Date   

Need Tek 7633 part

JOSE V. GAVILA (EB5AGV/EC5AAU) <eb5agv@...>
 

Hello!

In order to get my recently acquired (yes, I finally did it!) 7633, I need
a dual potentiometer
----------------------------------------------------------------------
73 EB5AGV / EC5AAU - JOSE V. GAVILA
La Canyada - Valencia (SPAIN)

EB5AGV Vintage Radio Site: http://www.geocities.com/eb5agv

European Boatanchors List: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/euro_ba_swap


Re: Cannot Send to list - Test

Peter Florance
 

Strange. Some lists do not echo the sender but I know this one does.

Peter Florance
Audio Services
544 Central Drive
Suite 101
Virginia Beach, VA 23454
757.498.8277
757.498.9554 Fax
Email: mailto:audserv@exis.net
http://www.audio-services.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Stan or Patricia Griffiths [mailto:w7ni@easystreet.com]
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 5:57 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Cannot Send to list - Test


Hi Doug,

I saw your request on the list at least 3 times so it is getting
posted. I
just don't have the stuff you need.

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com

DougHale@inet-1.com wrote:

I have not been able to post to the list - this is a test from alternate
email address


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Re: Copyright

Stan or Patricia Griffiths <w7ni@...>
 

jrlaw@istar.ca wrote:

Keep up the stimulating debate in amongst important things like
finding sources for Tektronix paint. (yes, the distinctive colour is
probably capable of being the subject of copyright!)

Regards Richard Jones
Well, I've got the paint in spray cans . . . both the latest Tek Blue and an
earlier Tek Gray that was on the really early scopes but I have yet to figure
out a both legal and economic way to ship it . . .

Asking other people how they do it usually results in finding out they simply
do it illegally . . . not terribly unlike copying manuals . . .

I HAVE found a company that can ship it for me. The cost breakdown goes like
this:

Paint per can = $15.00
UPS shipping fee = $6.00 (approx)
UPS Hazardous Material Handling fee = $22.00
Packaging fee = $75.00
Total = $118.00

for ONE can.

The reason the packaging fee is so much is that the person doing the packing
has to be "certified". To get certified you have to take a training course
in packing hazardous materials that takes 3 days and costs $500 in tuition
and fees.

The penalty for ignoring all of these requirements is in the range of a
$10,000 fine if you get caught.

This is what my research has turned up so far . . .

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com


Re: Cannot Send to list - Test

Stan or Patricia Griffiths <w7ni@...>
 

Hi Doug,

I saw your request on the list at least 3 times so it is getting posted. I
just don't have the stuff you need.

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com

DougHale@inet-1.com wrote:

I have not been able to post to the list - this is a test from alternate
email address


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Re: copyright issues...

Stan or Patricia Griffiths <w7ni@...>
 

It started when Tek discontinued "free coffee" for employees and went downhill
from there . . .

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com

Miroslav Pokorni wrote:

Stan,

It came as quite surprise to me that rot set in into Tektronix during 80s. I
always thought that mid 90s brought that in, but then I am slow to see
trends, or I was indulging in wishful thinking.

Regards

Miroslav Pokorni

-----Original Message-----
From: Stan or Patricia Griffiths
[mailto:w7ni@easystreet.com]
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 6:45 PM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: copyright issues...

Hi John,

I am pretty familiar with how Tektronix has behaved toward
supporting some of
their equipment in the last two decades or so. I spent a
total of 26.5 years of
my life on Tek's payroll and, finally, in late 1989, got so
disturbed by what I
saw happening inside of Tektronix that I resigned my job as
their Spectrum
Analyzer Sales Engineer in the Pacific Northwest. Believe
me, this was not an
easy move for me. I seriously thought I would NEVER leave
Tek. I was wrong.

I still have many very fond memories of life at Tektronix in
the 60's and 70's
and that is the part of Tek's history that I enjoy reliving
with my old
collection.

Still, they own that documented material and have refused to
let me have it. I
am just not willing to steal it from them.

How about a letter campaign to get Tek to let up on burying
that copyrighted
material?

