Date   
Re: Tektronix 2467B Auto Measure Faulty?

Leandro Lindemann
 

I believe that my scope really has some problem:

After performing the Auto DC Balance Routine procedure, a problem occurred:

I adjusted the trace to the center of the screen, with the volts / div switch set to 1V and the coupling in GND. When selecting the voltage of 500mV or 200mV, the trace left the center of the screen, moved 2 divisions! This has never happened before. To "resolve" this, I made a backup of Nvram Dalas 1225, which I had done when I bought the scopre and did a preventive maintenance, which includes the replacement of all the electrolytic capacitors of the source and also, of the capacitors that usually leak on the board A5. With the Backup performed, the trace is again in the center of the screen, regardless of the voltage selected in the Volts / Div switch.

I am very grateful if someone can guide me, because alone I do not have the knowledge to check what is happening.

Thanks.

Extender on eBay looks like 7000 series? 3 available

John Williams
 

Real Colors on 7000 Series Modules and Mainframes.

Egge Siert
 

Hi to All,

We all know the influence of sunlight on the red lettering and knobs of Modules. A spectrum of dark red to orange or even yellowish brown is sometimes the endresult. But I think the other colors are also vulnerable for much sunlight. During the years I saw several 7000 Modules with deep green and gray colors on their Timebases. Recently a "New" 7104 was sold on eBay and its 7B15 Timebase is a good example of this. I have several NOS 7000 Series Modules, but none of them has this deep colors. Does anybody know more of this?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tektronix-7104-Oscilloscope-Microchannel-Plate-CRT-034-New-034-With-Manual-/153818472955?nma=true&si=ZvGiEAfQU3k53Iauo1AI3OO36oY%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


Greetings,

Egge Siert

Looking for Instructions on Quickstart III Demo Board (671-2679-00).

Egge Siert
 

Hi to All,

Some time ago I picked this Demo Board up without any instructions attached. On internet there are no "real" hits. Also Hakan Hintze didn't have any information on it. Maybe someone on this forum knows the ins and outs?

Greetings,

Egge Siert

Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

Bob Wilson
 

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Glenn Little
 

Data for 3160-0497is located on web page:

https://www.wbparts.com/rfq/4140-01-081-6260.html

Glenn

On 2/23/2020 11:45 PM, Greg Muir via Groups.Io wrote:
Barry,

It appears that there is sort of a judgment call on the fan motor used in the 8640B signal generator.

Looking in the 8640A manual that I have (08640-90114) the motor is definitely called out and illustrated in the schematic as of the brushless design.

However, there are differences seen in the 8640B documentation. I referred to a 2-volume manual set for the 8640B number 08640-90215 dated May 91 and also noted as a “Mark-up Copy” that applies to serials 2520A through 2923A plus any included updates for later serials.

Referring to volume 1, there is a call-out in the parts list on page 6-117 of 2 DC style motors:

For serial numbers 2939A and below:
3160-0453 “FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC .25KV-DIEL” Mfr code 28480. Mfr part number 3160-0453
(Mfr code 28480 is HP)

For serial numbers 2939A and above:
3160-0497 “”FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC” Mfr code 11039, Mfr part number 612
(Any reference for Mfr code 11039 cannot be found)

However, on page 8B-123 titled “Service Sheet 19” there is a description of the -5.2V supply & fan driver assembly A18 where it describes the brushless motor & associated driver.

However in volume 2 if you go to Service Sheet 19 you will find a DC motor being driven by a simple DC controller.

As for the part number for a brushless motor, I could not find it in either volume.

It’s not that I don’t believe that a brushless motor design was used in the 8640B since there is a hint of the description of one but it also appears that HP once used a DC motor design as well. It looks like a judgment call on this one.

Greg

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Glenn Little ARRL Technical Specialist QCWA LM 28417
Amateur Callsign: WB4UIV wb4uiv@... AMSAT LM 2178
QTH: Goose Creek, SC USA (EM92xx) USSVI LM NRA LM SBE ARRL TAPR
"It is not the class of license that the Amateur holds but the class
of the Amateur that holds the license"

Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

David DiGiacomo
 

On Sun, Feb 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Bob Wilson <rwilson@...> wrote:

I could not find the pack listed at the link you sent. But I think the 5 in line AA's is a common item. I saw some at Amazon for less than $5 each.
And my local Batteries and Bulbs store probably has them too.
The original ones were probably 600MA and now they are all higher capacity.
Bob
Be careful, those are probably NiMH packs. The simple charger in the
211 will quickly ruin NiMH cells.

