advantage of the smaller LA or MSO is that it's easy to set
up and use. The greater flexibility in the 16500/16700 makes
setup more complicated.

If you're choosing between a 16500 and a 16700, go for the 16700.
It has later software, runs on an embedded HPUX system that can
be easily hacked and all the software option keys are available.

Later model large LAs tend to run Windows as a base OS. The 16700
is the latest model I'm aware of that runs a variant of Unix if
that makes a difference to you.

If anyone wants a 16500a or 16500b configured with blades, cables
and pods for cheap, drop me a note. Shipping is the real problem
with them.

Paul


On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 01:14:18AM -0800, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Hello all,
. . . . There are a large number of Logic Analyzers listed on E-bay. Does anyone have a 16 to 64 Channel Logic Analyzer for sale or can you recommend one for the page that I am looking at? Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA8P_TBRA9EiwAJrpHMyr7PaB4_RHc4TmDMsZwKeC4IwMsBEs0KU2QcLAgEhTQRrQbd9Y1CBoCrX0QAvD_BwE&geo_id=10232&MT_ID=70&crlp=190859226913_3517&keyword=usbee-sx&rlsatarget=kwd-298001681476&abcId=473846&clk_rvr_id=1438152186425&treatment_id=7&_odkw=usbee-sx+cables&adpos=1o1&ul_noapp=true&device=c&crdt=0&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xusbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables.TRS0&_nkw=usbee-sx+logic+analyzer+cables&_sacat=0
Any help is greatly appreciate!
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!





!DSPAM:5a8005ff223525978627994!




Harvey White
 

On Sun, 11 Feb 2018 18:23:39 -0500, you wrote:

I'd avoid a 16500a. They boot off a floppy and are very slow
to come up. The floppies are in LIF format and can be difficult
to deal with. You need the Agilent LIFUTIL software to deal
with those on a PC.
Agreed. The LIFUTIL (available) works only on some older PCS.


Look for a 16500b with the network option or a 16500c if you
want the 16500 series.
That would be my preferred configuration. However, if you are price
constrained, then this would be acceptable, but (to me) a compromise.

It will do the job, but with some compromises.


Network connectivity makes these MUCH more useful.

The blades are nice and are mostly compatible across the 16500/16700
line with some exceptions. There's a compatiblity matrix available
that shows which work with what. For the most part, blades are not
terribly repairable; they generally consist of a few large ASICs
and not much else. I did repair a 16534a DSO card once by replacing
the NVRAM.
Thoroughly agreed. Lots of BGA chips that you A) don't have one of
and B) can't replace without expensive equipment.

Buy new one.

Harvey



Paul

On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 04:55:17PM -0600, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he
says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It
has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one
easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!
< text snipped >


ed beers
 

16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards. Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great deals on ebay right now.

Ed

On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
    What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!


Richard R. Pope
 

Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards. Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!



ed beers
 

Keyboard an mouse are a plus since there are compatibility issues (mostly solvable by adding pullups).

Not the fastest card but lots of channels. I think you mentioned using it on a historical bus so it should be fine.

I don't see any lead sets or grabbers. Price these before you buy.

I don't know what current market prices are....

Ed

On 02/11/2018 11:06 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Ed,
    What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!
On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards.  Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for the logic analyzer board.  These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and greatest.  These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
     What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!




Richard R. Pope
 

Ed,
I notice the Keyboard and Mouse. The probe tips aren't expensive. I found a .pdf manual for the 16702a on the internet. I like being able to put it on the LAN and being able to control from my computer. All there software CD-ROM discs available. That looks like a possible hangup. The price and shipping look to be very reasonable. My biggest hurdle is that I won't have the money for 3 or 4 weeks. For less than $300 I end up with a system that has 80 channels. That will cover all of the busses that are used on 8 bit and 16 bit S-100 systems. I do see a problem. These Single ended probes have push on connections. How do you add microclips?
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 1:31 AM, ed beers wrote:
Keyboard an mouse are a plus since there are compatibility issues (mostly solvable by adding pullups).

Not the fastest card but lots of channels. I think you mentioned using it on a historical bus so it should be fine.

I don't see any lead sets or grabbers. Price these before you buy.

I don't know what current market prices are....

Ed

On 02/11/2018 11:06 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards. Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!









Sergey Kubushyn
 

On Mon, 12 Feb 2018, Richard R. Pope wrote:

You better aim for 16702B :) It has a 100Mbit Ethernet that you can actually
use and run the LA over the net using X server on your Linux desktop.

16900 runs Windoze and most (almost all) of cheaper blades are not
compatible so you would have to pay big bucks for those it can run with.
Those are not always better than old ones but way more expensive and rare.
They also use 90-pin connectors and cables/pods for those are not even rare
as hen's teeth but also order of magnitude more expensive than abundant
40-pin ones. That all is on top of that Microsoft is not an answer;
Microsoft is a question and the answer is "No!".

Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It
can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards.
Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for
the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900
may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and
greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great
deals on ebay right now.

Ed

On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he
says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It
has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one
easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!



---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************


Richard R. Pope
 

Sergey,
They are nice but they are way outside what I can afford. I'll live with 10baseT. I appreciate the suggestion.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 2:32 AM, Sergey Kubushyn wrote:
On Mon, 12 Feb 2018, Richard R. Pope wrote:

You better aim for 16702B :) It has a 100Mbit Ethernet that you can actually
use and run the LA over the net using X server on your Linux desktop.

