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Re: HV Probe?

magnustoelle
 

Good Day,
my 2€- cent ' s worth advice: Go for a Simpson HV Probe. Reliable and known for quality for decades. Look for a NOS or rarely used one on epay etc.
Cheers,
Magnus 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Need Advice on a good used shop scope

stefan_trethan
 

I agree completely.

Just to clarify, what I meant with "real work" was the opposite of "playing".
When I am in the midst of working on some problem, no matter if day
job or personal, I do not want to deal with the distraction of an
analog scope.
Using the digital scope is just so much easier and quicker for me.
Analog is fine when the problem is simple, and I have time to "play",
although I still prefer the 7D20 even then.

Even basic things like storing a trace for reference, that is one
press of a button on a digital scope and I get a nice trace that I can
move around, maybe even zoom in and stuff, in a different color to
tell them apart. On the analog storage scope it needs some fussing
around, and significantly more prior planning.
The other day I was working on a LED lamp and quickly threw a math
trace on the screen that shows power, just two examples where a
digital scope makes your life really easy.

When I am concentrating on a problem and having trouble to even
provoke the event I want to look at the tool should be as efficient
and simple to use as possible, while offering as much capability as
possible.

Of course it depends on what you are used to also. I only got analog
scopes because that was all I could afford at the time, not because it
was all I wanted. If the cheap but somewhat functional scopes like
Rigol etc. would have been around back then I might never have gotten
into Tek stuff, and might not have learned so much, and might not even
know you all.

There are people, like Arthur Seibt of Tek fame, that go around
claiming analog scopes are superior and you can not even do switchmode
power supply work with a digital scope. Well, frankly, that's
nonsense. Virtually everyone has learned to cope with the few
disadvantages of digital in order to benefit from the vast advantages.
The market reflects this, I think there are only a couple Chinese
firms left that even manufacture analog scopes.

Perhaps the best advise is any scope is a whole lot better than no scope.
Go and pick up whatever you can find and strikes your fancy. Because I
don't think we are _meant_ to avoid the collection of mostly useless
scopes that mostly sit around idle, it's all part of the process.

ST


On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 12:25 AM, Harvey White madyn@...
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:
On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 20:23:32 +0200, you wrote:

Given that this old stuff is now dirt cheap, you can just go with the
best, and that is a 7000 series in my opinion.
If you have the bench space and don't need portability it's really
hard to beat, and even takes a 7D20 plugin for some basic digital
scope functionality.
7D20's are not cheap, not that I've found. Correct about the
capability, though.


That said, personally I could not imagine using an analog scope for
real work every day.
Actually, I could. It depends *very* much what you define as real
work (as opposed to unreal?).

If you're not dealing with much that's digital, then you really don't
need a digital scope. The sharply tuned input filters that are needed
to avoid anti-aliasing limit the bandwidth, while analog scopes just
roll off gracefully.

You need not worry about sampling rates, either. You get everything,
and not just what's happening at the sample points.

On the other hand, if you want to look at steady representations of
low rep rate stuff, digital is your friend, otherwise you need a
storage scope.

Even with an extremely limited budget there are now cheap crappy
Chinese scopes and they often beat an analog scope in terms of
useability.
If you're dealing with an analog scope trying to decode a digital data
stream, then yes.

it all depends on what you mean by useable, and for what purpose.

Sure there are always points where the analog scope is superior
(bandwidth, noise, repairability, etc..) but my analog scopes see
practically zero use these days.
and I typically spend time with both digital scopes (TDS540A), analog
(7000 series), and the HP Logic analyzer (16702B). Then again, it
very much depends on what I need to see and why.


Since you work with vacuum tube gear I expect you have significant
experience with analog scopes and might find them more practical than
I do.
I'd agree with this. If he finds something that an analog scope won't
do (typically, for me, related to storage and not necessarily related
to data decoding), then a digital scope can be recommended. the 468
is both, within some limitations. The digital section is pretty much
independent of the analog section.

(Except that you need the digital section to control the analog
section in certain aspects, I think.)