The Bulbtronics pack is NiCd. Here's an updated link:

https://www.bulbtronics.com/Search-The-Warehouse/ProductDetail.aspx?sid=0029911&pid=BAMED4149++++++&Source=SearchResults#

If that doesn't work, search for 5149. They call it "Medical Battery 5149".

Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

flanneltuba@...
 

I'll spend some time studying the Parametric Measurement circuit and theory, if for no other reason than to marvel at how the Tek engineers designed such a thing, and, well, "just because." A big part of the point of this scope repair project is in the Learning of how it all works. This 2465B is a classroom in a metal box. Not necessarily one without tuition, but a good course, just the same.

I'll also check all the socketed parts and the various signal paths for noise or suspicious looking talk—of the "aperiodic" sort! ;)

- Scott

Tektronix 2467B Auto Measure Faulty?

Leandro Lindemann
 

Hello everyone.

I have a 2467B that I bought a few years ago, and I never used the automatic measurement functions.

Today I decided to test this and I think the scope is defective in this sector.

When using my signal generator with a 1VPP sine wave in Ch1 with the generator providing a frequency of 100Khz with the CH1 selected for AC coupling (using the original P6137 probes) and pressing the Step / Auto key the displayed waveform in CRT it occupies 4 divisions (ok) but the sinusoid visualized is not stable on the screen (the time base has not been adjusted, I need to adjust it manually).

When using the Measure option and choosing the Volts option, the voltage voltage is almost correct (1.953V), but the waveform displayed on the screen is very large, at the bottom of the screen it informed 100mV, and using the Volts / div knob of channel 1, I need to adjust it to 500mV so that the sinusoid is displayed on the screen, located at the top of the CRT. In this situation the sinusoid also has the wrong time base, I need to manually adjust the SEC / DIV switch to view the sinusoid.

When I press the Measure key and select the FREQ option, I always receive the message. SMALL OR LOW REP RATE SIGNAL.

The measurements using the time and frequency cursor manually are correct.

I did the self test and no error was indicated.

Is there something I am doing wrong or am I really defective in scope?

Sorry for the bad English, I'm using Google Translate.

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

n4buq
 

Hi Greg,

I assume HP had two different designs for the fan during the run of the instrument. I've had three of them and I'm pretty sure all three have had the Siemens motor.

One of the fan assemblies for the 8640B sold recently on eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/333071972966

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Muir via Groups.Io" <big_sky_explorer=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 10:45:10 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Barry,

It appears that there is sort of a judgment call on the fan motor used in the
8640B signal generator.

Looking in the 8640A manual that I have (08640-90114) the motor is definitely
called out and illustrated in the schematic as of the brushless design.

However, there are differences seen in the 8640B documentation. I referred
to a 2-volume manual set for the 8640B number 08640-90215 dated May 91 and
also noted as a “Mark-up Copy” that applies to serials 2520A through 2923A
plus any included updates for later serials.

Referring to volume 1, there is a call-out in the parts list on page 6-117 of
2 DC style motors:

For serial numbers 2939A and below:
3160-0453 “FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC .25KV-DIEL” Mfr code 28480. Mfr part
number 3160-0453
(Mfr code 28480 is HP)

For serial numbers 2939A and above:
3160-0497 “”FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC” Mfr code 11039, Mfr part number 612
(Any reference for Mfr code 11039 cannot be found)

However, on page 8B-123 titled “Service Sheet 19” there is a description of
the -5.2V supply & fan driver assembly A18 where it describes the brushless
motor & associated driver.

However in volume 2 if you go to Service Sheet 19 you will find a DC motor
being driven by a simple DC controller.

As for the part number for a brushless motor, I could not find it in either
volume.

It’s not that I don’t believe that a brushless motor design was used in the
8640B since there is a hint of the description of one but it also appears
that HP once used a DC motor design as well. It looks like a judgment call
on this one.

Greg



Re: 547 - $25 San Francisco Bay area (Sebastapol)

John Griessen
 

547 - $25 San Francisco Bay area (Sebastapol)

Jamie Ostrowski
 

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Greg Muir
 

Barry,

It appears that there is sort of a judgment call on the fan motor used in the 8640B signal generator.

