Date   

Waaayyyy OT for Portland folks

teamlarryohio
 

Just thinking back to a couple Beaverton trips 30+ years ago.
Is Earthquake Ethel's still around?
-ls-


533 and 535 on Seattle Craigslist

sipespresso <sipespresso@...>
 

I have no affiliation with the seller.
http://seattle.craigslist.org/est/ele/3882133784.html
-Kurt


Re: Tektronix Plug-in Extension Cable "012-0030-00" ?

David Holland
 

Have you prepared for the sticker shock when pricing those parts?

You can buy a whole extender for just what the connectors alone cost new......


On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 9:31 PM, mda231 <mda231@...> wrote:


Have just done a search and found this:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/TekScopes/message/92338

- Seems the part numbers are correct.

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@..., "mda231" wrote:
>
>
>
> Hello Tim,
>
> I suspect I may have to make my own, as you suggest.
>
> Having done some searching based on what you and Damian have said, I think the plug is an "Amphenol 26-159-16" and the socket is an "Amphenol 26-190-16".
>
> Can you or anyone else who's made their own confirm this, please?
>
> Thanks.
>
> MDA.
>
> --- In TekScopes@..., "Tim Phillips" wrote:
> >
> > from Tim P (UK)
> > Sometimes some rigid extenders appear on the 'bay, but for flexibles, most people roll their own.
> > The connectors are reasonably easy to get, and you just need wire that can carry the currents involved,
> > and co-ax for the signal and trigger lines. (I *think* these may be 93 ohm.)
> > Tim
>




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Re: Tektronix Plug-in Extension Cable "012-0030-00" ?

mda231
 

Have just done a search and found this:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/TekScopes/message/92338

- Seems the part numbers are correct.

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "mda231" <mda231@...> wrote:



Hello Tim,

I suspect I may have to make my own, as you suggest.

Having done some searching based on what you and Damian have said, I think the plug is an "Amphenol 26-159-16" and the socket is an "Amphenol 26-190-16".

Can you or anyone else who's made their own confirm this, please?

Thanks.

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Phillips" <tim@> wrote:

from Tim P (UK)
Sometimes some rigid extenders appear on the 'bay, but for flexibles, most people roll their own.
The connectors are reasonably easy to get, and you just need wire that can carry the currents involved,
and co-ax for the signal and trigger lines. (I *think* these may be 93 ohm.)
Tim


Re: 7854 readout jitter

 

On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 00:36:29 +0100, Chris Wilson
<chris@chriswilson.tv> wrote:

Yes easy, just put a time base into a vertical slot, nothing in the
horizontal. You'll get a line up the screen, adjust to centre, job done.
Regards,
David Partridge
20/06/2013 00:33

I tried this, and get no display at all save for the readout. Maybe I
moved it more than I thought, or it's incredibly sensitive? Or maybe
I am misunderstanding and missing some point? I can try David Whess's
idea, but don't want to muddy the waters further if I am
misunderstanding your all external save twiddling the pot method. I
had a 7B85 in the leftmost slot, and no other plugins in the chassis.

Thanks David P and David W.
I do not know the pattern but some of the 7000 series mainframes
require a plug-in to be installed in the selected horizontal slot or
they blank the z-axis. The deflection circuits are still driven so
you can see the readout jitter depending on the timebase sweep but no
trace will be seen.

I just checked and my 7854 blanks the z-axis without a horizontal
plug-in installed but I know my 7603 does not care.


Re: Tektronix Plug-in Extension Cable "012-0030-00" ?

mda231
 

Thanks again, Damian. - I think I may have now found the Amphenol part numbers.

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "cheater00 ." <cheater00@...> wrote:

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 5:37 PM, Tim Phillips
<tim@...> wrote:
Sometimes some rigid extenders appear on the 'bay, but for flexibles, most people roll their own.
The connectors are reasonably easy to get, and you just need wire that can carry the currents involved,
and co-ax for the signal and trigger lines. (I *think* these may be 93 ohm.)
Yeah, they're just Amphenol.

BTW, the guy also has this:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Amphenol-Kabel-24pol-Buchse-Stecker-75cm-Cable-ADMIRAL-/230989454751?pt=Mess_Pr%C3%BCftechnik&hash=item35c80b5d9f

Then there's also this:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Tektronix-067-0590-00-Calibration-Fixture-568-R568-Oscilloscope-Plug-In-Extender-/390600552477?pt=BI_Oscilloscopes&hash=item5af19b701d

and:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Tektronix-067-0591-00-Calibration-Fixture-560-Series-Oscilloscope-Extender-/271199605568?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f24c19340

Cheers,
D.