Harvey




ST

On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 7:27 PM, pdulaff@... [TekScopes]
<TekScopes@...> wrote:
Hello


I am Paul, WB2NMI. I am looking for recommendations on good affordable used scopes for my home shop. I work on vacuum tube and solid state amateur gear. Something like the 465/475 scopes make sense but there are these combo digital/analog scopes that maybe add additional versatility, but I don't have experience with digital scopes. I would like to buy used and keep the scope affordable and am willing to repair the scope provided parts and documentation are available.


Let me know your thoughts.


Paul - WB2NMI




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Posted by: pdulaff@...
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Yahoo Groups Links




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Posted by: Harvey White <madyn@...>
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Yahoo Groups Links


Re: HV Probe?

Vince Vielhaber
 

At one time they were quite large. Art dept, advertising dept, ... all those departments you wouldn't expect a company like that to have. Too bad they didn't make better products.

Vince.

On 10/08/2017 12:35 AM, Bob Albert bob91343@... [TekScopes] wrote:


They were big enough to have an art department?


On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:33 PM, "Vince Vielhaber vev@...
[TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


Their advertising is priceless. I once got an ad in the mail for their
freq counter. The ad went on and on about how good it is in high rf
environments. The reading on the display was in the 220 ham band, the
supposed source of that reading was a 2 meter hand held. Huh? So I
called them to ask WTF. They told me they were in a high rf environment
and couldn't get a stable reading so the art dept put the freq in for
the ad!

Vince.

On 10/08/2017 12:28 AM, Bob Albert bob91343@... [TekScopes] wrote:


My opinion of Sencore is with Chuck's. I do have a transistor tester of
theirs. Not user friendly and screams CHEAP at you. I have always
found their advertising objectionable.
Bob


On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:24 PM, "Chuck Harris cfharris@...
[TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:
Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm
considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following
eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't
quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's
decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality
gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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--
Michigan VHF Corp. http://www.nobucks.net/ http://www.CDupe.com/
http://www.metalworkingfun.com
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Re: HV Probe?

Michael A. Terrell
 

You can modify a TV HV probe to negative by reversing the leads on the meter movement, or by adding a small full wave bridge at the meter movement. Then it will display either polarity without a switch.

-----Original Message-----
From: "Bob Albert bob91343@... [TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...>
Sent: Oct 8, 2017 12:28 AM
To: "TekScopes@..." <TekScopes@...>
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] HV Probe?

My opinion of Sencore is with Chuck's.  I do have a transistor tester of theirs.  Not user friendly and screams CHEAP at you.  I have always found their advertising objectionable.
Bob


On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:24 PM, "Chuck Harris cfharris@... [TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


  Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:
Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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Michael A. Terrell

Re: HV Probe?

Bob Albert
 

They were big enough to have an art department?

On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:33 PM, "Vince Vielhaber vev@... [TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


  Their advertising is priceless. I once got an ad in the mail for their
freq counter. The ad went on and on about how good it is in high rf
environments. The reading on the display was in the 220 ham band, the
supposed source of that reading was a 2 meter hand held. Huh? So I
called them to ask WTF. They told me they were in a high rf environment
and couldn't get a stable reading so the art dept put the freq in for
the ad!

Vince.

On 10/08/2017 12:28 AM, Bob Albert bob91343@... [TekScopes] wrote:


My opinion of Sencore is with Chuck's. I do have a transistor tester of
theirs. Not user friendly and screams CHEAP at you. I have always
found their advertising objectionable.
Bob


On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:24 PM, "Chuck Harris cfharris@...
[TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:
Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm
considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following
eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't
quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's
decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality
gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--
Michigan VHF Corp. http://www.nobucks.net/ http://www.CDupe.com/
http://www.metalworkingfun.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: HV Probe?

Vince Vielhaber
 

Their advertising is priceless. I once got an ad in the mail for their freq counter. The ad went on and on about how good it is in high rf environments. The reading on the display was in the 220 ham band, the supposed source of that reading was a 2 meter hand held. Huh? So I called them to ask WTF. They told me they were in a high rf environment and couldn't get a stable reading so the art dept put the freq in for the ad!

Vince.

