Date   

453 SN: 043226 Anode Now Solid State

Joseph Rooney
 

Chasing down a gain change warmup problem, I decided to replace the 5642's in the anode with replacements I found on line. Pictures here: https://flic.kr/p/EV6GoL https://flic.kr/p/EV6GoL https://flic.kr/p/EV6GQ7 https://flic.kr/p/EV6GQ7 after replacement of 5642's with two ESJA52-10 from HVStuff.com . Didn't fix the problem, I had to order them from China, took less than a week. Found 5kv rectifiers at Halted that were just too big to be in series. https://flic.kr/p/F6Ajfn https://flic.kr/p/F6Ajfn


These are far smaller than the 152-0408-00 we routinely used at Tektronix to replace 5642's and I'm quite sure they will work in your 5642 replacement scheme.


Joe


Re: Tektronic 466 - Storage Modes inop

Ed Breya
 

I don't know if this will help, but it may be a good idea to let it cook for a few hours, especially if it hasn't been run in a few years. I have a 577 D1 storage type on which the display looks awful when first turned on, in storage mode, with a big pincushion green background that can't be turned off. After running for about twenty minutes, and a few erase cycles, it blanks out nicely.

If it doesn't settle down, you may want to check and tweak the flood gun circuits. Once the basic operation is confirmed, you can check the screen and storage mesh by filling the display - just set up for a free-running sweep, and work the vertical position up and down until the whole thing is written. Ideally, it should present a uniform filled green screen. You'll see any bad spots or after-images.

Ed


Re: MAKING EXCELLENT PCBs using toner transfer

petertech99h
 

Hi all,
In the days 'BC' (before CAD) I used Red and Blue mylar layout tapes and black adhesive IC pad shapes scaled 2X to do double sided PCBs.  The artwork got sent out and photographed with filters to produce 2 production films, 1 top, 1 bottom, black pads showed up on both films, overlapping red and blue produced black traces on both sides.
In high school I did a double-sided PCB making 2 artworks over a drafted layout with layout targets just outside the board outline then image the board one side at a time with 2 plates of glass and the board and artworks sandwiched inside.
Is anyone interested how plate-thru holes are made? or is everyone up to speed on that?  It may be possible to do that at home too!

Lots of fun, still have the boards plus a spare!
Pete

On Tuesday, March 8, 2016 12:59 AM, "'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7pF [TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


  Hi Dave,
Me too. Plus OSHPark boards are gold coated which is very unusual and very prettyl!!!.
Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@... [mailto:TekScopes@...]
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2016 9:31 PM
To: TekScopes@...
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] MAKING EXCELLENT PCBs using toner transfer

I have been very happy getting boards made by OSHpark.com, who offer both two and four layer small quantity fabrication at a reasonable price.

I did buy the Pulsar kit, but only with the intention of using it for certain projects where I felt it would be more cost effective than using a fab (such as a large area board of which I only plan to make one copy).

Dave Casey

On 3/7/2016 10:34 PM, 'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7pF [TekScopes]
wrote:

Hi George, Dave, et al,
I made my own PC Boards back in the 1960s using a variety of methods
including photolithography, toner transfer, PC layout tape, and
special ink pens. The problem with all of these methods is you can
realistically only do single sided boards.

I worked out a way to do double sided boards but I first had to design
and build a very accurate jig to hold the boards and the photomasks in
perfect alignment under hot lights for several minutes. Even with all
that, there was still no way to do plated through holes. In most cases
I was clever enough to make the connections from one side of the board
to the other by carefully choosing where the via was located so it
corresponded to where a part would be placed. Then the lead from the
part or IC did double duty by acting as a via.

If you want to do a PC Board today it seems to me that a better use of
your time would be ExpressPCB which has free software. It is a
do-it-yourself solution to PCB layout but they can handle up to 4
layer boards with vias, and they do silk screen layers on the top, and
(I think) the bottom as well. A big plus is you can learn it quickly
but it doesn't do much more than board layout. The biggest drawback is
you have to buy your boards from them and you have to buy 4 boards at
a time. Prices are reasonable. (I have no financial connection with them).

