Date   

Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Greg Muir
 

Barry,

It appears that there is sort of a judgment call on the fan motor used in the 8640B signal generator.

Looking in the 8640A manual that I have (08640-90114) the motor is definitely called out and illustrated in the schematic as of the brushless design.

However, there are differences seen in the 8640B documentation. I referred to a 2-volume manual set for the 8640B number 08640-90215 dated May 91 and also noted as a “Mark-up Copy” that applies to serials 2520A through 2923A plus any included updates for later serials.

Referring to volume 1, there is a call-out in the parts list on page 6-117 of 2 DC style motors:

For serial numbers 2939A and below:
3160-0453 “FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC .25KV-DIEL” Mfr code 28480. Mfr part number 3160-0453
(Mfr code 28480 is HP)

For serial numbers 2939A and above:
3160-0497 “”FAN-TBAX 23-CFM 12VDC” Mfr code 11039, Mfr part number 612
(Any reference for Mfr code 11039 cannot be found)

However, on page 8B-123 titled “Service Sheet 19” there is a description of the -5.2V supply & fan driver assembly A18 where it describes the brushless motor & associated driver.

However in volume 2 if you go to Service Sheet 19 you will find a DC motor being driven by a simple DC controller.

As for the part number for a brushless motor, I could not find it in either volume.

It’s not that I don’t believe that a brushless motor design was used in the 8640B since there is a hint of the description of one but it also appears that HP once used a DC motor design as well. It looks like a judgment call on this one.

Greg


Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

 

Yes, unfortunately I could not find it either.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis
Tillman W7PF
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:59 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

It was pretty stupid of me to forget the link.
This is the email I wrote years ago:

Note: the link is broken across 3 lines.
It is very hard to find this battery pack on this site so use the link.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

On Tue, Sep 5, 2017 at 11:50 PM, 'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7PF
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:

Hi Harvey,

Fortunately there is a great company that makes exact replacement battery
packs for the 214 and they are very inexpensive.
Here is a link:
http://www.bulbtronics.com/Search-The-Warehouse/
SearchResults.aspx?stype=Aut
oLampEq&mfg=TEKTRONIX&mod=OSCILLOSCOPE%20212

It's tough getting there. It's under Medical and Scientific batteries.
The company that makes them is called BulbTronics. They are the ones that
supplied me with the batteries for my 214 scope.

The battery packs they made up were a perfect fit, very professionally made,
and dirt cheap. The scope ran for over 5½ hours on them which was almost
twice the Tek specification.

Best thing to do is go to their web site and fill out an email request.
This
is the way you have to request that they make up a pack for you. It's more
than a little strange but it is worth it. You will appreciate that when the
batteries arrive.

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
greenboxmaven via Groups.Io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:04 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries.
ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models that
use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is installed,
and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the circuitry. Thanks,
Bruce KA2IVY


On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link will
connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
Bob Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it
works I need to replace the batteries.













--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator





--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator


Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

Bob Wilson
 

I could not find the pack listed at the link you sent. But I think the 5 in line AA's is a common item. I saw some at Amazon for less than $5 each.
And my local Batteries and Bulbs store probably has them too.
The original ones were probably 600MA and now they are all higher capacity.
Bob


Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

victor.silva
 

GerryR,

There are very few 2465As that use this motor, unless you have OPT 01, the DMM option.
You can tell externally if yours has this motor or not by the small vent on the rear cover.
Looking at the back cover of the scope, the inner vent next to the power cord - if is the same height as the left edge vent then you have a muffin fan and you don't need this motor.
If the vent near the power cord is about 2 inches high your scope use this fan.
Note, if your scope is working, keeping cool and not making a squealing noise you will not need this fan either.

--Victor


Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

Chuck Harris
 

The trigger hybrid triggers the A and B time base hybrids,
and they feed their gate signals (/SG) into the the PAL U975,
which chews on them, and feeds FF U980B, which talks back to
the PAL, which passes it on using /SGB goes back to the
trigger hybrid, and display sequencer.