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com

John Miles wrote:

> No offense or disrespect to Stan, certainly, but I tend
towards Michael's
> point of view on this. If Tek wants to preserve the
"right" to "copy" their
> literature, they can darned well "copy" it themselves and
offer it for
> sale... at which point I'll be first in line with my
credit card.
>
> Tek's behavior of late has been nothing short of shameful.
They had no
> qualms about selling a $50,000 spectrum analyzer in 1994,
but they'll tell
> you to find a short pier and take a long walk if you call
them after 1999
> asking to buy manuals and parts for your instrument.
>
> My somewhat-anarchic take on the matter is, if Tek won't
step up to the
> plate and support their products for a reasonable length
of time, then they
> don't have much of a moral right to complain when their
customers do what's
> necessary to take support into their own hands.
>
> Is violation of copyright "right"? Of course not; I make
my living from
> intellectual property and I'm the last guy who wants to
see lawlessness in
> this area. But then, I wouldn't leave my customers in the
lurch after 5
> years, either. I can, and do, take support calls from
people who bought
> software -- software!! -- from me six or seven years ago.
Tek can either do
> the same with their high-end hardware, or they can get
used to the
> consequences.
>
> (Of course, this is all a moot point nowadays, as I
discovered when I bought
> the $100 service manual for my TDS3034 and received a few
pages telling me
> how to take the back cover off.)
>
> -- jm

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Re: copyrights & CDROMs

Ashton Brown <ashtonb@...>
 

Having used Tek products since '56, known Paul Magnusson for a bunch of
those years - I concur exactly with Phil's observation (and deductions
of the hints we have been given + probable results of NOT heeding them).

Let this cocker spaniel doze indefinitely. Logic has little to do with
Bizness-2001: ask self how many continue to pay the Microsoft tax,
despite all we now know? Then ask what anyone cares about those who
appreciate 'Art' and want to preserve it (!)

(Nor can I yet fathom paying >$20K for an instrument with throw-away sm
boards, expected to be "written off" in 5 years and unserviceable in 6+.
They are nuts or I am.)

Ashton


"Phil (VA3UX)" wrote:


I'd be very careful about starting a campaign with Tek about the vintage
manual situation. I suggest we "let sleeping dogs lie". We've already been
given a preview of the answer such a request is likely to bring : one
retired employee has never received permission and another retired employee
was purportedly told " don't ask questions that you won't like the answers
to". That last statement - if it's true an accurate - has the answer we're
all looking for anyway but it's cleverly cloaked.

A petition is likely to attract the kind of attention that will have the
effect opposite to the intended goal. In today's high tech paranoia-driven
organizations, I can easily conceive a Vice President of Historical
Relations and Vintage Affairs looking at this and thinking, " my gawd !
There's 200 names on this letter. This must just be the tip of the iceburg.
There must really be thousands of potential customers for new products that
are being held captive by our older products. We'll stop this menace right
now. We'll issue a letter informing that we intend to prosecute copyright
infringement to full extent of the law, no matter how old the
product. We'll force them out of the 60's and 70's and into the year
2001". And then where would we be ? Worse-off than we are right now where
little if any attention is being paid to the miniscule market for copied
old manuals.

My advice : drop the issue and carry on as we have been.

Phil


Re: Copying of Manuals

Phil (VA3UX) <phil@...>
 

At 11:30 AM 9/17/2001 -0700, you wrote:
Phil,

The copy of the manual that you are describing looks like true copy. That
lady did a terrific job and quite quickly, even though you expected it to
take only 20 minutes. I own half a dozen of copied manuals and they are
'Xerox bond paper', that cheap staff used in copiers, schematics are double
letter size (fall of the cliff or next page if they are larger), spiral
bound alright but cover is just heavier blue paper.
Oh it was really nice Miroslav. If I had known she would go that much trouble I wouldn't have asked her. And I told her I wouldn't ask her to do any more in view of the effort required. The guy that got the manual was extremely happy and sent back a very nice e-mail which in turn I forwarded on to the girl that did the job. That made her day but I think she's happy that she's never seen another Tek manual come into the office.

Phil

Regards

Miroslav Pokorni



-----Original Message-----
From: Phil (VA3UX) [mailto:phil@vaxxine.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 7:42 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [TekScopes] Copying of Manuals

Well, I've read all the posts on this subject and I keep
flip-flopping
between it's OK to copy and it's not OK to copy. I see
valid points to
both sides. Stan is in the unique position of having worked
loyally for
Tek for along time which must create a bit of an internal
tug-o-war with an
issue like this.