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2016 5:52 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] MAKING EXCELLENT PCBs using toner transfer

Their website is http://www.pulsarprofx.com

Regards,

Dave Casey

On 3/7/2016 7:13 PM, gmt1@... [TekScopes] wrote:

Hi Folks,
You can make PCB boards of the highest quality using the toner
transfer method.
The secret is to use Pulsar’s Transfer Paper and Pulsar’s Green TRF
Foil (both products made in the US) and a modified laminator .Pulsar
products are sold worldwide i gather.

Use Ferric chlorides etchant.
I have no connection with Pulsar (just a happy customer)

I struggled for years to make decent PCBs and this is by far the
best DIY system avaliable.
You can produce boards that match Photographic methods and make very
fine tracks.
All electronic enthusiast should be able to make there own PCBs and
produce there own TEK

extender boards relatively cheaply.
Not a lot of info on Pulsar,on the net, for some reason but i found
this excellent writeup from a local mob here in Australia see......
http://ultrakeet.com.au/write-ups/makepcbs
http://ultrakeet.com.au/write-ups/makepcbs
Regards
George












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Posted by: Dave Casey <dcasey@...>
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Yahoo Groups Links

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Re: 7854 Repair & Restoration

Brian Bloom
 

I'll leave it running and 'play' with my psu-shorting 485 while keeping an eye on it and periodically tapping on U50 and it's surroundings and report back....
>That sounds promising.

>For what it is worth, U50 and the basics of this vertical amplifier
>design are shared by the 7834, 7844, 7854, and 7904. There might be
>something to learn from those service manuals.

>I have taken the very similar vertical amplifier board off of my 7834
>many times. It is not difficult to do however watch out for the
>vertical deflection plate connections which are directly under the
>board. Before removing the board, shine a light between it and the
>CRT and make a note of the lead dressing. This has to be duplicated
>when you reassemble it to preserve the transient response. The wires
>are *not* soldered to the CRT pins. Instead they are soldered to
>collets which slip over the CRT pins and they can carefully be pulled
>directly off or at least that is how my 7834 is constructed.

>I ended up buying a Wiha nut driver set to work in the area around the
>CRT amplifiers.


Found it.

After hooking the jumpers back up and running it a while with the sweep, I'm able to tap on U50 (kinda hard) with a ceramic screwdriver and induce the exact fault. Beamfinder deflected to the top of the CRT.

I can also tap on it again and it goes back to normal.

So then, I guess U50's non-soldered connections just need to be cleaned to make full-time positive contact again?

If Francis couldn't get a display on the scope before, I guess that the roughness of shipping caused the connections to rub and make partial contact again. That would have led to me being able to get a display on it once I powered it up...


So then... about the CRT circuit... DS47 is supposed to have a slight glow? Isn't that chain of neons supposed to be circuit protection?

I wonder if other scopes of the 78**/79** series have the same thing going on..

I'm really curious why Francis had circled the diodes in the focus-grid dc restorer. I guess I should just ask him.


Re: Tektronic 466 - Storage Modes inop

 

On 09 Mar 2016 18:46:03 -0800, you wrote:

This is a new-to-me 466. It seems pretty much OK in non-store modes. When I pop it into variable Persistance, I still see the trace, but no storage. No effect from the View Time Storage Level, or Storage Intensity controls. Pushing Erase, blanks the trace for a second, but no flash of light, as I'd expect.

LV DC supplies all look OK.

Weirdest symptom follows: With the intensity turned all the way down, I see a few dimly lit, stationary 'spots' on the screen and a faint overall green glow.
That is normal. I have noticed faint illuminated shadows and
illuminated dots before on storage CRTs.