On 10/08/2017 12:28 AM, Bob Albert bob91343@... [TekScopes] wrote:


My opinion of Sencore is with Chuck's. I do have a transistor tester of
theirs. Not user friendly and screams CHEAP at you. I have always
found their advertising objectionable.
Bob


On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:24 PM, "Chuck Harris cfharris@...
[TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:
Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm
considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following
eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't
quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's
decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality
gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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Re: HV Probe?

Bob Albert
 

My opinion of Sencore is with Chuck's.  I do have a transistor tester of theirs.  Not user friendly and screams CHEAP at you.  I have always found their advertising objectionable.
Bob

On Saturday, October 7, 2017 9:24 PM, "Chuck Harris cfharris@... [TekScopes]" <TekScopes@...> wrote:


  Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:
Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: HV Probe?

Chuck Harris
 

Sencore was their own standard. They built things their
way, and convinced the TV repair world they were better than
all the rest. If you ever get inside of one of their instruments,
you will not be impressed... more like MFJ inside.

I would not buy their probe unless you already... had their meter.

Get a fluke, or Keithley. Be mindful of the intended output
impedance, it will be probably be 10M or 20M.

Don't let your meter be in autorange, and connect the ground clip
before the HV. Autoranging into a 200M impedance 2V scale won't
be amusing.

Under no circumstances buy one of the probes that has a little
mechanical movement meter built in. They are positive voltage
only... and are meant for TV's.

-Chuck Harris

Barry n4buq@... [TekScopes] wrote:

Given my recent/ongoing trials with HV issues in my 465M, I'm considering getting a good HV probe.

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following eBay ad? I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't quite understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's decent quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality gear so am assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

Re: Successful restoration of 564B and 3L5, now looking for 7L5

Chuck Harris
 

A friend reminded me that the maximum horizontal sweep
time of the 3580A is 200s/division, for a maximum sweep
of 2000 seconds, which is only a little more than 1/2 hour.

I would swear it seemed longer, but I guess not.

The 3580A I had had a 1Hz filter. I though that was
standard, but maybe it was optional.

-Chuck Harris

Nenad Filipovic ilmuerte@... [TekScopes] wrote:

Hi Chuck, John,

Thanks for your very helpful feedback. Yes, to sweep the whole 50kHz with
5Hz RBW would indeed take >1.5h. But anyway that's not the way I'd use it.
For my noise work I may be interested in sweeping 0 to 20kHz with no less
than 100Hz RBW (which should take some seconds), or 10Hz to 1kHz with no
less than 10Hz RBW (which should take some tens of seconds). With digital
storage to aid the display of slow sweep, we could call these figures
acceptable.

John's notes on 3580A would surely be put to use if I happen to obtain this
device. I still fear that drifts are an archenemy of old school SAs when
spans are short and close to the low end of the frequency range. It would
be really helpful if someone could compare the 7L5 performance in that
aspect, I was hoping that its phase lock (and stable reference) would sort
this out, to an extent.

I had an FFT SA borrowed from a colleague some time ago, but unfortunately
had to return it too soon - never had a chance to fully get accustomed to
it and "calibrate" the whole process of measurement. It employed standard
FFT settings which could be translated into "traditional" ones (span,
RBW...), but I still struggled to get consistent and meaningful results
with it (measuring noise levels). I will definitely need to try again.

Btw, I find it a little scary that I found very little good words about the
7L5 so far. I understand that it may not employ the most comfortable design
of commands, or is missing nifty features, but according to the specs it
should be a decent performer. In a way I don't know what to think now. I am
looking for it also from the Tek collector's point - I already have a 7L18,
so I was hoping to one day complete the set of all 3 7000 SA plugins.

Best Regards,
Nenad Filipovic

Re: Successful restoration of 564B and 3L5, now looking for 7L5

Chuck Harris
 

face1941 face1941@... [TekScopes] wrote:
It's nothing as magic as a motor, it is just a cranked
mechanical counter.

The variety with the led counter isn't magical either.
It is just a DVM that measures the VCO voltage.

So, in either case you are relying on the linearity of
the VCO and how it matches to another device.

-Chuck Harris

The older variety used a mechanical frequency read out driven by a motor
and had an operator 'zero frequency' control which you reset at the start of
the sweep to take care of drift, which drifts upwards in frequency from
cold.