In summary, I see this as a tempest in a teapot. I believe
that the demand
for vintage Tek manuals is puny in modern economic terms. I
do not believe
there is any money to be made with this process. I do not
see that there is
any guilt to be felt or borne from sharing "a copy" of a
single obsolete
manual between friends. As for the Tek's copyrights : they
own them and
they have their rights. If they refuse to allow legitimate
copying of old
manuals, it isn't for economic reasons. It's because they're
afflicted with
the same paranoia that most high tech companies are
afflicted with today in
North America. Rational thinking has nothing to do with it.

Second, the task of producing a good quality copy is
formidable and the
ratio of time/labor requirement to economic reward is poor.
I base this on
the one and only experience I had producing a copy of the
Tek 180A manual a
few years back for someone that could not locate one at the
time. I asked
one of the girls in our office to do it and she obliged.
The 180A manual
is just a little thing compared to most Tek manuals. What
she produced was
a commercial quality copy - I was thrilled with it : no
schematics taped
together - proper sized sheets for the drawings, good
quality paper
throughout, covers with comb binding, labeled tabbed
dividers. She said it
took about 2 1/2 hours to produce that. I was shocked. I
thought she would
have that whipped-up in about 20 minutes. Taking everything
into account I
figure that manual was worth $40 or $50. And then you'd have
to add your
profit margin on top if you were going to sell it. Nobody
would pay that
kind of money for that manual when the instrument itself
sells for
considerably less. Now consider the time and cost of
producing a copy of a
547 manual. If Tek did it, they'd probably want $150 US for
it. Any
takers ? I doubt it. SO, anyone making copies of these
manuals for sale
AND offering them at a price that anyone is likely willing
to pay, is
probably doing so out of labor-of-love, or at tiny profit
margins that
virtually nobody people wouldn't be interested in. I've
copied schematics
here and there so I can mark them up while doing a repair.
The process of
just doing a few sheets is cumbersome enough. I can't
imagine anyone
wanting to copy entire manuals and doing a decent job - it
ain't
fun. Stan, are you REALLY sure you'd like to be franchised
for production
of manual copies ?

Phil


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Re: copyrights & CDROMs

Phil (VA3UX) <phil@...>
 

I'd be very careful about starting a campaign with Tek about the vintage manual situation. I suggest we "let sleeping dogs lie". We've already been given a preview of the answer such a request is likely to bring : one retired employee has never received permission and another retired employee was purportedly told " don't ask questions that you won't like the answers to". That last statement - if it's true an accurate - has the answer we're all looking for anyway but it's cleverly cloaked.

A petition is likely to attract the kind of attention that will have the effect opposite to the intended goal. In today's high tech paranoia-driven organizations, I can easily conceive a Vice President of Historical Relations and Vintage Affairs looking at this and thinking, " my gawd ! There's 200 names on this letter. This must just be the tip of the iceburg. There must really be thousands of potential customers for new products that are being held captive by our older products. We'll stop this menace right now. We'll issue a letter informing that we intend to prosecute copyright infringement to full extent of the law, no matter how old the product. We'll force them out of the 60's and 70's and into the year 2001". And then where would we be ? Worse-off than we are right now where little if any attention is being paid to the miniscule market for copied old manuals.

My advice : drop the issue and carry on as we have been.

Phil

At 12:13 PM 9/17/2001 -0700, you wrote:
<snip>

The letters that Stan mentioned and I understand that he meant mass mailing,
would be very effective. If letters came from people who still work and on
company letterhead, Tektronix might get an idea how their scheming is
received by potential customers. I do not think that Stan and Dean should be
asked to sign a 'collective letter'; they still know lot of people at
Tektronix and no strain should be put on those relationships. Besides, in
Tektronix's mind our group, as collectors, is of no consequence, they are
looking at people who would buy new equipment.


Regards

Miroslav Pokorni



-----Original Message-----
From: david@slack.com [mailto:david@slack.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 10:03 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: copyrights & CDROMs

>PS . . . . . I have to confess that I have made a copy of a
page or two for
>some desparate Tek equipment owners in the past myself.
One guy now offers a
>CD ROM with 46 complete manuals on it, which I consider
orders of magnitude
>worse than anything like this that I have seen in the past.

The manuals on that CDROM are *not* OEM Tek or HP manuals.
They are US
Army manuals that are publically available on an Army web
site. I'm
looking at one now (TM 11-6625-2759-14, aka Tek 7L5 service
manual) and it
says "This manual contains copywrite [sic] material
reproduced by
permission of the Tektronix Company." If Tektronix objects
to reproduction
of this manual, it's really up to them to complain to the
Army. The guy
selling the CDROM is not at fault.