No experience with tinkering at storage circuits... yet....

Comments, Ideas, admonishments, etc appreciated...
After checking the general stuff like the low voltage power supply
outputs and doing a detailed visual inspection, I would consider
connectors and socketted parts like transistors and ICs.

If that does not turn up anything, then I would do the z-axis
calibration procedures followed by the storage calibration procedures.


Re: 7854 Repair & Restoration

 

On 09 Mar 2016 17:18:14 -0800, you wrote:

...

It's not R105. I've got it powered up with jumpers disconnected as you suggested. (The display is some sections of dashes)
I can adjust R105 and it operates smoothly. there's not even the slightest sign of internal damage to the pot.

However, tapping on U50 makes the trace randomly jump to the upper part of the CRT. It hasn't yet gone off the CRT, and it seems to always recover. Then again, I just powered the scope on a few minutes ago...

I'll leave it running and 'play' with my psu-shorting 485 while keeping an eye on it and periodically tapping on U50 and it's surroundings and report back....
That sounds promising.

For what it is worth, U50 and the basics of this vertical amplifier
design are shared by the 7834, 7844, 7854, and 7904. There might be
something to learn from those service manuals.

I have taken the very similar vertical amplifier board off of my 7834
many times. It is not difficult to do however watch out for the
vertical deflection plate connections which are directly under the
board. Before removing the board, shine a light between it and the
CRT and make a note of the lead dressing. This has to be duplicated
when you reassemble it to preserve the transient response. The wires
are *not* soldered to the CRT pins. Instead they are soldered to
collets which slip over the CRT pins and they can carefully be pulled
directly off or at least that is how my 7834 is constructed.

I ended up buying a Wiha nut driver set to work in the area around the
CRT amplifiers.

On 09 Mar 2016 17:31:18 -0800, you wrote:

I think it has something to do with the 'node' that's pressure-seated against the top of the can of U50. If I press beside it on the can (with a ceramic screwdriver - my spudger....), it makes the trace jump to the top of the crt every time.

I assume that the pressure bracket with connected center node is to make sure U50's case stays grounded... If that is correct, what would happen if U50's case became un-grounded?
The board layout and schematic show 12 pins and no ground on U50. The
package guide shows a pin welded to the top of the can.

Does that top lead on U50 actually go to ground?

I am hoping that the problem is an intermittently open resistor or
solder joint. Probe around U50 with your insulated spudger (I know
this device as a diddle stick) and see if you can localize the
problem.

On 09 Mar 2016 18:23:56 -0800, you wrote:

I think we may be in the wrong path with this problem. I had my head next to the CRT HV can a bit ago and heard some random mild arcing noises.
I plugged the vert board jumpers back in, took the CRT can shield off, and powered up..
Darn. And the area around U50 was such a neat solution. Maybe there
are two different problems.

Is there supposed to be a neon mildly glowing in there?? (I don't think so..)
None of the neon bulbs should be glowing during normal operation. The
specific bulb will reveal which circuit is misbehaving.

It's DS47, which is 'Focus Grid DC Restorer' circuit. From what my eyes are capable of seeing, there doesn't appear to be any change in it when I mess with the focus control.
High voltage capacitors C36 and C39 are the parts most likely to fail
and cause the neon bulbs to light. Note that the schematic is very
specific that the resistors in this area are carbon composition.

Inspect the area around the focus DC restorer with a bight light
looking for anything funny. Then try to do an inspection of this area
in darkness when the failure is occurring.

DC restorer problems can be annoying to track down. I would consider
just replacing all of the parts.

So candidates are:
the "Focus Control" circuit, diagram 13
The "Focus-Grid DC Restorer" circuit diagram 14
The focus control circuit does not have any voltages higher than +130
volts.

If horses come before zebras, then the DC restorer is where to look
first.

I haven't yet tried to figure out the circuit, but I'll do my best to narrow down the possibilities.