So, it could be the trigger hybrid, the sweep hybrids, the
PAL (clean its socket), and U980B's flip-flop.

There is a Parametric Measurements flow chart, you should look
at.

My recollection is it is usually the trigger hybrid, the trigger
hybrid's socket, or the PAL's socket.

-Chuck Harris

flanneltuba@... wrote:

I tried cleaning and deox'ing the Trigger Hybrid, but the problem remained. Swapped it out with another chip, and still not change, or at least no meaningful change. (Curiously the error text from the chip out of a 2465 was just, "NOISEY OR APERIODIC SIGNAL" without the "CH1:" prefix.)

I tried feeding a higher signal amplitude into the scope, 2v PP instead of 500mv PP, with no change. Then tried some higher frequencies. Previously I had used 5kHz; I bumped it up to 20MHz and the scope at least made an attempt to read the signal frequency, but it was way off. It assessed the 20MHz signal to be 33.94MHz. The same signal measured with the cursors on 1/t was right at 20.4MHz. See the pics I posed at the top of the Album: https://groups.io/g/TekScopes/album?id=241733

The auto Measure feature does take correct aptitude readings. It read a 2.0v PP 2kHz sine wave right at 1.998v PP. There's some hope, I suppose. Aside from giving it a real calibration, it does seem to be working quite well. I was able to get it to trigger on and display a signal up at 1.0 GHz, though the cursors marked it at 797MHz. Not bad!

So it's down to this last little foible. I can certainly live w/o the frequency measurement feature, but, heck, why stop short of perfect?

Any other thoughts on my aperiodic little 2465B?




Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

flanneltuba@...
 

I tried cleaning and deox'ing the Trigger Hybrid, but the problem remained. Swapped it out with another chip, and still not change, or at least no meaningful change. (Curiously the error text from the chip out of a 2465 was just, "NOISEY OR APERIODIC SIGNAL" without the "CH1:" prefix.)

I tried feeding a higher signal amplitude into the scope, 2v PP instead of 500mv PP, with no change. Then tried some higher frequencies. Previously I had used 5kHz; I bumped it up to 20MHz and the scope at least made an attempt to read the signal frequency, but it was way off. It assessed the 20MHz signal to be 33.94MHz. The same signal measured with the cursors on 1/t was right at 20.4MHz. See the pics I posed at the top of the Album: https://groups.io/g/TekScopes/album?id=241733

The auto Measure feature does take correct aptitude readings. It read a 2.0v PP 2kHz sine wave right at 1.998v PP. There's some hope, I suppose. Aside from giving it a real calibration, it does seem to be working quite well. I was able to get it to trigger on and display a signal up at 1.0 GHz, though the cursors marked it at 797MHz. Not bad!

So it's down to this last little foible. I can certainly live w/o the frequency measurement feature, but, heck, why stop short of perfect?

Any other thoughts on my aperiodic little 2465B?


Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

n4buq
 

Hi Greg,

The P/N for the fan motor in the 8640B manual (TM 9-4935-601-14-7&P) shows it to be 1AD3001-OA.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Muir via Groups.Io" <big_sky_explorer=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 3:27:48 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Barry,

The fan in the HP 8640B is a simple 2-terminal DC motor. The Siemens device
is a 13-terminal brushless Hall Effect motor that requires external
excitation from a more elaborate switching driver scheme.

Greg




Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

 

It was pretty stupid of me to forget the link.
This is the email I wrote years ago:

Note: the link is broken across 3 lines.
It is very hard to find this battery pack on this site so use the link.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

On Tue, Sep 5, 2017 at 11:50 PM, 'Dennis Tillman' @Dennis_Tillman_W7PF
[TekScopes] <TekScopes@...> wrote:

Hi Harvey,

Fortunately there is a great company that makes exact replacement battery
packs for the 214 and they are very inexpensive.
Here is a link:
http://www.bulbtronics.com/Search-The-Warehouse/
SearchResults.aspx?stype=Aut
oLampEq&mfg=TEKTRONIX&mod=OSCILLOSCOPE%20212

It's tough getting there. It's under Medical and Scientific batteries.
The company that makes them is called BulbTronics. They are the ones that
supplied me with the batteries for my 214 scope.