For what it's worth, my opinion on the copyright issue is
that the test
equipment companies are happy with the current ambiguous
situation and
don't have any reason to clarify it. They also don't have
an incentive
to sue people for copyright violation since the legal
expenses would far
exceed any possible damages they could collect. Therefore,
I predict the
current situation will continue.

In support of this, I have noticed that even the largest
test equipment
dealers often supply photocopied manuals with the used
equipment they sell.
Two examples are Electro Rent and Tucker (Tucker also sells
photocopied
service manuals). This doesn't really prove anything, but
since they are
franchised dealers for new equipment from HP and Tek, it
supports the idea
that those companies must not be bothered too much by the
practice.


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Re: Cannot Send to list - Test

John Miles <jmiles@...>
 

All three of your messages seem to have come through just fine, actually.

-- jm

----- Original Message -----
From: <DougHale@inet-1.com>
To: <TekScopes@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 2:32 PM
Subject: [TekScopes] Cannot Send to list - Test


I have not been able to post to the list - this is a test from alternate
email address


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Re: Copyrights, patents, costs, etc.

Phil (VA3UX) <phil@...>
 

I agree with you Dean but I don't recall anyone ragging on Tek for the high cost of their manuals. I've never spoken to anyone that didn't consider the Tek scope manuals to be the "benchmark" of what a manual should be; a standard to be worked towards by all others, a standard that few others (if any) achieved. The Tek manuals are masterpieces and they should be expensive. Now I'm referring here to the older stuff (50's to 70's) since that's pretty much all I have here. The work in putting those manuals together must have been incredible : the clarity of thought and writing, the photography, the details, the exploded diagrams as you pointed out - all first class. Now I do recall a recent post about someone paying good money for a current manual that sounded like it's content was disappointing, but that's the only negative I've ever heard or read. Clearly, Tek is a different company today than it was 30 or 50 years ago. But so are most companies. My own employer is a disappointing shell of what it used to be just 15 years ago.

Anyhow I otherwise agree with everything you wrote.

Tnx.....Phil

At 04:19 PM 9/17/2001 +0000, you wrote:
On behalf of Tektronix and every other manufacturer of high-quality,
industrial test equipment, I can understand why a manual would cost
so much. When you consider all of the drawings, parts lists,
mechanical parts "explosions", etc. complete with pull-out
schematics, parts-placement diagrams, etc., all nicely bound, heavily
edited for minimal mistakes, high-quality paper, good printing ....
well, it's no wonder that a manual gets expensive. We can rag on Tek
all we want for high-cost manuals, but the day wasn't that long ago
that Tek charged either $7.50 or $15.00 for their manuals regardless
of the manual. Even back then, that was dirt-cheap!

They always included two manuals with each instrument. That's one
reason that a lot of Tek manuals are so plentiful on the surplus
market.

Tucker doesn't always copy those manuals. We tried ordering an hp
manual from them once and found out that the delay in ordering and
the high cost of the manual was because they were going to order it
directly from hp "for me" ... and add to the delay and the cost
considerable. (I don't remember the circumstances of why we were
ordering through them vs. directly from hp.)

Tek sued for copyright and patent infringement once. It left a bad
taste in their mouths, too, so that may be why they "speak loudly and
carry a small stick". The suit where they sued the U.S. Government,
Lavoie Labs, Hickok, et. al. for "cloning" 545 scopes for government
contract fulfilment took upwards of 10 years and gained them nothing
but principle. The money they spent defending their property was far
greater than that awarded -- from companies long-gone.

One reason that Tek is poor with support of older instruments is that
Tektronix is Tektronix's greatest competitor. How could they expect
to sell TDS-series scopes for a small fortune when there were all
kinds of fully-functioning, lab-grade, analog Tek scopes out there on
ebay and in "Nuts & Volts" magazine for pennies on the dollar? You
reduce that competition by killing support.

The comment was made something on the order that Tek's lousy customer
service support on the older equipment is doing little more than
losing customers for new equipment. Who are we fooling here? The
same folks that are buying 465's, 7904's and 7854's off ebay are not
going to be buying anything new from Tek. That's not even an
argument.

I'm not a Tek-blue supporter here. Just flipping over the other side
of the coin. I don't think that it makes sense that the "Concept
Series" and other out-of-print publications should be hoarded by Tek
and not shared. If there's no profit for them in
reprinting "Vertical Amplifiers" for sale, then there's no loss if
someone else does. At that point, it's only a matter of principle
and is more like me when I was a kid not letting my sister play with
my microscope even though I hadn't touched it in six years and had
zero interest in it.