Remember: I noted a while back that the schematic book that came with the scope had the "Focus Grid DC Restorer" circuit circled.
Usually we have to deal with z-axis DC restorer problems so I do not
know what happens when the focus DC restorer fails.


Tektronic 466 - Storage Modes inop

Jim McIntyre
 

This is a new-to-me 466. It seems pretty much OK in non-store modes. When I pop it into variable Persistance, I still see the trace, but no storage. No effect from the View Time Storage Level, or Storage Intensity controls. Pushing Erase, blanks the trace for a second, but no flash of light, as I'd expect.


LV DC supplies all look OK.


Weirdest symptom follows: With the intensity turned all the way down, I see a few dimly lit, stationary 'spots' on the screen and a faint overall green glow.


No experience with tinkering at storage circuits... yet....


Comments, Ideas, admonishments, etc appreciated...


Re: 7854 Repair & Restoration

Brian Bloom
 

I think we may be in the wrong path with this problem. I had my head next to the CRT HV can a bit ago and heard some random mild arcing noises.
I plugged the vert board jumpers back in, took the CRT can shield off, and powered up..

Is there supposed to be a neon mildly glowing in there?? (I don't think so..)


It's DS47, which is 'Focus Grid DC Restorer' circuit. From what my eyes are capable of seeing, there doesn't appear to be any change in it when I mess with the focus control.

So candidates are:
the "Focus Control" circuit, diagram 13
The "Focus-Grid DC Restorer" circuit diagram 14

I haven't yet tried to figure out the circuit, but I'll do my best to narrow down the possibilities.

Remember: I noted a while back that the schematic book that came with the scope had the "Focus Grid DC Restorer" circuit circled.


Re: SG504 Test Method

 

I hope I did not come across as hash. I really wanted to think that a
VNA could be used to do what you were trying because it would solve a
very difficult problem.

My next post was going to include math. :)

There are performance advantages if the source and receiver are
leveled to a certain extent but in a VNA, it is more important that
their levels do not drift with time and temperature.

I think just using the Boonton by itself to verify the SG504 would be
the best way to go. You have some requirements for other applications
though.

Most users in the forum lack a power meter like your Boonton. Real
sampling oscilloscopes are more common and are what I usually
recommend if nothing better is available but they are more difficult
to use than a power meter. A sampling voltmeter like a Racal-Dana
9301A or 9303 could also be used and I suspect HP had something
similar other than a power meter.

On 09 Mar 2016 11:26:04 -0800, you wrote:

Thanks for the insight David:

I did a quick test and I don't see any VNA source changes b4 and after the SOL cal, viewing with the scope. Thus a SOL cal has no effect on the precision of the signal amplitude delivered to the DUT. The VNA rcvr must be doing all the 'corrections'.
So your understanding is correct.
What I do see (O'scope) is the VNA signal amplitude error is within 0.5dB of the amplitude required at low frequencies <100Mhz. More accurate (0.25dB) at higher frequencies 100 to 200Mhz. Scope is a 300Mhz unit so I can't check further with it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll definitely have to use the Boonton 4210-4B to assess the true amplitude across the Ghz range.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...

Ancel


Re: 7854 Repair & Restoration

Brian Bloom
 

I think it has something to do with the 'node' that's pressure-seated against the top of the can of U50. If I press beside it on the can (with a ceramic screwdriver - my spudger....), it makes the trace jump to the top of the crt every time.

I assume that the pressure bracket with connected center node is to make sure U50's case stays grounded... If that is correct, what would happen if U50's case became un-grounded?


Re: 7854 Repair & Restoration

Brian Bloom
 

So I would take a close look at trimmer R105 which controls the
>vertical centering shown on schematic 9. Maybe one end of the trimmer
>is intermittently open like I had happening.

>For testing, I think you can disconnect the vertical signals at J9 and
>J10 (or J89 and J90) and also disconnect J11 and J43. This should
>leave only a horizontal line one the CRT and if it shifts, the problem
>has to be on the vertical CRT amplifier printed circuit board.