The battery packs they made up were a perfect fit, very professionally
made,
and dirt cheap. The scope ran for over 5½ hours on them which was almost
twice the Tek specification.

Best thing to do is go to their web site and fill out an email request.
This
is the way you have to request that they make up a pack for you. It's more
than a little strange but it is worth it. You will appreciate that when the
batteries arrive.

Dennis Tillman W7PF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
greenboxmaven via Groups.Io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 1:04 PM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries.
ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models that
use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is installed,
and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the circuitry. Thanks,
Bruce KA2IVY


On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link will
connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of
Bob Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it
works I need to replace the batteries.













--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator


Re: 547 scope HV transformer problem. One practical solution.

Morris Odell
 

I have washed many 500 series scopes (and other boatanchors) over the years without any fancy equipment and have had very good results. I posted a set of photos a few years ago of a 547 wash and you can find it here in the photos section. You need to pick a time and place when there will be several hot days in a row - here in Australia it's usually around this time of year and the temp can be 90-100F for days. Pull the tubes, CRT, fan, pluggable transistors and anything else easily removable or loseable taking care to label them so they can be reinstalled to the right places. Take it outside for a scrub down with a brush and detergent solution and rinse it down with the garden hose - fortunately the water where I live is pretty soft. Try to avoid flooding the power and HV transformers. Leave it outside in the direct sun for a day or two to dry. If you want to bake it even hotter, you could put it in a car parked in the sun but I haven't tried that. I do the knobs separately in the sink with detergent and an old toothbrush, a squirt with something like WD40 restores the shine nicely. Lubricate the shaft bushings and switches when you reassemble it.

It will look like new and after an electronic overhaul and cal, should behave like new too.

Morris


Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Greg Muir
 

Barry,

The fan in the HP 8640B is a simple 2-terminal DC motor. The Siemens device is a 13-terminal brushless Hall Effect motor that requires external excitation from a more elaborate switching driver scheme.

Greg


Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

David Holland
 

https://www.bulbtronics.com

Part # 5149

The search for Oscilloscope 212 doesn't work, but its listed under the
"Equipment using this product" tab....

David


On Sun, Feb 23, 2020 at 4:06 PM greenboxmaven via Groups.Io <ka2ivy=
verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries.
ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models
that use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is
installed, and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the
circuitry. Thanks, Bruce KA2IVY


On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link
will connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for
the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of Bob
Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it
works
I need to replace the batteries.












Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

greenboxmaven
 

Please share the link you mentioned so I can check out their batteries. ALSO, beware that the power supply sections of some of the "2XX" models that use these batteries will not regulate unless a good battery is installed, and will send excessive voltages to the rest of the circuitry. Thanks, Bruce KA2IVY

On 2/23/20 2:44 PM, Dennis Tillman W7PF wrote:
Hi Bob,
If that is the case then you are in luck because this link
will connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries.
Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of Bob
Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it works
I need to replace the batteries.








Re: 211 Replacement Batteries

 

Hi Bob,
Years ago I posted this information about the batteries I found for the
model 214 which I own. With a little research comparing the battery size of
your 211 to my 214 I think you will find the 211 uses the same rechargeable
battery pack. If that is the case then you are in luck because this link
will connect you with a company that makes an identical replacement for the
Tek batteries. The cost was dirt cheap, and they were absolutely perfect
plugin replacements. The quality was excellent.
The new batteries ran my 214 50% longer than the specification in the
Service Manual showed the original batteries were capable of.

Dennis Tillman W7pF

-----Original Message-----
From: TekScopes@groups.io [mailto:TekScopes@groups.io] On Behalf Of Bob
Wilson
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Subject: [TekScopes] 211 Replacement Batteries

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it works
I need to replace the batteries.

He seller already has the batteries out and I assume they are bad. It works
without the batteries installed but maybe it not good to run it that way.

My question is what kind of batteries can I use?