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Re: Copyright

jrlaw@...
 

Toronto, Canada
Monday, September 17, 2001

Dear John:
Thank you for your reaction to my thoughts on this issue. It
has clearly hit a number of nerves!

In terms of what to do, I would hope that Stan Griffiths and
others will simply forward the exchanges of messages from this group
to a number of execs at Tektronix. While they may have left the
golden era behind, it must be admitted that they are still a pretty
fine company and, hopefully not unaware of their market. The views of
people such as the enthusiasts here are important. In my day job, I
am the senior partner of a Canadian business law firm and I will
regale people with my pleasure at having got a Tek 191 Constant
Amplitude Signal Generator. As they glaze over, I have been known to
describe the perfection of its manufacture! Small thing maybe, but it
is a good thing for a business to have some folks out there who think
their products are (or were) the best.

Hopefully, Tektronix will be persuaded that indirectly
supporting the "legacy" equipment is cost effective marketing. If
Stan's friends in Tek Legal would like some suggested wording for a
public use license, I would be please to contribute some of my
copyrighted work product absolutely free!

Keep up the stimulating debate in amongst important things like
finding sources for Tektronix paint. (yes, the distinctive colour is
probably capable of being the subject of copyright!)

Regards Richard Jones


--- In TekScopes@y..., jstanton@v... wrote:
Hi Richard,

Thank you for an elegant treatise where you raise the issue
of "fair
use", the rights associated with the sale of the instrument and a
way
in which Tek could grant a limited license for the distribution of
documentation. What you suggest make eminent sense and should be
the
last word on this matter.

How an we persuade or help you to present your proposal to
Tektronix?

Regards

John Stanton

--- In TekScopes@y..., jrlaw@i... wrote:
Toronto, Canada
September 16, 2001

Re: Tek Copyright and Out-of-Print Manuals

The debate on this issue has become more heated than it
should.
I
know that we all look forward to hearing the feedback from Stan
Griffiths' dialogue with Tek Legal. In the meantime, perhaps a
couple
of Canadian cents worth may help to avoid escalating the
discussion
beyond the private rights actually involved.

This is not a matter of criminal or public law. Copyright is
the
property that each of us enjoys in what we create in the form of
original artistic work. It is seperate and different from
patentable
inventions or unique useful designs. The right is a private right
to
enjoin others from using your artistic work for profit or in
competition with you. Rights are usually best understood by
looking
at the remedies that give them effect. Private property rights
don't
mean much without a remedy.

The usual remedy fro copyright infringement is damages for
lost
profit by the owner of the copyright or an accounting (and
payment)
for all profits and gains made by the infringer. If the owner
suffers
no loss and the other user is not using in trade seeking profit,
usually (but not always) there will be no enforcement proceeding
by
the owner. Nobody but the owner can or cares to enforce his
property
right. The owner may abandon copyright into the public domain or
by
his conduct grant extnded implied licences.

An important implied licence recognized by decided cases in
most
jurisdictions is "fair use". It is not infringement to copy
portions
of a work for review or comment in other works. It is not
infringement to copy for private educational or private
convenience.
It is generally not infringement if there is no injury to the
owner
of the copyright.

In the case of out-of-print written works (such as Tek
manuals),
the important consideration is that Tek chooses not to further
its
copyright by publishing. A purchaser of a Tek scope (which
contains
a
great deal of copyright such as panel layout, colour schemes,
component layout, circuits etc.) purchased a copyrighted manual
with
it. The licence to use those copyrights is transferred to each
subsequent owner. Such an owner does not infringe Tek's copyright
if
he or she copies for purposes incidental to the ownership, such
as
replacement or repair of lost or damaged material or for his or
her
private convenience.

Copies made for further publication to others, particularly
if
for the purposes of trade, do infringe the Tek copyright because
such
use was never contemplated by Tek or reasonabley implied from
their
original sale. Such copying trespasses on Tek's property rights.
It
is entirely Tek's choice as to whether they choose to enforce
those
rights.

By not publishing out-of-print manuals and by not licencing
someone to do it under their rights, Tek may be implicitly
abandoning
these old copyrights into the public domain and permitting anyone
to
reproduce them. In my opinion, it would be best for Tek to grant
a
general licence permitting free publication but only if the copy
is
accurate, complete, contains all corrections, reserves all
circuit
rights and other proprietary rights and containing a disclaimer
from
any responsibility by Tek. Such a public licence would be easy to
do
and would clearly enhance customer goodwill and the reputation of
Tek.