Finally got time to 'play with my toys'...

It's not R105. I've got it powered up with jumpers disconnected as you suggested. (The display is some sections of dashes)
I can adjust R105 and it operates smoothly. there's not even the slightest sign of internal damage to the pot.

However, tapping on U50 makes the trace randomly jump to the upper part of the CRT. It hasn't yet gone off the CRT, and it seems to always recover. Then again, I just powered the scope on a few minutes ago...

I'll leave it running and 'play' with my psu-shorting 485 while keeping an eye on it and periodically tapping on U50 and it's surroundings and report back....


Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Dave Daniel
 

Ah. Now I see. The thread subject reads "- $150C", not "$150C". My mistake.

On 3/9/2016 5:54 PM, analogaddict013@... [TekScopes] wrote:


When I look at this listing here in the US, the price is $450C. ?
DaveD

Yeah, $450 Canadian or about $335 USD.

Shipping is the real killer, though. for many people in the US it's
going to be near 60% of the cost for the lot. The seller was
originally asking $600C, but upon bringing up the excessive shipping
costs, he lowered his asking price.


Sergey -
If I don't end up with a sampling system, 7S14, or 7T11/7S11 by the
time you're ready to sell, I'll likely take one of the pairs if you're
asking price is reasonable. I'm not sure about whether I want a 7M11 -
it all depends on what sampling setup I obtain, and again - price.

-Brian






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Brian Bloom
 

When I look at this listing here in the US, the price is $450C. ?
>
>DaveD


Yeah, $450 Canadian or about $335 USD.

Shipping is the real killer, though. for many people in the US it's going to be near 60% of the cost for the lot. The seller was originally asking $600C, but upon bringing up the excessive shipping costs, he lowered his asking price.


Sergey -
If I don't end up with a sampling system, 7S14, or 7T11/7S11 by the time you're ready to sell, I'll likely take one of the pairs if you're asking price is reasonable. I'm not sure about whether I want a 7M11 - it all depends on what sampling setup I obtain, and again - price.

-Brian


Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Dave Daniel
 

When I look at this listing here in the US, the price is $450C. ?

DaveD


On 3/9/2016 5:43 PM, Sergey Kubushyn @KSI [TekScopes] wrote:

On Thu, 10 Mar 2016, Malcolm Hunter malcolm.r.hunter@...
[TekScopes] wrote:

I would've bought it had it not be in Canada... Shipping to Vegas would be
probably as much as the lot price itself :( Don't need those plugins but
7934 itself would've been nice to have...

BTW I have a lot of 7S11/7T11/S4/S5 plugins/heads as well as complete
fully working 7S12/S6/S52 TDR set in very nice condition that I'm going to
sell -- got 11801C and 5 sampling heads including S-26 so I don't need all
that 7000 sampling stuff any more. However it is not going to happen
tomorrow because I simply don't have time to test those
7S11/7T11/S4/S5 and
don't want to sell something that doesn't work. Also have 7633 and
R7633 for
that sampling stuff, 7M11 in original Tek case so it won't take a slot in
the scope. Also have one good R7103 but won't sell it for nothing -- it
takes a good hour just to pack it for shipping. Time is very expensive and
in short supply :)

Keeping 2 x 7104 and 2 x 7834 for my own use to have working ones and
parts
donors for both if ever needed.

On 9 March 2016 at 23:55, @walter2 [TekScopes] <
TekScopes@...> wrote:

who is this person that has the scope, might be able to get it over
here
to sphere.

​Ebay #​322033357924

Malcolm
---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************





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Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Sergey Kubushyn
 

On Thu, 10 Mar 2016, Malcolm Hunter malcolm.r.hunter@... [TekScopes] wrote:

I would've bought it had it not be in Canada... Shipping to Vegas would be
probably as much as the lot price itself :( Don't need those plugins but
7934 itself would've been nice to have...