Re: Tektronix Plug-in Extension Cable "012-0030-00" ?

mda231
 

Hello Tim,

I suspect I may have to make my own, as you suggest.

Having done some searching based on what you and Damian have said, I think the plug is an "Amphenol 26-159-16" and the socket is an "Amphenol 26-190-16".

Can you or anyone else who's made their own confirm this, please?

Thanks.

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Phillips" <tim@...> wrote:

from Tim P (UK)
Sometimes some rigid extenders appear on the 'bay, but for flexibles, most people roll their own.
The connectors are reasonably easy to get, and you just need wire that can carry the currents involved,
and co-ax for the signal and trigger lines. (I *think* these may be 93 ohm.)
Tim


Re: Tektronix Plug-in Extension Cable "012-0030-00" ?

mda231
 

Thanks Damian. - That's the general type of thing, but I am looking for the flexible cable version.

MDA

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "cheater00 ." <cheater00@...> wrote:

Hi MDA,

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 4:29 PM, mda231 <mda231@...> wrote:
Thanks for the hint. - I've had a look on ebay in the UK and couldn't see any, unfortunately.

The one I'm looking for is suitable for a 500 series scope (Type 556).

It's in Austria:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Tektronix-Plug-In-Extension-545A-545B-547-555-551-549-531A-Extender-Verlangerung-/230986824259?pt=Mess_Pr%C3%BCftechnik&hash=item35c7e33a43

Cheers,
Damian


Re: CRT magnetic screens: Mumetal?

Ed Breya
 

I think in the earlier days, or in some manuals, there were warnings about avoiding stresses on the material. It's not practical to re-anneal to original performance if seriously banged up, but the overall shielding is still pretty good even so, and certainly better than nothing. For our purposes, I wouldn't worry too much about a few dings here and there - just don't put any magnets near the defects, which could become slightly magnetized and possibly cause distortion in the CRT.

I've saved the shields from every CRT item I've ever junked out, and have worked and re-used the material for a number of applications. It loses some of its effectiveness near any cuts or sharp bends, but large planar areas that aren't stressed too much tend to be OK.

Ed

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "John S" <John@...> wrote:


Thanks for the confirmation guys: must have been an expensive component. There's no "warning" lable on either the shield or the manual to tell you not to knock etc.

John


Re: 7854 readout jitter

Chris Wilson
 


Yes easy, just put a time base into a vertical slot, nothing in the
horizontal. You'll get a line up the screen, adjust to centre, job done.
Regards,
David Partridge



20/06/2013 00:33

I tried this, and get no display at all save for the readout. Maybe I
moved it more than I thought, or it's incredibly sensitive? Or maybe
I am misunderstanding and missing some point? I can try David Whess's
idea, but don't want to muddy the waters further if I am
misunderstanding your all external save twiddling the pot method. I
had a 7B85 in the leftmost slot, and no other plugins in the chassis.

Thanks David P and David W.

--
Best Regards,
Chris Wilson.


Re: CRT magnetic screens: Mumetal?

Bernice Loui <rupunzels_window@...>
 

Not just dropping, bending or trying to alter the shape of those magnetic shields will reduce their effectiveness.


There are two basic version of magnetic shielding Co-NETIC and NETIC. There are versions of mu metal that does not require the hydrogen annealing process post fab, but they may not be as effective as the materials that require the post fab annealing process.


http://www.magnetic-shield.com/faqs-all-about-shielding.html


Bernice





--- On Wed, 6/19/13, Steve wrote:

From: Steve
Subject: [TekScopes] Re: CRT magnetic screens: Mumetal?
To: TekScopes@...
Date: Wednesday, June 19, 2013, 10:05 PM

 

--- In TekScopes@..., "John S" wrote:
>
>
> I've always assumed that the blue screen around the CRT on Tek scopes (400 series etc) was made of Mumetal. Is this actually true?
>
> John
>

Yes.

Tek fabricated them from raw stock. After they were cut, bent and spot welded, they went into an oven to be annealed (mu metal loses its shielding properties if physically bent or modified (drilling holes etc.) after annealing. If you drop a shield on the floor and the corner bends - throw it away.) The ovens operated at high temperature in a pure hydrogen (reducing) atmosphere. Opening an oven door before it had cooled posed an explosion hazard. To minimize the danger, Tek used several small ovens, each could only contain about 4 or 6 shields.