We can all hope that the raising of this issue in the
dialogue
of this forum may stimulate a thoughtful policy review by Tek. A
great company, that has produced the best equipment for so long,
so
much of which rises to the level of "art", should be able to find
a
solution that will preserve its proprietary rights will also
encouraging and supporting the enthusiasts of its past
achievements.

Regards

Richard B. Jones


Service manual cost from Tek

donlcramer@...
 

After reading John Miles' recent post informing of the "resources for you"
section of the Tek web site, I requested via that channel availability and
pricing for a TAS 465 service manual. I've been spectacularly unsuccessful
in locating a manual through the usual second hand sources. I received a
prompt, detailed response from a person in "Tektronix Parts Research" giving
the appropriate manual part number for my scope's serial number. He said it
was available for "$370 MSRP". Shipping is a further $24.95 (based on dollar
amount---orders over $1000 ship free!).

You read that right folks, nearly four hundred dollars to get a service
manual. And I live only a few miles from the Tek main campus (though, I
don't know if they would allow me to pick it up for a reduced shipping
charge).

By the way, the same message said there is no return on manuals (as one would
expect) and a $100 restocking fee on parts (better make sure that's the right
knob you want, buddy....).

Prior to receiving the quote, I was trying to get myself used to $120 as the
price to get a service manual through Tek (based on what I've found was the
incremental cost to add a service manual to a new scope order). Boy was I
off. I love Tek, and think there equipment is tops, but $395 is pretty
serious change for a commoner like me. Especially if it turns out I can't
fix the scope anyway. I am very glad they sell the manual, but as a
practical matter it's almost as if they didn't. Maybe there is some price
reduction leeway in the phrase "MSRP" which might give me a break, as I sent
the message with my company name included, though the actual purchase would
be a personal one by me only.

The only thing I can think of to do is forward the info to Surplus Sales on
the off chance they would buy the manual for use in their manual rental
business. I can only wonder if, at their normal $25 a week rental charge,
whether they could recoup the investment. Could there be 15 other guys out
there like me?

Thought this would be interesting info to go with all the copyright talk.
I'm not complaining, just surprised.

Don


Trying to get help

Doug Hale <DougHale@...>
 

I have tried to send this message before but it never got sent to the list.
One more try?

Can anyone help me find these parts?

What I need are:

155-0067-02 Regulator IC for 7904, 7854
336-1299-00 Grey knob for 7A26, and others
336-1308-00 Red calibration knob for 7A26, and others
384-1178-00 Calibration knob extention shaft (6.1 ") for A26
???-????-?? the metal leg that pulls down from the bottom of a 3 bay frame

any help anyone can give is appriciated.
Doug


Need some parts

Doug Hale <DougHale@...>
 

Can anyone help me find these parts?

What I need are:

155-0067-02 Regulator IC for 7904, 7854
336-1299-00 Grey knob for 7A26, and others
336-1308-00 Red calibration knob for 7A26, and others
384-1178-00 Calibration knob extention shaft (6.1 ") for A26

???-????-?? the leg that pulls down from the bottom of a 3 bay frame

any help anyone can give is appriciated.
Doug


Looking for some parts

Doug Hale <DougHale@...>
 

Can anyone help me find these parts?

What I need are:

155-0067-02 Regulator IC for 7904, 7854
336-1299-00 Grey knob for 7A26, and others
336-1308-00 Red calibration knob for 7A26, and others
384-1178-00 Calibration knob extention shaft (6.1 ") for A26

???-????-?? the leg that pulls down from the bottom of a 3 bay frame

any help anyone can give is appriciated.
Doug


Re: copyrights & CDROMs

Miroslav Pokorni <mpokorni@...>
 

To my mind examples of Electro Rent and Tucker show that Tektronix prefer
attitude 'do not ask, do not tell', the same as was allegedly hinted to
Dean. I visited couple of sites that were listed in Stan's mailing,
http://www.tek.com/Measurement/scopes/index.html
<http://www.tek.com/Measurement/scopes/index.html> Both of them are mostly
copies; if Tektronix wanted to go after someone these two guys would be
prime targets. As for legality of the matter, it seems quite clear that
Tektronix does not want to be bothered by enforcing their copyright, whether
it is manual business or their franchised distributor. I am not saying that
it is right to infringe Tektronix copyright, but I see clear evidence that
they are not going to put teeth into it.

The letters that Stan mentioned and I understand that he meant mass mailing,
would be very effective. If letters came from people who still work and on
company letterhead, Tektronix might get an idea how their scheming is
received by potential customers. I do not think that Stan and Dean should be
asked to sign a 'collective letter'; they still know lot of people at
Tektronix and no strain should be put on those relationships. Besides, in
Tektronix's mind our group, as collectors, is of no consequence, they are
looking at people who would buy new equipment.


Regards

Miroslav Pokorni

-----Original Message-----
From: david@slack.com [mailto:david@slack.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 10:03 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: copyrights & CDROMs

>PS . . . . . I have to confess that I have made a copy of a
page or two for
>some desparate Tek equipment owners in the past myself.
One guy now offers a
>CD ROM with 46 complete manuals on it, which I consider
orders of magnitude
>worse than anything like this that I have seen in the past.

The manuals on that CDROM are *not* OEM Tek or HP manuals.
They are US
Army manuals that are publically available on an Army web
site. I'm
looking at one now (TM 11-6625-2759-14, aka Tek 7L5 service
manual) and it
says "This manual contains copywrite [sic] material
reproduced by
permission of the Tektronix Company." If Tektronix objects
to reproduction
of this manual, it's really up to them to complain to the
Army. The guy
selling the CDROM is not at fault.

For what it's worth, my opinion on the copyright issue is
that the test
equipment companies are happy with the current ambiguous
situation and
don't have any reason to clarify it. They also don't have
an incentive
to sue people for copyright violation since the legal
expenses would far
exceed any possible damages they could collect. Therefore,
I predict the
current situation will continue.

In support of this, I have noticed that even the largest
test equipment
dealers often supply photocopied manuals with the used
equipment they sell.
Two examples are Electro Rent and Tucker (Tucker also sells
photocopied
service manuals). This doesn't really prove anything, but
since they are
franchised dealers for new equipment from HP and Tek, it
supports the idea
that those companies must not be bothered too much by the
practice.


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Re: copyright issues...

Miroslav Pokorni <mpokorni@...>
 

Stan,

It came as quite surprise to me that rot set in into Tektronix during 80s. I
always thought that mid 90s brought that in, but then I am slow to see
trends, or I was indulging in wishful thinking.

Regards

Miroslav Pokorni

-----Original Message-----
From: Stan or Patricia Griffiths
[mailto:w7ni@easystreet.com]
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 6:45 PM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: copyright issues...

Hi John,

I am pretty familiar with how Tektronix has behaved toward
supporting some of
their equipment in the last two decades or so. I spent a
total of 26.5 years of
my life on Tek's payroll and, finally, in late 1989, got so
disturbed by what I
saw happening inside of Tektronix that I resigned my job as
their Spectrum
Analyzer Sales Engineer in the Pacific Northwest. Believe
me, this was not an
easy move for me. I seriously thought I would NEVER leave
Tek. I was wrong.

I still have many very fond memories of life at Tektronix in
the 60's and 70's
and that is the part of Tek's history that I enjoy reliving
with my old
collection.

Still, they own that documented material and have refused to
let me have it. I
am just not willing to steal it from them.

How about a letter campaign to get Tek to let up on burying
that copyrighted
material?

Stan
w7ni@easystreet.com

John Miles wrote:

> No offense or disrespect to Stan, certainly, but I tend
towards Michael's
> point of view on this. If Tek wants to preserve the
"right" to "copy" their
> literature, they can darned well "copy" it themselves and
offer it for
> sale... at which point I'll be first in line with my
credit card.
>
> Tek's behavior of late has been nothing short of shameful.
They had no
> qualms about selling a $50,000 spectrum analyzer in 1994,
but they'll tell
> you to find a short pier and take a long walk if you call
them after 1999
> asking to buy manuals and parts for your instrument.
>
> My somewhat-anarchic take on the matter is, if Tek won't
step up to the
> plate and support their products for a reasonable length
of time, then they
> don't have much of a moral right to complain when their
customers do what's
> necessary to take support into their own hands.
>
> Is violation of copyright "right"? Of course not; I make
my living from
> intellectual property and I'm the last guy who wants to
see lawlessness in
> this area. But then, I wouldn't leave my customers in the
lurch after 5
> years, either. I can, and do, take support calls from
people who bought
> software -- software!! -- from me six or seven years ago.
Tek can either do
> the same with their high-end hardware, or they can get
used to the
> consequences.
>
> (Of course, this is all a moot point nowadays, as I
discovered when I bought
> the $100 service manual for my TDS3034 and received a few
pages telling me
> how to take the back cover off.)
>
> -- jm