BTW I have a lot of 7S11/7T11/S4/S5 plugins/heads as well as complete
fully working 7S12/S6/S52 TDR set in very nice condition that I'm going to
sell -- got 11801C and 5 sampling heads including S-26 so I don't need all
that 7000 sampling stuff any more. However it is not going to happen
tomorrow because I simply don't have time to test those 7S11/7T11/S4/S5 and
don't want to sell something that doesn't work. Also have 7633 and R7633 for
that sampling stuff, 7M11 in original Tek case so it won't take a slot in
the scope. Also have one good R7103 but won't sell it for nothing -- it
takes a good hour just to pack it for shipping. Time is very expensive and
in short supply :)

Keeping 2 x 7104 and 2 x 7834 for my own use to have working ones and parts
donors for both if ever needed.


On 9 March 2016 at 23:55, @walter2 [TekScopes] <
TekScopes@...> wrote:

who is this person that has the scope, might be able to get it over here
to sphere.

​Ebay #​322033357924

Malcolm
---
******************************************************************
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
******************************************************************


2213 Diodes

Wes Rule <wes_rule@...>
 

That was a Lightning response from Tom jobe thank you Tom I will try to get some at Jamesco in San Carlos on my way to Stockton and the work bench.I will post My slow progress and will surley have more Questions as this is a new relearning as I hav'nt played with Electronics in about 20 years.I currently have only six[6] silly scopes,3 tek a 2213 and two 2445s,and 3 HP a 54602B,1740A and a beaut a 1745A BIG screen CRO,the last of the HP analogue scopes?
Thanks Tom. WWR

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Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

 

On Thu, 10 Mar 2016 00:03:35 +0000, you wrote:

On 9 March 2016 at 23:55, @walter2 [TekScopes] <
TekScopes@...> wrote:

who is this person that has the scope, might be able to get it over here
to sphere.
?Ebay #?322033357924

Malcolm
The listed 7D12 is actually a 7A19 with the pull-tab replaced so there
is a pair of 7A19s and one of them has the optional delay adjustment.

The 7B80 400MHz delayed timebase is paired with a 7B15 1GHz delaying
timebase which seems a little odd to me. The 7B15 has HF Sync
triggering but lacks AUTO Peak-to-Peak triggering. Maybe the owner
wanted the faster 1GHz timebase to better operate with the 7T11
sampling timebase.

There are 5 x 7S11 sampling plug-ins instead of the listed 4. One is
missing its pull-tab.

It looks like a nice collection fell into the hands of someone who is
not familiar with 7000 oscilloscopes but knew enough to figure out
basic operation. My guess is that their condition is probably pretty
good and like you would find at an estate sale.


Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Brian Bloom
 

If I wasn't 4000 miles away, I'd buy that in a heartbeat. A major league
>> bargain.
>>

​>£100 shipping to the UK going by what ebay says, but would it survive?​

​>Malcolm​

Maybe if the seller can be convinced to package it in the specific manner that Tek specifies in some of their manuals.. then wrap the box in foam, box it again, then box it again.

I've learned that you must always expect shipping companies to rough up your heavy packages... and that's an expectation I've learned from continental USA shipping. I can only guess about int'l - Id probably be horrified to see how they handle our gear.


Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Malcolm Hunter
 

On 9 March 2016 at 23:24, 'Craig Sawyers' c.sawyers@...
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:

If I wasn't 4000 miles away, I'd buy that in a heartbeat. A major league
bargain.
​£100 shipping to the UK going by what ebay says, but would it survive?​

​Malcolm​


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Re: 7934 / plugin lot - reduced price ( - $150C )

Brian Bloom
 

who is this person that has the scope, might be able to get it over here
>> to sphere.


​>Ebay #​322033357924

>Malcolm

Ah, yes... the crucial detail I forgot to include.... (OOPS!!!)