Interference on 20M #Radios


Keith - KJ7OND
 

With my new FT-710 I have been able to get a much better idea of the RF conditions in my immediate area. For the most part things seem OK, with a few noise spikes here and there. However I am having serious interference on 20 meters. I have included a picture of the waterfall indicating some sort of repeating noise spikes. Thanks.


Bruce Haupt - WA6DNT
 

Hi Keith
Power your radio from batteries then shut off ALL power to your house. Is the noise still there?
Does the noise go away when the antenna is disconnected?
The harmonic content looks like what you can get from the cheap Chinese "Wall-Wart" power supplies.
If the noise is coming from your house, shut off each circuit -one breaker at a time until the noise goes away. 
You can "Sniff it out " with a SW receiver like the one I got from Amazon that has an external antenna jack:
 It is a "Tecsun PL660" if you use the built in antenna - you can shorten it as you get closer to the noise source.
Better yet -use a shielded loop antenna into the EXT jack - for a "Bi-Directional" bearing - the "Null" is when it is pointing to the source.
If the noise is still there with the house power gone then look for external source.
 Then the spectrum looks like what can come from a poorly engineered  solar system.
A grow light "WEED" farm?  Christmas lights are famous for RFI .
Measure the intervals (Period) between the same point on each noise spike. How many KHz is it, looks like 100 KHz. ?
If you have an oscilloscope run the audio into a channel and see if the wave form will Sync to the power line 60Hz.
If it does- then the device is being powered  by the grid. If it does not - I would look for a solar array.
If TARA members need some help I will again bring my RFI  DF equipment when I come in May - June.
73 Bruce WA6DNT@...
    


On 1/2/2023 4:32 PM, Keith - KJ7OND wrote:

With my new FT-710 I have been able to get a much better idea of the RF conditions in my immediate area. For the most part things seem OK, with a few noise spikes here and there. However I am having serious interference on 20 meters. I have included a picture of the waterfall indicating some sort of repeating noise spikes. Thanks.


Woody Phillips - KJ7YYI
 

Bruce pretty much nailed it on all the steps to find the noise. Some of these things we can help with when we come over to make your antenna installation more permanent.

It definitely looks like man made noise and since it is in the 20 meter band I would agree that it is "probably" something in your house. Depending on what, that is either good news or bad news.

Remind me to bring some Ferrite Beads with me when we come over.


Keith - KJ7OND
 

Thanks for the extensive list of things to go though. I'll have to wait until I am alone so I dont interrupt football time with my experiments. I also don't yet have any proper batteries or a seperate portable SW radio. The noise goes away when I detach the antenna, all signals in fact do. The distance between intervals does look like a solid 100ish KHz. The radio has a built in oscilloscope but I am not sure exactly what I am looking for. I put the radio in AM and was able to get a waveform of somekind with sporadic bursts of noise.

Thanks


On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 7:19 PM Bruce Haupt - WA6DNT <wa6dnt@...> wrote:
Hi Keith
Power your radio from batteries then shut off ALL power to your house. Is the noise still there?
Does the noise go away when the antenna is disconnected?
The harmonic content looks like what you can get from the cheap Chinese "Wall-Wart" power supplies.
If the noise is coming from your house, shut off each circuit -one breaker at a time until the noise goes away. 
You can "Sniff it out " with a SW receiver like the one I got from Amazon that has an external antenna jack:
 It is a "Tecsun PL660" if you use the built in antenna - you can shorten it as you get closer to the noise source.
Better yet -use a shielded loop antenna into the EXT jack - for a "Bi-Directional" bearing - the "Null" is when it is pointing to the source.
If the noise is still there with the house power gone then look for external source.
 Then the spectrum looks like what can come from a poorly engineered  solar system.
A grow light "WEED" farm?  Christmas lights are famous for RFI .
Measure the intervals (Period) between the same point on each noise spike. How many KHz is it, looks like 100 KHz. ?
If you have an oscilloscope run the audio into a channel and see if the wave form will Sync to the power line 60Hz.
If it does- then the device is being powered  by the grid. If it does not - I would look for a solar array.
If TARA members need some help I will again bring my RFI  DF equipment when I come in May - June.
73 Bruce WA6DNT@...
    


On 1/2/2023 4:32 PM, Keith - KJ7OND wrote:
With my new FT-710 I have been able to get a much better idea of the RF conditions in my immediate area. For the most part things seem OK, with a few noise spikes here and there. However I am having serious interference on 20 meters. I have included a picture of the waterfall indicating some sort of repeating noise spikes. Thanks.



--
Why must all the hoops be on fire?


Rick Lovdahl - KJ7ROX
 

Keith,
I have a lithium battery that you could use to run your radio for rfi testing.  I'm really interested in what you find out.  I'll bring the battery and adapter cables whenever you need them.
Let me know if you want any help.