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Re: Copying of Manuals

Miroslav Pokorni <mpokorni@...>
 

Phil,

The copy of the manual that you are describing looks like true copy. That
lady did a terrific job and quite quickly, even though you expected it to
take only 20 minutes. I own half a dozen of copied manuals and they are
'Xerox bond paper', that cheap staff used in copiers, schematics are double
letter size (fall of the cliff or next page if they are larger), spiral
bound alright but cover is just heavier blue paper.

Regards

Miroslav Pokorni

-----Original Message-----
From: Phil (VA3UX) [mailto:phil@vaxxine.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 7:42 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [TekScopes] Copying of Manuals

Well, I've read all the posts on this subject and I keep
flip-flopping
between it's OK to copy and it's not OK to copy. I see
valid points to
both sides. Stan is in the unique position of having worked
loyally for
Tek for along time which must create a bit of an internal
tug-o-war with an
issue like this.

In summary, I see this as a tempest in a teapot. I believe
that the demand
for vintage Tek manuals is puny in modern economic terms. I
do not believe
there is any money to be made with this process. I do not
see that there is
any guilt to be felt or borne from sharing "a copy" of a
single obsolete
manual between friends. As for the Tek's copyrights : they
own them and
they have their rights. If they refuse to allow legitimate
copying of old
manuals, it isn't for economic reasons. It's because they're
afflicted with
the same paranoia that most high tech companies are
afflicted with today in
North America. Rational thinking has nothing to do with it.

Second, the task of producing a good quality copy is
formidable and the
ratio of time/labor requirement to economic reward is poor.
I base this on
the one and only experience I had producing a copy of the
Tek 180A manual a
few years back for someone that could not locate one at the
time. I asked
one of the girls in our office to do it and she obliged.
The 180A manual
is just a little thing compared to most Tek manuals. What
she produced was
a commercial quality copy - I was thrilled with it : no
schematics taped
together - proper sized sheets for the drawings, good
quality paper
throughout, covers with comb binding, labeled tabbed
dividers. She said it
took about 2 1/2 hours to produce that. I was shocked. I
thought she would
have that whipped-up in about 20 minutes. Taking everything
into account I
figure that manual was worth $40 or $50. And then you'd have
to add your
profit margin on top if you were going to sell it. Nobody
would pay that
kind of money for that manual when the instrument itself
sells for
considerably less. Now consider the time and cost of
producing a copy of a
547 manual. If Tek did it, they'd probably want $150 US for
it. Any
takers ? I doubt it. SO, anyone making copies of these
manuals for sale
AND offering them at a price that anyone is likely willing
to pay, is
probably doing so out of labor-of-love, or at tiny profit
margins that
virtually nobody people wouldn't be interested in. I've
copied schematics
here and there so I can mark them up while doing a repair.
The process of
just doing a few sheets is cumbersome enough. I can't
imagine anyone
wanting to copy entire manuals and doing a decent job - it
ain't
fun. Stan, are you REALLY sure you'd like to be franchised
for production
of manual copies ?

Phil


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Re: Filter Material for 453A-2 intake

Miroslav Pokorni <mpokorni@...>
 

I do not have an answer, but in case that filter for your scope is aluminum
mash (shavings) I might have address of the place that makes this type of
filters; they are widely used for kitchen exhaust fans. Let us see what
group would point as material. Your manual should list filter in 'Mechanical
Replaceable Parts'; what does it say in filter description?

I just thought, if your filter is plastic foam, some fancy filters for home
heating furnaces are made from that type of plastic.

Regards

Miroslav Pokorni

-----Original Message-----
From: kg0k@yahoo.com [mailto:kg0k@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 8:52 AM
To: TekScopes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [TekScopes] Filter Material for 453A-2
intake

My new (new to me)scope did not have filter material in the
intake
bracket. Being clueless on most facets of scopes, including
the
repoduction debate currently raging, what is the best
material and
density to use? I'm in St. Louis and need a couple of
sources, please.
Thank you,
Stephen


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Cannot Send to list - Test

DougHale@...
 

I have not been able to post to the list - this is a test from alternate
email address

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