Date   
Re: Re 310A still ailing

Stan & Patricia Griffiths
 

Joe,

 

Did you ever get your 310A working correctly?  I have fixed a LOT of those and am willing to consult with you if you still need help . . . but, as you can see I am WAY behind in reading email so that is why I don’t know the status of your scope . . .

 

Stan

w7ni@...

 


From: TekScopes@... [mailto:TekScopes@...] On Behalf Of Joseph Orgnero
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2010 10:32 AM
To: TekScopes@...
Subject: [TekScopes] Re 310A still ailing

 

 

Hello all,

After receiving advice, much appreciated, from various members, I attempted to resolve the 2 problems presented by the scope

# 1 low HV voltage, - 500 V instead of -1675 V. Replaced V701 (12AU7) and V704 (6AQ5), replaced both electrolitics (C701 and C705) with Orange Drops, checked continouity of rectifiers (V720 and V730) and transformer (T 700), checked all low voltages (OK)

Result: no change, still low voltage, intensity has no effect, focus limited.

# 2 no sweep, only a spot or two if I applied the calibrator signal. After testing and swaping some and measuring the voltages shown on the schematics, the sweep worked on and off but now is off completly. If I apply a signal  (9 VAC)at the external horizontal input I get a horizontal line

So, my question is, where do I go from here.

Many thanks for any help.

Joe Orgnero VE7LBI 

Re: 2465B Display Issues.........UPDATE!!!!

David <david@...>
 

Hello Tom,

I Ammon Cleveland 

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 11, 2010, at 10:23 PM, "Tom Miller" <tmiller@...> wrote:

 

Where are you located?
 
Tom
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 4:58 PM
Subject: [TekScopes] 2465B Display Issues.........UPDATE!!!!

 

After spending the morning and most of the afternoon tracing my square-wave in from channel one I have a couple of questions.

1) I have signal going into U800(Horizontal) from Channel 1 Pre-Amp(U100) Trigger pick-off and I have signal going into U500 from the same. Nothing is coming out of U500(A/B Trigger) at pin 18 or 42 though. So the question is this......is this a definitive answer as to the state of the A/B Trigger Hybrid or is there more I should be looking into before going off and looking for another U500?

2) Does anyone have a A/B Trigger Hybrid (155-0239-01 or 02, large footprint) they can spare, loan, or sell if I need one? I would prefer to try one and see if that is in-fact the real issue before I go off and spend the money on one or a whole parts scope. Could someone be so kind as to let me have one on loan to verify or possibly buy it if it does fix the issue?

Cheers,

David


No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3309 - Release Date: 12/11/10

Re: 2465B Display Issues.........UPDATE!!!!

Tom Miller <tmiller@...>
 

Where are you located?
 
Tom
 
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 4:58 PM
Subject: [TekScopes] 2465B Display Issues.........UPDATE!!!!

 

After spending the morning and most of the afternoon tracing my square-wave in from channel one I have a couple of questions.

1) I have signal going into U800(Horizontal) from Channel 1 Pre-Amp(U100) Trigger pick-off and I have signal going into U500 from the same. Nothing is coming out of U500(A/B Trigger) at pin 18 or 42 though. So the question is this......is this a definitive answer as to the state of the A/B Trigger Hybrid or is there more I should be looking into before going off and looking for another U500?

2) Does anyone have a A/B Trigger Hybrid (155-0239-01 or 02, large footprint) they can spare, loan, or sell if I need one? I would prefer to try one and see if that is in-fact the real issue before I go off and spend the money on one or a whole parts scope. Could someone be so kind as to let me have one on loan to verify or possibly buy it if it does fix the issue?

Cheers,

David


No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3309 - Release Date: 12/11/10

Re: Taps and setscrews

Robert Simpson
 


--- On Sat, 12/11/10, Artekmedia wrote:

From: Artekmedia
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Taps and setscrews
To: TekScopes@...
Date: Saturday, December 11, 2010, 2:52 PM

 
Hank

Interesting .....It is not listed as a "key Brand" on Danaher's WEB site ?

Where did you glean this tidbit  of knowledge?

Dave



On 12/11/2010 4:03 PM, HankC wrote:
 
Craftsman is owned by Danaher, which is the same co that bought up Tektronix 3 yrs ago.


--
Dave & Lynn Henderson
Manuals@...
www.Artekmedia.com
PO Box 175
Welch,MN 55089

Re: SQHill Manoman repository

jekker52 <jekker@...>
 

It's working perfectly here at this moment..