16900 runs Windoze and most (almost all) of cheaper blades are not
compatible so you would have to pay big bucks for those it can run with.
Those are not always better than old ones but way more expensive and rare.
They also use 90-pin connectors and cables/pods for those are not even rare
as hen's teeth but also order of magnitude more expensive than abundant
40-pin ones. That all is on top of that Microsoft is not an answer;
Microsoft is a question and the answer is "No!".

Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It
can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards.
Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for
the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900
may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and
greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great
deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he
says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It
has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one
easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!







---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************



Harvey White
 

On Mon, 12 Feb 2018 01:57:58 -0600, you wrote:

Ed,
I notice the Keyboard and Mouse. The probe tips aren't expensive. I
found a .pdf manual for the 16702a on the internet. I like being able to
put it on the LAN and being able to control from my computer. All there
software CD-ROM discs available.
Yes, there are. You'll need a SCSI CDROM drive to instll (ignite) the
system. You *can* take the case off and parallel the existing drive,
ignite it, then remove the CDROM and reassemble. Not sure if the
existing cable is good for that, but I've done it several times (on
different machines).


That looks like a possible hangup. The
price and shipping look to be very reasonable. My biggest hurdle is that
I won't have the money for 3 or 4 weeks. For less than $300 I end up
with a system that has 80 channels. That will cover all of the busses
that are used on 8 bit and 16 bit S-100 systems. I do see a problem.
These Single ended probes have push on connections. How do you add
microclips?
They have little pins that the push on clips attach to. The push on
clips work on dip clips without the retaining bump, and the grabbers
will work on the dip clips that do.

You may wish to take a blank breadboard card (assuming you want to
have a plug-in adaptor), put some 20 pin IDC sockets on them, wire
connections to the S100 bus itself, then buy the 20 pin probe
adaptors.

Where are you, by the way (roughly)?

Harvey


GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 1:31 AM, ed beers wrote:
Keyboard an mouse are a plus since there are compatibility issues
(mostly solvable by adding pullups).

Not the fastest card but lots of channels. I think you mentioned
using it on a historical bus so it should be fine.

I don't see any lead sets or grabbers. Price these before you buy.

I don't know what current market prices are....

Ed

On 02/11/2018 11:06 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is
also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator
cards. Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and
grabbers for the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900.
16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the
latest and greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any
great deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but
he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for
it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes
repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!













Hans Boon <hans.boon@...>
 

Where can I find the decoding software in GITHUB?

Looks a nice addition to the logic analyser.

Regards,

Hans Boon


Richard R. Pope
 

Ed,
I believe that I am going to go with this one. He put up some more pictures. There are six cables in this machine. If I am looking at this correctly that would be 96 channels. He also has a copy of the CD. So for about $250 including the shipping I believe that this is a pretty good buy.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 1:31 AM, ed beers wrote:
Keyboard an mouse are a plus since there are compatibility issues (mostly solvable by adding pullups).

Not the fastest card but lots of channels. I think you mentioned using it on a historical bus so it should be fine.

I don't see any lead sets or grabbers. Price these before you buy.

I don't know what current market prices are....

Ed

On 02/11/2018 11:06 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Ed,
What about this 16702A? https://www.ebay.com/itm/253358003032.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 12:58 AM, ed beers wrote:
16500 series host processor is dog slow so the user interface is also. It can be pretty painful unless you are really patient.

The listing you link to is populated mostly with pattern generator cards. Great if you need them but I never did.

The one logic analyzer card is slow (35 MHz state/100 MHz timing?).

The cable for the logic analyzer board is ripped.

It isn't clear from the photos that you get any lead sets and grabbers for the logic analyzer board. These are pricey.

If you want a mainframe analyzer I would look for a 16700 or 16900. 16900 may be a little expensive since I think they are still the latest and greatest. These are big and heavy so shipping is a problem.

I like the 167*g series standalone ones although I don't see any great deals on ebay right now.

Ed


On 02/11/2018 02:55 PM, Richard R. Pope wrote:
Paul and Harvey,
What do you think of this 16500? He will include a manual but he says that the OS is built in and that there are no OS disks for it. It has all of the cables. I like the idea of blades. It makes repairing one easier and cheaper in the long run.
Here is the link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/332191371457
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!









Paul Amaranth
 

On Mon, Feb 12, 2018 at 05:55:37PM +0100, Hans Boon wrote:
Where can I find the decoding software in GITHUB?

Looks a nice addition to the logic analyser.

Regards,

Hans Boon






!DSPAM:5a81c39e174321834011173!
--
Paul Amaranth, GCIH | Rochester MI, USA
Aurora Group, Inc. | Security, Systems & Software
paul@... | Unix & Windows


Richard R. Pope
 

Paul,
I also appreciate this information.
GOD Bless and Thanks,
rich!

On 2/12/2018 7:51 PM, Paul Amaranth wrote:
Here it is:

https://github.com/racingmars/hp16700-i2c/blob/master/i2c-tdk.c

On Mon, Feb 12, 2018 at 05:55:37PM +0100, Hans Boon wrote:
Where can I find the decoding software in GITHUB?

Looks a nice addition to the logic analyser.

Regards,

Hans Boon






!DSPAM:5a81c39e174321834011173!