Looking in the 8640A manual that I have (08640-90114) the motor is definitely called out and illustrated in the schematic as of the brushless design.

However, there are differences seen in the 8640B documentation. I referred to a 2-volume manual set for the 8640B number 08640-90215 dated May 91 and also noted as a “Mark-up Copy” that applies to serials 2520A through 2923A plus any included updates for later serials.

Referring to volume 1, there is a call-out in the parts list on page 6-117 of 2 DC style motors:

For serial numbers 2939A and below:
3160-0453 “FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC .25KV-DIEL” Mfr code 28480. Mfr part number 3160-0453
(Mfr code 28480 is HP)

For serial numbers 2939A and above:
3160-0497 “”FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC” Mfr code 11039, Mfr part number 612
(Any reference for Mfr code 11039 cannot be found)

However, on page 8B-123 titled “Service Sheet 19” there is a description of the -5.2V supply & fan driver assembly A18 where it describes the brushless motor & associated driver.

However in volume 2 if you go to Service Sheet 19 you will find a DC motor being driven by a simple DC controller.

As for the part number for a brushless motor, I could not find it in either volume.

It’s not that I don’t believe that a brushless motor design was used in the 8640B since there is a hint of the description of one but it also appears that HP once used a DC motor design as well. It looks like a judgment call on this one.

Greg

Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

 

Yes, unfortunately I could not find it either.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis
Tillman W7PF
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:59 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

It was pretty stupid of me to forget the link.
This is the email I wrote years ago:

Note: the link is broken across 3 lines.
It is very hard to find this battery pack on this site so use the link.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

On Tue, Sep 5, 2017 at 11:50 PM, 'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7PF
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:

Hi Harvey,

Fortunately there is a great company that makes exact replacement battery
packs for the 214 and they are very inexpensive.
Here is a link:
http://www.bulbtronics.com/Search-The-Warehouse/
SearchResults.aspx?stype=Aut
oLampEq&mfg=TEKTRONIX&mod=OSCILLOSCOPE%20212

It's tough getting there. It's under Medical and Scientific batteries.
The company that makes them is called BulbTronics. They are the ones that
supplied me with the batteries for my 214 scope.

The battery packs they made up were a perfect fit, very professionally made,
and dirt cheap. The scope ran for over 5½ hours on them which was almost
twice the Tek specification.

Best thing to do is go to their web site and fill out an email request.
This
is the way you have to request that they make up a pack for you. It's more
than a little strange but it is worth it. You will appreciate that when the
batteries arrive.

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
greenboxmaven via Groups.Io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:04 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries.
ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models that
use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is installed,
and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the circuitry. Thanks,
Bruce KA2IVY


On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link will
connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
Bob Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it
works I need to replace the batteries.













--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator





--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator

Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

Bob Wilson
 

I could not find the pack listed at the link you sent. But I think the 5 in line AA's is a common item. I saw some at Amazon for less than $5 each.
And my local Batteries and Bulbs store probably has them too.
The original ones were probably 600MA and now they are all higher capacity.
Bob

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

victor.silva
 

GerryR,

There are very few 2465As that use this motor, unless you have OPT 01, the DMM option.
You can tell externally if yours has this motor or not by the small vent on the rear cover.
Looking at the back cover of the scope, the inner vent next to the power cord - if is the same height as the left edge vent then you have a muffin fan and you don't need this motor.
If the vent near the power cord is about 2 inches high your scope use this fan.
Note, if your scope is working, keeping cool and not making a squealing noise you will not need this fan either.

--Victor

Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

Chuck Harris
 

The trigger hybrid triggers the A and B time base hybrids,
and they feed their gate signals (/SG) into the the PAL U975,
which chews on them, and feeds FF U980B, which talks back to
the PAL, which passes it on using /SGB goes back to the
trigger hybrid, and display sequencer.

So, it could be the trigger hybrid, the sweep hybrids, the
PAL (clean its socket), and U980B's flip-flop.

There is a Parametric Measurements flow chart, you should look
at.

My recollection is it is usually the trigger hybrid, the trigger
hybrid's socket, or the PAL's socket.