--- In TekScopes@..., "wendell" <wendellgreene@...> wrote:

Does anyone have any information about why the SQHill Manoman Repository is not working.
Thanks
Wendell

SQHill Manoman repository

wendell19430
 

Does anyone have any information about why the SQHill Manoman Repository is not working.
Thanks
Wendell

Re: Taps and setscrews

Artekmedia <manuals@...>
 

Hank

Interesting .....It is not listed as a "key Brand" on Danaher's WEB site ?

Where did you glean this tidbit  of knowledge?

Dave



On 12/11/2010 4:03 PM, HankC wrote:
 

Craftsman is owned by Danaher, which is the same co that bought up Tektronix 3 yrs ago.


-- 
Dave & Lynn Henderson
Manuals@...
www.Artekmedia.com
PO Box 175
Welch,MN 55089

Anyone have a 605 storage monitor manual?

Peter Gottlieb <hpnpilot@...>
 

Got one of these recently and was wondering if anyone had a pdf or printed manual.

It is a little more complicated than just an X-Y-Z monitor as it has an internal sweep capability. I would like to understand this.

It arrived with a bad 2000 uF 50 volt electrolytic, but when I replaced it, the +5 was shorted to ground. It turns out there is a trace on the power supply board which is VERY close to a mounting bracket and can short out pretty easily even when the board is properly mounted. It is rare to find an engineering defect in a Tek product but I would consider this to be one. I did a "cheap and dirty" repair by filing the edge of the mounting bracket (near the pass transistor towards the front of the unit) so no matter how you mount it in terms of play the trace will not short out.

The unit now works great, better than any storage CRT based device I've ever had, but I would like to understand the rudimentary triggered horizontal capability of this unit.

Peter

Taps and setscrews

 

Craftsman is owned by Danaher, which is the same co that bought up Tektronix 3 yrs ago.

2465B Display Issues.........UPDATE!!!!

David Garrido <david@...>
 

After spending the morning and most of the afternoon tracing my square-wave in from channel one I have a couple of questions.

1) I have signal going into U800(Horizontal) from Channel 1 Pre-Amp(U100) Trigger pick-off and I have signal going into U500 from the same. Nothing is coming out of U500(A/B Trigger) at pin 18 or 42 though. So the question is this......is this a definitive answer as to the state of the A/B Trigger Hybrid or is there more I should be looking into before going off and looking for another U500?

2) Does anyone have a A/B Trigger Hybrid (155-0239-01 or 02, large footprint) they can spare, loan, or sell if I need one? I would prefer to try one and see if that is in-fact the real issue before I go off and spend the money on one or a whole parts scope. Could someone be so kind as to let me have one on loan to verify or possibly buy it if it does fix the issue?

Cheers,

David

scanned: 286/287/R288 manual

sipespresso <sipespresso@...>
 

Re: Help to calibrating TEK2232 without disassemble all!!

sbirdasn <sbirdasn@...>
 

--- In TekScopes@..., "right_electronics" <right_electronics@...> wrote:
I'm not finish yet the calibration,is a hard and tedious and danger thing ,the time for find the right adj,why just side (R467)for instance? the Tek guy not wrote, (located in A10 board b/8 coordinate),this simple addition simplify a lot the task ,an avoid mistake.
By sure who wrote the manual is not who design the scope.
I understand your frustration with information scattered around the manual, but consider the audience it was written for- calibration technicians (whom we presume are trained/qualified to perform oscilloscope calibrations).

The calibration procedure needs to be brief, to keep from turning pages and pages just to get to the next step. Remember, these procedures will (normally) be performed by experienced tech's that do this for a living, and only need a reminder so that everything is done in order and quickly, as time is money. Besides, when you do this all the time, it becomes second nature, and many scopes have a similar set of adjustments and the locations tend to be the same across the same scope series.

Also, over the years, professional calibration services have gone to automation and programmed calibration/test sequences, so the written procedure only needs to convey enough information for the calibration bench programming staff to know what needs to be included when developing an automation assisted calibration program.

I have some doubt about trigger adj procedure page 5.22 item 2, R741,the explanation on how to adjust sound me confusing, this R741 pot adj go to hysteresis pin of trigger specials IC pin 9 U460...then is a hysteresis window adj?,whats the goal?...minimize the hysteresis?
I think you mean R471...

You're over thinking this one. It's a trigger sensitivity adjustment. You don't want the trigger system to be too sensitive, or it will trigger on any high frequency noise and increase trigger jitter. Yet, you need to meet the 100 MHz signal minimum amplitude triggering specification.

When you look at the required test gear, the leveled sine wave source is very clean, so that the trigger system doesn't see any noise to mess up the adjustment.

As you turn down the trigger sensitivity (R471), then the trigger level control (on the front panel) will reach a point where there is only one tiny spot where the signal will trigger cleanly. Turning down the sensitivity any further results in not being able to trigger on the signal at all (not sensitive enough) regardless of the trigger level position control.

That is the correct adjustment. You then verify that the scope will trigger on a full bandwidth signal at the specified amplitude to verify that the sensitivity is good enough.

The scope is spec'ed to trigger on a 100 MHz sine wave of (at least) 1.5 divisions cleanly. That is what you're adjusting for.

If some body has a better "plain vanilla" procedure or explanation I will be gratefully
Regards Gabriel.
Hope this helps.

Sbirdasn.

Re: Recommend for a young student

sbirdasn <sbirdasn@...>
 

My recommendations:

*Any* Tek 100 MHz or better analog scope is a fine way to go, and will be good enough for most hobbyist R&D, including dabbling in microprocessor based projects. I consider dual sweep to be a must-have feature for any scope.

Old school, I'd say 465B.

Any 223x scope is good, but I recommend 2235/6 in the A versions since they have trigger filtering added over the earlier non-A models (or get the Military version - 2235 AN/USM-488).

If you can swing it, the 2232 is a great 100 MHz Analog/DSO. Fully analog with usable DSO functionality to rated bandwidth (100 MHz sampling & 10 nS glitch capture). The on-screen annotations are a nice confidence builder. Even without the communications card, the DSO makes digicam pictures for school lab book notes a snap.

But my all-time favorite is the 2236A. I love that scope! The integrated CTM/DMM is really great. Counter functions to full rated bandwidth. If you can trigger it, you can measure it. And the CH1 voltage functions along with side panel DMM is a real bench space saver, and very handy.

All controls are on the front panel- nothing hidden, no menus, all in plain view. Push a button or two and you go from say frequency, to volts, to Ohms, then back to timing functions with ease. The 5000-count DMM has 0.01 Ohm resolution, so tracking down shorts is on par with a good (Fluke) 4-1/2 digit DMM costing $100's itself. All in the space of a single bench instrument.

Not to preclude having a hand-held/bench DMM as a basic electronics bench requirement. But now you can use the DMM for current, while monitoring voltage with the scope and seeing the ripple too.

I think the 2236/A is probably the most capable 100 MHz scope Tektronix made until the 224x series finally arrived. For its bandwidth/price, I think it can hold its own against the lab grade scopes like the 2445/65's feature for feature even when loaded with options.

All of the above being said, I've spent more on my probes than I did for my scopes. ;) But then, I'm picky. I insist on waveform fidelity along with good scope probe goodies that lower the frustration/hassle factor. Take good care of them, they'll last a very long time.

Comments invited.

Sbirdasn.

Re: Recommend for a young student

ken chalfant
 

I see value in a scope that is repairable.  When I was starting out virtually everything was repairable (yes with tubes) unless it was military gear and the power transformer was fried.  But I sure learned a lot buying broken equipment which I had to repair before I could use.  I know - its a different world - but there is still value in basic trouble-shooting skills.

I might make one other suggestion.

When you look through eBay you'll notice that most older logic analyzers don't sell at all or if they do not for very much.  If this student is interested in digital logic and is going to start hooking glue and counters and such together if you could find an old HP 1610 or 1630 that had pods and grippers for a few bucks that would (IMHO) be a fantastic learning tool.

I just hope there's a bright future in America for him and all the young people who are technically inclined!

Ken

On 11Dec, 2010, at 11:12 AM, tubesnthings@... wrote:

 

In a message dated 12/10/2010 9:30:58 PM Pacific Standard Time, todd@... writes:
Thinking about picking up a used scope for a highly motivated and brilliant youngster.
 
Where budget is a consideration the 2245A is a great choice. 100mHz, 2+2 ch, GREAT user interface, readouts for basics only.
 
I found the readouts to be a great learning aid, kinda like a practice test allowing a student to compare his own observations with an accurate reference - RIGHT NOW - which is HUGE for the current crop of humanoids. Attention spans have become much shorter since the days of Eico kit scopes.
 
Probes!
 
Have fun - wish my daughter were interested...
Bernd Schroder
 
 


Re: Using Curve tracer

 

Fred,
 
I have tested inductors on my 577. You can see the V vs. I hysterisis curve and the core saturation current.
 
Setup is quite easy. The inductor is placed between the collector and emitter inputs. Set a suitable series limiting resistor to start (a few hundred ohms) which you can experiment with and lower as you go. Set the (horizontal) collector sweep voltage low to start with and you can increase it as needed. The (vertical) current setting will be determined by how much inductance there is so experiment with it.
 
One note of caution: A SMPS works at comparitively high frequencies for power devices. The 577 tests at a low 60 or 120 Hz. So the results you get on the 577 will only guide you in the right direction. They will not be an indication of actual performance in the SMPS.
 
Have fun discovering the hidden versatility of a curve tracer.
 
Dennis


From: TekScopes@... [mailto:TekScopes@...] On Behalf Of Pa4tim
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 11:01 PM
To: TekScopes@...
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Re: Using Curve tracer

I am building some smps and have problems with the right inductor. I wanted to make an inductor tester but then I thought it must be possible to use my 577 fot that. i'm I right or is an inductive load not a good idea for the CT. If it is possible how do I connect and set the CT

Fred PA4TIM

Op 4 dec. 2010 om 20:49 heeft DaveC <davec2468@...> het volgende geschreven:

 

Ed,
This "other use" of a curve tracer (other than the intended
semiconductor V-I curve mapping) is a real head-slapper to me. The
CT, in my eyes, just became a much more versatile piece of gear.

When you have the time I would very much appreciate a description of
how to use the CT to test each type of component in the categories
you mention.

Thanks for the benefit of your knowledge.

Dave

(And a big THANKS to Dave P. for re-titling the post. I would not
have otherwise read it. We should all take note and do more of this
when a thread morphs.)

-=-=-=-

>The nominal peak is 1500 V depending on line voltage and loading.
>Mine reaches around 1750-1800 V DC in anti-loop mode, unloaded. You
>can measure load/leakage to 1 uA/div directly, and there is
>apparently capability to reach the nA/div range measuring off the
>emitter side, but I have never used that so not sure. If measuring
>leakage of caps, for example, the ripple and noise (it's just
>rectified and slightly filtered transformer windings) would probably
>swamp out the higher sensitivity current measurements anyway.
>
>Ed

Re: Using Curve tracer

PA4TIM
 

I would be interested in that info

Fred PA4TIM

Op 11 dec. 2010 om 20:25 heeft "Ed Breya" <edbreya@...> het volgende geschreven:

 

I know what you mean about trying to use and test unknown/unspec'd power inductors. I was planning to build a special fixture with a MOSFET-based variable current source to look at saturation while measuring with the HP4276A. I can send some info on the project, but don't have a finished design yet - just a partial prototype. There is an HP/Yokogawa fixture for this - I can't remember the model number off-hand - but it is quite complicated, and way more than I would want to acquire or duplicate.

Ed

--- In TekScopes@..., PA4TIM wrote:
>
> Hi Ed,
>
> Thanks for the info. I have build several simple smps's (buck and boost
> converters) but the problem most times is the inductor. I can measure
> inductance, Q, R+jx, selfresonance you name it. But the problem is I
> have a box full of unknown inductors and some work and others do not
> because they saturate. And that is what I want to measure.
>
> I made a small saturation tester for it but then I thought it would be
> nice to have the current on the Y axis and Volt on the X axis but while
> designing that I read about the curvetracer discussion and had an Eureka
> moment. That must be able to do that too I think. I normaly just try it
> instead of asking but I do not know if the measure-circuit of my tracer
> likes inductive loads. And I'm very carefull with my nice Tek.
>
>

Re: Recommend for a young student

Paul Amaranth
 

I'd agree with Bernice with the caveat that i prefer my 465/DM40 over
a 7904 w onscreen readouts when using the delayed sweep function. It's
just easier (for me) to read the LED display on the DM40.

You can also find them dirt cheap. I paid $50 for mine with a couple of
dead filter caps. That scope was my best deal ever.

With the mainframe, you can always find a curve tracer plugin, that's great
for learning about semiconductors. Being able to swap out the plugins is
handy too. But, after you collect a bunch of plugins, you probably could
have bought a digital scope with the money you spent. I have around $400
into my (free) 7904, between repair items and plugins.

I also have a 453 that I still use on my bench. I like the feel of the
controls too much to part with it.

On the other side of the spectrum, last week I saw a TDS460A from ChipXS (Tek ebay
surplus) go for $510.

Choices, choices ...

On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 09:32:08AM -0800, Bernice Loui wrote:

Of the 400 series Tek portables, my all time favorite is the 475, not that 475A. Next would be the 465 these were the industry work-horse portable that were used everywhere and well proven.

Or a 7603, 7704A if real estate allows.

IMO, it is better to get a less automated scope as a learning tool as it tends to help understand waveform measurement basics. There is much that can be seen real time and these observations skills seems to be lost with many of the newer digital/measurement automated scopes.

Get good probes, cheap ones are awful.

100 Mhz is plenty for most work, but it really depends on what you are working on.

Newer is not always better. Those older Tek scopes were well built, designed to be repaired and functions very well indeed.


Bernice

--
Paul Amaranth, GCIH | Rochester MI, USA
Aurora Group, Inc. | Security, Systems & Software
paul@... | Unix & Windows

Re: Using Curve tracer

Ed Breya
 

I know what you mean about trying to use and test unknown/unspec'd power inductors. I was planning to build a special fixture with a MOSFET-based variable current source to look at saturation while measuring with the HP4276A. I can send some info on the project, but don't have a finished design yet - just a partial prototype. There is an HP/Yokogawa fixture for this - I can't remember the model number off-hand - but it is quite complicated, and way more than I would want to acquire or duplicate.

Ed

--- In TekScopes@..., PA4TIM <fredschneider@...> wrote:

Hi Ed,

Thanks for the info. I have build several simple smps's (buck and boost
converters) but the problem most times is the inductor. I can measure
inductance, Q, R+jx, selfresonance you name it. But the problem is I
have a box full of unknown inductors and some work and others do not
because they saturate. And that is what I want to measure.

I made a small saturation tester for it but then I thought it would be
nice to have the current on the Y axis and Volt on the X axis but while
designing that I read about the curvetracer discussion and had an Eureka
moment. That must be able to do that too I think. I normaly just try it
instead of asking but I do not know if the measure-circuit of my tracer
likes inductive loads. And I'm very carefull with my nice Tek.

Re: Recommend for a young student

widgethunter
 

In a message dated 12/10/2010 9:30:58 PM Pacific Standard Time, todd@... writes:
Thinking about picking up a used scope for a highly motivated and brilliant youngster.
 
Where budget is a consideration the 2245A is a great choice. 100mHz, 2+2 ch, GREAT user interface, readouts for basics only.
 
I found the readouts to be a great learning aid, kinda like a practice test allowing a student to compare his own observations with an accurate reference - RIGHT NOW - which is HUGE for the current crop of humanoids. Attention spans have become much shorter since the days of Eico kit scopes.
 
Probes!
 
Have fun - wish my daughter were interested...
Bernd Schroder
 
 

Re: Recommend for a young student

Tom Miller <tmiller@...>
 

I might suggest getting a good DVM such as a Fluke 87 or so. Whenever I work on
something, that is the first piece of test equipment that comes out. Then, you cant
go wrong with a 475 and two good probes.
 
Bernice, what is your objection to the 475A? I don't have one and just wonder.
 
The old 453 can be had for less than $50 and are easily maintained. Be sure to get
the one without the tube front end. I bet most modern digital systems come down to
finding bad power supply sections. You just need to see stuff in the < 50 MHz range.
 
The very high speed digital scopes are needed in the design of GHz+ systems and I
doubt a teenager will be involved with that. Let the university buy that stuff. :)
 
 
Anyway, good luck. Encourage that interest as much as you can.
 
Tom
 
 
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 12:32 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] Recommend for a young student

 


Of the 400 series Tek portables, my all time favorite is the 475, not that 475A. Next would be the 465 these were the industry work-horse portable that were used everywhere and well proven.

Or a 7603, 7704A if real estate allows.

IMO, it is better to get a less automated scope as a learning tool as it tends to help understand waveform measurement basics. There is much that can be seen real time and these observations skills seems to be lost with many of the newer digital/measurement automated scopes.

Get good probes, cheap ones are awful.

100 Mhz is plenty for most work, but it really depends on what you are working on.

Newer is not always better. Those older Tek scopes were well built, designed to be repaired and functions very well indeed.

Bernice


--- On Sat, 12/11/10, toady3040 <todd@...> wrote:

From: toady3040 <todd@...>
Subject: [TekScopes] Recommend for a young student
To: TekScopes@...
Date: Saturday, December 11, 2010, 5:30 AM

Thinking about picking up a used scope for a highly motivated and brilliant youngster. I see good deals on 465, 453 series but would appreciate your Tek savy's input for a kid who will be probably be working more with digital - which is beyond my scope (pun intended) Should I shop for a storage scope? is 60mhz enough BW?

Thanks for your advice here


No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3309 - Release Date: 12/11/10