Re: HV Probe?

n4buq
 

Is anyone familiar with the Sencore 39A19 as shown in the following eBay ad?
I've looked for info on it and haven't found much. I don't quite
understand how it is connected, etc., nor do I know whether it's decent
quality probe. I think Sencore makes/made pretty high quality gear so am
assuming this would be a good probe.

Anyone know about it?

http://www.ebay.com/itm//202071277710

It's a high voltage resistor in a protective housing.

It should have a resistor across the input jacks to the meter.

I have a fluke 80 HV probe. It contains a complete HV divider, with
the resistor across the input about 1.109 megs, forming a 100 to 1 (or
1000 to 1) divider.

This one is designed for a 15 meg input impedance meter. It should
have a parallel resistor which in combination with the meter's
impedance should give you the appropriate division factor. If you use
a DMM with near infinite impedance or the wrong impedance, you could
put a parallel resistance across the meter terminals.

Harvey


Then it will read 1/100th of the applied voltage.

I don't think any of my meters have 15M input resistance; however, if placing an appropriate resistor across one of my higher-impedance meters (e.g. an HP 410B/C) would work, then that might be an option.

Thanks!
Barry - N4BUQ

Re: 465M HV Multiplier

n4buq
 

Well, after getting the replacement U550, before unsoldering the old and trying the new, I thought I'd try to test the tripler. Using the same kind of setup, I put 200VAC @ 40kHz on the input and monitored the output. Both input and output VMs are Fluke 25s. With this setup, I was seeing pretty much the same kind of output vs input as I was seeing with the existing module/multiplier.

As a test, I decided to substitute my Triplett 630NA to monitor the output and discovered that that meter shows pretty much a tripled voltage. Even when both the Fluke and the Triplett in parallel, the Fluke shows only a few volts and the Triplett shows several hundred volts. I also tried one of my Simpson 260s and am seeing the same results as the Triplett.

I then used both analog meters as input and output monitors and am seeing what one would exect out of a tripler.

I then switched to using the same analog monitoring with the existing U550 module (still in the scope) and am seeing virtually the same results (e.g. tripled output voltages vs input voltages).

This is perplexing to me. I realize the analog meters have a different/lower input resistance but would have expected the analog meters to fall off at the higher frequencies versus the Flukes. What's makes it even more odd (to me) is that monitoring the input voltage with either the DMM or the analog meters gives me about the same readings - it's just the output that's different.

What's going on with this? Is this "normal"? I'm beginning to wonder if the tripler in the original module is not really bad but with these conflicting readings, I'm no longer sure.

As a side note, I did find that the input and output voltages peak more around 37kHz instead of 40kHz. I don't know if the manual states the operating frequency of the oscillator (and, hence, the expected operating frequency of the multiplier) but looking at the scope scans in the manual, it appears it has a 25 microsecond period so would have expected it to peak at 40kHz. Perhaps, though, that's just a product of the closest values of capacitors being used and not a truly tuned circuit(?).

Sorry - that was rather long but I would appreciate any comments/explanations of what I'm [not] seeing with all of this.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry" <n4buq@...>
To: TekScopes@...
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2017 3:25:43 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 465M HV Multiplier

Yes, be careful of this. Even Tektronix labeled voltage multipliers
both ways in different documentation.
The 465M documentation states 3X in at least two places; however, I've
yet,
though, to find the expected input and/or output voltages. Maybe I'm just
not finding it but I think I've seen a site that discusses this very thing
with respect to the 465M. I assume it's the same circuit for the 455 so
maybe that manual is clearer.

Barry - N4BUQ
The ambiguity comes about because some documentation bases the
multiplication factor on the peak input voltage and some on the
peak-to-peak input voltage which is twice as high.

The 455 manual says the output at pin 10 of T550 is 3.3 kilovolts
peak, not peak-to-peak, and the total CRT acceleration voltage is
about 12 kilovolts. Subtracting the -2 kilovolt cathode voltage
yields about 10 kilovolts for the PDA (post deflection acceleration)
produced by x3 multiplication of the peak, not peak-to-peak, voltage
of 3.3 kilovolts. The 455 and 465M schematics and parts lists say
U550 is a x3 multiplier and part number 152-0635-00.

The Tektronix parts catalog however lists 152-0635-00 as a 1.5x
multiplier with a peak-to-peak input voltage of 6.7 kilovolts hense
the confusion.

I think Chuck has it right and you are looking for a 3 diode
multiplier. Check out the 454A schematic for an example where
Tektronix also refers to it as a tripler. It takes 3 diodes and 3
capacitors plus maybe some resistors and capacitors for an output
filter as shown.
I have located a replacement brick and hopefully that will take care of this.
If not, then I'll start looking into building a suitable multiplier and
will check out the 454A for any other things aside from the basic diodes and
caps that might be necessary/good to have for it.

Thanks for the reply!

Barry - N4BUQ

Re: Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

 

Hi Håkan and Rolynn,

This doesn't make sense to me since the construction of the CRT gun is so weird. Even my friend, who used to design CRT elements at Tek could not figure out what we were looking at inside the neck. Further mystery comes from the fact that the 11301 is an average speed (<500MHz) scope with no unusual features that would require such a strange gun.

What am I missing?

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2017 12:47 PM
Subject: [TekScopes] Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

<snip>
About 2 years ago I bought 100 Tek oscilloscope CRTs from Walter Shawlee at Sphere Research before he took them to the dumps.

I just got around to opening their shipping boxes and looking at a few of them. That is when I came across an extremely unusual CRT. The gun area is filled with things I have never seen before in any CRT I ever looked at.

Can you lookup this number and figure out what instrument or scope it went into:
154-0883-00
I suspect it was made in 1987 because there is another number on the Tek label that says 07-7 which might be a date code.

Thanks, Dennis
------------------------------------
Posted by: "Dennis Tillman" <@Dennis_Tillman_W7pF>
------------------------------------

Re: Successful restoration of 564B and 3L5, now looking for 7L5

Nenad Filipovic
 

Hi Chuck, John,

Thanks for your very helpful feedback. Yes, to sweep the whole 50kHz with
5Hz RBW would indeed take >1.5h. But anyway that's not the way I'd use it.
For my noise work I may be interested in sweeping 0 to 20kHz with no less
than 100Hz RBW (which should take some seconds), or 10Hz to 1kHz with no
less than 10Hz RBW (which should take some tens of seconds). With digital
storage to aid the display of slow sweep, we could call these figures
acceptable.

John's notes on 3580A would surely be put to use if I happen to obtain this
device. I still fear that drifts are an archenemy of old school SAs when
spans are short and close to the low end of the frequency range. It would
be really helpful if someone could compare the 7L5 performance in that
aspect, I was hoping that its phase lock (and stable reference) would sort
this out, to an extent.

I had an FFT SA borrowed from a colleague some time ago, but unfortunately
had to return it too soon - never had a chance to fully get accustomed to
it and "calibrate" the whole process of measurement. It employed standard
FFT settings which could be translated into "traditional" ones (span,
RBW...), but I still struggled to get consistent and meaningful results
with it (measuring noise levels). I will definitely need to try again.

Btw, I find it a little scary that I found very little good words about the
7L5 so far. I understand that it may not employ the most comfortable design
of commands, or is missing nifty features, but according to the specs it
should be a decent performer. In a way I don't know what to think now. I am
looking for it also from the Tek collector's point - I already have a 7L18,
so I was hoping to one day complete the set of all 3 7000 SA plugins.

Best Regards,
Nenad Filipovic




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Need Advice on a good used shop scope

Harvey White
 

On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 20:23:32 +0200, you wrote:

Given that this old stuff is now dirt cheap, you can just go with the
best, and that is a 7000 series in my opinion.
If you have the bench space and don't need portability it's really
hard to beat, and even takes a 7D20 plugin for some basic digital
scope functionality.
7D20's are not cheap, not that I've found. Correct about the
capability, though.


That said, personally I could not imagine using an analog scope for
real work every day.
Actually, I could. It depends *very* much what you define as real
work (as opposed to unreal?).

If you're not dealing with much that's digital, then you really don't
need a digital scope. The sharply tuned input filters that are needed
to avoid anti-aliasing limit the bandwidth, while analog scopes just
roll off gracefully.