73... Rick

On Tue, Jan 3, 2023, 8:04 PM Keith - KJ7OND <kommandr@...> wrote:
Thanks for the extensive list of things to go though. I'll have to wait until I am alone so I dont interrupt football time with my experiments. I also don't yet have any proper batteries or a seperate portable SW radio. The noise goes away when I detach the antenna, all signals in fact do. The distance between intervals does look like a solid 100ish KHz. The radio has a built in oscilloscope but I am not sure exactly what I am looking for. I put the radio in AM and was able to get a waveform of somekind with sporadic bursts of noise.

Thanks


On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 7:19 PM Bruce Haupt - WA6DNT <wa6dnt@...> wrote:
Hi Keith
Power your radio from batteries then shut off ALL power to your house. Is the noise still there?
Does the noise go away when the antenna is disconnected?
The harmonic content looks like what you can get from the cheap Chinese "Wall-Wart" power supplies.
If the noise is coming from your house, shut off each circuit -one breaker at a time until the noise goes away. 
You can "Sniff it out " with a SW receiver like the one I got from Amazon that has an external antenna jack:
 It is a "Tecsun PL660" if you use the built in antenna - you can shorten it as you get closer to the noise source.
Better yet -use a shielded loop antenna into the EXT jack - for a "Bi-Directional" bearing - the "Null" is when it is pointing to the source.
If the noise is still there with the house power gone then look for external source.
 Then the spectrum looks like what can come from a poorly engineered  solar system.
A grow light "WEED" farm?  Christmas lights are famous for RFI .
Measure the intervals (Period) between the same point on each noise spike. How many KHz is it, looks like 100 KHz. ?
If you have an oscilloscope run the audio into a channel and see if the wave form will Sync to the power line 60Hz.
If it does- then the device is being powered  by the grid. If it does not - I would look for a solar array.
If TARA members need some help I will again bring my RFI  DF equipment when I come in May - June.
73 Bruce WA6DNT@...
    


On 1/2/2023 4:32 PM, Keith - KJ7OND wrote:
With my new FT-710 I have been able to get a much better idea of the RF conditions in my immediate area. For the most part things seem OK, with a few noise spikes here and there. However I am having serious interference on 20 meters. I have included a picture of the waterfall indicating some sort of repeating noise spikes. Thanks.



--
Why must all the hoops be on fire?


Keith - KJ7OND
 

Thanks for the offer. I intend to get a battery setup soon but my "fun" money is pretty much spent at this point.

On Tue, Jan 3, 2023 at 9:06 PM Rick Lovdahl - KJ7ROX <rick.lovdahl@...> wrote:
Keith,
I have a lithium battery that you could use to run your radio for rfi testing.  I'm really interested in what you find out.  I'll bring the battery and adapter cables whenever you need them.
Let me know if you want any help.

73... Rick

On Tue, Jan 3, 2023, 8:04 PM Keith - KJ7OND <kommandr@...> wrote:
Thanks for the extensive list of things to go though. I'll have to wait until I am alone so I dont interrupt football time with my experiments. I also don't yet have any proper batteries or a seperate portable SW radio. The noise goes away when I detach the antenna, all signals in fact do. The distance between intervals does look like a solid 100ish KHz. The radio has a built in oscilloscope but I am not sure exactly what I am looking for. I put the radio in AM and was able to get a waveform of somekind with sporadic bursts of noise.

Thanks


On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 7:19 PM Bruce Haupt - WA6DNT <wa6dnt@...> wrote:
Hi Keith
Power your radio from batteries then shut off ALL power to your house. Is the noise still there?
Does the noise go away when the antenna is disconnected?
The harmonic content looks like what you can get from the cheap Chinese "Wall-Wart" power supplies.
If the noise is coming from your house, shut off each circuit -one breaker at a time until the noise goes away. 
You can "Sniff it out " with a SW receiver like the one I got from Amazon that has an external antenna jack:
 It is a "Tecsun PL660" if you use the built in antenna - you can shorten it as you get closer to the noise source.
Better yet -use a shielded loop antenna into the EXT jack - for a "Bi-Directional" bearing - the "Null" is when it is pointing to the source.
If the noise is still there with the house power gone then look for external source.
 Then the spectrum looks like what can come from a poorly engineered  solar system.
A grow light "WEED" farm?  Christmas lights are famous for RFI .
Measure the intervals (Period) between the same point on each noise spike. How many KHz is it, looks like 100 KHz. ?
If you have an oscilloscope run the audio into a channel and see if the wave form will Sync to the power line 60Hz.
If it does- then the device is being powered  by the grid. If it does not - I would look for a solar array.
If TARA members need some help I will again bring my RFI  DF equipment when I come in May - June.
73 Bruce WA6DNT@...
    


On 1/2/2023 4:32 PM, Keith - KJ7OND wrote:
With my new FT-710 I have been able to get a much better idea of the RF conditions in my immediate area. For the most part things seem OK, with a few noise spikes here and there. However I am having serious interference on 20 meters. I have included a picture of the waterfall indicating some sort of repeating noise spikes. Thanks.



--
Why must all the hoops be on fire?



--
Why must all the hoops be on fire?