- Steve


Re: CRT magnetic screens: Mumetal?

John
 

Thanks for the confirmation guys: must have been an expensive component. There's no "warning" lable on either the shield or the manual to tell you not to knock etc.

John


Re: Spot the 'scope

mda231
 

Hello Julian,

I know I'm a "bit" late on this one, but the scope is definitely a 545A.

If you go to the Youtube link of the video, pause it at about 1:03 - 1:04 and go into full-screen mode, you will see the scope's name in the usual place. It's the scene where the scientist seems to be adjusting the scope's "VARIABLE" control.

It's a really nice track, by the way: I am quite a fan of Benny Benassi's stuff and have been since I heard "Satisfaction".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8k01lcSB0-g

Did anyone spot what looks like an MPC-3000 at about 1:10?

MDA.

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "Julian" <Julian.Bunn@...> wrote:

I happened upon a music video by Benny Benassi that features a nice vintage Tektronix 'scope, I think it's a 545, but am not sure?

Here is the link - the 'scope appears right at the start, and throughout.

http://www.lp33.tv/artists/bennybenassi/

The track is called "Cinema".


Re: Is this P5205 worth buying and repairing?

 

On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 21:56:20 -0000, "Steve" <ditter2@yahoo.com> wrote:

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "cheater00 ." <cheater00@...> wrote:

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 5:14 PM, David <davidwhess@...> wrote:
In theory by negating the readout current you could divide by 10
instead of multiplying by 10 but I am not aware of a probe doing that.
It would require an external power connection.
...which would fit given that a probe which amplifies stuff needs a
power connection anyways :) Very smart indeed :)

D.
Nice theory, but the readout logic does not work that way. It only detects current in one direction, and will not apply gain if you tried to reverse it, which possibly may damage the chip. The intent was only to handle attenuating probes, which back in the 1960's when this was designed, only attenuated in factors of /1, /10, /100 and /1000.

The ability to handle the inner division factors (/20,/50, /200, etc. was added with 11000 series plug-ins, which used a processor to read the encoding ring. TDS400 and TDS700C added gain factors as well. communication to the readout system in 11000 series is through a serial data bus, not the time slot current sense system used in 7000 series.

- Steve
Ah well, it would have worked if not for those meddling kids.

Looking at it now, I see that a darlington emitter follower (and a
diode) used to isolate the time slot pulses from the readout
connector. For some reason I thought the current was added directly
or via a current mirror for isolation.


Re: CRT magnetic screens: Mumetal?

ditter2
 

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "John S" <John@...> wrote:


I've always assumed that the blue screen around the CRT on Tek scopes (400 series etc) was made of Mumetal. Is this actually true?

John
Yes.

Tek fabricated them from raw stock. After they were cut, bent and spot welded, they went into an oven to be annealed (mu metal loses its shielding properties if physically bent or modified (drilling holes etc.) after annealing. If you drop a shield on the floor and the corner bends - throw it away.) The ovens operated at high temperature in a pure hydrogen (reducing) atmosphere. Opening an oven door before it had cooled posed an explosion hazard. To minimize the danger, Tek used several small ovens, each could only contain about 4 or 6 shields.

- Steve


Re: Received 468 - It works like new (almost)! Digital and all.

Paul Amaranth
 

Get a probe with the readout pin on the BNC and the correct
scale lamp will illuminate showing the correct X10 scale
when you use it. The Tek P6065A is one, another is the
HP10441a/b

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 03:26:19PM -0500, David wrote:

For general use you really need some x10 passive probes.

On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 20:03:12 -0000, "yankee495"
<yankee495@mailshack.com> wrote:

I sure wish I had a probe. Is there any simple way to take any readings to see how close it is without a good probe?
--
Paul Amaranth, GCIH | Rochester MI, USA
Aurora Group, Inc. | Security, Systems & Software
paul@AuroraGrp.Com | Unix & Windows


Re: Is this P5205 worth buying and repairing?

ditter2
 

--- In TekScopes@yahoogroups.com, "cheater00 ." <cheater00@...> wrote:

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 5:14 PM, David <davidwhess@...> wrote:
In theory by negating the readout current you could divide by 10
instead of multiplying by 10 but I am not aware of a probe doing that.
It would require an external power connection.
...which would fit given that a probe which amplifies stuff needs a
power connection anyways :) Very smart indeed :)

D.
Nice theory, but the readout logic does not work that way. It only detects current in one direction, and will not apply gain if you tried to reverse it, which possibly may damage the chip. The intent was only to handle attenuating probes, which back in the 1960's when this was designed, only attenuated in factors of /1, /10, /100 and /1000.