You need not worry about sampling rates, either. You get everything,
and not just what's happening at the sample points.

On the other hand, if you want to look at steady representations of
low rep rate stuff, digital is your friend, otherwise you need a
storage scope.

Even with an extremely limited budget there are now cheap crappy
Chinese scopes and they often beat an analog scope in terms of
useability.
If you're dealing with an analog scope trying to decode a digital data
stream, then yes.

it all depends on what you mean by useable, and for what purpose.

Sure there are always points where the analog scope is superior
(bandwidth, noise, repairability, etc..) but my analog scopes see
practically zero use these days.
and I typically spend time with both digital scopes (TDS540A), analog
(7000 series), and the HP Logic analyzer (16702B). Then again, it
very much depends on what I need to see and why.


Since you work with vacuum tube gear I expect you have significant
experience with analog scopes and might find them more practical than
I do.
I'd agree with this. If he finds something that an analog scope won't
do (typically, for me, related to storage and not necessarily related
to data decoding), then a digital scope can be recommended. the 468
is both, within some limitations. The digital section is pretty much
independent of the analog section.

(Except that you need the digital section to control the analog
section in certain aspects, I think.)

Harvey




ST

On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 7:27 PM, pdulaff@... [TekScopes]
<TekScopes@...> wrote:
Hello


I am Paul, WB2NMI. I am looking for recommendations on good affordable used scopes for my home shop. I work on vacuum tube and solid state amateur gear. Something like the 465/475 scopes make sense but there are these combo digital/analog scopes that maybe add additional versatility, but I don't have experience with digital scopes. I would like to buy used and keep the scope affordable and am willing to repair the scope provided parts and documentation are available.


Let me know your thoughts.


Paul - WB2NMI








------------------------------------
Posted by: pdulaff@...
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links


Re: Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

 

Can you lookup this number and figure out what instrument or scope it went into:
>154-0883-00

Rolynn is right, 11301.

/Håkan

Re: Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

Verne Morrow
 

I wonder if it's from a specialized 7912 digitizing scope.
http://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/T7912 and http://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/7912
have nice pictures of the basic 7912 tube, and note about getting it to
do 1 Ghz
in specialized configs.


'ROLYNN PRECHTL' k7dfw@... [TekScopes] wrote:


Can you lookup this number and figure out what instrument or scope
it went into: 154-0883-00

===========================================

Dennis,

How about the 11301.

Rolynn



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

ROLYNN PRECHTL K7DFW
 

Can you lookup this number and figure out what instrument or scope it went into: 154-0883-00
===========================================

Dennis,

How about the 11301.

Rolynn

Thank you, and question about a very unusual CRT

 

Hi Håkan,
Thank you for the HV Transformer. My 577 is now working perfectly again. Now I have a new question for you.

About 2 years ago I bought 100 Tek oscilloscope CRTs from Walter Shawlee at Sphere Research before he took them to the dumps.

I just got around to opening their shipping boxes and looking at a few of them. That is when I came across an extremely unusual CRT. The gun area is filled with things I have never seen before in any CRT I ever looked at.

Can you lookup this number and figure out what instrument or scope it went into:
154-0883-00
I suspect it was made in 1987 because there is another number on the Tek label that says 07-7 which might be a date code.

Thanks, Dennis

Re: Need Advice on a good used shop scope

Richard Solomon <dickw1ksz@...>
 

For versatility and ease of repair, you
can't beat the 7603 as a bench scope.

There are a plethora of plug-ins that
you can use.

73, Dick, W1KSZ

On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 10:27 AM, pdulaff@... [TekScopes] <
TekScopes@...> wrote:



Hello


I am Paul, WB2NMI. I am looking for recommendations on good affordable
used scopes for my home shop. I work on vacuum tube and solid state amateur
gear. Something like the 465/475 scopes make sense but there are these
combo digital/analog scopes that maybe add additional versatility, but I
don't have experience with digital scopes. I would like to buy used and
keep the scope affordable and am willing to repair the scope provided parts
and documentation are available.


Let me know your thoughts.


Paul - WB2NMI



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]