It came with Nicad but NiMH are common these days. If I had my choice I
would like Eneloop batteries or something like that so they would hold there
charge for a long time.

Bob








--
Dennis Tillman W7PF
TekScopes Moderator


Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

GerryR <totalautomation1@...>
 

I have a 2465A but don't have any idea where a motor like that is used. Any help??
Thanks,
GerryR
KK4GER

----- Original Message -----
From: "n4buq" <n4buq@...>
To: <TekScopes@groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 2:20 PM
Subject: Re: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor


I'm not 100% sure, but I think that same motor is used in the HP 8640B (and, possibly, other models) as well.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "victor.silva via Groups.Io" <daejon1=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 9:15:44 AM
Subject: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

I am not associated with this seller.

I found a seller on ebay selling the Seimens 1AD3001-0A brushless motors for
a reasonable price.
The shipping is steep for USA Parcel Post, but the total cost to buy is ok.

These motors are used in most of the Tek 2465 and some 2465A, 2465B(w/option
01).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Siemens-1AD3001-OA-Motor-10-15volts/274013390896

--Victor




Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

n4buq
 

I'm not 100% sure, but I think that same motor is used in the HP 8640B (and, possibly, other models) as well.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

----- Original Message -----
From: "victor.silva via Groups.Io" <daejon1=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: TekScopes@groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2020 9:15:44 AM
Subject: [TekScopes] New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

I am not associated with this seller.

I found a seller on ebay selling the Seimens 1AD3001-0A brushless motors for
a reasonable price.
The shipping is steep for USA Parcel Post, but the total cost to buy is ok.

These motors are used in most of the Tek 2465 and some 2465A, 2465B(w/option
01).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Siemens-1AD3001-OA-Motor-10-15volts/274013390896

--Victor




211 Replacement Batteries

Bob Wilson
 

Yesterday I bought a model 211 scope at the Dalton hamfest. While it works
I need to replace the batteries.

He seller already has the batteries out and I assume they are bad. It works
without the batteries installed but maybe it not good to run it that way.

My question is what kind of batteries can I use?

It came with Nicad but NiMH are common these days. If I had my choice I
would like Eneloop batteries or something like that so they would hold there
charge for a long time.

Bob


Re: Tekprobe 1103 PSU mod. advice

 

Hi Mark..
Thank you for the links. Seems those threads have gone quiet. It might mean that the developers had no plans to offer a commercial outcome, but they supported open sourcing, or demand isn't there.
You're correct in that my concept appears to be a hybrid of the two links. USB powered plus direct cable free installation. Seems Probe Offset voltage adj. is not an in demand feature which answers one of my constraint concerns adequately.
The build in the first link is remarkably close to my physical concept, leveraging the proven laser cut acrylic approach to sandwich the PCB as I did with the SG 504 leveling head since 2016.

Well...it's still a back burner item for now.
thanks again.
~A


Re: New 2465 Seimens brushless motor

Greg Muir
 

It is Tek part number 147-0035-00 and will fit Tek 465, 465B, 466, 464, 475, 475A, 475M, 2445 & 2465 series scopes.

Greg


Re: Weird 466 horizontal glitch--SOLVED

Mlynch001
 

Power supply voltage and power quality are the foundation of everything else. This was and remains the most important lesson for me when working with these scopes.

--
Michael Lynch
Dardanelle, AR


Re: 2465B - Weak Readout Intensity

flanneltuba@...
 

Thanks, Chuck. I'll do a careful inspection and deoxit cleaning of the Trigger Hybrid chip. I do have a 2465 (two, actually) that I can borrow a known good chip from if necessary as well.

Tony: As for the photos, below is a copy/paste link from the TekScopes Photos gallery of the Album I created earlier, which includes various pictures from this project from day 1 through the present. Nothing spectacular but no doubt familiar "before" type scenes for many of you, showing visibly sad 2465B boards and parts.

Here's the link. Let me know if it does not work: https://groups.io/g/TekScopes/album?id=241733

Thanks,

- Scott