The ability to handle the inner division factors (/20,/50, /200, etc. was added with 11000 series plug-ins, which used a processor to read the encoding ring. TDS400 and TDS700C added gain factors as well. communication to the readout system in 11000 series is through a serial data bus, not the time slot current sense system used in 7000 series.

- Steve


Re: 7854 readout jitter

 

Yes easy, just put a time base into a vertical slot, nothing in the horizontal. You'll get a line up the screen, adjust to centre, job done.


Regards,
David Partridge

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com [mailto:TekScopes@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Wilson
Sent: 19 June 2013 21:50
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: 7854 readout jitter

Stupidly though I nudged R15 by mistake (the horizontal centre adjustment). I realised my error immediately, but did move it and can only guess it's pretty close to where it was. Is there a way to set this without a standardizer? Perhaps using a sig gen or function gen creatively? A standardizer is now near the top of my "must have" list.
This must be the fifth time I could really have done with one. Thanks Albert, David and Göran.

--
Best Regards,
Chris Wilson.


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: 7854 readout jitter

 

On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 16:17:42 -0500, David <davidwhess@gmail.com>
wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 21:49:35 +0100, Chris Wilson
<chris@chriswilson.tv> wrote:

I have managed to effect a big improvement with these adjustments.
There is still very slight jitter, you have to look for it, but now
pretty equally balanced channel to channel. It is certainly a lot
better now.


Stupidly though I nudged R15 by mistake (the horizontal centre
adjustment). I realised my error immediately, but did move it and can
only guess it's pretty close to where it was. Is there a way to set
this without a standardizer? Perhaps using a sig gen or function gen
creatively? A standardizer is now near the top of my "must have" list.
This must be the fifth time I could really have done with one. Thanks
Albert, David and Göran.
The horizontal and vertical center are easy to set without a
standardizer.

The CRT output zero trims are set after using a jumper to short the
differential input to each CRT amplifier as outlined in the service
manual. That is probably the one you fiddled with accidentally.

The input trims can be done with any vertical amplifier. Set the
input if the vertical amplifier to ground coupling and use a voltmeter
to measure the differential signal across pins A11 and B11 and adjust
the position control for zero volts. Now as long as you do not change
the position control, you have a zero reference that does the same
thing as the standardizer.
Incidentally, you can do the vertical and horizontal calibration in
the same way. Use an AC voltmeter to accurately measure a low
frequency square wave between pins A11 and B11 while using a
calibration factor depending on if the meter is average or RMS
responding. Any good meter will get you to 0.2% accuracy or better
and even a mediocre meter will get you to 1% accuracy which is good
enough.

I believe the sensitivity at pins A11 and B11 is 50 millivolts per
division but I am just going by memory.


Re: 7854 readout jitter

 

On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 21:49:35 +0100, Chris Wilson
<chris@chriswilson.tv> wrote:




Hi Chris,
You only have to do Step E2 u-z, so you don't need a standardizer.
In response to you question to David, the fault does affect the
horizontal time-linearity of the "normal" trace. Specifically the
start of the trace might be compressed or expanded.
Albert


19/06/2013 21:40

I have managed to effect a big improvement with these adjustments.
There is still very slight jitter, you have to look for it, but now
pretty equally balanced channel to channel. It is certainly a lot
better now.


Stupidly though I nudged R15 by mistake (the horizontal centre
adjustment). I realised my error immediately, but did move it and can
only guess it's pretty close to where it was. Is there a way to set
this without a standardizer? Perhaps using a sig gen or function gen
creatively? A standardizer is now near the top of my "must have" list.
This must be the fifth time I could really have done with one. Thanks
Albert, David and Göran.
The horizontal and vertical center are easy to set without a
standardizer.

The CRT output zero trims are set after using a jumper to short the
differential input to each CRT amplifier as outlined in the service
manual. That is probably the one you fiddled with accidentally.

The input trims can be done with any vertical amplifier. Set the
input if the vertical amplifier to ground coupling and use a voltmeter
to measure the differential signal across pins A11 and B11 and adjust
the position control for zero volts. Now as long as you do not change
the position control, you have a zero reference that does the same
thing as the standardizer.

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