-Chuck Harris

flanneltuba@... wrote:

I tried cleaning and deox'ing the Trigger Hybrid, but the problem remained. Swapped it out with another chip, and still not change, or at least no meaningful change. (Curiously the error text from the chip out of a 2465 was just, "NOISEY OR APERIODIC SIGNAL" without the "CH1:" prefix.)

I tried feeding a higher signal amplitude into the scope, 2v PP instead of 500mv PP, with no change. Then tried some higher frequencies. Previously I had used 5kHz; I bumped it up to 20MHz and the scope at least made an attempt to read the signal frequency, but it was way off. It assessed the 20MHz signal to be 33.94MHz. The same signal measured with the cursors on 1/t was right at 20.4MHz. See the pics I posed at the top of the Album: https://groups.io/g/TekScopes/album?id=241733

The auto Measure feature does take correct aptitude readings. It read a 2.0v PP 2kHz sine wave right at 1.998v PP. There's some hope, I suppose. Aside from giving it a real calibration, it does seem to be working quite well. I was able to get it to trigger on and display a signal up at 1.0 GHz, though the cursors marked it at 797MHz. Not bad!

So it's down to this last little foible. I can certainly live w/o the frequency measurement feature, but, heck, why stop short of perfect?

Any other thoughts on my aperiodic little 2465B?



Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

flanneltuba@...
 

I tried cleaning and deox'ing the Trigger Hybrid, but the problem remained. Swapped it out with another chip, and still not change, or at least no meaningful change. (Curiously the error text from the chip out of a 2465 was just, "NOISEY OR APERIODIC SIGNAL" without the "CH1:" prefix.)

I tried feeding a higher signal amplitude into the scope, 2v PP instead of 500mv PP, with no change. Then tried some higher frequencies. Previously I had used 5kHz; I bumped it up to 20MHz and the scope at least made an attempt to read the signal frequency, but it was way off. It assessed the 20MHz signal to be 33.94MHz. The same signal measured with the cursors on 1/t was right at 20.4MHz. See the pics I posed at the top of the Album: https://groups.io/g/TekScopes/album?id=241733

The auto Measure feature does take correct aptitude readings. It read a 2.0v PP 2kHz sine wave right at 1.998v PP. There's some hope, I suppose. Aside from giving it a real calibration, it does seem to be working quite well. I was able to get it to trigger on and display a signal up at 1.0 GHz, though the cursors marked it at 797MHz. Not bad!

So it's down to this last little foible. I can certainly live w/o the frequency measurement feature, but, heck, why stop short of perfect?

Any other thoughts on my aperiodic little 2465B?

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

n4buq
 

Hi Greg,

The P/N for the fan motor in the 8640B manual (TM 9-4935-601-14-7&P) shows it to be 1AD3001-OA.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Muir via Groups.Io" <big_sky_explorer=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 3:27:48 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Barry,

The fan in the HP 8640B is a simple 2-terminal DC motor. The Siemens device
is a 13-terminal brushless Hall Effect motor that requires external
excitation from a more elaborate switching driver scheme.

Greg



Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

 

It was pretty stupid of me to forget the link.
This is the email I wrote years ago:

Note: the link is broken across 3 lines.
It is very hard to find this battery pack on this site so use the link.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

On Tue, Sep 5, 2017 at 11:50 PM, 'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7PF
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:

Hi Harvey,

Fortunately there is a great company that makes exact replacement battery
packs for the 214 and they are very inexpensive.
Here is a link:
http://www.bulbtronics.com/Search-The-Warehouse/
SearchResults.aspx?stype=Aut
oLampEq&mfg=TEKTRONIX&mod=OSCILLOSCOPE%20212

It's tough getting there. It's under Medical and Scientific batteries.
The company that makes them is called BulbTronics. They are the ones that
supplied me with the batteries for my 214 scope.

The battery packs they made up were a perfect fit, very professionally
made,
and dirt cheap. The scope ran for over 5½ hours on them which was almost
twice the Tek specification.

Best thing to do is go to their web site and fill out an email request.
This
is the way you have to request that they make up a pack for you. It's more
than a little strange but it is worth it. You will appreciate that when the
batteries arrive.

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
greenboxmaven via Groups.Io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:04 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries.
ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models that
use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is installed,
and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the circuitry. Thanks,
Bruce KA2IVY


On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link will
connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
Bob Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it
works I need to replace the batteries.













--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator